trick plays

Bullwinkle ...

Where have you been???

Actually saw that same 'play' at the minor league level last year ... whowouldathunk?

Maybe son in law learned something from father in law last night?

Have seen a variation in that once.

Gillespie doing a great job with the eaters! I'm impressed!

congrats ... and very exciting, tho kinda surpising they'd be running the basic "stumble play" most 10U teams in this area have been running for 30+ yrs

most here consider it a bit "hokie" above 12U
(no offense to VT)

To: My favorite castaway on Gillian’s Island.

Let’s see…I’ve been there and done that….(not to be confused with that dude from Chicago)… For a large herbivore I can be stealthy….just last week I walked up to you in Albertson’s with a bag of carrots and large summer squash said… “Helloooo” …but you continued to bag your bulk sunflower seeds…..it was as if you didn’t see me or want to see me….no worries…I have been going to Jenny Craig, and I am happy to say that I have lost 750 lbs and now fit into my summer mauve short shorts and some what stained wife beater shirt….so I can understand the confusion…..

I have been joyfully embarrassing my boys at their games….Bullwinkle Jr….(due to those selfish Northerners, who have the NCAA’s by the jock) is playing 5-6 games a week...Bullwinkle Jr the second, is playing 3 games a week for varsity…I only have one day off from baseball over the next three months…not that I’m being crabby…just no time for the wicked…The brilliant one Miss Bullwinkle has gotten a regents scholarship from UCLA…just so she doesn’t feel left out, while in LA I will on occasion yell outside her dorm room….“I’M GOING TO THE STORE, DO YOU NEED ANY FEMININE PRODUCTS?” of course being a daughter of mine she yells down…”NO, BUT I DO NEED SOME CONDOMS!” This of course puts me in my place as I sulk away.

I have now high jacked my own thread…I am now ****ed at myself….

Now; does anyone have a trick play that they have seen or used?

This one got used on my son...in a 13-U tourney...about 6 years ago (a play which was picked up by the AAU team from the local college):

Man on 2nd...not sure how many outs.
Pitcher turns and FAKES a pick-off throw...CF dives and gets up running after the "ball." Son sees the CF butt and elbows...takes off towards 3B...
...he's the ONLY ONE in the ball park that did not see the pitcher STILL with the ball.

Yeah...he got suckered. Came into the dugout...mad as heck at the CF (his COUSIN, of all people)...kicked the bucket of balls over...got YANKED FROM THE GAME in front of his grandmother...
...and never threw an on-fit tantrum ever again.

quote:

by JT: Man on 2nd...not sure how many outs. Pitcher turns and FAKES a pick-off throw...CF dives and gets up running after the "ball." Son sees the CF @$$ and elbows...takes off towards 3B...

lol, just last night we were dicussing that "scramble play" with an opposing player whose 12U team we used that play on twice one yr

#1) stadium tourny ... our pitcher's Grandma even stood up & loudly shouted
"you dummy ... why'd you even throw the ball"
we got the out at 3B ... she was NOT part of it but did help sell it, and appologized for
months.

#2) post season playoff game -
we did NOT get the out ... but the BU scooted thru the CF gate looking to retrieve that phantom ball ...
he was very unhappy about that play .. but his partners were kinda amused

I have never been a big fan of trick plays. I just prefer to play the game.

I think that the trick stuff goes on when you have relatives coaching against one another.

I've seen youngster Tommy Bowden pull off some stuff on his Daddy. I guess it's hard for him to stand there looking aggravated yet at teh same time proud of his offspring.



I've also seen some hokie stuff go on when opposing coaches have no love lost between them.

Here's a tricky one for ya.

http://sports.aol.com/mlb/story/_a/tempers-flare-in-ben...id=NWS00010000000001

bullwinkle,we run that exact play as well.It works a lot of the time

quote:

Originally posted by Bullwinkle:
This happened last night (03/11/2008)UC Irvine at USC Trojans.....

