SCAC realignment

First I've heard of this, and as an Austin College alum, I tend to keep up with it pretty well.

Very interesting. I know, if nothing else, travel costs for these D3 schools has to be pretty high (again, for the budgets these institutions have) given the location of all the schools.

With 4 of the 5 remaining SCAC schools from Texas, I would bet any new schools will be closer in proximity compared to those who are leaving next year.

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That's news to me as well. I'm with AW concerning the travel costs.

Our daughter will be attending Centre College next year as a freshman and playing softball. I'll have to show her this.

Questions: Where did University of Dallas come from and where did DePauw University go?

Thanks BOF.




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My son will be attending Trinity next year and I knew this was coming so it is no surprise to me. Someone told me some of the prospective schools, but like a lot of things I don't remember the names.

I do know that with Birmingham-Southern coming in that it made sense for the Eastern schools to form a common league. Trinity is going to loose a good rival with Millsaps.

Infielddad will jump in here eventually with some more information.

Let's just regard what I say as "conjecture."

Expect this new former SCAC member conference to add Berry College (GA) to the mix for the inaugural season, and they will be seeking probably one more additional member after that season.

DePauw is leaving to the NAC (I think that is what it is called), a conference that also includes Wooster.

UDallas was a D3 independent.

Some schools/programs were breaking the banks going to Trinity and I know some mentioned spending an enormous part of their budget going there and not winning for years (in a couple cases, decades) without winning.

It seems both conferences will remain strong, though. I'm not sure what Texas schools might be good pickups for the SCAC.

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Thanks JP!



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I also hear that Colorado College was planning to leave the SCAC before this stuff even began. I think they may be contemplating a move to D2 to join the RMAC, which may save them money in the long run for travel.

quote:

Originally posted by JPontiac:
Let's just regard what I say as "conjecture."

Expect this new former SCAC member conference to add Berry College (GA) to the mix for the inaugural season, and they will be seeking probably one more additional member after that season.

DePauw is leaving to the NAC (I think that is what it is called), a conference that also includes Wooster.

UDallas was a D3 independent.

Some schools/programs were breaking the banks going to Trinity and I know some mentioned spending an enormous part of their budget going there and not winning for years (in a couple cases, decades) without winning.

It seems both conferences will remain strong, though. I'm not sure what Texas schools might be good pickups for the SCAC.

I'm with you... not sure who near/in Texas would be a good addition, who hasn't already been affiliated with many of these schools in the ASC at some point in the past. The ASC is still going strong, of course, so there would be no reason to jump to the SCAC, IMHO.

If my memory serves me correctly, it was a number of these Texas schools who jumped to the SCAC, after leaving the ASC. I thought it was a good move, given the drastically different tuition structures while they were in the ASC, as well as other significant differences.

From the Trinity website yesterday.

Trinity Committed to SCAC; Excited About Future

San Antonio – Despite an announcement about major changes in the membership of the Southern Collegiate Athletic Conference, Trinity University remains committed to the conference, and is excited about what the future holds.

Seven out of 12 member schools announced that they will withdraw from the SCAC following the 2011-12 academic year. Those leaving the conference are Birmingham-Southern College, Centre College, Hendrix College, Millsaps College, Oglethorpe University, Rhodes College, and Sewanee: The University of the South.

Five institutions will remain in the SCAC: Trinity, Austin College, Colorado College, Southwestern University, and the University of Dallas – which will open its first season in the conference in 2011-12.

The announcement was made following yesterday’s meeting of the Board of Directors, consisting of university presidents.

Remaining as Commissioner of the SCAC will be Dwayne Hanberry, who has worked in the conference for the past 16 years. Any inquiries about future membership in the SCAC should be directed to the SCAC Office.

“Obviously, this news puts Trinity and the remaining members of the SCAC in a difficult situation,” said Trinity Director of Athletics Bob King, “but we feel confident that under the leadership of Commissioner Dwayne Hanberry that we will pull through this, and eventually, be better than ever.”

New members have already been approached about joining the SCAC. The goal is to have an eight to 10-member conference, which will continue to be part of the NCAA Division III. The SCAC is committed to the philosophy of having members with the highest academic standards, while maintaining competitive athletics programs.

According to Mr. King, “Trinity’s goal is to continue to be a nationally-competitive athletics program, and we hope that new members of the SCAC will have similar goals. We are already looking at ways to develop competitive schedules in all sports for the future. We are open to any and all possibilities moving forward.”

Tiger teams have won 11 President’s Trophies, as the best overall program in the conference. Trinity won the trophy – a railroad bell – seven consecutive years, from 1993-94 to 1999-2000. A four-year streak was produced from 2001-02 to 2004-05. Trinity began competition in the conference in the 1989-90 season.

