Does anyone know how TSA structures their teams? I see Scout, National, Prime, etc. Is there a hierarchy or something like that with their teams?
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Not sure of the way that they structure them now, a couple of years ago Prime was the top. They were sold in the last year or so, I don't think that the Barths are involved any longer.
I would think that Prime would be the top team.....Scout team for certain events that don't fit into the normal Prime schedule (likely fall/winter events) and National their 2nd tier summer team. When my son played against them a few times, they didn't have Prime/National designations. That must be a fairly new way of them designating their teams.
Buckeye 2015 posted:I would think that Prime would be the top team.....Scout team for certain events that don't fit into the normal Prime schedule (likely fall/winter events) and National their 2nd tier summer team. When my son played against them a few times, they didn't have Prime/National designations. That must be a fairly new way of them designating their teams.
I just took a look at PG. I looked at 14U for 2019. They didn’t have a prime (although they had a 13U prime in 2017 – so, maybe they don’t use prime anymore?). They had a 2022 (14U) scout team – but, there were no kids from NJ on that team. It was all kids from around the country. The did have a 14U national team in 2018. It looked like kids close to their base – NJ/PA/NY, etc. But, the team went 2-11 in PG. So, maybe that is their “B” team?
their top 17U team is TSA National. They struggled this year.
PitchingFan posted:their top 17U team is TSA National. They struggled this year.
Yes. When they go 4-2-1 and finish 4th in their pool that is struggling for them.
PitchingFan posted:Yes. When they go 4-2-1 and finish 4th in their pool that is struggling for them.
thanks
But each age group has different names for their best teams. This is the teams that have played PG events in fall 2018.
https://www.perfectgame.org/PG...amid=0&Year=2019
17U National is a put together team that normally only plays the big events.
We’re egos bruised teams were called A, B and C forcing a change? Or is it hard to charge thousands for a team called a B and C team?
RJM posted:We’re egos bruised teams were called A,B and C forcing a change?Or is it hard to charge thousands for a team called a B and C team?
Yes
It varies by age group. To add to the confusion, they went down to Jupiter as Tri State Arsenal FC. They're good but something I would wait until after freshman year before jumping into.
Francis7 posted:Does anyone know how TSA structures their teams? I see Scout, National, Prime, etc. Is there a hierarchy or something like that with their teams?
At your age (now 15U) prime will be the top. Just look up players on PG.
Do they use Prime as a label anymore?
For many orgs like Tri State, the "B" team usually wins the most games, and the most development will come from this team. It's mostly the same players, same coaches and they don't bring in the guest players very often. And get this, THEY ACTUALLY PRACTICE TOGETHER AND KNOW EACH OTHER.
Go44dad posted:For many orgs like Tri State, the "B" team usually wins the most games, and the most development will come from this team. It's mostly the same players, same coaches and they don't bring in the guest players very often. And get this, THEY ACTUALLY PRACTICE TOGETHER AND KNOW EACH OTHER.
I don't really buy that. The B team is still pulling players from 5/6 different states, not sure how much practice time they're getting in. They charge a few thousand to play in some local tournaments and then head down the WWBA where they go 3-4, 2-5, etc. The top team is good, but after that it's a cash grab with the hopes that they get lucky with a few kids so they can slap in on the website.
It’s been 10-12 years. But we (the team I formed) beat the B team on a regular basis from 13u to 16u. When my son played the teams we’de called Blue and Gray. I didn’t see anything special about the B team. They didn’t stink. But they weren’t any better than ASBA teams below 17u.
My son's friend played for the TSA 15U B team a couple of years ago. The kid's dad said that the best part was that they all got the same training in the Winter workouts, and there were a lot of strong players there pushing each other. Once the season started, though, they were just an above average team. Typically came in 2nd or 3rd in tournament pools. Obviously all the top pitching went to the A team.
PABaseball posted:It varies by age group. To add to the confusion, they went down to Jupiter as Tri State Arsenal FC. They're good but something I would wait until after freshman year before jumping into.
Great, not only did baseball organizations start naming their teams Premier, Elite & Select, which came from travel soccer.....now they're using FC? FC is football club....another soccer term lol. Why would anyone possibly use FC in a baseball organzation? I don't care if it means Fastball-Changeup lol, any true sports fan is going to look at it and assume it's a soccer club
My son knows some kids who played on their older team. One was a two way player. He said that he had to pay as a pitcher and a hitter to play both ways for them. It was like four grand in total. And, he never got to pitch in the tournaments as they always brought in pitchers. He did say that you would probably play if you were a position player who could hit. But, they were always bringing in players to play in the tournaments that no one knew or saw before, etc.
Buckeye 2015 posted:PABaseball posted:It varies by age group. To add to the confusion, they went down to Jupiter as Tri State Arsenal FC. They're good but something I would wait until after freshman year before jumping into.
Great, not only did baseball organizations start naming their teams Premier, Elite & Select, which came from travel soccer.....now they're using FC? FC is football club....another soccer term lol. Why would anyone possibly use FC in a baseball organzation? I don't care if it means Fastball-Changeup lol, any true sports fan is going to look at it and assume it's a soccer club
Founder's Club
PABaseball posted:Go44dad posted:For many orgs like Tri State, the "B" team usually wins the most games, and the most development will come from this team. It's mostly the same players, same coaches and they don't bring in the guest players very often. And get this, THEY ACTUALLY PRACTICE TOGETHER AND KNOW EACH OTHER.
