Son and college baseball

Wow, this one is a rough one to wrap your arms around because of so many different dynamics that could be going on that either your son really isn't aware of, or that he's not being completely transparent with you about. That's hard to hear I know but I was once right where you are. I honestly thought my son at the time of his Frosh year was thriving and doing good. Until one fall morning when I received a call from the Head coach and he asked if I knew or had seen my son. Obviously to say I was flabbergasted that the Coach and team hadn't seem him for a few days. So what I was "hearing" from my son about how it was "going" was not how it was really going down. And we are tight so I think that maybe he saw some things that he couldn't control and his only way to deal with it was to begin slowly sabotaging himself? I don't know and never figured it out. I just know that during Christmas break I was at his school packing him up to bring home so he could attend (hopefully) a nearby JUCO. Sometimes it's the Upper Classmen who are also reporting to the coach(es) about a certain players attitude, comradeship, etc and if he's clashing with any of them the Coach will listen to what is being said. They are his eyes and ears when he's not around. Does he miss any practices that you may not be aware of? Does he not do any of the typical "freshman" duties that most do to pay their dues? You see what I'm talking about? You're not there and sometimes the adjusting period is maybe a little more harder than you know and he may not want to disappoint and/or worry you with it. The part above about "The coach says he is lazy, doesnt fit in and doesnt have his life together" does seem to be little disconcerting to hear that his coach perceives this about your son. And I think may call for you to do a little more "digging" about these remarks. 

But if none of that IS the case and he genuinely has no idea what the coach is referring to I hate to say it but, if you don't really have much of a rapport with this Coach (from earlier recruiting, visits, etc) then reaching out to him will do you virtually no good. And honestly, this could be one of those times that you may have to restrain yourself from stepping in and advising your son that he needs to figure this out or his dreams of ball could come to a screeching halt.

I hope this may help give a little insight or shed some light that maybe you hadn't consider. I wish you the best as I know this is hard for your son and even harder for you.

YGD

I asked him alot of the same things tonight...he has had some issues with this coach right before Christmas after he got hurt and had to go thru rehab...he just got cleared about a month ago...His girlfriend actually texted me and said my son was upset and I should call him....he says He hasnt missed any practices....He shaved his head like all the freshman.. He says he does all the things that the freshman and pitchers are required to do...he hangs out with many of the players. He graduated from a small HS and this was a dream come true for him and he does not want to mess it up. He was basically in tears tonight as I was talking to him as he really has no idea what the coach wants from him. He did say the coach had the same conversation with a couple other kids....I am not sure if the coach is trying to run him off or fire him up.

He says he is very unhappy but wants to play....

If he wants to transfer how do I go about that. or how does that work....the team is last in the conference and has not one alot in D2....so I dont know if the losing is adding to the pressure. Do I or my son have other avenues we can take to try and resolve this.

younggundad....thanks for you response....I havent talked to the coach since summer last year when we sat down during the recruiting trip....

This is a tough one.  I will preference this by saying, I have not had to deal with this with my son as he is only in HS.  I did however run track in college and am giving my advice from that point of view.  

In college after my recruiting visit my parents had exactly one conversation a year with our HC.  That was at the year end banquet as he came around to the tables to say Hi to all the parents.  It was a quick handshake and the "glad to see you, we are very happy to have Joe on the team".  That was pretty much it.    Based on what I experienced in college I would suggest you need to let your son deal with it and keep out of it.  I know as a parent that is difficult but at the college level the kids are adults and expected to take care of stuff themselves.

Does your son have a trusted assistant coach he can talk to?  He maybe able to provide some insight to the coaches thinking.  Or even help smooth things over for your son.  You mention drinking, but I read into it that there maybe things other then drinking that is causing the coaches consternation.   Is your kid attending classes?  What about optional team activities.  At most schools, attending practice is the minimum.  Is your kid hitting the weight room like he should?  Is he working with the pitching coach to correct whatever shortcomings they may see?  Is he attending "voluntary" team activities?

