Prospects in your area not rated by PG!

You mean if you are not rated by Perfect Game, they might still draft you? If you are not even on Baseball Americas 800 player CA follow list, you still might get drafted? No way!

LOL!
SSSHHH, don't let anyone know!

My son has pitched against both Scott and Justin. Both are outstanding pitchers and great kids. Believe me, they are both "legit". Take care.

PG puts out some impressive statistics on the kids that played for them getting drafted or college scholarships. They are legit. What I want to see is the stats on kids that should have been drafted or signed at a D-1, but didn't, because they did not attend one of their showcases. (Does that make sense)

By the way, the MLB Scouting Bureau has missed them on their list also. We have 18 MLB Scouting Directors on our committee, I'll check with them about Blue. Sounds very interesting.

This stuff always picks up about this time of the year and always slows way down right after the draft.

Obviously we don't see them all. In fact, last year of every 100 draft picks there were 2 who were unranked by us.

Best of luck to those players. They sound very talented.

PGSTAFF,
If my info proves correct will you rate them? Or do they have to attend an event? Just wondering not slamming PG.

quote:

Originally posted by bulldog4ever:
PGSTAFF,
If my info proves correct will you rate them? Or do they have to attend an event? Just wondering not slamming PG.

Dunno but I dont think PG could rate them w/o seeing them at a PG event or elsewhere...

With all the pro connections PG has I am sure there is someone's opinion that they can trust.

Bulldog, although you would think that would be the case. I don't think so. Perfect Game does a great job with scouting, and provides complete and detailed scouting reports on players that attend their events. Either WWBA, or showcases, etc. There are several players that they have ranked, that have not attended one of their events, but for them to give a detailed report, I am positive they would have to see them first hand. Considering as good as those two boys you mentioned are, I am kinda shocked they have not chose to attend at least one event over the course of their High School Careers. But like previously mentioned, this will have no bearing on their draft status. If you are good enough, they will come, and it is obvious from the number of scouts at Morro Bay games, Scott is good enough. Take care, and this is only my opinion. Cheers!

Ok bulldog but then the PG rating would have to read something like this:
"As per (insert name or organization here)the kid is a 9, but we havent seen him.

Could you rate the kid if you havent seen him?

If they have access to MLB Bureau reports they could just use that report and put their name on it.
My prediction is this, if there is a chance that Blue will go in the the top 10 rounds, Prospects Plus will rank him.
Backdash, I know you just threw out a number, but based on other kids around here and the numbers they got, this kid is a 9.5 maybe a 10. He is that good of a prospect.
My original post was not intended to slam PG, but to maybe give some awareness for kids that are not rated that are possible draftable kids.

Ya know what, if he's that good ( I'll take your word for it) then what does it matter what PG or Prospect Plus does?

Good point, backdash.

Scott Blue

Maybe this will help explain why he hasn't been "on the radar" until recently.

Bulldog. (ABD?) Don't worry. I know a player that is getting tremendous interest and his name is not mentioned anywhere on Perfect Game or Prospects Plus. Prospects Plus works closely with Perfect Game. He'll be mentioned when it counts.

Ya know....stories like that are why 11 year old kids are so infatuated with velocity and overthrowing.

Don't misunderstand...I am very happy for Blue's success and apparently bright future, but he should never have been given the opportunity to work through this.

Coaches see a remarkably fast pitcher, and everything else means nothing. "8.12 ERA and allowing 39 walks in 25 innings"...who leaves this kind of pitcher on a team? What does this say to the kids who are working on mechanics and hitting their spots? They are told not to worry about velocity (it will come with time), then kids like this come along with nothing but a cannon for an arm, and he gets all the innings? What would you do as an 12 year old teammate of this guy?

Again...I don't want to seem negative toward young Mr Blue, but the system that allowed kids like this to continue to throw are suspect.

CADad,

Nice job of shedding some light on this.

We faced Scott in our second league game and beat them pretty convincingly. He has really bad defense behind him. And the article is correct, he has certainly found his command of his pitches. I felt bad for him last year when we faced him, he was so bad after walking 8, and being removed he went to the bullpen and continued to throw, and people were afraid to go to the restroom, he was that wild. But all is well, he has certainly worked through it, and good luck to him in the future.

