Professional baseball scout/advisor

quote:

Originally posted by brsfan:
My son is a rising high school senior and LHP and has been to several mlb/pre draft workouts. We had an "Advisor" talk to us after one of his workouts but how do you find more "Advisors". We don't want to rush this process. Can anyone help?

Welcome to the HSBBW.
You don't find advisors, they find you. The more talented your son is, the more inquiries you will get.
Feel free to ask any questions.

A few for you. Has your son commited to college yet? His height, his velo and what pitches does he throw for strikes? Were these private workouts or group? Has your son been contacted by many scouts?

You don't have to rush through this process, the draft is not until next June, that is approximately 11 months away.

Thank you for the reply. His height is 6'1" and he throws fastball 85-87, change-up, curve, slider and yes he throws all of them for strikes. His plans are to go to a juco so he can be draft eligible every year. No individual workouts just group stuff. Maybe you can help with this question. He did go to a MLSB tryout in June and they talked to him after he pitched. Told him since he was a rising senior in high school that he was a "book". I am guessing that is where his name goes in a book of kids to keep an eye on? Any information would be very helpful. As far as the advisor, one the other day said he would be able to help him for a small fee. DO they usually charge a fee to be an advisor? Thanks again for your help

every scout has their own terms/sayings Book could mean any number of things. but i'm uessing he's in his "book".

advisors typically take a set % of the signing bonus, then no money (maybe some % from endorsements if any are there) until i think the 3rd yr in MLB. there isn't anything to negotiate money wise until then. be dilligent in your homework before you agree to work with an advisor, their are some snake oil salesman out there.

quote:

Originally posted by brsfan:
Thank you for the reply. His height is 6'1" and he throws fastball 85-87, change-up, curve, slider and yes he throws all of them for strikes. His plans are to go to a juco so he can be draft eligible every year. No individual workouts just group stuff. Maybe you can help with this question. He did go to a MLSB tryout in June and they talked to him after he pitched. Told him since he was a rising senior in high school that he was a "book". I am guessing that is where his name goes in a book of kids to keep an eye on? Any information would be very helpful. As far as the advisor, one the other day said he would be able to help him for a small fee. DO they usually charge a fee to be an advisor? Thanks again for your help

Anyone can take a fee for advisement if they are NOT an agent. I am learning this is a new thing, people willing to give you info and help you to understand the draft process without being in the business of baseball (agent). Be careful.

Do you need an agent? If the scouts are showing up in the fall, calling to speak to you, at HS games specifically to see your son, if he is a highly ranked player out of HS (ex. PG), then yes, you need to speak to someone regarding the draft and the implications of being drafted out of HS, the MLB scholarship plan, signing bonus, etc.

I never heard that expression "book". I can tell you this though, if your son doesn't have a college commitment and has indicated to scouts that he is going to JUCO to remain eligible for each draft year, he just lowered any bonus by alot, if drafted.
You need to do some reading regarding life at the minor league level for very young players (out of HS). A book I suggest is "Inside Pitch" by George Gmelch, try amazon.
Big decision, do your homework.

Thank you for the advise. We will def. do our homework. Thanks again!

Hi!
Do not exchange money, gifts, or sign a contract with anyone for advise regarding the draft. Like TPM said, if your son is getting a lot of attention from MLB scouts and is considered a top prospect for the June draft, good advisors with solid reputations will contact you. They will gladly answer any questions about the draft for free. There is no rush to select one. Take your time and check their references.

If you do not get a lot of contact from advisors/agents you really don't need one. College will be your son's best option.

quote:

Originally posted by TxMom:
good advisors with solid reputations

Who pays these advisors? Do they have another job? Do they work for mlb teams?

quote:

Originally posted by AntzDad:

quote:

Originally posted by TxMom:
good advisors with solid reputations

Who pays these advisors? Do they have another job? Do they work for mlb teams?

I am pretty sure it is understood that an agent can only "advise" you in the process (unless you get drafted and signed). His advice is free.

Since you brought it up, how do you and others feel about someone wanting to charge to give advice regarding the draft process, helping with negotiations, etc. An advisor that IS NOT an agent?

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:
His advice is free.

Are you saying he is just a nice guy? How does this fellow make a living? What qualifies him to give out free advice? Can a player have more than one advisor? I'm asking.

As far as paying someone for advice that could effect my future, I don't see what's wrong with it. I don't rely on web md or some guy on the corner to tell me "what's this thing growing out of my neck?". I go to a real doctor, who charges me.

Scott Boras = Advisor/Agent

Advisor and then later Agent.

The good ones tend to get the best players and they do much better than just make a living.

If you are an advisor for a player that ends up signing for $2 million, you make $60,000 or more. That's just one player of many you might be working with. And the big $$$ come later when and if your player makes it big.

