It seems that everyone is arguing about two common techniques as though they are the same. There are two common techniques for catchers, the first is the rocker technique. This requires more arm strength but is very short and quick in the delivery. The catcher receives the ball as they are shifting weight to their rear foot. With a short step of their left foot toward second they release complete the throw. This may be the Pirate technique being described because in this method the arm will go back farther behind the head. The second technique is more common and involves the catcher stepping with the left foot where the right foot was and then forward with the right. This is done as the ball arrives) In this method you take the ball and glove to your ear and as you step forward the glove and ball stay in place, placing them behind your head for the throw. If you try to go back with the ball while you are going forward you will end up going back too far and will slow the process. The second method is where you see quick releases and rapid throws to second and does not require the rocket arm.
Ever catch before?
I was a pitcher and developed a true love of those that did it the right way. I made it a point to learn a lot about the art of catching. Without a good receiver a pitcher is half as good as he can be. I was born throwing from the other side so catching after little league (that was fun) was not an option.
I just want to let you guys know what I learned from this instructor I go to. First your arm should be basically near 90 degrees it really doesn't matter how much angle in your what matters is how it got there. Your arm should be coming back as you are getting you feet set. You really don't want to be too technical about it but the from in detail I got is, you right foot should move slightly forward as you are coming out of your crouch (if you where standing straight up this would be under your belly button)then you left foot follows so your momentum is bring you toward second base. Now you don't want to have too much momentum because you don't want to end up way in front of home plate. Basically this is like the "load and throw" technique because you are letting the ball **** your hips as you receive it. So the arm angle really doesn't matter, what does matter is how fast you get it there so your arm and your feet catch up.
The instructor's name is Dan Ninemire. He played AAA ball in the Yankees organization (Newark Bandits) as a catcher and he coached at Pitt and he is a scout for the Seattle Mariners. The man knows his stuff and this technique really seems to help me get more zip on the ball.
-Kevin
The instructor's name is Dan Ninemire. He played AAA ball in the Yankees organization (Newark Bandits) as a catcher and he coached at Pitt and he is a scout for the Seattle Mariners. The man knows his stuff and this technique really seems to help me get more zip on the ball.
-Kevin
quote:Originally posted by Catcher41:
...right foot should move slightly forward as you are coming out of your crouch
I realize I won't convert the world to a different technique, which, no matter what I say, and it feels like even if I could demonstrate it, no one will buy the fact that my technique requires less arm strength. It is the absolute truth. I ask you to explore it on your own.
But, the above quote is wrong even if you use the pivot technique. Taking a step forward, with the right foot, even if tiny, adds to your pop time.
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But, the above quote is wrong even if you use the pivot technique. Taking a step forward, with the right foot, even if tiny, adds to your pop time.[/QUOTE]
The right foot really only turns. The heel should turn forward thus keeping your body from losing ground, but the step itself is very small. I threw consistently 1.70-1.8 with that technique, so saying it adds is a mistruth. If you will watch slow speed video of Pudge, or any of the good ones, they "turn" their right foot slightly to get their body squared and momentum going forward.
Catcher41, Your instructor knows his stuff. The key is staying "stacked" or balanced as you come out and you will be fine. Keep up the good work!
But, the above quote is wrong even if you use the pivot technique. Taking a step forward, with the right foot, even if tiny, adds to your pop time.[/QUOTE]
The right foot really only turns. The heel should turn forward thus keeping your body from losing ground, but the step itself is very small. I threw consistently 1.70-1.8 with that technique, so saying it adds is a mistruth. If you will watch slow speed video of Pudge, or any of the good ones, they "turn" their right foot slightly to get their body squared and momentum going forward.
Catcher41, Your instructor knows his stuff. The key is staying "stacked" or balanced as you come out and you will be fine. Keep up the good work!
There is a huge difference between taking a tiny step forward with the right foot and turning the right foot.
At least a .1 or .2
Your other point is spot on.
I like the term "stacked". Have never heard it before.
