Size of the strike zone

knees to waist

The last two touraments we played here in Texas both had tightly defined strike zone. For the most part the pitchers responded well but the hitters had the advantage.

The touraments were the Premier Championship and the AABC Regional.

Most of the time it was fair but in three of the games the strike zone was more like a postage stamp.

I don't mind the occasional double shoe box...knees to just above the waist....but overall the original definition still should be enforced:

Definition
The top of the strike zone is the mid-level between the top of the batter's shoulders and his belt, and the bottom is at the level just beneath the knee cap. The right and left boundaries of the strike zone correspond to the edges of home plate. A pitch at which the batter does not swing and which does not pass through the strike zone is called a ball. Unofficially, the strike zone in Major League Baseball is often enforced as being from the knee of the batter to no higher than his belt, although there are a handful of umpires known to call the 'high' strike.

When you get the Major Leagues or play professionally then you should have a knees to waist strike zone.

But it does seem the the Major League Umps do give the corners, in and out more often than not.

JMHO

A couple of points about strike zones....

1. Size doesn't matter - it just needs to be consistent for both teams and throughout the game.

2. An umpire with a very "tight" strike zone is an umpire in many cases who does not have alot of confidence in his ability to see a strike. If the truth be known it takes alot more "courage" to call a strike rather than call a ball.

I can't say that I have noticed anything different about the "DFW" strike zone as compared to anywhere else. It is a little different depending on the ump behind the plate - as is the case in most locales.

Consistency is first & foremost. But a postage stamp sized zone will matter. It can turn the game into a slugfest.

I was thinking of when you have a postage stamp zone. The pitchers need to learn to pitch "in" that strike zone. I noticed during the H.S.season and especially during the H.S. playoffs the zone seemed to expand, sometimes 4-5 inches off the plate. Pitchers get used to getting calls on the edges and dont focus on movement, changing speeds, or working down.ect...

I have posted this before, but it's worth it to mention again...

1. The "strike zone" is not a judgment call. It does not vary from one umpire to the other. It is defined as above,

Definition
The top of the strike zone is the mid-level between the top of the batter's shoulders and his belt, and the bottom is at the level just beneath the knee cap. The right and left boundaries of the strike zone correspond to the edges of home plate. A pitch at which the batter does not swing and which does not pass through the strike zone is called a ball.

2. The size is 7 baseballs butted up wide by about 11 high. That is a really big rectangle.

3. The only judgment of the umpire is if it hit the defined area or not. Period!

4. "Consistency" only means the umpire is not doing his job. I prefer the inconsistent umpire who trys to call the defined zone and occasionally misses. The umpire that calls even two balls off the plate, then refuses to call the inside corner doesn't understand hitting.

None of you have changed my opinion in past threads on this subject. You have on many other topics. We ask our kids to play by the rules then put up with umpires who refuse to. Does this really make sense to any of you?

baseballpapa,
You are like alot of people who throw out the definition of the strike zone as stated in the rules of baseball. But we all know that this defined "zone" has not been called in a hundred years. The strike zone as defined in the rulebook would RUIN the game of baseball if that was the zone that was actually called. There would be ZERO runs scored in most games - the pitcher would have almost complete dominance over the batter.

And I cannot believe that you do not want a "consistent" umpire. That doesn't make any sense to me - either as a pitcher OR a batter. A pitcher and batter spend the first couple of innings trying to adjust to the strike zone being called that game. I must say I have never seen anyone advocating an inconsistent strike zone being called by an umpire. Have you ever pitched with an umpire who spent the evening trying to figure out what his strike zone was???

The strike zone in reality is whatever the umpire feels comfortable calling. Thank goodness it is NOT what is called for in the rule book. Like I said before I have nothing against every umpire having their own strike zone. Just make sure it is the same strike zone from the beginning of the game to the end and the same one for both teams.

Good luck to Casey - he obviously can adjust to any strike zone either as a hitter or a pitcher.

Aren't you being just a little radical on your assessment of a zone called by the book?