I had a run in with my HC just prior to the start of my senior season.  I approached him for some advice/help on a class scheduling issue.  He had repeatedly asked us to come see him if we needed some help academically.  Our discussion actually turned into an enough of an argument that I left the meeting and was in the process of clearing out my locker.  Intending to walk into the HCs office afterwards and quit the team.  An AC that I was close with saw me and asked what was going on.  He went into the coaches office and talked with the HC.  He basically brokered another meeting between the two of us and helped smooth things over.  My relationship with the HC was not quite the same after that but we got through things.  I was lucky as it was my SR year and I only had about 5 months left on the team, but I am thankful that the AC helped out.  

That's a great point about the AC. I know sometimes as coaches we intend our conversations with players to be taken a certain way and sometimes they aren't taken that way at all. Maybe it's a miss communication? And some coaches are just idiots lol *raises hand*

thanks Joe....I appreciate the advice....My son is attending all classes as is required and is sitting in the front row with no hat. The coach gets regular attendance from his players. I will say my sons grades are not great...above a 2.0 but barely above. So that has been a struggle. As I mentioned earlier he had to rehab for a good chunk of the year due to a shoulder issue so he made all the therapy sessions and his throwing rehab. He did tell me a while ago that he hasnt had a Bullpen in a couple weeks. He said all his bullpens were scheduled then all of a sudden they werent. He said that was brought up in the meeting. My son said he wasnt sure why the coach quit scheduling his Bullpens. I fussed at him about that and told him son you are an adult now you have to make the effort to get in the BP and I am sure thats what the coaches wanted. Other than that I am not sure. He said he does everything all the other players are doing. Helping out and shagging balls at batting practice, raking bases, cleaning, community service, class, mandatory study hall...and so on....

Does anyone know the transfer rules for D2...how does he initiate that....etc...etc

Beyond the good advice provided... if your son has no idea what the issue is, that should be step one.  He should ask for another meeting with HC.  Help him put together a constructive line of questions that will help clear up any confusion.  Coach him that he must remain positive and show the coach his full commitment to the team and to resolving whatever the issues are.  Easier said than done for many young men in this position but it sounds very necessary.   Also, yes, losing a lot can put a college coach in a tough spot and some will either be very grumpy and look for targets or try a lot of different approaches to get players to respond better.

Your son's  HC has given up on him, it happens all the time - college sports are a business. He is not of value to him on the field, and he is not of value to him from at grade point standpoint off the field and he is a very high risk to him and the program. Your son needs to take a hard look in the mirror as getting "barely above 2.0" when he is on rehab and not travelling is frankly unacceptable to the coach and should be for him and you. What happens to his GPA when he has to start travelling and really have a tough schedule?  To the coach he is a marginal contributor in what really matters. 1) Winning on the field and 2) keeping his kids there without having the baby sit them; one more bad grade and he is ineligible. Put yourself in the coaches position.

Time for your son to grow up and take responsibility for his situation, as a parent we want to rescue our kids, but your son is in college now.  Your son is a "student athlete" not the other way around and unless he has some sort of learning disability he has no one else to blame but himself. If his bullpens are cancelled then he should go find a catcher who will catch him and do it on his own, he should be meeting with all of his professors one on one and talk to them about what he has to do to get his grades up, AFTER he has demonstrated that he really cares about himself and the program then he should meet with the HC and tell him "I am sorry for failing you and myself" Obviously the only person who knows the real story is your son but that is my takeaway from this. I am sorry for the dose of reality but it is time for your son to put his big boy pants on. 

PS: Also why would another coach want to take a player who has been injured and can't cut it in the classroom.

Not that it matters but my advice would be for him to drop baseball and get what really matters in order and then earn his coaches respect back by taking responsibility for himself. I think your son would be surprised at the reaction from the coach.  

Best of luck I know this is a bit harsh, but I do feel your pain. 

BOF....I know this board gets harsh at times....no worries...I get it...I was just looking for advice from someone....but basically that was my advice to him....that he needs to man up and focus on his grades and if baseball is what he wants he needs to work harder and prove to the coach he wants to be there and can do better....I have also told him he needs to sit down with the coach and try to figure things out....

For the record he has been travelling with the team and has been a part of all team activities....

again thank you for your comment and I agree with you for the most part.

I've been to this rodeo with one of my sons...

This situation is for your son to work out with the HC.  Not all players are capable of doing this.  Not all HC's are willing to engage.