(As a side note, father-in-law is Irvine head coach and son-in-law is SC head coach)

Irvine as a man on first and third with two out.
RH batter in box.
SC has a freshman LHP that is struggling.
Man on first breaks off for a steal…trips over feet and falls to the dirt.
At same time, man a third is stealing home.
LHP (who of course is facing 1st), runs directly to fallen runner for an easy out, not noticing that runner is stealing home.
Son-in-law screaming at LHP from dugout
Father-in-law smirking.
Fallen runner gets up and runs to second, to be tagged out after runner from third has scored.

Of course this was a called trick play by father-in-law…
Great acting by player


I’m guessing that son-in-law won’t be inviting father-in-law for thanksgiving dinner.

What trick play have you seen recently?

Are they really your relatives?

quote:

Originally posted by switchitter:

quote:

Originally posted by Bullwinkle:
This happened last night (03/11/2008)UC Irvine at USC Trojans.....

(As a side note, father-in-law is Irvine head coach and son-in-law is SC head coach)

Are they really your relatives?

No (Well not that I know of anyway). He's saying that UCI's coach (Gillespie) is the Father-in-law of USC's coach.

Our guys practiced this play in HS last year under our former coach. Never saw it used in a game. Couple of weeks ago, under a new coach, our 3B (good friend of 2B ) froze between first and second while the runner from 3rd ran home. Pitcher charged 3B (who was hung up between 1B and 2B ) and got him out after the run scored.

My question after the game: Did you plan that? Answer: No, just a brain f*a*r*t. Whatever, it worked!

quote:

Originally posted by JT:
This one got used on my son...in a 13-U tourney...about 6 years ago (a play which was picked up by the AAU team from the local college):

Man on 2nd...not sure how many outs.
Pitcher turns and FAKES a pick-off throw...CF dives and gets up running after the "ball." Son sees the CF butt and elbows...takes off towards 3B...
...he's the ONLY ONE in the ball park that did not see the pitcher STILL with the ball.

Yeah...he got suckered. Came into the dugout...mad as heck at the CF (his COUSIN, of all people)...kicked the bucket of balls over...got YANKED FROM THE GAME in front of his grandmother...
...and never threw an on-fit tantrum ever again.

Was that your kid?? We ran that at 12U and 13U against the same team 3 or 4 times. I have never seen it not work. It's commonly referred to as the "Miami" play, who actually used it to win the 1982 CWS.

Tie game, bottom of the last inning, runner at 3B 2 outs, Pitcher winding up. As the Pitcher lifts his leg the batter drops his bat and starts waving his hands like a bee is attacking him and runs out of the box. The Pitcher stops his motion, balk called, game over. This actually worked for us in the District Finals 35 years ago.

quote:

Originally posted by powertoallfields:
Tie game, bottom of the last inning, runner at 3B 2 outs, Pitcher winding up. As the Pitcher lifts his leg the batter drops his bat and starts waving his hands like a bee is attacking him and runs out of the box. The Pitcher stops his motion, balk called, game over. This actually worked for us in the District Finals 35 years ago.

Too bad, you might have won that game instead.

With the Moose's permission I would like to consider "Are trick plays OK?" If they are OK, when do they become bush league, if ever? Arod got called bush for rounding 2B and yelling "BALL!!" on a pop up. At what age, if ever, is that OK?

quote:

Originally posted by Dad04:
With the Moose's permission I would like to consider "Are trick plays OK?" If they are OK, when do they become bush league, if ever? Arod got called bush for rounding 2B and yelling "BALL!!" on a pop up. At what age, if ever, is that OK?

If we wrote the rules down...then that would violate the basic principle behind having "unwritten rules" in the first place

We run the pithcer fakes to 2B and everyone dives and then tag out at 3B play. I think we have a reputation for doing it because it doesn't work as well now.

As for bush league or not = I don't feel this one is because you are forcing the opposing team to pay attention.

