Question about stealing 2nd base

I heard this from a well respected track coach several years ago...and I have implemented it into our teaching.

Your first movement is with your right foot and right hand (like you are reaching to grab something beside you), this will jump start the crossover step and left arm ... gaining ground toward second in the process.

I know there are different ways of teaching this. We have put a stopwatch on it and we did see improvement over the method of pulling across the chest with the left arm.

Another one of those things that can be done both ways and be right. Some MLB players will open up with a jab step with their right foot and some will crossover first. That's the way I taught it.

Two key areas to work on are: get a good jump and run straight.
Lots of youngsters will wait too long fearing a pick and then once running will wander all over the place.

Thanks all. Cball, I agree that a good jump is of utmost importance. Although my boys are not very experienced, they have speed. More than 50% of the team runs extremely well and I'm trying to teach them to not fear the pick. Just focus on your key and go on first movement of the lead foot.

P4G

No man can climb out beyond the limitations he places on himself.

What age are they? Until about 11 to 12 stealing 2B is a very high percentage play.

They are 13 & 14. Middle school 8th graders. It's still a relatively high percentage play, especially with our speed. I'm just trying to prepare them for the next level where the percentage of decreases a little.

P4G

No man can climb out beyond the limitations he places on himself.

Percentage of success decreases a little.

P4G

No man can climb out beyond the limitations he places on himself.

I've always been a big supporter of the crossover step. What we teach is to punch with the left hand across the body while elbowing somebody behind you with the right elbow and pivot the feet. This helps explode the upper body and forces the feet to start moving.

I went to a clinic a couple of years ago (or whenever - it all runs together now) and they said to throw the right arm at second to create momentum. I'm probably doing a horrible job of explaining it here but it makes sense.

I agree with cball in that they need to go and go in a straight line. I see young guys all the time think by chugging hard they are doing good but they have no control over their body and end up weaving in and out with each step. That adds distance you got to cover to get to the bag. Plus the less movement you have the more efficient and more chance of being successful in a steal you are.

Teach open hands or relaxed fists to help relax the rest of the upper body. Teach start low and stride to high. Olden days they used to teach start low and run low. Well you're not avoiding sniper fire so there's no need to run low since it tends to slow you down. Start low and within 3 - 4 strides be taller but not completely upright - be athletic.

Coach, you explained it well enough foe me to get the mental picture of throwing the right arm. It's similar to what Goodie described above:

"Your first movement is with your right foot and right hand (like you are reaching to grab something beside you), this will jump start the crossover step and left arm ... gaining ground toward second in the process."

Personally, I like the crossover step, but can see the advantages of throwing the right arm.

Great info, thanks guys.

P4G

No man can climb out beyond the limitations he places on himself.

Several years ago I was trying as a coach to determine which was better. The cross over or the jab step. I was convinced the cross over was better but was wondering what other people thought. PG came back with a post and sent me in the mail a booklet on baserunning describing both the jab step technique and the crossover technique. I then worked my players on both and found the jab step technique was indeed faster , simply better. MLB teaches the jab step technique. I switched over to teaching the jab step techique vs the cross over.

Maybe Jerry will see this thread and help you out like he did me several years ago. I wanted to use what was best for our players and teach the best technique. After reading this booklet and teaching the jab step to my players I am convinced it is indeed the best teachnique. Give it a shot with a stop watch. Ask your players what they like best after you have actually taught it to them. I think you will like it.

Mayb I should explain it a bit. With the crossover your taking your left hand punching it towards 2b and bringing your left leg with it crossing over in a direct line towards 2b. With the jab step your punching your right hand towards 2b and turning your right leg while jabbing it towards 2b. This is the start of the process. The jab step is quicker and better. Work with both and see for yourself and good luck with it.

Thanks Coach.

P4G

No man can climb out beyond the limitations he places on himself.