So, is an advisor a liason between player and mlb team? I still don't get it. If the advisor negotiates, how is he not an agent?

Advisor can not negotiate with MLB club, though it has been done. He can only advise his client. This only pertains to NCAA rules. No one wants to break those rules.
1. it can cause elegibility problems if the player attends school.
2. It can cause the player to lose some leverage ($$$)with MLB club when it is known he could have NCAA eligibility problems.

If the advisor negotiates, he techically becomes the agent. If the player ends up signing rather than go play college baseball, there is no penalty.

Basically advisor is just a word used to describe an agent in order to keep everything legal. 99% of all the advisors I know, make their living as an agent.

Ok, so I have a question for the experts. What do MLB scouts look for in a left handed pitcher. Velocity, height, weight, pitches, etc.

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
Advisor... can only advise his client.

OK, thanks.

Purely hypothetical situation:

A kid gets multiple D1 offers and signs nli in Nov. Pro scouts disregard nli, and attend several games to watch said player. Let's pretend player has an advisor. June, MLB draft- what 54 rounds?- and kid's name never appears...

Some other kid's dad asks 'what happened to so and so?'. A little bird tells him 'the kid's number was way too high'.

So, somehow, some way, a 'number' was discussed between mlb teams and 'who knows who'.

My next question is "who is advising the mlb teams?"

AntzDad,

Commiting to a college doesn't stop MLB scouts from doing their job.

An advvisor can talk to his client about "numbers", he just can't legally negotiate with the MLB club. It still happens though.

Not sure what you mean by "who is advising the MLB teams".

I'm asking how dollar amount to sign as a pro gets back to the mlb teams interested in a player. Can a kid's parents say to a mlb scout, "not for less than $1 million" and not jeopardize college eligibility?

SO back to the question I posted earlier. What do mlb scouts look for in a left handed pitcher? Speed, pitches, height, weight, any thing else? Do they really look at how the ball moves but doesn't throw 90? Is velocity all they really look at? Any input would be helpful. Thanks

quote:

Originally posted by AntzDad:
I'm asking how dollar amount to sign as a pro gets back to the mlb teams interested in a player. Can a kid's parents say to a mlb scout, "not for less than $1 million" and not jeopardize college eligibility?

The scouts will ask how much money the player is looking for prior to the draft.

Whom do they ask?

The amount of money a player will sign for is put out by the player/family. I'm not sure if it's put out through the advisor or directly through the scouting bureau. As the draft get closer all teams want to know what $$ amount, if any, will convince the player to skip college and go pro.

Antz dad - there are multiple interviews before draft day. They look at everything, including the kitchen sink. It all comes out one way or another. During the draft the player might get a call confirming what the player is looking for. Will they sign for slot money at this point, or are they still holding out. It's a fascinating process.

There is a local kid that went undrafted - he made it very clear he was not interested. He is looking forward to school. Several others have already signed, or have agreed to, they just wanted the last summer. Some are waiting for the 14th.

One thing they also look at is how they handle themselves on the field. They don't want showboats.

As to what they are looking for in LHP, it is my belief all they want is velo. I would say for HSers - hit 90. Same thing for righties, but looking for 92+.

(just my opinion, as always)

quote:

Originally posted by brsfan:
Ok, so I have a question for the experts. What do MLB scouts look for in a left handed pitcher. Velocity, height, weight, pitches, etc.

We are not experts, we are just parents whose sons have been through the draft process.
I can't tell you what scouts look for in a LHP but your son, from what you describe has good skills. Whether those skills translate into future potential, not sure.

Have you been to a legit showcase that has evaluated your sons skills? It's always good to get an opinion from others that do not have a professional stake or interest in your player. It's not that I don't believe what you say, but it is from your parental prospective.

The draft is very much determined by many different things, and yes it is the family and their player that sets the number. That number based upon where your son falls in the june draft will attract some teams and wont attract others. It will bring much interest if your son has the skills that make him a potential future MLB player. They just don't draft you because you want to be drafted.

If teams are very interested in your son, the MLB area scout will most likely call. He is the scout assigned in your area to help MLB determine who is eligible and in many areas help educate the player and family, he may do it by coming to your home or if a large area by a showcase.

I am a strong supporter of a player having an agent, but when the time is right. He did not have one out of HS (even though we did talk to a few) and had one in college. I am pretty sure that is why I know what I do, I made it my business to try to understand the draft, bonuses, agents, milb vs college out of HS. We did speak to people who were helpful, but we never commited to anyone that if he was drafted that he would be the agent. Most good ones will never ask you, but rather sell you on his firm, his philosophy (they all have different ones),etc.