To me the difference between bush and baseball is if you pull a play that requires them to pay attention or if it's something that interferes with a play.

Paying attention = good baseball
Interfering = bush league

The bee incident and ARod is interference and is wrong.

Coach, that seems reasonable. I guess bush league is like obscenity. You know it when you see it.

quote:

Originally posted by coach2709:
We run the pithcer fakes to 2B and everyone dives and then tag out at 3B play. I think we have a reputation for doing it because it doesn't work as well now.

As for bush league or not = I don't feel this one is because you are forcing the opposing team to pay attention.

To me the difference between bush and baseball is if you pull a play that requires them to pay attention or if it's something that interferes with a play.

Paying attention = good baseball
Interfering = bush league

The bee incident and ARod is interference and is wrong.

I wouldn't really call what ARod did a play. I think it's bush, but not a play. It could have gotten someone hurt.

In the Bee situation, the Pitcher knew he couldn't stop his wind up without being called for a balk. He just lost concentration. You have to know what your job is and what everyone else on the fields job is. Who should the baserunner be looking to or listening for in the pick-off scenario? Who should the Pitcher be more focused on in the 1st and 3rd stumbling runner scenario? What should a baserunner see before he takes a step off the bag in the hidden ball trick? These players just lost focus and all would tell you it was their mistake after the play.

I do agree that these plays are done to players or Coaches that have bad blood between them. In the Bee situation, we were out of Pitchers and our Coach (who was a MLB scout) took a chance it might work so we wouldn't have to go to extra innings with an outfielder doing the pitching.

The Bullwinkle believes this to be true…

If any play happens that it is out of the ordinary but it happens to you, its bush.

If any play happens that you run and is successful, it’s cool.

BTW: the Bullwinkle is the king of hijacks…..actually it is my middle name….Bullwinkle hiJack Moose…while I know this is upsetting to control freaks….I can never stay on a steady stream of information….think of me as a five year old from the 60’s….no ritalin to abuse….only snickers and coke to calm me down. Let this post go anywhere you want it to go…..no permission needed….only wit and wisdom.

Hope to see you at the field tonight SizzlePop...Hawaii @ Irvine 6pm anteater ballpark.

Oh a BullSizzleWinklePop.

"Tie game, bottom of the last inning, runner at 3B 2 outs, Pitcher winding up. As the Pitcher lifts his leg the batter drops his bat and starts waving his hands like a bee is attacking him and runs out of the box. The Pitcher stops his motion, balk called, game over. This actually worked for us in the District Finals 35 years ago"


NOT LEGAL........and Bad umpiring.......see rule below....Consider the cost, I better see a bee....or you are now minus the player.......

lets try hitting the ball..........

4.06
(a) No manager, player, substitute, coach, trainer or batboy shall at any time, whether from the bench, the coach’s box or on the playing field, or elsewhere—

(3) Call “Time,” or employ any other word or phrase or commit any act while the ball is alive and in play for the obvious purpose of trying to make the pitcher commit a balk.

PENALTY: The offender shall be removed from the game and shall leave the playing field, and, if a balk is made, it shall be nullified.

See.....that's how you do it..

TheEH: Wit
Piaa_Ump: Wisdom
GottaWoody4ya: Wit

quote:

Originally posted by JT:
This one got used on my son...in a 13-U tourney...about 6 years ago (a play which was picked up by the AAU team from the local college):

Man on 2nd...not sure how many outs.
Pitcher turns and FAKES a pick-off throw...CF dives and gets up running after the "ball." Son sees the CF butt and elbows...takes off towards 3B...
...he's the ONLY ONE in the ball park that did not see the pitcher STILL with the ball.

Yeah...he got suckered. Came into the dugout...mad as heck at the CF (his COUSIN, of all people)...kicked the bucket of balls over...got YANKED FROM THE GAME in front of his grandmother...
...and never threw an on-fit tantrum ever again.