I don't really buy that. The B team is still pulling players from 5/6 different states, not sure how much practice time they're getting in. They charge a few thousand to play in some local tournaments and then head down the WWBA where they go 3-4, 2-5, etc. The top team is good, but after that it's a cash grab with the hopes that they get lucky with a few kids so they can slap in on the website.
Are you referring to Tri State? I was generalizing with my experiences and with what I have observed to give Francis an idea of what to research for his either hypothetical or real situation. All good here.
Go44dad posted:Buckeye 2015 posted:PABaseball posted:It varies by age group. To add to the confusion, they went down to Jupiter as Tri State Arsenal FC. They're good but something I would wait until after freshman year before jumping into.
Great, not only did baseball organizations start naming their teams Premier, Elite & Select, which came from travel soccer.....now they're using FC? FC is football club....another soccer term lol. Why would anyone possibly use FC in a baseball organzation? I don't care if it means Fastball-Changeup lol, any true sports fan is going to look at it and assume it's a soccer club
Founder's Club
Where I know FC / Founder's Club from is Marucci (the sporting goods company). Years back they created a grass roots marketing campaign that gave discount uniforms/gloves/bats/etc to travel orgs. If the team joined the program, they became a member of the "Founder's Club". Three/four years back they started a Marucci World Series with the FC teams. Here is a link to 2017 list of teams (at least that came to the World Series). https://maruccisports.com/mws Orgs such as Scorpions, Stars, East Coast Sox, CBA, Ontario Blue Jays, Louisiana Knights, Dallas Tigers were at the WS. Games were played at LSU, ULL, Tulane and other colleges/high schools.
The boudin was hot and the crawfish did flow.
I see some Arsenal teams are tagged HTG (and not FC). What's HTG?
Francis7 posted:I see some Arsenal teams are tagged HTG (and not FC). What's HTG?
HomeRun-Triple-GroundOut 
At least that way it sounds like a baseball team
I figured it out! It's Honor The Game. Another Marucci thing.
Francis7 posted:I see some Arsenal teams are tagged HTG (and not FC). What's HTG?
I'm not sure if Tri State Arsenal FC has anything to do with Marucci FC. Here is the link to marucci FC orgs. I don't see Tri State. https://maruccisports.com/founders-club/
Francis, if you were a game show host and I had 5 seconds to answer to win $1M, I would say "Honor the Game".
Francis7 posted:I figured it out! It's Honor The Game. Another Marucci thing.
Let me know if you need my address for the $1M.
K9 posted:Not sure of the way that they structure them now, a couple of years ago Prime was the top. They were sold in the last year or so, I don't think that the Barths are involved any longer.
Correct -- they are no longer involved.
baseball mom2020 posted:FC is Founders Club and TSA is scheduled to play in the Marucci World Series.Top teams are "National"
FWIW, their 14U "National" team went 2-11 in PG contests last year.
baseball mom2020 posted:FC is Founders Club and TSA is scheduled to play in the Marucci World Series.Top teams are "National"
That's great! It is a really fun tournament. Probably the most fun for both of us since little kid days. All the teams show up opening night at Tiger Stadium (LSU). They have cajun food for the kids, a HR derby and fastest man for the 17U kids. Then Bands play that night. Games start the next day.
It will be very interesting to watch what happens with Tri-State with out the Barth's involved. For better or worse the man had a vision and built towards it.
When you sell a business to new owners it is very difficult to remain the same company, experience and guidance are lost, relationships while they still exist are new and untested. Debt service can create process changes to keep the books in line. There is much behind the scenes both operationally and financially that can have an impact on the what the product ends up looking like.
I think in the short term it is buyer beware.
My son had two classmates that played on their 16U teams last year (B&C). They had good experiences and felt they improved as players. It's true the won/loss record wasnt great, but they are returning this year and they do have a 60+ minute drive to practice. In speaking with their dads, It sounded similar to my kids experience at ASBA........ Similar cost and development, but more of a drive.
Velo From The Stretch posted:My son had two classmates that played on their 16U teams last year (B&C).
What's B & C?
Francis7 posted:Velo From The Stretch posted:My son had two classmates that played on their 16U teams last year (B&C).
What's B & C?
Second team, third team (my guess). Not speaking to Tri State, but often the more stable teams in the "really big org" world. But all are different.
That's what I assumed - 2nd and 3rd. Wasn't sure if it meant something else?
baseball mom2020 posted:Barth still shows up from time to time and he went down to Georgia to watch the teams compete.
A lot of the staff are the same and they have great relationships with college coaches.
good to hear, they have been a quality organization for a long time.
For better or worse, Tri-States structure is no different than many of the top programs.
I have noticed a number of the big programs moving to a national “franchise” model. However, the “national” team remains under control of the programs leadership.
Francis; correct on the B&C, I meant the second and third teams.... not the National team that has more hired guns. I wasnt sure of there real names.
Arsenal switched their uniforms from Nike to Marucci in the fall- that may be the source of some of the name changes.