Sounds like a terrific story with a huge amount of improvement at an opportune time. For the player's best interests, I really hope he has a college as an option. If he is being looked at in the top 10 rounds and doesn't have college as an option, he has no leverage with which to negotiate and the money in rounds 6-10 decline pretty rapidly even with some leverage. As RHPmom and the Boras agent have said in the other recent topics, the most important issue here, IMO, is not getting rated by PG, it is getting rated highly by some colleges to afford this player the maximum chances of being successful both on and off the field.

quote:

If they have access to MLB Bureau reports they could just use that report and put their name on it.

Bulldog,

I'm not sure how much you know of PG, but you above statement tells me you don't know much. Do you really thing PG would plagerize a report? I can tell you that was one of the most ridiculous statements I have ever heard.

I have read several of PG reports and they are almost always on the money. Different scouts see some things differently, but I have yet to read a PG report on a players I knew where I couldn't see what they saw.

The reputation of PG amongst the pro scouting community is very high. Would they want to be associated with someone who was writing copied reports? I think not.

One example of PGs relationship with Major League Baseball is that their National Showcase is always held at a Big League ballpark.

One suggestion. Before you hit the send button on a post you might want to read it to see if it is insulting to anyone.

On another note: PG can't see everyone. They do a great job, but they may miss a kid here and there. It doesn't make that kid not a good player. But I do know that the PG staff is always on the phone trying to find the top players from around the country. If they don't care why are they making such an effort to cover all 50 states?

IrishDad,
I think you are over reacting a bit. The kid wasn't getting much playing time and was sent down to JV. It was only in an offseason program that a coach gave him innings in an attempt to develop his control.

The fact that he's managed to show adequate control and has been fairly successful means that the coach was justified in doing just what he did and should be commended.

Thanks Bob, that was nice of you.

Bulldog4ever,

You certainly got my interest on young Mr. Blue. Unfortunately we have not seen him pitch, but I asked a Scouting Director today if they had him in. Here is almost exactly what he told me. “ Yes, our guys have seen him. 6-2/190, 88-91, pretty much just a thrower for now. Could be a good Draft and follow.”

From this one club, you could say top 10 rounds is somewhat of a stretch. However, there are 30 clubs and I don’t doubt the 94 you mentioned earlier. 94 is a good number! 88-91 for just a thrower is interesting, but 94 is extra interesting. Has he signed with a college or Juco?

If you are close to the situation and care to email me some info, I’ll be happy to get someone out to see him and turn in a report. It's probably not necessary but I’ll admit it, we hate to miss a good prospect, but we do at times as we are not perfect. No matter what anyone thinks, this kid deserves to be ranked, we just don’t have a good feel as to how high yet. Same goes for Justin Robertson.

Thanks for bringing those two players to our attention.

My email – pgjerry@qwest.net

CADad,

Thanks for the link. While we put very little scouting value in newspaper articles, it does seem to explain why we hadn’t heard of Blue before now. Our people scour the web for stories on high school and college players. I bet I’ve read stories on over 100 players who are “likely” to get picked in the 1st round. Funny thing is probably less than 15 of those stories will turn out to be true.

One last thing about our rankings... There is usually a bigger difference between the #1 player and the #10 player in our estimation than there is between the #100 and #500 player. Think about that for awhile!

In the state by state rankings... There is often a bigger difference in ability between the #1 and #2 ranked players than the #2 and #20 ranked players. Please realize we are not talking about California, Florida or Texas here.

Jeff Zielke, Watertown High School. Third year as ace of varsity staff. Career stats with a month left in season: IP:202.3; ERA:1.20; K:231;
BB:56; CG:22; SHO:10: W/L record:22-8. Has broken several school records, will break season strikeout record(which he set last year) in his next start. Attended PG Showcase in 2001.Haven't been able to afford to send him to any others. No one coming to see him pitch. Looking at UWSP as a starter in the fall.

szlongball,

Jeff is in our rankings for the state of Wisconsin. However, I don't see any record of him attending a PG event at any time. Our database probably lists him at the wrong size if it hasn't been updated for awhile. How big is he now? We have him listed at 6-3/170 and my guess is he's bigger than that now.

In Wisconsin Andy Stack and Kirk Gardner (Blazers) cover it like a glove. Kirk is actually a full time employee of Perfect Game. Have you had any contact with them?

Best of luck to Jeff

Why are people always looking to slam someone ?

I know both Coach Stack and Gardner and if they are covering the area for PG then that is enuff for me.

