Should 2022 focus on pitching Velocity or Movement?

Should he focus on this vs that?  The answer is yes.  You describe him as a RHP.  He should continue to work on all facets of pitching.  That process won't stop until he is done playing.

Will more velo come?  The answer is "who knows?..., at least some more is likely".  So many variables.  Has his body come close to full maturation?  Has he maxed his mechanics and sequencing?  Is he as physically strong as he can be?  Does he have the genes? Will he continue to put in the work?  Will certain instruction just click?  Will he "find something"? etc., etc.

Velocity.  He has to be able to pitch too, but to even get a coach to watch him pitch, velocity.  We had two friend with lefties who topped 87.  Both had to work very hard to get offers. One ended up with a nice D2 scholarship in December of senior year. One is at a D3, committed April of senior year. Both were touching 87 summer after junior year.  For RHP it’s even more competitive. My son was topping ( he isn’t typical, but there are plenty of him).

8th: 81

9th, 84

10th: 91

11th: 94

12th: 95

Depends on what his goals are... Topping out at 80 when D1 kids are in the mid 90's...  Hard to believe velo increases 15 in the next 12-15 months you essentially have for recruiting time. Command, Control, Change of Speed - only gets you so far... D1/D2 hitters will adjust.

What is his goal?  D1, D2, D3, NAIA, JUCO, or being a strong contributor on his varsity HS team? To map out a successful route you must start with an end in mind.

@Around_The_Horn posted:

What is his goal?  D1, D2, D3, NAIA, JUCO, or being a strong contributor on his varsity HS team? To map out a successful route you must start with an end in mind.

I would agree with this.  If the goal is being a hs contributor.  Good movement on a low 80s ball works.

No matter what his goal, what is he doing to become a better pitcher so he can reach his goal.

It doesnt matter who sees you, a 2022 RHP should be above 80.  He can fix that.

IMO he should be training and get a check up on his mechanics. 

Your son doesn't need 4 pitches.  He needs a FB and a good off speed pitch.  The rest will come later.

JMO

A player should always be looking to get bigger, faster, stronger, better. Why focus on command over velocity or vice versa? Work on both. From now and through college ball. 

Start lifting, tomorrow.  Squats and deadlifts.  Set a goal of 6'-2" and 185 by next summer.  This, he can control.

Don't forget about nutrition (he should take in calories to his goal weight and make sure there is an appropriate ratio of macros) and rest. It is the troika to gaining strength. Seek a professional to have a movement screen to identify any issues before lifting.

College coaches mentality: I can teach pitching/control, without velocity it is irrelevant... and so will your son be in their eyes without it. 

Some velocity improvements come with age, but he is behind today's velocity curve so he better get in the weight room, get in a Driveline or Wolforth program, and get some quality instruction. Also why the heck is he messing around with four pitches when he is throwing 80? Focus on developing a good fastball and CH. What happens with younger pitchers is that they have success with breaking pitches and waste time developing them (because they work against inferior hitting) Focus on developing a FB and offset it with a CH with FB arm action. If he is laser focused on these goals he has a chance.  Short term he may not be as "successful" but if he does not do this NOW he will never play college ball IMO. 

@BOF posted:

College coaches mentality: I can teach pitching/control, without velocity it is irrelevant... and so will your son be in their eyes without it. 

Some velocity improvements come with age, but he is behind today's velocity curve so he better get in the weight room, get in a Driveline or Wolforth program, and get some quality instruction. Also why the heck is he messing around with four pitches when he is throwing 80? Focus on developing a good fastball and CH. What happens with younger pitchers is that they have success with breaking pitches and waste time developing them (because they work against inferior hitting) Focus on developing a FB and offset it with a CH with FB arm action. If he is laser focused on these goals he has a chance.  Short term he may not be as "successful" but if he does not do this NOW he will never play college ball IMO. 

Agree with 100% of this post! 

@Orlando2022Dad posted:

Currently tops at 80mph

6'2" 165lb RHP (Throws a 4 seam FB, CB, SL, CH)

Should he focus "now" on increasing velocity? or on spotting, movement, pitch shape and being a pitcher?

