Throwing around after outs

I've never thought it served much purpose aside from keeping players focused.  At the same time though it shouldn't take more than a few seconds in which the next batter would be approaching the plate anyway. Just throwing it back to the pitcher isn't really going to save much time unless the team has a habit of throwing the ball away.

It's one of those things where I can take it or leave it.  I've never done it with anything younger than a 14U team because it doesn't get done quick enough and way too many balls get thrown away. A HS team should be able to do it, but it's certainly not necessary. 

I like it at the HS level.  We demand a purposeful throw-around... quick tempo, quick feet, quick hands, firm throws.  If a P is deliberate or dominating or running deep in counts, the defense can start to lull.  This gives IF's a game-like throw and keeps them more prepared for the next ball that comes to them.  If properly executed, it adds zero time to the game.  

I don't care as much for the short huddles that sometimes take place at the end of a throw-around, usually 3B with P, but if it appears to work with the P's demeanor, I am not inclined to cut it out.  There better be hustle back to position though.

Agree with Rob....in most cases, the "throwing it around" is done and the ball is back to the pitcher before the previous batter is back to the dugout.  ex) a grounder to short and the batter is thrown out at first...by the time he overruns 1B by 15', turns and gets back to the dugout (expecially 3B dugout) the ball should easily have thrown around and be back to the pitcher before the next batter is in the box.  I always thought it kept the IF in the game...heck, a 2B may go 3 innings without touching a ball lol. 

That being said.....I don't quite understand the OP's reasoning about "getting back to the dugout"....you're not throwing the ball around after the 3rd out anyway (at least I hope not)....so how would it affect players getting back to the dugout quicker??

I will most likely time it both ways and adjust as the season goes along.  The get back in the dugout quicker is the total time on the field for the half inning.  What I've noticed in the past is on a strike out even good high school teams are going to throw the ball away some and opposing hitters which I can't control wait until the ball is back to the pitcher before they start towards the plate.  Also just thinking from a mental stand point I want it to seem as though my pitcher is waiting on the batter. While this won't make a difference to above average hitters to some average and below average maybe it makes them rush to the plate and just get out of sync.  Would be the same as a hitter stepping out of the box to try and throw the pitcher out of rhythm.  Rarely will it effect a good pitcher but a young pitcher may get frustrated and rush if he knows a hitter will step out of the box.

I remember back when my son was in middle school. The teams that threw the ball around after an out I felt were much better, looked much more confidant with more purpose than those who didn't throw the ball around.  

It's also a way for each infielder to showcase their glove and arm if nothing else.

Also I feel like a lot of the game is mental part and if I can find an advantage that isn't unethical then we will take advantage of it.  Another example is we keep our facilities super nice from the time you enter campus until you get to the field.  This requires a ton of work as we take care of a lot that isn't even seen from the baseball field but I want the other team to think this is the nicest place we have ever been they must be good at baseball even though it has zero effect on playing ability.  Again against good team that are well coached it won't matter but vs an average team maybe we have an off day and this allows us a little adjust inning where the other team is still in awe so to speak.

Florida State Fan I agree with this at younger levels but feel as though in high school everyone should be able to so maybe not be as important.  But those are the things I'm looking for things that I may not think about.  Thank you

I'd be more concerned about my pitcher/catcher working quickly than I would a throw around. You're going to save a lot more time with pitching tempo. I also feel the defense is better behind a pitcher working more quickly, as well. 

UNCOACH that is one of reasons for not throwing ball around.  Get it back to the pitcher and get back on the mound mindset.  We are pushing to only have 12 pitch innings and a good tempo during those 12 pitches.  Now weather this is going to work the way I planned I have no idea but I know we have been 2nd in the district for the last 10 years and while I'm the new guy at the school I want to try some different things this first year.  We have very young team that not a lot is expected out of so if it doesn't work we can always go back to what they have been doing and grow from there.  

The real reason of throwing the ball around the horn is to give the infielders something to do while the next hitter gets into the box.

FHO, "around the horn" is tradition!!    Are you trying to defy baseball tradition??  If it's always been done it must be right 

fhobbs013 posted:

UNCOACH that is one of reasons for not throwing ball around.  Get it back to the pitcher and get back on the mound mindset.  We are pushing to only have 12 pitch innings and a good tempo during those 12 pitches.  Now weather this is going to work the way I planned I have no idea but I know we have been 2nd in the district for the last 10 years and while I'm the new guy at the school I want to try some different things this first year.  We have very young team that not a lot is expected out of so if it doesn't work we can always go back to what they have been doing and grow from there.  

I think there is merit to that idea if you have P's that are comfortable and can execute well at a quick pace or if you can get them there.  I totally agree that the defense is more likely to stay sharp with a quicker pace but it is awfully important to allow a good P to work at the pace he is most comfortable with.  Some like to command the game and think through their attack approach for each pitch and count situation, and therefore are a bit more deliberate.  Some can just step up, take the sign/location and execute.

QHEAD I've already gotten that push back from some of the SR's on other stuff.  Most common thing heard around our practices are "We have always done it ______ way" and the next is We have always been 2nd too.

CABBAGE my thought is a good pitcher will pitch when they are ready at their pace.  So if we mess up and throw it away or whatever happens I take that out of their hands but if the ball is in their glove they go when they are ready.  

