Single-inning pitch counts

Definitely not a program I'd want my kid playing for. I did see a travel coach leave a kid in to walk 8 or 9 batters. The dad was wearing the coach out all year about letting his kid pitch. So he finally did and made him sit through the misery.

No kid that age should every throw more than 25 pitches in an inning. Hit that number and they should be lifted.

If you haven't gotten a couple outs within about 30 pitches or so then usually the kid gets one more hitter. Honestly at that point the game is starting to get out of hand. Anything after that becomes hard to watch from either side. I've always been a big believer in injury rates relative to high stress pitches.   

I've also been around the block a few times with travel ball as well, and don't think over-throwing a child is something exclusive to HS JV games. The most I've seen in 1 weekend (2 days) is 228 pitches. 

The worst outing I've ever seen was in a HS JV game last year, had a Junior who was supposed to be a Varsity PO throwing in his first outing after coming back from an ankle injury. He didn't throw *bad*, he just ended up throwing BP for an inning.

I had to look up the stats: 1 inning: 48 pitches (23 strikes, 1 WP), 4 BB, 6 Hits, 9 runs. There were also 2 errors.

If I had been coaching I would have pulled him, but the point of JV baseball isn't really about winning baseball games.

Agree with most on the limits and importance therein, i think Ryley had one game where he went over 100 in a 7 inning HS game but had a no-hitter and would not leave the mound and another one close to that count and it was against Lambert and Seth Beer which he won ith a 1 hitter. Ha...the good old days. Man i miss em!!!!!!!!

Just being there doesn’t necessarily tell the entire story. On the surface it’s poor arm care. But the coach may have been sending a message to the kid and his dad about his pitching potential. He may have been trying to save the pitcher who got one out for a winnable game in two days. The team may have been missing pitchers due to illness, injury, suspension or varsity call ups.

A game like that is counter-productive for everyone involved. Nobody gets fielding reps if only a few balls get put into play all game, and hitters get nothing out of 4-pitch walk after walk. Even the fans of the winning team had to be miserable. The injury risk is one thing, but that coach did everyone a disservice by keeping those pitchers in.

@947 posted:

A game like that is counter-productive for everyone involved. Nobody gets fielding reps if only a few balls get put into play all game, and hitters get nothing out of 4-pitch walk after walk. Even the fans of the winning team had to be miserable. The injury risk is one thing, but that coach did everyone a disservice by keeping those pitchers in.

My conclusion about JV baseball in general is that the entire experience is often counterproductive. That statement may not hold true at large school baseball powerhouse programs - but those are the exception. What I typically see at the JV level is a football coach who is on the baseball field to make some extra money in the off season. They often don’t know the game, don’t run an efficient practice, can’t evaluate talent, and have no idea how to coach a game. Worst of all, they have not a care about all those shortcomings. The kids get little to no good instruction and bad habits creep into their game. This can lead to a very frustrating season for parents (that have spent lots of money on competitive travel ball) and players (who have played for good travel ball coaches). As a side note, I will add that at MOST HS programs if you aren’t on Varsity as a sophomore that should be a clue that D1 baseball isn’t a realistic goal. There are plenty of exceptions (and I don’t need a reply from those who are) but as a rule that holds up pretty well. Part of the development process (as a parent) is making a realistic evaluation of your son’s progress along the way - and making adjustments to your plan as necessary.

Our high school program is famous for this nonsense. We have been averaging 1 player per year that needs TJ surgery for the past 5 years. Coach refuses to make mound visits because he wants his pitchers to "mature" and work their way out of issues. Overpitches his top two kids each week, maxing their pitch counts out at every outing...... Hard to watch because he was a college pitcher himself.

Being a former player doesn’t always translate into being a good coach - although the odds are better. IMO it’s very difficult (and pretty rare) to be a really good coach of a sport that you never played. But to your point @Velo From The Stretch, I see what you are describing at most HS programs and it aggravates me too. It seems that many HS head coaches make decisions about their pitching staffs before the first game and never change regardless of the results. They pick 2 starters and one reliever, check that box, and never look back. I don’t understand that way of thinking and I don’t condone it. But it’s very common.

I see the problem sometimes with former college and pro players coaching is they think every one of their players should be just like them, especially if they were a freak.  Middle son's college pitching coach never long tossed and very rarely threw between outings.  So he never long tossed and didn't throw bullpens.  It affected most of their pitchers except one who was very much like the PC.  I've seen it with hitting guys also and HC's.  Not everyone is the same and every player has to be treated differently.

@adbono posted:

Being a former player doesn’t always translate into being a good coach - although the odds are better. IMO it’s very difficult (and pretty rare) to be a really good coach of a sport that you never played. But to your point @Velo From The Stretch, I see what you are describing at most HS programs and it aggravates me too. It seems that many HS head coaches make decisions about their pitching staffs before the first game and never change regardless of the results. They pick 2 starters and one reliever, check that box, and never look back. I don’t understand that way of thinking and I don’t condone it. But it’s very common.

My son’s high school coach was a D2 All American position player. He knew his stuff except for pitching. He went with his starters until the house was on fire regardless of pitch count. My son was the closer. He was coming from his position in the field.

Junior year my son convinced the coach it was a lot easier to warm up between innings while the team was hitting and come in fresh than come from his position facing a house on fire. The coach eventually agreed.

It didn’t stop the coach from running up starter’s pitch counts too high. There were times my son should have pitched two innings or used a setup reliever.