Travel Sports World Series - Pitching Limitations (cough cough)

There was a time when USSSA didn't have pitching limits. I saw some serious abuse from 13u to 16u. Do you remember LLers going 130 to 150 pitches in all stars?

Innings/outs should never be a factor.  Pitches are the most important.  LL has the right idea now, and they even have some type of rule about catching after/before pitching, which I've seen abused this year also.  Some coaches don't really understand, but I guess that trophy is REALLY important.

Just plain crazy.  Counting pitches as opposed to innings is the way to go

Next, lets talk about the kids who throw 75+ pitches and then play 3B or SS in the next game the same day on a 60/90 diamond.   Or even the next day, or for 2 days after that, & then get pitched again because they are on 2-3 days "rest"

RJM posted:

There was a time when USSSA didn't have pitching limits. I saw some serious abuse from 13u to 16u. Do you remember LLers going 130 to 150 pitches in all stars?

I remember when Little League teams generally just trotted out the same pitcher game after game.

3and2Fastball posted:

Just plain crazy.  Counting pitches as opposed to innings is the way to go

Next, lets talk about the kids who throw 75+ pitches and then play 3B or SS in the next game the same day on a 60/90 diamond.   Or even the next day, or for 2 days after that, & then get pitched again because they are on 2-3 days "rest"

This one never bothered me as much. Generally, my son's cool-down program, which he does immediately after pitching, is much more rigorous with throwing than anything he would do by taking a position in the infield for the rest of a game. Having said that, I'd prefer the controlled atmosphere of his cool down program.

At a smaller school like ours, I run into this all the time with my pitchers. They are all needed in the lineup after they pitch. A kid with our program is never going to go from the mound to the bench. Outside of blow outs, we can't afford that luxury.

roothog66 posted:

3and2Fastball posted:

Just plain crazy.  Counting pitches as opposed to innings is the way to go

Next, lets talk about the kids who throw 75+ pitches and then play 3B or SS in the next game the same day on a 60/90 diamond.   Or even the next day, or for 2 days after that, & then get pitched again because they are on 2-3 days "rest"

This one never bothered me as much. Generally, my son's cool-down program, which he does immediately after pitching, is much more rigorous with throwing than anything he would do by taking a position in the infield for the rest of a game. Having said that, I'd prefer the controlled atmosphere of his cool down program.

At a smaller school like ours, I run into this all the time with my pitchers. They are all needed in the lineup after they pitch. A kid with our program is never going to go from the mound to the bench. Outside of blow outs, we can't afford that luxury.

Kind of the same story here.  Small town, limited number of players all the way thru HS.   Son played both local rec and travel from 9U on up.  Then travel and even some Legion during HS.   Heck, sometimes he played 7 days straight...and loved every minute of it.  SS, P and some C.   Rarely sat unless it was a blowout.  He has never iced...really didn't even ever have a "cooldown" of any kind until he got to college and has never so much as woke up with a sore arm.  He's been lucky I guess but I wasn't going to be the one to tell him he had to take some innings off....lol. 

roothog66 posted:

3and2Fastball posted:

Just plain crazy.  Counting pitches as opposed to innings is the way to go

Next, lets talk about the kids who throw 75+ pitches and then play 3B or SS in the next game the same day on a 60/90 diamond.   Or even the next day, or for 2 days after that, & then get pitched again because they are on 2-3 days "rest"

This one never bothered me as much. Generally, my son's cool-down program, which he does immediately after pitching, is much more rigorous with throwing than anything he would do by taking a position in the infield for the rest of a game. Having said that, I'd prefer the controlled atmosphere of his cool down program.

At a smaller school like ours, I run into this all the time with my pitchers. They are all needed in the lineup after they pitch. A kid with our program is never going to go from the mound to the bench. Outside of blow outs, we can't afford that luxury.

I'd be interested in hearing more specifics about that.   What specifically does he do in his cool down program?

Max effort (at times) throws of 120 plus feet from 3B or 100+ feet from Shortstop, plus medium effort throws from that distance, plus 4-5 warmup throws from that distance per inning (after sitting for 5-15 minutes cooling down while offense is hitting) after pitching and throwing 75+ pitches sounds like a good way to cause an injury, to me, however I am open minded to differing views.   And then there is the cool down of a few hours in between games and for the 2nd Game that day you have a full throwing warmup plus all those throws again in game.

The last two coaching jobs I had, both of my bosses seriously disagreed with what you are proposing and I would have been fired if I went against their direction:  One, a former AAA MiLB pitcher, said never play a kid at SS/3B/C after they pitch.  The other, a current D3 coach, said kids should never play a defensive position after they pitch.  (both referring to full size 60/90 fields)

Until USA Baseball has the courage to establish limitations and then enforce them in all amateur venues issuing punishments for violators that are more than mere slaps across the wrists, the kinds of things seen in the OP will continue to happen.