By the way, I have no relationship with PG other than we attend their events which I have the utmost respect for and we are both on the same page in terms of getting kids exposure, be it for college coaches or pro scouts.

By the way, a report on kid cannot be written if he has not been seen in person !

Jeff attended the camp in Indianapolis. Was rated as a possible high D1 or draftable player then. No contact from either of the guys. Our catcher was contacted last year. I remember seeing a post two years ago from someone with the Blazers, and they were not impressed with Jeff. I think it was from the Legion State Tournament, and he had already thrown 135 innings since spring ball began. He is still 6'3 and 175 lbs.

If Jeff is a 2005 grad, he would have attended that “clinic” in Indianapolis before his freshman season. This wasn’t even a showcase event it was an instructional clinic that was actually set up by LSU. When it was discovered LSU could not work it because of NCAA regulations, we ran the camp with professional instructors.

If a player never attends anything after his freshman year he’s likely to be forgotten. That is unless the player lives in a baseball hotbed. I’m not sure where Watertown, WI is, but I’d venture a guess it’s not considered a baseball hotbed. There is only one DI school in the state of Wisconsin.

Players need to be proactive at least to the point of going outside the local area. Did he play Junior Olympics? Go to any Pro tryouts, Go to any college camps? Ask for any advice? Did you report his successes to those who could get the word out?

We didn’t forget Jeff, we just haven’t seen him since before his freshman year (more than 4 years ago). He was probably 14 years old at the time. And we still have him ranked as a senior in the state of Wisconsin. We must have liked him.

You say…

quote:

No contact from either of the guys (from the Blazers). Our catcher was contacted last year. I remember seeing a post two years ago from someone with the Blazers, and they were not impressed with Jeff.

Did you talk to Kirk Gardner who runs the Blazers program? There are lots of negative posts on every message board. I’m fairly certain neither Kirk or Andy Stack would not have posted anything negative about a player.

Sorry, but why didn’t you pursue this a bit farther? I don’t understand why you would wait until his final season is almost over and a couple weeks before the draft to talk to someone. Perhaps you thought he was doing so well, which I can understand, setting school records and all that everyone would come see him.

A topic that often pops up here is the old… If you’re good enough they will find you discussions. Unfortunately, people often find out the truth only it is too late. Of course, it is never too late if you’re good enough and want it bad enough. You just might have to take a different path to get there, is all.

Listen I really do feel sorry for Jeff. At this point I don’t know what to say. I wish we were discussing this a couple years ago rather than now.

On the bright side… There are players every year who get drafted out of small colleges. Hopefully if nothing better comes along Jeff will have an outstanding college career and who knows what could come out of it. We wish him the very best.

If there’s anything we can do to help feel free to email me. pgjerry@qwest.net

First, its Fresno State Bulldogs.
Second, I wasn't trying to put down PG in anyway. This is the tough part of a message board, you can't tell a person's conviction or tone of voice. I understand all what you are saying FLAGuy, but maybe you can practice what you preach because your comments have insulted me.
All I wanted was to get names out there of kids not rated for whatever reason, location, $$$$, etc. that have not yet to be seen by PG. That is all.

Jeff actually attended the Indianapolis camp in 2002. Varsity basketball coach sent him down to JV level because he was going to a baseball camp instead of scrimmage with the basketball team. Jeff played for the Baseball Factory in Tucson a couple of years ago. He has attended camps at University of Toledo and Cincinnati. Also attended several camps and tryouts. Unfortunately, we believed the varsity coach when he said he was getting calls about Jeff. Everyone wanted to watch his senior season. Not trying to complain, just can't believe that even state schools are not showing any interest beside Stevens Point. Also when checking state sites, don't see any mention of Jeff has a top pitcher. I know that most of the camps he went to last summer, he didn't register well because the legion coach had pitched him all week-end. I'm not saying he should get drafted, but based on what we hear about other players in the area, find it hard to believe those schools wouldn't at least take a look at Jeff. Player of the Year last year for conference. Will also be this year. Apparently his coach really dropped the ball last year. Our area is not a hotbed by any means. And if you don't play for the Blazers or any other travel team, I realize you won't get noticed. We can live with Jeff playing college baseball, just doesn't seem fair, if you don't have the money,or you coach doesn't lookout for you, you can be overlooked.

I looked Jeff up, he looks like the real deal to me. But instead of blaming everyone else, maybe you need to look in the mirror first.

