Scouts Finding Players They Don't Intend To Scout?

Marlins,

Baseball America has not even done any 2010 rankings let alone 2011. PGCrosschecker has a top 25 2011, but there are no two players from the same school. However, there is one, from what I believe to be, your school.

To answer your question... Yes it often happens that scouts come to see a certain player or two and end up liking someone they didn't know about before hand.

There is a big advantage playing with (and against) the guys who are considered the top prospects.

There will always be cases where a scout will keep their eyes open for other players, if you are a hitter that gets good cuts against a pitcher that is being scouted, they will take note. That being said, you may not get a lot of scouts coming around to check out the players until their senior year, there may be a lot more college coaches, but not that many scouts until their draft year.

What I have seen is that scout come to see a specific player. Usually pitchers. When they are done the scouts pack up and leave. They are busy dudes.

The way you can get noticed is if you do something amazing while the player they are looking at is playing. Example: You hit a 400 ft bomb off a top ranked pitcher. You are a catcher and throw out a super fast runner they are scouting...twice. You make a diving play and have the mind set to look and throw out an advancing runner showing not only heads up but superior arm strength.

"Be ready to be in the right place at the right time."

I've observed an interesting phenomena in this regard.
I'll call it the attendance/attention ratio.
It works like this:

The more scouts on-site, the less attention is paid to any player other than the "assignment".

One example (of many) I've noticed over the years:

Mike Pelfry pitching a high school game in a Kansas City suburb. 20+ scouts, with radar guns up for every Pelfry pitch, were extremely attentive.

Between innings, and when Pelfry's team was hitting, each (scout's) head pivoted, mechanically and in unison, to face/schmooze with their nearest colleague, returning to the field only during Pelfry's next inning warm-up.

The previous summer, I saw Pelfry pitch a few innings in a tournament game, way out in west Kansas. With far fewer (2-3) scouts around, there was significantly less between-inning banter and considerably more attention paid to the game (players) in general.

_________

Clearly, the tournament teams were more talented than the high school teams back in Pelfry's Kansas City start. And wider scouting attention is obviously paid in major travel team tournaments, (sanctioned World Series etc.). But, when the stud pitches a low profile game and, in front of large number of MLB scouts, I've noticed that general scouting "antenna" are often switched off.

Mike Pelfrey pitched in our Area Code games, his agent was then and now Scott Boros. Mike at age 16, also traveled with our Goodwill Series team to Australia and our pitching coach was Gary Wheelock *Mariners minor league pitching coach]. At that time;
we all agreed he pitched similar to Kevin Brown.

The scouts are have assignment and reports to send to the front office, naturally if a player runs to 1b in
3.9 or hits a HR [with a wood bat], notes will be made for a later "follow up".

In our 1st year of the Area Code games in 1987, the scouts were dozing until the Dodgers Area Code team at 11 PM brought in to pitch a 5'9 LHP from Santa Monica HS. On his first "warm up" pitch every radar gun flicked on at the same time and recorded a 90 mph fast ball. This LHP was not drafted from HS and "undrafted" from 4 years a Lewis and Clark College.

Signed as "free agent" and pitched 7 years in the Major Leagues.

"That is the rest of the story"

Well I can tell you from personal experience that scouts do notice other players when coming to see a player. They are always looking for players. If a player shows ability they are going to notice. They are not so locked on the guy they are watching that they can not notice another potential prospect. He may not be a draft guy but he may indeed be a player that their friend "ie College coach" may indeed want to see. Or they may be an underclassman that they will take note of and make sure they keep tabs on. College coaches will notice other players. There have been many instances where coaches have come to see one of our players and made sure they stopped by to get contact information on another player that impressed them.

When scouts were present at all of our games Matt Harrisons Sr year many wanted to know who the lanky ss was. They were back the next year to take a closer look. They stayed in touch and drafted him his sr year. That players sr year two jr's were noticed and they made contact with several college programs about these players. If your son plays on a team with guys that are being scouted either by pro scouts and or college coaches its a good thing. And it can lead to some nice contacts.

I can distinctly remember scouts coming to watch several upperclassmen when my team played the Bayside Yankees. I made the play of my life and every scout there knew my name after that game. I saw many of them at MY games when I was a senior to watch me.

As an underclassman, they DEFINITELY weren't there to see me.

Even back in the old days, I would see scouts who would spend most their time chatting rather than watching. We see some that do that now days, too.

However, those are not the good ones! IMO Some scouts can talk for hours without missing a pitch. Some of the very best scouts in all of baseball are the college recruiters (some college recruiters).

