Serious advice needed..college student in need of baseball advice

quote:

I still have a sour feeling knowing I can still play.

Wouldn't you have more of a sour feeling if you didn't try and spent the next three years in the stands mumbling to yourself you're better than some pitcher out there who showed up next year?

Gametime - I am never one to tell anyone to not chase a dream. I think rather than wonder "what if", you should go for it if that's what's in your heart. However, knowing the school that you reference, I can tell you that there are pitchers sitting on that bench that had unbelievable HS careers and multiple offers that chose to come there for book money. I guess what I suggest is that you evaluate the reality of the situation. Shoot for the stars, but make sure you have a plan B as what you're aiming for is a difficult journey.

Best wishes whatever you decide to do.

Lafmom, appreciate the kind words. I do know the severity of the situation, but I also know how close I came this fall and how well I can do. I have a good back up plan ( finance degree and law school afterwards) but I can't help but wonder what if. I know if I do make the team, I will be used minimaly, and I am fine with that.

quote:

Originally posted by RJM:

quote:

I still have a sour feeling knowing I can still play.

Wouldn't you have more of a sour feeling if you didn't try and spent the next three years in the stands mumbling to yourself you're better than some pitcher out there who showed up next year?

Gametime - IMO - I think that RJM's advice cuts right to the heart of it.

Given what you have described - Its probably too early to pack it in - IMO.

Gametime -- Go for it. Now, as you go for it, consider the following:

-- Take some quiet time to come to grips with what you really want. What dream is it that knaws at your belly, and won't let go. If it is to play where you are (to be baseball's Rudy), stay ... if it is to just make a team, then consider going somewhere else where you can achieve your athletic and academic goals.

-- If you decide you want to make it where you stand, then schedule a meeting with the Head Coach where you can tell him that you intend to make his team, and contribute to the team, and ask him what you need to do to make that happen. LISTEN very carefully. And be ready to hear the hard stuff. Remember: the outcome is not in doubt, the purpose of the conversation is to find out what you have to do to achieve the goal. Keep your eye on the ball.

-- Then, commit your goal to writing; develop a plan for success; determine what you are willing to give up in order to do the work to achieve your goal; then DO IT NOW. Go forth with absolute faith in your dream, and your ability to achieve your goal.

This is the same formula for success that catapulted millions to great achievement in every field ... including the baseball field. If you want a good book to help support you in the process, go buy Jack Canfield's The Success Principles. Better yet, read a chapter a day, and apply the lessons to realizing your dream.

Please let us know what your number is when you make the team.

Go get baseball ready and go for it.

Young man at Clemson walked on never thinking he would make the team. In his second year. He has only caught in one game and had 3 or 4 at bats and is a bull pen catcher ( a thankless position) and loves every minute of it.

Do you feel you have done everything in your power to accomplish this goal of playing college ball?

If the answer is yes then take comfort in the fact it wasn't meant to be.

If the answer is no then work your butt off and put yourself in the best possible position in order to make it.

If you feel you are a marginal player at this level then you may want to consider moving down a level and get playing time. I like the fact that you said you would content getting very little playing time because that shows (at least to me it does) that you are about the team and not yourself.

It's your call but based on what I have heard you need to start working out to get back in shape.

When I read that you didnt get a roster spot because of "certain complications" a red flag goes up for me.

Can you explain that statement?

Gametime,
Only you know what is in your heart. Southpaw provided solid advice, like another posters tag line reads, Believe, Plan, Do You sound like someone with a bright future regardless of the path you choose, be sure to please yourself along the way. Leave the "what ifs" for the weak of will.

I can't see a down side to trying again.

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
When I read that you didnt get a roster spot because of "certain complications" a red flag goes up for me.

Can you explain that statement?

"Certain complications" are normal at 20, 30, 40. Life is rarely cut & dried, black and white.

After the season is done, I'd ask the coach your chances, what you need to show in the fall to make it. If he hesitates a nano-second, you have a shot. Take it.

DAD04

I sure I get as smart as you before I die

I asked a simple question which to me is reasonable since the statement he made reeks of "excuse"

Lets stop all the touchy feely stuff here--what are the complications as to why he did not make the roster? Lets get real so we can offer advice on fact not assumptions--

Where does it " reek of excuse " ?????

" Certain complications " does not necessarily mean an " excuse ".

I get the feeling were are talking with a pretty talented player here.