Enjoy!
Optimal Base Stealing Technique

Coach May,
I agree with you. I did the same thing myself a number of years ago. It took a little bit for the kids to get used to it, but they did have better times. The second they move, they have gained some ground. You need to narrow their stance a bit so they can take that jab step without being too spread out to then get the left leg going. But I agree, it works well.

Top base stealer technique

If fast runners do this? Why would we teach avg to slow runners anything different? The "Freak" scenario has to come to an end. We need to understand what the great ones do?
There are no Freaks. If so, don't read "Talent is Overrated."

I'm with Coach Corral on this one. We teach the "Directional Step" approach. I'm also a firm believer at this age (MS and HS) that which foot you lead with isn't necessarily as important as your jump. We rarely go off a straight steal - unless te pitcher is a 1.5 to the plate and catcher isn't much better. Instead we find the pitchers tendency and usually break for 2nd before he even lifts his front foot with a righty on the mound. With a lefty it's an entirely different system.

Most HS and MS pitchers will fall into 1 of 4 categories:
1.) Timing - The pitcher will come set and go to the plate with the same timing almost every time. We count that out by spelling a word to find out what letter he is. Then we go right before that letter.

2.) Bills up - The pitcher will lift his head (bill) a certain number of times before he goes to the plate. Maybe it's once, maybe it more. We figure out which one he does and then when he lifts his head, we'll take off. If he mixes it up, we figure out how many times is the max he goes bill up. Once we figure that out, we go on his max every time.

3.) Back Knee Break - Some pitchers will collapse the back knee before they lift their left foot to go to the plate. As soon as we see the back knee collapse we take off.

4.) Front Shoulder Leak - This one is more rare. Pitcher will move his shoulder in one direction before he goes to the plate. It will be slight but some times it's there. The most common shoulder leak we see is when a pitcher comes set with an open stance so he can see the runner better. With an open stance he has to close him self back off and he usually does this by starting with his front shoulder. We see the shoulder close/dip, we go.

Of course we get banged on this from time to time, but our success in stealing far out weighs the times we get popped. We also teach to put your head down and go straight to the bag if they pick. We're counting on running 90 ft with a head start before they can make 2 throws and a tag to get us.

I hope that's fairly clear but it's a HUGE part of our offense. It also helps with our approach at the plate. We tell our guys that we don't care how far you hit the ball, find a way on base. Every time you get on base is a double with our system.

quote:

Originally posted by TheRick:
3.) Back Knee Break - Some pitchers will collapse the back knee before they lift their left foot to go to the plate. As soon as we see the back knee collapse we take off.

Some good stuff but #3 raises a question... back knee break is the first thing that happens on a pick move. Why do you use this instead of front heel lift?

Knee break is what we look for but opposite of this. Back knee movement precipitates a pick. We go on front knee movement.

I agree that it's odd - even more so on paper. It's one of those things that's a lot clearer when you can see it in person as opposed to reading it. That's why it's at the bottom of our list, but there is a difference in the way they load up on that back leg and when they pick.

We also read front hip leak - I forgot that one. When the pitcher comes set with his feet close together, often times he will be slow to the plate unless he does an extreme slide step. When he goes to the slide from a narrow stance, a lot of times his front hip will start before the rest of his body. Either way, we're going to run on that guy.

I know this sound crazy, I wasn't easily sold on it either. However now I swear by it and I credit a lot of our wins to this system.

quote:

Originally posted by TheRick:

3.) Back Knee Break - Some pitchers will collapse the back knee before they lift their left foot to go to the plate. As soon as we see the back knee collapse we take off.

Good stuff. We use to use back of the knees as well, but we have gone to reading the pitcher's heels instead. Two reasons:

1: A good balk move will eat you up. We play with 2 umps until the playoffs and a slight flex of the front knee is practically imperceptible from behind.

2:The baggier the kids pants get the tougher it is to do. I know it sounds crazy, but a kid wearing fairly tapered pants is easier to read the back of his knee. The loose fitting pants everyone wears in our area now makes it tough.