Will the Velocity come eventually or are we being naive in thinking that?

What was your son's Velocity bell curve over time?

 

 

For me, this is like asking what is more important food or water?  Got to have some of both, if you want to get to the next level.   He should focus on proper mechanics.   This will help him get the most out of his frame to achieve optimal velocity and movement.  

My son was not as tall as your son, but my son did have very good pitching mechanics since he was 12-13 years old.   I believe he was topping out at 85mph at 14-15 years old.   He did see a private pitching coach that understood my son which is not easy.   Those efficient mechanics helped him get to 90+ mph his junior year in high school.   As a hitter, you saw an effortless motion and then it was on you and he could put it any where he wanted.   In college, he would pitch any pitch in any count.   He had tremendous control of a two-seam, four seam and change up.   He could make that change-up dance.  While he learned a curve ball at 16 years old, he didn't really throw it until he worked with his college pitching coach.   It was clear to me the college PC saw the potential to add pitches to his repertoire when he was recruiting him.

As always, JMO.

Once again Fenway wins....it’s mechanics every time.  Once you have the right mechanics, command, movement and velocity will follow.  Coaches also focus on mechanics, during recruiting, knowing HS recruits are still growing.

IMO those who focus on velocity over mechanics are the ones who typically flame out because they can’t throw good strikes consistently 

Son was T82 summer rising junior year, T88 summer rising senior year and recruited.  T93 freshman spring season (I never recorded my son, so no reading for 1.5 years), T95 this summer (now Sophomore)

Take your time, do it right and velocity will follow if he has the God given talent.  

with all due respect to Fenway and CTbbD, i think OP's son is in a vastly different situation.  Fenway's son was T85 as an 8th grader/9th grader.  how much velo is he going to focus on at that point?  CTbbD's son looks like he's in a similar boat to OP's. it's easy enough to say "the velo will come" when it's already came for his son, but i think what the original question is getting at is what did he do to make those gains (82-88-93)?  was it all natural, no strength training/velo training involved?  did he get a summer job throwing hay bales on a nebraska farm?  did he eat you out of house and home for a couple of years?  

for OP, it sounds like he is in my shoes, thirty some years later.  tall (taller than my by a couple of inches), skinny and passable but not great velo.  enough to get you by.  back then, the thought was that velo was god-given so i worked on command and had a nice little hs run and a naia "career (cut short by freak injuries (who dislocates their shoulder diving back to first on a pickoff???).  my velo "didn't come" but i didn't do anything specifically to usher it in. i lifted a ton of weights but, looking back, probably all the wrong way.  that was it.  

for OP, it isn't an either or situation. "working" on velo will pay off he'll be stronger with better command and movement just by putting in the work.  his stuff will be sharper, he'll throw harder and longer with less chance of injury.  I'd say, work on arm strength, arm care and just plain throwing.  

velocity = mass x acceleration

This kid needs to eat, lift, eat again, work on mechanics, lift with a baseball focus, and eat some more!  Lay the cornerstone to velocity, which is mass and mechanics!   I would focus on him putting on 25 lbs by the spring.  2 - 3 lbs per week,  by eating the correct calories, and lift with baseball in mind!

D1 colleges need 185lbs on a kid before they'll even look at him.  Yes, I know there are exceptions, but at 6'2", his target should be 190 lbs, minimum.  

Don't chase velocity, build the body, and velocity will come!

Didn’t Kevin Costner say, “If you build mechanics velocity will come.”

@LeftyDadP9 posted:

velocity = mass x acceleration

This kid needs to eat, lift, eat again, work on mechanics, lift with a baseball focus, and eat some more!  Lay the cornerstone to velocity, which is mass and mechanics!   I would focus on him putting on 25 lbs by the spring.  2 - 3 lbs per week,  by eating the correct calories, and lift with baseball in mind!

D1 colleges need 185lbs on a kid before they'll even look at him.  Yes, I know there are exceptions, but at 6'2", his target should be 190 lbs, minimum.  

Don't chase velocity, build the body, and velocity will come!