What did you do to get him seen in Jr/Senior year?

Did you send letters/Video tapes to schools?

Did Jeff attend any of the FREE MLSB tryouts?

Who about the FREE area code games? As good as he is you should have been able to get someone to nominate him.

Your close to UWM did you contact Cory Bigler and ask him to take a look at Jeff?

Did you contact nay of the local colleges liek Ripon, St. Norberts, Viterbo etc.

I am not trying to be a jerk, although I know I sound like one. But it doesn't look to me like you did your home work. A coach/scout can't come to see a player if he doesn't know the player exists.

When the All State rankings come out in a couple of weeks, if Jeff is listed, I'll bet Dollars to donuts he gets some calls.

Best of Luck to Jeff

Didn't want to sound like I was trying to place the blame on everyone else. Yes, Jeff went to the Area Code tryout last year in Illinois. And yes, he has attended the MLSB in Madison the last 2 years. Also sent info to all the schools that Jeff had received letters from. Coach wouldn't let him go to Clemson for an unofficial visit, because if we had a rainout that week, they would play on the week-end and he needed to be there. Also, the coach never nominated Jeff or our catcher for all-district. Didn't even send anyone to the meeting. Got this info from a parent who was at the meeting. So I understand where you are coming from. But I feel that I did do as much as I could to get Jeff noticed. Stevens Point is the only school
in which we have had contact with the head coach. High Point in North Carolina and Carthage have shown some interest. Jeff wants to go where he can play ball for more than a couple of months. Also from everything I have read, you don't send out video unless the coach asks for it. A parent from another school in our conference, called asking for video tape of his son, because some of the schools he was looking at wanted a copy. And this parent knew I had videotaped the games.I e-mailed every newspaper article to every coach I had an e-mail for. Financially, just couldn't send Jeff out west to attend a college camp. Just came across this site and thought I would post. Didn't know if Jeff was ranked by Perfect Game or not.

Bulldog and szlongball,

I have absolutely no problem with anything that has been written here.

In fact, other than the timing of things, I respect what both of you have said.

Bulldog, you caused me to investigate Blue. Without your post, I might never have heard his name. While the report I got was a bit different than yours, it came from a most credible source and assured me that Blue is a legitimate prospect. I still need to gather some info on him to get him into our system. When I gather a bit more info we will get him into the rankings. Thanks for telling us. Feel free to email me any info that might help on Blue or anyone else. pgjerry@qwest.net

szlongball,

Please email me Jeff's schedule and when he will next pitch. I will have someone there. Everyone wants to help deserving young players.
Thanks,
pgjerry@qwest.net

quote:

Didn't want to sound like I was trying to place the blame on everyone else.

Sorry, I should have put phrased my response more diplomatically.

I could sense more frustration in your Email then anger, my choice of words was poor.

If nothing else, this should be a good example to all high school baseball parents and players about being proactive in getting your name out there. If you play in the southeast, Texas or Cal. it is really not an issue. However, if you are in the midwest, northeast or Canada, get your butt into high profile games, tourneys, events, showcases, etc. Most probably if your good enough, they will hear about you. However, why leave it to chance.

Eric Barrett from Marion Illinois. Lhp 6-3 180 88-91 fb that has topped out at 93 last summer. Has had every team out to see him. We had him along with Mike Broadway who is ranked #49 by baseball america and the consensus was that Eric was easily the better of the two. Signed juco and from most of the scouts that I talked to is a lock for the top ten rounds.

Savannah,
Actually it isn't necessarily that easy for the kids in CA, Texas, etc. either. There are parts of CA and Texas that are in the boonies and the scouts are going to concentrate on the usual So Cal and Silicon Valley hotbeds.

There are also situations where there is so much talent that a pretty good player with at least the ability to play college ball can get very little playing time and be overlooked unless they get out and showcase.

Players everywhere need to be proactive.

CADad is right. We drive to Orange County in the Summer to play baseball. We are about 60 miles away. Every scout we talked to since my 05 son was a Freshman had no idea where his school was. They do now. Get noticed and the scouts will take it from there.

Scott Blue-4th round Red Sox.

Not rated by Prospects Plus or PG?

bulldog,

If you check our home page you will see Mr. Blue listed. We should have ranked him higher is all.

By the way, thanks for the heads up on that kid. We owe you one. Your info was confirmed by a MLB SCouting Director, so we got him in the rankings.

Without you we would have missed him.