As a parent, it's hard to watch unfold.  And it's best that we engage with our sons, at this college age, when they want us to.  I didn't talk to the coach unless approached by the coach.  I let my son take the lead and asked if he wanted my input. 

College baseball is a business.  The coach may have moved on.  He may be a jerk.  Your son may have issues that you're not aware of.  All of this and anything else is possible as others have noted.

In our situation, we settled into the belief that college is primarily for academics and creating future career opportunities, maybe just the first job, out of college.  Our sons have to want that first and foremost.  Baseball can enrich the college experience, but IMHO, it can't be the singular reason for being there. 

If the focus is firstly on academics, and the player is mature enough to take on baseball too, then the player should take the lead (with the parents' help if desired) to find the right fit.  It may still be at this school.  That requires your son to engage the HC and find out.  It requires your son to work hard in the classroom, weight room, practice field, including getting bullpen reps even when they're not scheduled.  It may be at another school.  You can certainly help in that process following your son's lead. 

Very tough situation.  Sorry for the lack of specificity in my response.  Lots of good advice already.  Good luck to your son and your family.

BOF is probably right about the coach having already made up his mind. 

It is not uncommon for coaches on losing teams to look at their benches and decide that everyone who isn't good enough to play on the team while they're in last place isn't likely to get good enough to lift them in the standings, and therefore needs to get replaced.

Whatever else your son does, he needs to put a full court press on academics the rest of the semester.

A GPA near 2.0 would preclude most non-JUCO transfer options.

dont get why bench players with low grades travel. I would make them stay at home and work on academics.

I'm agreeing w others thinking 2.0-2.2 GPA is what coach is referring too most likely. May be difficult to transfer to D2 w low grades. What were his grades in HS when they recruited him(assuming he didn't walk on). If he's getting scholarship money coach is saying he's not keeping his end of deal w grades. 

If son wasn't scheduled for BP it's his responsibility to ask why. Don't leave a coaches meeting w unanswered ?

Don't know why son is unsure of what coach means. If it's grades coach needs to say so up front. 

Playball....my son says he will finish with a 2.5 for the year....

He was given a scholarship but his grades were not great in HS. He did do pretty good on the ACT but bombed the SAT....but he was around a 3.0 in HS.

I agree about the BPs...that's 100% on him.

I think my sons confusion is the coach is very vague to him about what he wants or what his issue is about.

there some other issues he has told me that I really don't want to spout out on here....they are very concerning IMHO...

I think I am too the point that I am gonna send an e-mail and ask for a meeting with him this weekend to discuss my sons future. Right or wrong I don't know but what can it hurt at this point.

I appreciate all the advice so far

I suggest the clarification meeting by son first.  If nothing else, it will help you with clarity for your contact.  I do realize that time is a big factor here.

Whatever you choose to do, or have your son do, do NOT bring up the word transfer until the end of the season.  Even if the coach is actually hoping that your son transfers and he brings it up, your son should say that he is fully committed to his current team. 

Otherwise, I have seen coaches immediately remove an athlete from the team if they even mention they might be thinking about a transfer. 

If you want detailed info on the transfer process, you're welcome to contact me at rick@informedathlete.com.  We frequently walk athletes and parents through every step in a transfer, and alert them to potential pitfalls, like the one I mentioned above.

The most salient point made here is the academics. He is not attractive to other schools with a low 2.something GPA unless he is a superstar. He has got to address that first and foremost. 

This overall situation is not uncommon. But I suggest that it's possible your son isn't giving you the whole picture. I'd try harder to get the full story out of him. You cannot help him without knowing most of everything. 

DDan1,

You meeting with the HC is a bad idea! It's pretty clear what's going on here, grades stink, work ethic below standard, & on field performance lousy. College sports aren't for everybody. It's real hard work in all catagories.

Best advise you can give your son is to buckle down immediately on grades, beg for forgiveness with professors & HC. Find an assistant coach that will pull for him and maybe get a second chance.

You can't fix this for him. 

Sorry for the tough love, but better now then later. If he was good enough to get a scholarship, there's still a chance he can right the ship. 

Good luck!

Dolphindad, thank you very much for sharing.  This is a very interesting and telling story of a possible outcome after high school.  I hope all works out for your son.

Don't meet with the coach. If he wanted to speak with you, he would have made an effort.