School House Rock taught us that 3 was the magic number, but reality is that they were rounding.

2.5 is the magic number.  (At least for pitchers)

@LeftyDadP9 posted:

velocity = mass x acceleration

This kid needs to eat, lift, eat again, work on mechanics, lift with a baseball focus, and eat some more!  Lay the cornerstone to velocity, which is mass and mechanics!   I would focus on him putting on 25 lbs by the spring.  2 - 3 lbs per week,  by eating the correct calories, and lift with baseball in mind!

D1 colleges need 185lbs on a kid before they'll even look at him.  Yes, I know there are exceptions, but at 6'2", his target should be 190 lbs, minimum.  

Don't chase velocity, build the body, and velocity will come!

This is it, essentially.  Get some weight on him, then work on repeatable mechanics that get players out.  

And get rid of so many pitches. 3+ pitches is P5. 2 solid pitches gets you a spot on a mid D1 or D2 and needs to be coachable.

You know that old saying,  " Jack of all trades, master of none" applies here.

@LeftyDadP9 posted:

velocity = mass x acceleration

This kid needs to eat, lift, eat again, work on mechanics, lift with a baseball focus, and eat some more!  Lay the cornerstone to velocity, which is mass and mechanics!   I would focus on him putting on 25 lbs by the spring.  2 - 3 lbs per week,  by eating the correct calories, and lift with baseball in mind!

D1 colleges need 185lbs on a kid before they'll even look at him.  Yes, I know there are exceptions, but at 6'2", his target should be 190 lbs, minimum.  

Don't chase velocity, build the body, and velocity will come!

Agree, 190 is a good goal. At 6'2, he is no where near filled out.  After reporting to college this fall, they want my 6'3 rhp at 220.  

Thank you all for the insight and detailed responses. We will focus on getting strong and gaining weight. Going to find him a pitching coach who can identify his mechanical flaws. With this hopefully the velocity will increase as he is able to spot his fb and throw what is his best pitch, the cb, with accuracy at any time in the count...actually likes throwing it on a full count as it's not expected by the batter. He does not lack confidence or mound presence and is usually the "go to" guy on most teams he PO's for...but we are both smart enough to know that he MUST have more velocity then 80 to compliment his off speed and get looks to play beyond HS. Fingers crossed velo starts creeping  higher Thanks again everyone....

Very good advice as usual... weights, diet and mechanics. I'd say anything he can do on the tunneling side would help with whatever he is throwing. That incorporates both velocity and movement and with either, he should he able to get better results. My son was a 2 pitch guy thru HS and College and just this spring developed a slider for his 2nd Milb season but he is a reliever.

Weight is your friend. Mechanics is your savior. Weight and proper mechanics will set the stage for when Velo comes. My RHP son, 6'3", didn't break 90 until Aug of Soph Summer. 90-91 at Underclass WWBA and then 92 at Jupiter at 182 lbs as Junior.  Put on 24 lbs during Covid Quarantine/HS Season. Huge difference in physique. Now sits 90. still weighs 204. Big difference.

The real interest/recruiting didn't start until he broke 90. Didn't learn a curve until Junior year (keys before curves). He had Fastball, Cutter, somewhat of a change.  Now has 2 & 4 Seam, Curve, Cutter, Change and sick command of 5 and can use them as needed. Huge difference.   

One thing to also consider is these guys lost a "season" so history & timing does not apply. 
Including HS season and summer/fall he's at 57 IP. He'd get that in a Normal HS season with Districts and finish the summer around 100 IP.  So it's hard to judge timeframe and ramp up like we have in the past. He's basically in "May" shape and would be getting ready for summer/travel ball.

To be honest, we were happy HS season didn't happen and that saved 1000 pitches off his arm, but not throwing disrupted his gains and delayed this summer/fall ramp up and preparedness. Luckily we stuck with the same consistence and Pitching coach and he got used to the additional weight and how to use it.

Naked Mass protein shakes have been quite helpful. Eat more, work out, drink shakes and drink again before bed. Calories and good cardio. You'll see gains on the mound.