I guess Chris and Jeff have another thing in common...Chris got hoodwinked with that same play in Cooperstown at 12 by a team from Utah. Also saw it worked to perfection by a team from Puerto Rico in the AAU Nationals at Disney. Guess those type of plays get around.

quote:

Originally posted by piaa_ump:
"Tie game, bottom of the last inning, runner at 3B 2 outs, Pitcher winding up. As the Pitcher lifts his leg the batter drops his bat and starts waving his hands like a bee is attacking him and runs out of the box. The Pitcher stops his motion, balk called, game over. This actually worked for us in the District Finals 35 years ago"


NOT LEGAL........and Bad umpiring.......see rule below....Consider the cost, I better see a bee....or you are now minus the player.......

lets try hitting the ball..........

4.06
(a) No manager, player, substitute, coach, trainer or batboy shall at any time, whether from the bench, the coach’s box or on the playing field, or elsewhere—

(3) Call “Time,” or employ any other word or phrase or commit any act while the ball is alive and in play for the obvious purpose of trying to make the pitcher commit a balk.

PENALTY: The offender shall be removed from the game and shall leave the playing field, and, if a balk is made, it shall be nullified.

I guess the umps can lose concentration too, huh?

Runners on 1st & 3rd. First base runner gets a huge lead, so much so that the pitcher has no choice but to pick him off.

Instead of going back to the bag, he dives to the line about 4' behind first base.

First baseman catches the ball and can't help but go after him (thus walking away from home plate)

Runner on 3rd scores.

quote:

Originally posted by Bullwinkle:
The Bullwinkle believes this to be true…

If any play happens that it is out of the ordinary but it happens to you, its bush.

If any play happens that you run and is successful, it’s cool.

BTW: the Bullwinkle is the king of hijacks…..actually it is my middle name….Bullwinkle hiJack Moose…while I know this is upsetting to control freaks….I can never stay on a steady stream of information….think of me as a five year old from the 60’s….no ritalin to abuse….only snickers and coke to calm me down. Let this post go anywhere you want it to go…..no permission needed….only wit and wisdom.

Hope to see you at the field tonight SizzlePop...Hawaii @ Irvine 6pm anteater ballpark.

"Our guys was just blue collar guys. Maybe they cut a few corners just tryin' to get ahead."

quote:

Originally posted by coach2709:
We run the pithcer fakes to 2B and everyone dives and then tag out at 3B play. I think we have a reputation for doing it because it doesn't work as well now.

That play falls under what the Ill HS Assoc calls dekeing and is illegal in Illinois HS baseball.

To me, that's when the adult coach is trying to outsmart the teenage player. Let the kids play the game and determine the outcome, pitch, hit, field.

There is no honor is winning that way.

quote:

Originally posted by CPLZ:

quote:

Originally posted by coach2709:
We run the pithcer fakes to 2B and everyone dives and then tag out at 3B play. I think we have a reputation for doing it because it doesn't work as well now.

That play falls under what the Ill HS Assoc calls dekeing and is illegal in Illinois HS baseball.

To me, that's when the adult coach is trying to outsmart the teenage player. Let the kids play the game and determine the outcome, pitch, hit, field.

There is no honor is winning that way.

What about bunting when the other team isn't ready for it? What about pitching out and catching someone stealing? What about intentional walks? It's all part of baseball. I wouldn't want to win by intentionally walking the other teams best hitter in a crucial situation nor would I want to lose because someone walked our best hitter. I don't believe there is honor in that.

quote:

Originally posted by CPLZ:

That play falls under what the Ill HS Assoc calls dekeing and is illegal in Illinois HS baseball.

What about faking turning a DP when a flyball is hit to the OF on a hit and run?