DONT EVER QUIT.............

If you do you will regret it.......and I am not talking just baseball here.......do not spend any part of your life with regret of...I could have, should have or would have..........

If you dont make it, then you gave 100% , went to a great school ahd ad great experience and got a degree.........and you still love the game..

In baseball all careers come to an end.......one way or another..........make sure it ends on your terms....

SSmom

The young man wants advice and mentions complications as the reason he did not get the roster spot---how can one give advice if one does not know what the complications/reasons are?

All this touchy feely **** doesnt give him the answer he needs and without facts you cannot evaluate the situation---at least that is the way I see it !


Question: what does a pink poodle have to do with this?

Gametime24,

quote:

Am I chasing a far-fetched goal?

We dont know all of the ins and outs of your particular situation.
What I do know is that your goals are only as far fetched as you make them out to be. If your
" certain complications " are ones that have nothing to do with your abilities or your desire, then keep rolling ahead and go for your dreams.

Never say never kid,..and that's not fluff or hot air. It is the truth. Where there is a will there is away. Let nothing or nobody stop you. Find what you need to work on, be 100% honest & truthful with yourself.
Follow your dream(s). Have no regrets!

Certain Complications should be explained. It could have a bearing on the advice given.

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
DAD04

I sure I get as smart as you before I die

I asked a simple question which to me is reasonable since the statement he made reeks of "excuse"

Lets stop all the touchy feely stuff here--what are the complications as to why he did not make the roster? Lets get real so we can offer advice on fact not assumptions--

An uncomplicated college baseball team does not exist. There is nothing simple or easy about 30 or 40 college athletes on a team. Complications are normal and get dealt with by coaches and players, which is why the better coaches and players win year after year. It's like saying water is wet. Obsticles are opportunities for growth. You find a way around "certain complications", whatever they are. Their nature or specifics is irrelevant.

quote:

Obsticles are opportunities for growth. You find a way around "certain complications", whatever they are. Their nature or specifics is irrelevant.

TRhit, to answer your question the complications were that the team already had 18 scholarship pitchers this year and chose not to end up taking a walk-on this year. They reccomended I pursue a transfer elsewhere at a D-1 but I chose not to, if that answers some questions.

quote:

Originally posted by gametime24:
TRhit, to answer your question the complications were that the team already had 18 scholarship pitchers this year and chose not to end up taking a walk-on this year. They reccomended I pursue a transfer elsewhere at a D-1 but I chose not to, if that answers some questions.

Hmmmm ... sure doesn't sound like an excuse to me.

Are you comfortable enough with the coaching staff to sit down and talk with them about next year or do you feel like the 'advice' to transfer put the kabosh on any future chances of making the team?

Whatever happens with this school, I too suggest that you do whatever you can this summer to stay baseball sharp and in shape. You may find some connections during the summer that may make your dream more of a reality.

Good touchy feely wishes from So Cal ...

Brain science research now indicates that nearly everyone has extreme difficulty changing fully formed opinions, even when there is clear contradictory evidence.

(Explains a lot doesn't it?)

My point is: There is a distinct possibility that this coach has already mentally boxed you out.

As such, there may be nothing you can do.
Be as honest as possible with yourself here.
Is there ANY history of walk-on success with this coach?
If not, your chances are thinner yet.

The big idea is to be happy.

What matters most?

If pitching in real games, where scorebooks are kept is most important to you, then you must balance that, against your real chances of wedging your way onto a recruited roster.

And remember, you still must earn playing time, and in most cases you will be taking it away from recruited players who already have the coach's favor.

You know in your heart what will make you happy.

I can tell you this however. Somewhere, right now, there is a coach wishing you'd walk through his door.

quote:

Somewhere, right now, there is a coach wishing you'd walk through his door.

gametime

Did you know they had 18 scholarship players?

If so why even try to walk on?

If you didnt know then you did not ask the right questions or do your homework

TR,..I know your approach is to speak the brutal truth, but not everyone is at your high superior knowledge level.

How bout' you explain the questions that you feel needed to be asked and explain the homework assignment for us?
I have a HS senior and several of his team mates have given thought to walking on.
What should they be asking?

And while you are doing that, I'm going to go get you a fresh hot cup of coffee with extra whip cream.
IMHO, you seem a little low on the sweet stuff this morning.

SSmom

First of all I cannot have the "sweet stuff" as I am diabetic--OK

I am asking the young man what he did or did not do, not you, ok?