I would suggest considering a transfer to a JUCO where your son can figure it out. Sounds like he bit off more than he could chew.

Best o luck.

Agree with TPM in that it's not a good idea to meet with the coach.  This is something your son needs to find a way to talk with the coach on a man to man level and show the HC he has the maturity to deal with adversity and show respect to the HC as a person (whether he feels like it or not).   At your son's age, the only time a parent should really be in contact with the HC is for specific health issues.   You ask, what can it hurt at this point . . . well, his future in baseball can still be affected as word of such things do have a way of getting out to other coaches and other coaches certainly tend to not like the idea of a young man effectively leaning on a parent for such help at this stage in their life.  Your son can play his best cards with the HC and if it just doesn't work out, then your son should work on plan B (such as considering a transfer to a JUCO to  buy time with regard to his baseball future).  Otherwise, if he values a diploma from this school, then maybe it's just time for letting go of baseball and focus on academics like some have already mentioned???

In any case, I'm sure we all really wish the bests for your son and hope he finds a way to work his way through this.

Truman posted:

   At your son's age, the only time a parent should really be in contact with the HC for specific health issues.  

100% agree with Truman, TPM and others.  This is your son's gig.

I am also in agreement with not meeting the coach. If he gets bad grades do you meet with the professor? If he has a job and has issues with his boss do you meet with him?  Be your son's advisor, councilor and friend and help him grow up to be a man. It's his deal not yours.  Best of luck.  

What do you expect to be said at this meeting if you have it?  If the coach is vague to your son I seriously doubt he will be more clear with you.  If this meeting takes place then your son truly is sunk on that team.  Sounds like he already is but the meeting will not help.  If you decide to transfer what's to stop the coach from reaching out to the new team and saying "So and so had his daddy fight his battle.  I told him exactly what was going on and he wouldn't listen.  Then he had his daddy come talk to me"  Do you really want to start on a possible bad foot with a new team.

Look sometimes there are bad fits.  The recruiting doesn't live up to the expectations you have.  Maybe it's on the coach and maybe it's on your son - who really knows?  But the thing is your son and coach will probably never see eye to eye.  How is you meeting with the coach going to change that?  Let's be honest it won't and you're not going to get any type of closure or confirmation the coach doesn't know what he's talking about.  It will leave a sour taste in everyone's mouth.  Fix the grades, find a new place to play and see what happens.

Ask the question Why play baseball?

why attend college? What is his motivation, goals. Maybe he has met the wall and cannot climb over.

Bob

I'm with the others. Let your son deal with this. Your job is to sit in the background and provide guidance. As I mentioned in my earlier post my parents talked to my college coach 6 total times. 1 during his initial phone call to me. He asked to speak with them. During my official visit we had a sit down with him and then every year at the year end banquet.  Everything else I took care of. 

You're only responsibility is to coach your son through the problem. He's an adult. The coach does not want to meet with daddy.

When your son was told he had two weeks to straighten things out he should have asked for specifics. He shouldn't have walked away not knowing. To me, that's a maturity issue. 

If your son is being given two weeks it's either attitude/work ethic or grades. He needs to find out immediately. If there's an assistant he feels closer to (typically his position coach) he needs to talk with him right away. If he doesn't get the specifics he needs he has to go to the head coach.

To be honest I believe the coach has already made his decision. This is about attitude or grades. The season doesn't end in two weeks.

Dont take your son's word he's going to get a 2.5 this semester. If a kid is in academic trouble he may not want to tell you. He may be praying he's gets a 2.5. Is your son missing mandatory study halls?

The net: He needs to identify the issue and determine if it's fixable in the coach's eyes. If the situation can't be fixed he can't overreact. He should thank the coach for the opportunity. Never burn bridges. Coaches know each other. If he ends up transferring down to a JuCo maybe the coach will help with placement.

If I'm paying for part of his college or have co-signed a student loan I would be telling my son to worry about his grades first.  If keeping his grades up is an issue I would probably call the coach myself, if needed, and tell him to pull my son off the team.   Unless your son is throwing 90+ mph.  

Nothing good will come out of calling coach.

the fact that he said son was lazy when son said he does same as other players is confusing. Must be grades.

has he lost yr of eligibility? Did this coach recruit him? They must have seen something to give him a Scholarship. Why is he not throwing BP and getting in an inning or two? 