Antzdad,
Teams speak to players because they don't want to waste picks, especially the very early ones. It usually will cost them a lot of money to draft high prospect HS players, the comment you heard meant that they player wanted more than any team was willing to pay, which is called signability.

Can the advisor be present, or listen to phone conversations, and 'advise', during interviews with mlb scouts?

An advisor that is not an agent, yes. An advisor that is an agent, no.


I am not sure of your son's age, but if you have signed up for the clearinghouse they send you that info regarding contact with an agent, what is and what is not appropriate.

You can alos do your own research, with the NCAA, perhaps 3FG can advise you were to do that. Here in our area if you play HS sports, the guidance counselors provide you with a booklet.

My son is a rising sophomore in college. He was intent on playing football, but changed his mind at the last minute to give baseball a shot. I read all the clearinghouse stuff, but it was from a football prospective. The rules are, in most cases, black and white.

I'm asking so many questions because there seems to be a somewhat larger gray area for baseball players.

I'd say to sign or go to college s a very important decision. When dealing with money, and his future, I'm all for a young man's having an experienced advocate. Whether the person is paid, or not, doesn't bother me. Why does it bother the ncaa?

But... in the same sense, I would hope the young man is not taken advantage of, and talked into something that may not be in his best interest.

Hi again,
We went through the draft process 3 times with 2 sons. I clearly remember having many of the same questions you have during our first draft. It can be very confusing to someone with no experience.

You still have plenty of time to learn about the process before the next draft. If your son is a pro prospect, interested MLB scouts will contact you and gladly answer any questions, both on the phone and in your home. They are an excellent source of information. You need to be honest with them, but you don't have to "show all of your cards" at once. If your son doesn't know if he wants to go to college or play pro ball or how much it would take to sign, simply tell the scouts that he doesn't know yet. That is a fair and common answer.

As the year progresses, you may also be contacted by professional advisors. They can help you navigate the process, but can't accept any payment or require you to sign a contract with them until your son is drafted and signs a professional contract. Once your son pays money to an advisor, accepts any gifts, or signs a contract, the advisor becomes his agent and your son is considered a pro, unable to ever play college ball. NCAA has many rules in place to ensure that college athletes are amatuers. Loosing college eligibility will impact negotiating power significantly. Good, experienced advisors know this and understand that building a good relationship based on trust without compensation will provide them with the most income down the road, if and when he becomes a pro ball player and needs an agent.

In conclusion, it’s important to remember that everyone involved in the process has some stake in it, financial or otherwise. Educate your son, but try not to overwhelm him with details, especially during his senior season. The best approach is to simply handle things as they come and try your best to not get caught up in the process. It can rob you of enjoying one of the most special times in your son's life...his senior season. Walk humbly, be honest, ask questions, take time to learn, and smell the roses along the way. Try to keep the big picture in mind ...that being to help your son grow into a responsible, humble, hard working, and honest man in whatever he does. If you center every decision on those goals, you'll be fine.

The rules are different, football players MUST go to college to play at the professional game.

There is nothing that says who you can or can't talk to, you can't sign any agreement with a agent to lose your eligibilty as an amatuer until after you have become a professional. All the issues that have occured with players and the NCAA were because of promises made, not due to not knowing the rules.

Everyone sees things differently, I would never tell anyone to not go to school unless they got paid well to give up that opportunity and of course a lot depends on where one has commited.

A committed HS senior to JUCO may get attention but when it comes to the draft, he has to understand all of the implications that it brings. Some guys out there latch on to the "average" player, with the hope that they make some money off of their small bonus never caring what future potential they have (Boras does not take clients unless they have future MLB player written all over them, apparent even in HS).

Lots of young players want to follow their dream, the dream for a player out of HS is very difficult than what you see on TV. Lots of temptations out there and truthfully, most older players couldn't care less if you succeeded or didn't. Very often far from home, it's not glamour and glitz. Most HS players enter complex level ball, that's games in front of no one and done by 1,2 pm and lots of afternoon to do nothing.

The importance of an experienced agent acting as an advisor would be to help you to understand what the experience may or may not be like. What round you may fall on based upon his assesment he has seen (not anyone elses) and what teams may be a good fit. Some people actually turn down signing based upon the team that drafted them. In other words, as an example, some organizations in their lower levels are mostly foreign born. Most 17, 18 year olds go to college first. The average time it takes the average HS player to figure it out in pro ball is 5-6 years, not barring injury. Heck mine out of college is in his 5th year.

Good stuff Txmom, was posting while you were, hope that the family is well.

quote:

Walk humbly, be honest, ask questions, take time to learn, and smell the roses along the way

best advice you'll get,try to follow it as it will make the whole thing soooo much easier. enjoyable too.