Let him answer the questions and between me and you, we can do without your superior knowledge shots---I never claimed to be all knowing just perhaps more experienced than others---what I am seems to be all in your minds

BTW arent we here to offer opinions and not necessarily be all pink and fuzzy---

TR,

No one is asking you to talk all warm and fuzzy with butterflies and harps. But a lot of your posts come off as unnecessarily negative, and would intimidate newer members from posting questions. That's wrong. We want people to be able to post their questions without fear.

And please don't pick on shortstopmom.

Julie

TR,

What questions need to be asked and what kind of homework needs to be done?

We can all learn from others experiences.

Not sure why you are upset with the question TR asked. I also wondered what the comment meant. Personally I think his explaination is okay but too many players signed to make room for him is probably why most pitchers don't make roster and not a complication. There is only so much money and so many roster spots. The way the comment was phased left a question in my mind as to what the problem was. Maybe he used the wrong wording.

Not everyone has knowledgeable people around them to guide them in the right direction.

I know some current seniors who keep saying, " I'm going to University XYZ, I still want to play ball, so I am going to try and walk on ".

Perhaps if they know what to look for or the right questions to ask before doing so, ( such as roster size, # of scholarships, etc. ) they might get a better idea of what their chances are of making the team.
I think some are under the assumption that if they are good enough, somehow the coaches will find a way to get them on.

Note taken and changed:
high superior level
more experienced and knowledgeable

extra whipped cream
straight black,...served in a smiley cup.

TR is pointing out the basic problem with his "questions", to walk on a baseball team a player must be noticably better then the scholarship player. Schools kept extra catchers and pitchers around for bp purposes through the fall. Unfortunate but true.

I hate to say it but my serious advice is to follow the coaches advice which was to transfer if you want to continue playing baseball. The coach has already made his feelings known. It would probebely take alot of improvement on your part to change the coach's mind.

Several Kids have left my son's former school, attended a local JC and then returned after improving their skills and showing the coach they could play college level baseball. These kids were able to stay in the area and maintain relationships from their freshman year.

You have lots of options including staying, good luck.

This young man has stated he doesn't want to transfer to another college because he has formed great relations at his current college. I am not sure that he is ineligible to transfer without sitting as I take it he was never on the roster. However that is a moote question.
I think that he should try again since he wants to pitch and doesn't want to transfer. As was pointed out it will be tough because the coach has already shown his feelings. Maybe with hard work he can change that around. The worst thing that can happen is that he doesn't make the roster again.

FOLKS

I still ask the questions to him and have no answers

Yes he should working toward his dream, wherein did I say he shouldn't?

BUT

What is the story? I like to deal in fact not suppositions and assumptions

Did he not ask for advice ?---maybe you can give advice without facts--I cannot--


Bottom Line--what is the full story?

gametime, between your initial post, the post of collegeparent and some others, I think you are going to identify your answers as well as the biggest challenge for walking on next Fall.
As you describe what happened last Fall, you pitched better than you ever have. That did not get you on the roster.
collegeparent very appropriately points out walk-on players at a DI CA school who don't make it head to a JC, where they "improve" and return showing they can play. It is also true that those scholarship players who didn't get much playing time also need to improve.
In my view, the jump in ability between the freshman and sophomore year in college can be pretty spectacular. In most programs, at any college level, it has to be to continue to earn playing time.
Even when a college program loses 10 players, the coaching staff recruits with the mindset they need to be better the next year.
Many will recruit, or feel they have, over the talent level of the current roster of players. The coaches know they have to get better to keep their job and to do that, they have to recruit better players/pitchers trying to achieve the goal that is set for coaches by the Athletic Director.
In terms of trying to compete as a recruited walk-on next Fall, I don't think you can allow yourself to mentally approach the situation that they lost a lot of pitchers and I can find an opening based on how I performed last Fall. Personally, I don't think you can approach it on the basis they had 18 on schollie and that is the reason.
Next Fall, you will have to perform at a higher level than ever before. There are two reasons: your skills and talent last Fall didn't get you a spot, and everyone returning will have been working an entire year to be bigger, stronger, faster and better. Combine with that the mental approach of that coaching staff which will head into the Fall believing, right or wrong, that they have recruited better players than they lost.
In my view, those will be your challenges. I know of a lefty pitcher at the school collegeparent is posting about who transfered as a sophomore from a DIII. Out of more than 50 walk-ons, he was the only one who earned a roster spot. Two years later he is a weekend starter who has already been drafted in 2007.
Can it be done? Yes, that lefty proves it can.
To do it, you need to be much better than you were last Fall, so that you are at least as good as those returning on a schollie, and those entering with a 25% minimum schollie.
Increasing your competitive ability, and providing "facts" for TRhit to provide his opinion, look to be the major challenges you need to consider in your decision.
Good luck to you!