Really it's an experiment and more just to change the thought process of the team to thinking hey we don't have to do it the same way everyone else does.  If it doesn't work then we really haven't lost anything but if it works for whatever reason then we may gain something.

fhobbs013 posted:

CABBAGE my thought is a good pitcher will pitch when they are ready at their pace.  So if we mess up and throw it away or whatever happens I take that out of their hands but if the ball is in their glove they go when they are ready.  

Really it's an experiment and more just to change the thought process of the team to thinking hey we don't have to do it the same way everyone else does.  If it doesn't work then we really haven't lost anything but if it works for whatever reason then we may gain something.

Cool, definitely agree on the good pitcher pace and think it might be worth trying in regards to game pace.  

Your comment did bring to mind one more point against that may have been touched on earlier i think ...  if your guys aren't able to execute the short throw-around with no live game action pressure at least 90+ % of the time, that is a sign you have issues that need worked on - a clear measuring stick.

We have evolved to the point where we do quite a bit of timed around-the-horn drills (with a competition element) in practice and I think it is a very relative game-like drill that immediately translates.  The in-game throw-around is, in some ways, just an extension of that.

Sorry, that will be my last counter .  Like I said, I do think your idea has merit and it's good to do things out of the box sometimes.

I was more interested in the fact that you consider northern Mississippi to be a cold weather environment. 

I guess I have the same feeling.  I love seeing a team execute a crisp, quick throw around...especially after a great play by the SS or a great scoop by the 1B....it seems to fire up even the guys (2B and 3B in this case) who weren't involved in the play.  I just feel like if I saw a team make a great play...then just throw it back to the pitcher that it would seem strange....almost like they didn't know that that's what they "are supposed to do"....even though as some said, it's really more of a tradition than a rule, but I think it looks good

Simple:  all games prior to March 11, no around the horn, except after a K.  Gotta have it after a K.  All games after March 11, around the horn.

Don’t upset the baseball gods. 

https://i.imgur.com/nxEbs80_d....&fidelity=medium

This is simply trying to do something different just to be different... but to each his own. 

Like Root66 was probably wondering, did you mistype a Ietter or two?  You typed MS.   Did you really mean MN, MD or possibly MA.  If MS is correct, I'm not following your logic.

I (always) liked the idea of throwing the ball around the infield at all levels to keep the players engaged and sharp.   I especially like it after a strikeout when a catch snaps a throw off to first base, to SS to 2nd to 3rd and back to the pitcher.  At the higher levels a throw from catcher to first is likely to happen more times than a throw to third. 

As always, JMO.

FHOB: have you discussed the "9-5 rule" with your team? The throwing the ball around after an out develops "quick feet" if done properly. The infielders are performing proper "catch and throw" with their moving feet.

Bob

fhobbs013 posted:

UNCOACH that is one of reasons for not throwing ball around.  Get it back to the pitcher and get back on the mound mindset.  We are pushing to only have 12 pitch innings and a good tempo during those 12 pitches.  Now weather this is going to work the way I planned I have no idea but I know we have been 2nd in the district for the last 10 years and while I'm the new guy at the school I want to try some different things this first year.  We have very young team that not a lot is expected out of so if it doesn't work we can always go back to what they have been doing and grow from there.  

Not throwing the ball around steals energy from your own team.

Sounds like you're in a great situation, taking over a team that has a beautiful facility and has been near the top of hot heap for a decade.  But you also have an interesting challange because you have a young team and you need to figure out how to get from second place to first. I'm thinking that if you sit down and try to identify how previous teams came up short and how the next team is going to get over the hump, this isn't going to be among the important factors.

How a team does round the horn is kind of like how they do pre game. If see a new team and their pre game is crisp and clean,  you know they are well coached and have the ability to beat you, even if they don't have as much talent as you do.

I can’t get on board with them not throwing it around. Keeps guys loose and in rhythm. 

We have the C throw down to 1b to start it. Gives us a handful more reps of a “dropped 3k” situation, which I think is beneficial. Working on timing to have 2b take throw from SS mimicking DP feed if possible. Not sure yet. 

Just seems like you’re sacrificing reps but still not speeding things up any. 

But if it works for you, do it. 

fhobbs013 posted:

UNCOACH that is one of reasons for not throwing ball around.  Get it back to the pitcher and get back on the mound mindset.  We are pushing to only have 12 pitch innings and a good tempo during those 12 pitches.  Now weather this is going to work the way I planned I have no idea but I know we have been 2nd in the district for the last 10 years and while I'm the new guy at the school I want to try some different things this first year.  We have very young team that not a lot is expected out of so if it doesn't work we can always go back to what they have been doing and grow from there.  

A well coached team will do what they can to get a pitcher out of his rhythm.  They will do everything they can to slow down the pitcher and disrupt his tempo.

I agree with all of your points and as far as the cold goes we start games Feb. 17th and are located just outside of Memphis so cold is usually 40 degrees during the day for the first month of games and varsity games start at 7.  I love getting feed back from everyone as it shows a lot points and both sides of the argument.  The biggest thing is we are having to change a lot of things to try and get the team culture better.  We have a lot of small groups that play together in travel ball and things like that.  We do a lot of things trying to and make everyone uncomfortable and rely on each other on and off the field instead of just relying on talent alone.   We may throw the ball away once every 5 games or so if we throw it around.