Son needs to talk w coach again, and leave w no question unanswered. 

Good Luck to him. If he is cut and goes somewhere else he can take these life lessons w him and not make same mistakes at new school.

Tough news to deal with Dolphin, there is really nothing more to add here, i hope your son finds his stride and determines what he really wants. FWIW, kid's you think have it all as a student athlete...playing time, good grades, new friends,  still feel isolation and anxiety as freshman in college. Injury and grades are probably the two deal killers in college ball and it sounds like your son has experienced a bit of both. I hope he gets back on track and wish you the best. 

Sorry I just caught up on the responses and have agreed with everyone. We are visiting this weekend and will discuss with our son what should happen based on a lot of the advice here.

FWIW...My son graduated from a class of 18 kids, a 6'5 lefty from a small HS going to D2 was a huge deal for us and the community. I advised JUCO as a couple wanted him, but once the D2 offered it was over. They offered on the spot and he accepted on the spot.

I appreciate all the advice and have listened....

lionsbaseball....not quite 90...about 4mph away...lol

dolphin, good luck this weekend.

Pretty sure it is the grades.  My son attends a JUCO, and he has a friend on the team, who my wife and I love.  However, the coaches apparently aren't real happy with him.  It was really hard for me to understand why.  His dad is a local HS Coach, who was a closer at a major D-1, and this kid is a great athlete. He's respectful, and a real joy to be around.  With all that being said, I asked Ryno why the coaches didn't seem to like him.  Ryno said they think he is "lazy".  I said why do they think that?  He said, "because of his grades. They don't think that he works hard enough to take care of that end of the bargain."  He also said that he only wants to stay in his room and play video games all the time. 

I am pretty confident it is the grades.  Ryno is a very bright kid, but I keep on him about his grades EVERY time that I talk to him.  Last semester was his first, and he had a hard time with a 200 Level Business Stats Class. (Not sure why they would suggest he take that in his first semester of college.)  I told him constantly to get with the professor to find out what he can do for extra credit, additional classroom time, get with a student who understands the material better, etc.  It ultimately didn't lead to him getting an A in the class, but I know that he did his part to try and make it happen.  He ended up with a 3.6, and his lowest grade this semester is a 95%.  My point is that I am constantly discussing this with him because of the importance to his future.  If he transfers to another college, it lets those coaches feel confident that he can handle the load without them having to baby sit him. 

I would talk to your son and find out what classes he is struggling in.  Then I would advise him to meet with each professor and develop a plan of attack to get his grades up to a MORE than satisfactory level.   Then, I would have him talk to the coach and apologize for his "laziness" in the classroom.  I would also have him tell him that he is sorry that the he has provided undue stress to the coach because he didn't take care of his business.  After all of that, I would have him stress to the coach that he is going to make changes, and he will get his grades where they need to be.  Then, I would have him ask to PLEASE give me another chance. 

If that doesn't get things on the right path, then I would consider looking into the transfer idea, or give up baseball all together to get my academics right.

Hey just wanted to follow up with this to update....Went to visit my son. Had a good time....team lost both games. Anyway we had a long sit down with my son. Then before we left for home I pulled my son aside and talked to him man to man. Told him that if he wants to come back he need to step up and bury the hatchet with this coach and figure what he needs to do to get the coaches trust back. If not he needed to decide what his next step was going to be and soon. I also explained to him that grades should be his main priority no matter what.

Well he had his meeting with the coach the coach wants him back but told him he need to get things on the right track. I asked my son did you as what he meant by that. of course he said no.....anyway it looks like my son is gonna finish with a cumulative gpa of 2.8 this year....Which is not great but not terrible coming from the school he came from.

I told my son that although he didn't completely resolve issues with this coach that he needs to do everything to get on his good side. or his soph. year wont be any different. My son said he is even more motivated now and gonna work this summer to get in even better shape and keep his shoulder healthy.

He does have a job lined up for the summer...Should he throw at all over the summer? or should he do cardio, weights and therapy only? He did pitch again last week of the season...and did ok....did give up 1 run.

Why isn't York he playing this summer to get better? Or attend summer school?