Next year: how many of the existing 18 scholarship players will be there and how many new scholarships are coming in?


Staying at a school because your "friends" are there is not a recipe for success

quote:

not a recipe for success

Depends on how you define success.

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
Next year: how many of the existing 18 scholarship players will be there and how many new scholarships are coming in?


Staying at a school because your "friends" are there is not a recipe for success

TR, in my view, you are making this too complicated.
It should not make a difference to gametime24 how many of 18 return and how many more are coming. He cannot control any of that.
When you are a college level player and above, you can't pay attention to those issues over which you have no control.
You pay attention to your skills, your development and your ability to improve and compete. The only relevence the schollie players should have on this is to understand the level of skills/competition they establish.
If gametime feels he can work hard enough and improve enough in the next few months to get to the level set by the scholarship players, then he sets his goals and goes to work with the recognition he is not one of them and he needs to prove he is at least as good, and probably better.

Back to the original post by gametime24

quote:

I haven't been on the site in awhile, but many posters on here have helped me before. Basically, I am finishing up my first year of college. In the fall, I tried out for my college team(ranked in the top 20 currently D1) and I was invited to participate in the fall season and was the only potential walk-on to do so. I ended up not getting a roster spot because of certain complications. I have too many friends and ties to the university, so transferring is really not an option right now. I am considering playing ball again this summer and conditioning myself to attempt to try out again next year. The most frustrating thing is that I know I can still pitch and I pitched the best I have in my life during the tryouts. Am I chasing a far-fetched goal? I have no problem being a normal kid and pursuing my degree, but I still have a sour feeling knowing I can still play. The positive is that the team graduates a bunch of seniors this year, so they will be in need of pitching next year. Any serious and honest thoughts will be appreciated. Thanks-Gametime24

gametime.

Sounds like you are at a national power type program. Walk ons seldom make those teams, but it sounds like you are aware of that and can live with it.

You appear to be very intelligent. You definitely want to pitch, but understand there are more important things in life. Seems like you understand your situation completely and also understand your options. Only you can make these type of decisions. This is all about you, none of us know you, better than you do.

FWIW, IMO You should definitely play at the highest level possible during the summer. I suggest getting with someone who is very knowledgeable at pitching. Find out what it is that you need to improve to get over the hump and make the team next year, if you plan to stay at your present college. Those who say you need to be better, rather than equal, to the scholarship pitchers, are correct. So your job is to separate yourself.

We don't know what type of pitcher you are. If your a finesse type who relies on changing speeds and locating... Your chances will be limited by having to be close to perfect in the fall. Even then, it will be hard to impress the coaching staff into placing you above some others. If you are a power type pitcher, who has velocity equal to or better than your competition for a roster spot... You stand a much better chance IMO. Velocity is a more obvious seperater! No matter what, if I were to make a suggestion on something to work on in order to give you the best chance... It would be to try and improve velocity before next fall. But I'm just guessing because we don't know what kind of pitcher you are.

It does sound like there might be more opportunity next year with all those graduating, maybe some juniors getting drafted and possibly some transfers. But remember, there will be a new recruiting class coming in.

Yes, you are chasing a far-fetched goal. The truth is nearly everyone in baseball is chasing a far-fetched goal at some point. Those who give up make those goals impossible. What you are talking about is not impossible, especially if you have already impressed the coaching staff.

Your job is to be even better next fall! That is not a far-fetched goal!

Bottom line, if you can live with the possibility of not playing and staying to get your degree… Great!
Sounds to me like you’re prepared to give it everything you have and live with the results... Great!

I would be very interested in knowing which college you are at. If you feel comfortable with that, please PM or email. I promise to keep it very confidential. If you don’t want to do that, I understand.

Best of luck

PGstaff, I am playing some summer ball this year with a coach who pitched in the Red Sox organization for about 10 years so I am hoping he will help me develop