Every player at some point has to be spotted by someone in order to become the one scouts come to watch. How does that happen if no one is looking for players other than the guy they came to see?

Most often those players with outstanding ability stand out like a sore thumb (whether they are well known or not). A good recruiter or good scout will spot them. Other times it just takes one play or at bat to create serious "interest". Read what "redbird" posted... it happens a lot! Last year, there was a player drafted in the first round who was unknown entering his senior year in high school. He hit a home run off of a high profile pitcher that was a projected first rounder with a pile of scouts in attendance. That one at bat ended up changing his life!

When Mike Pelfrey pitched in the PG WWBA Championship he was scouted heavily. However the team he was pitching against had several draft prospects. The team he pitched for also had several draft prospects. Those in that game who were not so well known, had the chance of a life time!

Coach May, might be familiar with another HS in NC that would be another example of finding more than what scouts came to see. TC Roberson, Ashville NC.

It happens nearly every day that someone new is discovered by the scouting community.

quote:

Originally posted by Coach May:
Well I can tell you from personal experience that scouts do notice other players when coming to see a player. They are always looking for players. If a player shows ability they are going to notice. They are not so locked on the guy they are watching that they can not notice another potential prospect.

Coach May,
Granting that you have much more experience in this arena than I, my slight change to your above comment would be the word "may", instead of "are"...going to notice.

I have seen it both ways, where a scout didn't notice someone new and other scouts where they did. I suppose that's why some scouts make a name for themselves and others don't last.

Thinking about our geographical differences, I wonder if that has anything to do with it? Obviously certain areas of the country are considered more talent rich. Do you think they send better scouts to those areas?

JMO, but I think that this has a lot to do with your coach.

I know of two occassions where a coach (same coach) asked college coaches and scouts to stick around to watch relievers. In both cases both players were given scholarships and in one case scouts began following a player who was drafted out of HS.

Of course, this coach had a reputation for picking players for his team who had talent.

Yes, the scouts do have a tendency to chit chat among themselves, but they also know what they are looking for, and many do scout for college coaches.

Back when I played several of us on a Legion team benefitted from playing with a five tool prospect. While we were on radar screens this teammate got us a lot more visibility.

A friend's younger brother never pitched until halfway through his senior year of high school when injuries struck a couple of pitchers. He was not a college prospect as a catcher.

In a high school playoff game he outpitched the pitcher the scouts came to see. He threw a two hitter and struck out seventeen. He went from not planning on playing college ball to being drafted and signed. He made it to AAA.

re: "Some scouts can talk for hours without missing a pitch."

Perhaps, but how much detail are they seeing and remembering, while watching baseball and in simultaneous (multiple) conversations?

During the last decade, overwhelming nueroscientific evidence reveals multi-tasking as a functional myth, and that everyone's performance suffers while trying to do two things at once.

MIT professor of neuroscience Earl Miller says: “People can’t multi-task very well, and when people say they can, they’re deluding themselves".

Two years ago my son was a Jr in hs and we went to play Rocky Mount HS in a non conf dh on a Saturday. We were asked him our RHP Chris Luck was going to throw that day. I said yes in one of the games. When we arrived there were 10-12 scouts at the game waiting to watch Luck pitch the opener. The game started out and all of them were focused in on Luck getting gun readings etc. I noticed a CF for Rocky Mount that day. A kid named Brian Goodwin. Fast , strong , cannon for an arm etc. He went 3-3 that first game off Chris who was sitting at 89-92. My son went 3-3 with 2 hr's. After the game every scout wanted information on Goodwin and May. I sent PG a message the next day on Goodwin. Im sure he remembers that. Goodwin was the AFLAC mvp in this years game. My son really jumped on the radar with the pro scouts after that as well. The scouts stuck around to see Goodwin and May in the second game instead of heading off to the next game in the area to see another big arm just down the road. In that game a JR RHP Pratt Maynard dominated for us and he then was on the radar as well. One of the scouts played at NC State and called his old college coach. Maynard is now at NC State on scholarhip.

The fact is if you are a player and scouts are coming to see another player you "may" get noticed. And if you have a good game or a do something that catches their eye you "will" get noticed. Luck went in the draft that year to Tampa. Goodwin signed with UNC and will be a nice draft pick. Jeff went to UNC and turned down a pre draft offer from LA to go to UNC. Pratt is at NC State.