I just don't think I can go along with a book zone creating complete dominance for the pitcher. What do you think would create such a huge advantage? I assume you must be referring to the top of the book zone. For the inside/outside & the bottom are commonly called per the book (actually, there often is some expansion on the outside corner).

Just not following you here.

Please don't get keller Dad started.

You would think KD's son was a pitcher.......

Casey actually doesn't adjust to an umpire's strike zone. The hitter really cannot. Casey doesn't think balls and strikes as a hitter -- only "pitches to drive and others to let go by." He is taught it is merely a ball and a rectangle, "hit it when it is in your power zone." That is one of our practice and play keys. Most of his strike outs are on balls he took and not on swinging strikes. (Of course he cannot strike out looking if he doesn't get to two strikes first). If you try to adjust to bad umpiring you cannot hit in the long run. When he was young I told him the umpiring and strike zone would get better as he got older. It has.

Another point I have driven into him -- "you cannot umpire and hit at the same time." You cannot spend your time as a hitter reacting to bad calls.

A hitter in the long run cannot adjust to three balls outside as a strike. You try to center the ball with a metal bat on about a two ball area of the bat. There are 10 balls across butted up with the umps that give the 3 balls off the plate strike.

In general, little league umpires that give a 15 ball strike zone ruin both pitchers and hitters in the name of "I'm not going to let kids walk." The umpires job is not to prevent walks but to call the zone. If you get to 4 balls before 3 strikes it is a walk.

In Dallas you better have the ability to take the
ball the other way.

I think I'd rather have a zone that encourages kids to hit rather than wait on walks.

My son recently pitched against the Redskins in the WWBA tournament in Ga. The first few batters swung at the knee high pitches and grounded out. Soon it became apparent that, to that ump, the kneee wasn't a strike so it turned in to a walk fest or wait on the fat pitch.

Ted,
I agree with you to a point...

When a hitter is even and certainly ahead in the count he is looking for a pitch that he can drive - in other words a pitch in HIS "strike" zone. However, at 2 strikes he had better be aware of what the umpire's strike zone is or he will get K'ed - especially if the pitcher is aware of what the ump's zone is. That is where the umpire's consistency becomes VERY important. It is not so much what size the strike zone is but rather is it predictable.

In regard to pitching, any good pitcher will adjust to an ump that is calling a strike low or off the plate. Having said that I am not an advocate of coaching young pitchers to try to paint the black part of the plate. Young pitchers should be taught not to pitch to avoid contact but rather pitch aggressively with fastballs on both sides of the plate - middle in and middle out. That strategy tends to lessen the effect of depending on an umpire for ultimate pitching success.

What I see too often is pitchers trying to "nibble" around the strike zone. There is too much emphasis on strike outs and not enough respect for a good ground ball out. Attack the zone with your fastball and those "small" strike zones will not be a big issue.

quote:

Originally posted by crawdad:
There is too much emphasis on strike outs and not enough respect for a good ground ball out.

Now that I can agree with.

Crawdad.....Very Well put!!! In regards to pitching, I preach/teach them to pitch to contact,(goal is 3 pitches for an out)changing speeds with movement and hitting your spots...you would be amazed how many 7 inning games are pitched with 70 pitches.

SWAC and OBN, how did I ever get drug into this?

Oh, yeah, I have a serious issue with calling strikes that are 8" off the plate. Seen it all year, frustrates the **** out of me.

I seem to not be yelling at umpires as much this summer as I was during the HS season, but spring is right around the corner.

quote:

Originally posted by KellerDad:
I seem to not be yelling at umpires as much this summer as I was during the HS season, but spring is right around the corner.

Got hoarse, eh?

quote:

I seem to not be yelling at umpires as much this summer as I was during the HS season, but spring is right around the corner.

Doug, did I hear you yelling at me behind the plate when you played the Pirates or was that the Pirate fans?

Kermit, I've never yelled at you when you were behind the plate, but I have said a few words across the field when you were in the other dugout.

Yea, but your words were all in fun. Glad you guys won today.

Doug, what avatar will you use once Nick graduates?