Trinity’s men’s and women’s teams have captured 144 SCAC Championships over the years, including five during the 2010-11 season: men’s and women’s s****r, women’s swimming and diving, baseball, and men’s tennis.

Some general thoughts on the new changes.
It appears the new league was formed due to increasing travel costs and time away from class. This isn't the result of baseball, which has always had divisional play.
This is other sport related and primarily because Trinity and Colorado College were "teamed" together for weekend games. Thus, for s****r, volleyball and basketball, for instance, a school like Millsaps might have Friday games in San Antonio and Sunday games in Colorado, and need to be back in Jackson before the start of classes on Monday morning. This type of schedule impacts costs, logistics and the classroom.
Going forward, the biggest issue for each conference is in football.
Applying the changes to baseball, each of the conferences will be impacted, but in different ways.
For the new one, the transition for regular season should be seamless.
The impact is post season competition. With its inaugural 2012-2013 season, and for 2 seasons after that, this new conference will not receive an automatic qualifying bid for post season baseball. Teams in the new conference will only be considered for a Pool C bid, and even the conference winner may well end just watching post-season Regional competition. Even if one team is selected to make it, they won't know until 3 weeks after their season ends. Equally, for Pool C consideration, that conference will lose it strongest team with national recognition in Trinity and SOS as applied for post season consideration might become a factor against them.
Thus, players at Birmingham Southern, who have not been eligible for conference tournament or post-season play for 4 years, will have next Spring to be eligible and then be back where post season play will be problematic. Additionally, players like JPontiac and his teammates will be playing the waiting game as they did this season, even if they went 40-0 in regular season play.
On the SCAC side, I think it is very positive the Commissioner stayed with those schools. That sends a strong message.
Further, the SCAC will retain the NCAA recognition and its tournament winner will receive the automatic bid to the Regional. Other baseball teams will still be eligible for Pool C consideration.
Additionally, Bob King, the AD at Trinity, has done a masterful job of making Trinity a nationally recognized D3 program, in multiple sports, based on the Emory model of academic and athletic excellence.
I believe the combination of these bode well for the SCAC in attracting new members.
It appears Colorado College may exit but that does not impact baseball. That school does not have a baseball team.
With all of that said, this is not a fun time for those running the SCAC. They want a conference with national recognition for excellence in the classroom and on the fields.
Travel costs and logistics led 7 schools to form their own conference the year after DePauw left for reportedly similar reasons. Attempting to add 4-5 schools with Phi Beta Kappa Chapter recognized academics and aspirations to compete at the highest levels of DIII competition will be challenging.
There appears to be a good amount of information that Centenary, transitioning from DI to DIII, will become of member of the SCAC. That would be good for baseball and the conference.
With Bob King involved, and the success and recognition he has in DIII athletics, I believe the Texas SCAC schools will be able to add 3-4 quality academic institutions and continue the conference in baseball competition at the highest levels of national DIII.
It will be a challenge.
However, when Bob arrived at Trinity, their athletic program was average at best. He built it with quality coaches and hires to where they can compete for national championships and win them. Trinity helped force some of the schools now leaving build their programs to the level of quality that now exists with their exit.
It is a bit sad that the Trinity-Millsaps rivalry might end. Personally, it would not surprise me if it transitions to and continues as out of conference play.
Change is never easy.
As I view and summarize these changes in baseball, the players in the new conference get significantly impacted in terms of post season play opportunities.. Additionally, it is always the challenge to compete against the best. Trinity baseball, winning 5 of the last 8 conference championships since 2004, is with the best. To be honest, I don't know if players of the quality of JPontiac would be at Rhodes if that and other schools didn't upgrade to try and beat the best, like Trinity. The question is whether these aspects are off set by travel reduction and whether the new conference will continue to strive for the athletic excellence that membership in the SCAC was driving.I hope both turn out with a resounding yes.
For those remaining in the SCAC, the commitment to level of play and post-season opportunities remain unchanged. The uncertainty is who will be the new conference members and will they have the same level of academic excellence which made the SCAC such a great conference over an extended period of time.
Uncertainty all around, for sure.

The President of Hendrix provided an interview on the vision he has for student/athletes within the new conference.
Here is that section of the Q&A in which the vision is summarized:

"It seems like you are trying to create a league that reflects as pure as form of athletics as you can make it in an imperfect world. (Division III has no athletic schools).

Cloyd: We are striving for balance with the whole person. Our emphasis is on the student and giving as many students as possible the total experience within the institution and not just the athletic experience. We want good teams and good athletes and playing opportunities within the overall educational experience, which I think what college athletics ought to be. We want a good athletic experience and a good educational experience and a good class experience, which means you need to limit the possibility of missed class time. We also want the student-athlete to be able to participate in co-curricular experiences like theater."