Every game I go to I am there to see someone. Sometimes I know exactly who I need to look at. But I am always looking for that "other guy". Why? Because I know they are out there. All you have to do is keep your eyes open and look for them. If may be that you have a player that is not a draft guy but a very good player. Those scouts be it college or pro played somewhere and have a tremendous amount of baseball contacts. "Hey I like your first baseman. Is he going anywhere. Well I know the coach at NC Wesleyan I am going to call him and tell him he needs to see him." That was the comment I got from a scout for Cincy. The kid is at NC Wesleyan and is slated to start 1b for them this year.

It happens all the time.

By the way PG - My 2011 team is "Loaded"

I suppose I owe an explanation for my comment since you were kind enough to take the time to example yours.

Scout shows up to look at 2 way player who was pitching. This kid and the pitcher on the other team are both sitting 87-90. The kid he came to see has ok outing, 5K's and 5 hits 2BB over 5IP and goes 0-4 at the plate with 4 K's...

Other pitcher struck out 13 over 6 IP and dominated the game. Scout left after the 5th when the player he came to watch got pulled. Scouted player actually wound up throwing a tantrum after he struck out the 4th time (playing 3rd base)...the scout had already left.

The player with the 13K's never heard from the scout or that team.

It was funny, because the two pitchers wound up on the same summer team. The scouted one told the unscouted one, he was the best pitcher he'd ever seen in HS.

Maybe it's just a beauty is in the eye of the beholder story, or maybe something else, we'll never know.

BTW, they are both playing D1 now.

I see your point CPLZ. And I am sure that happens. But just like anything there are good and then there are not so good. A guy really looking to find players certainly would have made sure he wrote down the other pitchers name and contact info. But it sounds like it ended up working out ok for both of them.

quote:

The player with the 13K's never heard from the scout or that team.

CPLZ,
That is not unusual, scouts don't always personally contact every player they see and think has talent. That doesn't mean he didn't notice the pitcher with 13 K's.

Haverdad,

Multi tasking is a must for scouts. And contrary to what most might think, it does not take total concentration in order to notice someone that displays outstanding talent.

A good example of multi tasking by scouts took place this past October in Jupiter Florida. You can be riding a golf cart between fields and spot something special from 150 yards away.

One example... I was in a golf cart betweem the Red and Blue (Cardinals/Marlins) fields a couple years ago and noticed a left handed pitcher from a long distance. I thought he looked real good even from that distance, so I drove up to the right field foul line to watch him. He looked very good so the next inning I went behind home plate to watch him throw.

By the time all this took place there were more than 50 scouts behind home plate watching a pitcher no one had ever heard of. Long story short... His name was Jeff Locke and the following spring he was drafted in the second or third round.

The real good ones tend to stick out like a sore thumb. You would be surprised as to how much detail you can see and remember. Once you see it you quit talking and start writing.

Can't tell you how many times I've seen a group of scouts swapping stories in the stands and then all of a sudden stop everything and start writing notes.

We are confusing two seperate things here.

1 - Scout is at a game to glue in a certain player who has already been identified.

2 - Scout is at a game and identifies a player in addition to the one that caused him to attend the game.

Once a player is identified, he often becomes part of #1. He immediately becomes someone to glue in on.

True multi tasking for a scout would be "gluing in" on every player and that is virtually impossible.

The other side of the coin is why we, as travel/showcase teams, play in events against great competition---the scouts may be there to see a player on the other team and one or two of our guys have a great game they now are on the radar screen

Like I have said numerous times---it ain't about winning it is about being seen

What an interesting topic to follow. . . each opinion is so unique yet all aiming toward the same goal. .

Might I add a personal note, as I notice many of you target "game preformance" statistics for the players to be noticed, well they also notice the athletes behavior in other areas.

Remind your players that scouts/college coaches are watching their behavior ALL the time, even when caught up in what seems to be a very distracting conversation with their peers.

uh oh, just for the record, I am from somewhere that really does know some correct sentence structure and spelling, I just don't know how to proof read yet. . .

We "are" from. . not "am" from. . . (hiding my face and quietly sneaking out. . .)

gobig, I agree that scouts/college coaches are watching behavior all the time. We had a scout at our high school to assess Josh Fields during a practice his senior year. While doing so he noticed my son and did an assessment of him also and liked what he had seen. This scout made it a point to impress on my son that he needed to work on his mental toughness which was a very good observation on the scout's behalf. I had to agree with that also. My son's baseball career did not go far after that but what that scout said to him paid dividends when my son entered the workforce because he now understands a bit more about that aspect as it pertains to everyday life. This particular scout was a bird dog associated with the Royals' organization.