And, a tiny step forward hurts your ability to be "stacked". Better said hurts your ability to "stay" stacked.
At least a .1 or .2
Your other point is spot on.
I like the term "stacked". Have never heard it before.
And, a tiny step forward hurts your ability to be "stacked". Better said hurts your ability to "stay" stacked.
"Absolute truth"--is there such a thing in baseball ?
Linear and Coach A have consistently made good points here. The three types of throws a catcher can make are called, the load and throw, whch Linear has been describing, the jump pivot, where the catcher scissors his hips and lines his feet and shoulders up to second base and the jab step, which is when you step with your right and then your left foot toward second. The jab step is really for youngsters with an undeveloped arm. They must actually move their body toward second to get momentum. The load and throw is the quickest, but let me say that its not really an arm strength issue as much as it is getting the catcher into the right position to be successful at this throw.
quote:Originally posted by Coachric:
...the load and throw, whch Linear has been describing
Yes and No. Sounds right but I believe I do it differently than what most envision.
quote:The load and throw is the quickest, but let me say that its not really an arm strength issue as much as it is getting the catcher into the right position to be successful at this throw.
I can agree with that but it sounds like your're saying it's hard to "get the catcher into the right position". The right position is the "nobody on base" stance, which all catchers are used to. Easy.
Linear,
The only reason I share a different opinion on not getting your hips up even with the knees is that when you block laterally (side-to-side), being in the "nobody on base" position limits your quickness and range. Does it slow you down on footwork throwing...could be debated, but I will say probably not enough to warrant saying it. The blocking problem is a factor though that should be considered when setting up with men on base.
The only reason I share a different opinion on not getting your hips up even with the knees is that when you block laterally (side-to-side), being in the "nobody on base" position limits your quickness and range. Does it slow you down on footwork throwing...could be debated, but I will say probably not enough to warrant saying it. The blocking problem is a factor though that should be considered when setting up with men on base.
Linear, some of your mechanical stuff is right on and enjoyable to read. However, in my years in this game it has always been called the "load and throw". I am only saying that it CAN be difficult to get a kid to realize that he can make a solid throw using this style as a SS does from the whole. Thats the best way to describe it to a catcher in training. Part of teaching is breaking down old myths and habits and refining new techniques for the learner. Once a catcher has practiced and worked hard on the load and throw, he should realize its advantages. We must all be flexible in this game and realize that there are many ways to skin a cat (sorry cat lovers) and as long as the catcher is comfortable, making good pop times and especially throwing out runners, he should be OK. As each student of the game progresses, he will find opportunities to advance and improve.
Well Stated Coachric.
We spend too much time trying to teach all kids to do it the same way even if some bodies don't work the same. I spend most of my day trying to figure out what direction to take a lot of different body types in all aspects of the game including catching. Great point that you made.
We spend too much time trying to teach all kids to do it the same way even if some bodies don't work the same. I spend most of my day trying to figure out what direction to take a lot of different body types in all aspects of the game including catching. Great point that you made.
Coach A,
I agree with you on this point. I was blessed a feew years ago with a catcher that had a very strong arm and was able to use the load and throw or rocker method with little body momentum to second. Two years ago we had a kid that was outstanding as a receiver and terrible as a thrower. We worked hard for two years on his throwing with his footwork and utilizing his body more. He became effective and was able to hold runners affectively. He was never great, but never hurt us. Each person has to be built upon the attributes they posses.
I agree with you on this point. I was blessed a feew years ago with a catcher that had a very strong arm and was able to use the load and throw or rocker method with little body momentum to second. Two years ago we had a kid that was outstanding as a receiver and terrible as a thrower. We worked hard for two years on his throwing with his footwork and utilizing his body more. He became effective and was able to hold runners affectively. He was never great, but never hurt us. Each person has to be built upon the attributes they posses.
quote:Originally posted by Coach A:
future C27, what part of oklahoma you from?
Tulsa
I only ask because I grew up and graduated in Guthrie. Good to see some Oklahoma talent out there learning all they can. Good luck!
Glad I found this site,thanks
