Play or Forfeit

Are they set as ground rules? If so, the umpire has the obligation to tell any player with spikes to either change or not play. To me it's similar to jewelry. It either comes of or you leave the game until it does come off. It tends to become a personal safety issue if the surface is not intended to support the same type shoe that is meant for dirt and grass.

I would hope the coach of the team with the turf field would have called ahead of time to let the opposing coach know of the rule about footwear!!!  If he did, then there is no excuse that the opposing team is not prepared to wear turfs.  If he didn't, then shame on that coach.

During football games that involve a turf field the opposing schools will always email a set of directions that include, no colored sports drinks, no sunflower seed, no chewing tabacoo and that if the visiting school is caught breaking the rules they will be required to pay for the damages.  Other than the chew the other stuff is not in the rule book as well.  It is about respecting other peoples stuff and as previously stated, if those are the ground rules they must be enforced.

Interesting discussion.  Our HS installed a new football stadium with a turf field last year.  It was used for the first time beginning last fall.  I believe most of our district opponents are aware of this as it is the only turf football field in the region - all others are natural grass.

Anyhew, I'm not sure if they are banning metal cleats or not.  And if they do whether an e-mail or notification goes out to the other schools.

I have to agree with bballman - if the coach or AD of the school with the turf field notified the visiting teams of the "rules" regarding the field, there's no excuse for showing up with inappropriate footwear.

Unless the state association has a rule otherwise, a school cannot prohibit otherwise legal equipment. Ground rules cannot supercede book rules.

What would you do if a school banned the use of brown gloves?

Matt13....You are incorrect on the fact that ground rules can not supersede the rule book.  Case in point.  Rule book states that coaches can not be outside of the dugout.  All you have to do is pour concrete outside the dugout, call the area a dead area, and now the coaches can be outside the dugout, and yes that is a true story.  I understand what you are saying but it is not always the case.

If the home coach tells me no metal is allowed on a turf field, then no metal is allowed.  I'll leave it up to someone else to determine whose fault it is and what the penalty should be, if any.  Metal on turf can be bad news.  I have seen a career end because a metal spike got caught in the turf and a knee got ripped apart.

I am not incorrect (FED 4-1-2, OBR 3.13) and what you have as an example is not contradictory to a rulebook rule.

If a school refuses to allow metal on its field, then the state can decide what to do, not me as an umpire. If I'm in on that decision, home team forfeits. I'm not forcing a team to change its legal equipment.

One of our High Schools just put in a new turf baseball field and e-mails were sent to all the umpires and ADs which stated that metal spikes (along with sunflower seeds) were not permitted.  Everyone knew this in advance.  

Metal spikes tear up a turf field and pose a danger for the player because they are not designed to be used on turf.

I have to go with enforcing this because it is what the "powers that be" want.

Yeah, and what about the school whose players can't afford a second set of spikes? You want them to forfeit?

Seriously, there are ways to work with this that don't involve costing a game.

Home team forfeit?  What a joke!!

I didn't mean to kick up such a S**T storm.  I am new to umpiring (Hope to pass Fed State test this week) and I find the conversations in this forum to be very educational.  I agree that if the home team advises the visiting team ahead of time and the visiting team can accomodate with out undue expense or disadvantage, then they should comply with the home request.  But if the visitors only have metals, and the only alternative is to go buy new shoes or wear sneakers... I can see where sneakers would be at a disadvantage to base runners... especially in the base cut outs or when there is a bit of rain.  I was only looking to see how umpires would handle this.  There are definitely differences of opinion.  Thanks to all for sharing your 2 cents.

Metal cleats/spikes (i.e. baseball metal, track spikes, etc) aren't allowed in football. You have four choices, molded (typical in middle school and below), tpu ( a harder, smaller plastic cleat, preferred choice for field turf), nubbies (for astroturf, not used much anymore), and replaceable cleats (preferred on grass, mud).  Replaceable cleats come in 3/8, 1/2, and 3/4 plastic, and 1/2" plastic that are metal tipped.  All can be used on field turf.  The problem is that the 1/2" replaceable cleats (which is typical) tend to have too much grip on field turf and can stress your knees, 3/8" are much better on field turf.  My son just uses two pairs of cleats for football, replaceable on grass and tpu for turf.  As for turf baseball fields my son uses his trainers (Mizuno) which work pretty well on turf baseball fields.

I find it hard to believe kids can spend $300 or more on a bat but can't spend $60 on a pair of turf shoes.  Please!!

I don't want to see a forfeit in this sitch, and I agree there must be a way to work this out.

I have umpired schools (both college and HS) where the kids can't afford their own gloves, let alone extra shoes.

Here is another curve.... lets say it is playoff season... the visiting team wins their round.. and has to play next day on the turf... even if the team can afford the shoes, is it realistic to have them go home and shop at the end of the season for shows that they may need only for this one game? I agree that there should never be a forfeit.  I would hope the state governing body would lend guidance.  If the metals are a show stopper for the home team and the visotors can not adhere to the request, the simple solution is to play the game at the visitor location or other site, but the home / away designations stay the same.  But that decision would (hopefully) be made by the AD's and/or governing bodies before the game is scheduled.  But if you get to the field - as an umpire - and this dispute is not resolved, by rule, can you instruct the visitor that they can not wear metals?

I would say it goes to the state. We are responsible for playing rules. By playing rules, metal spikes are legal. We have no authority to ban them. If the state hasn't said anything to this point, then it's on them, and now they are going to have to deal with it.

General rule: umpires do not forfeit games. If there is a dispute that makes the game unplayable, refer it to the league. If an ejected person refuses to comply, suspend and refer. If a team refuses to play because they think the field is too wet, refer. If a team refuses to let the other team play because of potential damage, refer.

I agree this is the only way too address this issue.

It's common to not wear metal cleats on the FieldTurf.. the manufacturer will void the warranty if done so!

We recently played at a minor league park that has FieldTurf. I thought they had worn metal there in the past, but our kids all wore sneakers or turf shoes. They will do the same tomorrow when they play there again.

In the Frontier League a few years ago there was an incident where the visiting manager nearly got arrested for refusing to make his players take off the metal cleats on the turf...

Like Matt said.....I dont forfeit games....in this case, this is up to the state.....suspend.....and depart....  

It's up to the home coach if a game starts.Not my problem.