IMO, if you don't want to fall victim to a trick play, spend 15 minutes going over them so your team knows what to look for. It's called coaching.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by CPLZ:

It's not coaching. Anyone that thinks you can spend 15 minutes on something and have it ingrained into a player so that he reacts properly to something unfamiliar and out of the ordinary, has never coached.
[\QUOTE]

1) I have and do coach - both a travel team and college. We spend 15 minutes per week going over possible trick plays. I coach a 14U team and they pick it up just fine.

2) Trick plays are part of baseball. I am as honorable and respectful of the game as anyone on this board. Perhaps, you don't like me because I went to Annapolis.

quote:

Originally posted by redbird5:

quote:

Originally posted by CPLZ:

That play falls under what the Ill HS Assoc calls dekeing and is illegal in Illinois HS baseball.

What about faking turning a DP when a flyball is hit to the OF on a hit and run?

IMO, if you don't want to fall victim to a trick play, spend 15 minutes going over them so your team knows what to look for. It's called coaching.

quote:

I have coached for 25 years and if I did something like that to some kid, I wouldn't be able to look my team in the eye.

Your profile says "non baseball Dad". What do you Coach?

If you trick someone who doesn't know any better, then it is just wrong! You can't trick someone who knows better, you can just catch them sleeping. It's no different than snow birding in basketball or throwing it off a defensive player when you are throwing it in and they have their back to you. They messed up! Mental or physical mistakes both hurt and cost people games, it's part of playing sports!

quote:

Originally posted by powertoallfields:

quote:

I have coached for 25 years and if I did something like that to some kid, I wouldn't be able to look my team in the eye.

Your profile says "non baseball Dad". What do you Coach? Basketball

If you trick someone who doesn't know any better, then it is just wrong! You can't trick someone who knows better, you can just catch them sleeping. It's no different than snow birding in basketball or throwing it off a defensive player when you are throwing it in and they have their back to you. They messed up! Mental or physical mistakes both hurt and cost people games, it's part of playing sports!

Deception plays in baseball are taught and called by adult coaches on unsuspecting youth. Your examples involve players using normal and everyday moves in the flow of the game. Hardly comparative.

quote:

Originally posted by CPLZ:

quote:

Originally posted by powertoallfields:

quote:

I have coached for 25 years and if I did something like that to some kid, I wouldn't be able to look my team in the eye.

Your profile says "non baseball Dad". What do you Coach? Basketball

If you trick someone who doesn't know any better, then it is just wrong! You can't trick someone who knows better, you can just catch them sleeping. It's no different than snow birding in basketball or throwing it off a defensive player when you are throwing it in and they have their back to you. They messed up! Mental or physical mistakes both hurt and cost people games, it's part of playing sports!

Deception plays in baseball are taught and called by adult coaches on unsuspecting youth. Your examples involve players using normal and everyday moves in the flow of the game. Hardly comparative.

Okay! A kid is throwing the ball in bounds and the other team is pressing. The kid on defense is playing the kid throwing the ball in very tight. The kid reaches the ball out towards the kid on defense and he touches the ball, Technical Foul. Were both kids taught what they should do in that situation? Deception is part of sports as well as life. Learn what the tricks are and then PAY ATTENTION and you won't get tricked!

quote:

Originally posted by powertoallfields:

Okay! A kid is throwing the ball in bounds and the other team is pressing. The kid on defense is playing the kid throwing the ball in very tight. The kid reaches the ball out towards the kid on defense and he touches the ball, Technical Foul. Were both kids taught what they should do in that situation? Deception is part of sports as well as life. Learn what the tricks are and then PAY ATTENTION and you won't get tricked!

That's ok, there's lots of people that don't understand honor and teaching young people values.

quote:

That's ok, there's lots of people that don't understand honor and teaching young people values.

I understand what your saying CPLZ.

But I also believe in taking advantage of what ever the other teams give's you.
And that can be a teaching tool as well??
Players need to learn to pay attention at all time's, and sometimes it takes a ( bush ) trick play to make that happen. hopefully lesson learned.
EH