This is very interesting. So many times on this site there have been threads which talked about college baseball in terms of school/education/baseball and sacrificing on social and other aspects.
In a thread earlier I had summarized life of most Stanford student athletes where roughly 1 or so hours per week were available after sports, school, and sleep. In other words one excels in competition in the classroom and on the field.
President Cloyd, to my reading, seems to advocate striving to be good in the classroom, good on the field, good in other aspects of collegiate life and making sure there is time and involvement in such activities as theater.
In another site, a poster summarized this view as being a new Division IV within the NCAA.
I would be very interested in views on this seemingly new vision of collegiate life for the student athlete, which appears to be the goal of this new conference affiliation.

Wow, great information IFD.

I think as a President of a University he should have these goals, (and I am sure the Stanford President has the same objective) however in a competitive world it I think it is not realistic. (or they will not have a competitive baseball program) Certainly a tighter geographic conference will make it easier for the schools, but I will be surprised if they will be able to compete at the highest athletic level other than Birmingham who is dropping down from a D1.

I fully expect my son to not have much time other than class, homework, working out, baseball and a bit of hanging out with his buddies. Theater not so much…..

I remember life in a D3/NAIA D2 setting... and there was certainly no time during the season for what Dr. Cloyd is talking about, and I'm not sure I'd have had it any other way.

D3 is already limited in # of "official" off-season workouts, and is limited to 40 reg season games during the season.

The "D4" comment has some validity.

All I know is during the season it was b'fast, morning scheduled classes, lunch, and on the field for the next 6 hrs on game day (DHers), shower, study, bedtime. On off-days, it was lifting and practice in the afternoon. My wife (fiance, at the time) didn't see me much in the spring the two years we were together in college.

I do remember some of our pre-med guys missing practices to take care of their afternoon labs.

But I never once felt like I was missing out on something else. I certainly never wished I had more time for yet another extra-curricular that devoured more of my time.

That being said, we weren't in the SCAC back when I was playing, so the travel wasn't nearly as significant, which I understand would lead to more missed classes. The current SCAC is very spread out, even compared to D1 conferences.

It almost sounds like he is describing intramural sports. Which BTW I think are great, but are just not sanctioned sports. I am also sure there are lots of D3 programs like he is describing, however they will not be expected to be in post season play, or consistently have winning seasons.

quote:

Originally posted by infielddad:

There appears to be a good amount of information that Centenary, transitioning from DI to DIII, will become of member of the SCAC. That would be good for baseball and the conference.

Infielddad - Looks like you had good information back in June. The announcement was made today that Centenary is moving to the SCAC for 2012-2013. See link to the article below...

http://www.gocentenary.com/Vie...2887&DB_OEM_ID=17900

cheapseats,
Thank you for posting the new information and the release.
This looks like wonderful news and a great first addition by the SCAC in building back to at least 8 members.
I know the Trinity players loved the trip(during Spring break) to New Orleans when our son played.
From a baseball perspective, this really seems to be a very good result for the SCAC remaining members and for the student-athletes at Centenary who choose to remain after the transition.

On the surface it looks like a great add to the conference. The game schedules are not out yet but my wife and I have been talking about visiting on some of the more interesting away series. This certainly looks like one to consider.

Thanks for the post!

BOF - It is a 5 hour drive from Centenary (Shreveport, LA) to New Orleans but maybe they could get Univ. of New Orleans to join the conference too, that would be a fun visit.

I get my coworkers in California always thinking Houston and Dallas are next door to each other...and essentially suburbs of one another. Sort of like LA and SF are.

quote:

Originally posted by cheapseats:
BOF - It is a 5 hour drive from Centenary (Shreveport, LA) to New Orleans but maybe they could get Univ. of New Orleans to join the conference too, that would be a fun visit.

Who said anything about wanting to see my son in New Orleans.

Don't confuse us out here, everyone in California already knows that JR Ewing and Matt Houston are neighbors....

Heck, it is only 75 miles from Austin to San Antonio and that trip can take 3 hours many times.
Between the freeway construction on I35 in Austin that was ongoing for close to 10 years and the 50mph speed trap just South of San Marcos that can catch many an inexperienced out of stater , that can be be the trip fraught with delay.
With that said, the bus trip our son and his teammates dreaded was from SAT to play a doubleheader against HSU and McMurry in Abilene, and then back, all in one day(or arriving back in the early A.M, usually on a weekday/school day.
The drive our son dreaded was part of his trip home each Spring and return each August. The drive from SAT to El Paso when temps are around 105 and up,. something like 10 or so hours, and not exactly like driving through Yosemite...if you get my drift.

quote:

Originally posted by BOF:

Who said anything about wanting to see my son in New Orleans.

Well, you can have a fun visit (or good parade) just about anywhere in Louisiana during Mardi Gras.