Ultimate list of things to do at this point?

Vector,
With your son being a 2011, isn't he already applying to colleges, since application deadlines are very close on the horizon, or past for some?
What is he doing with the schools where he is applying to determine the interest level of the coaches?
I am having a hard time with your post since it could be read that your son is laying all his cards into whatever baseball opportunities might develop in the next few months. That can happen.
But it is not something he or you can use as a plan, which I assume you know.
Also, what level is your son looking at for playing/education? Is he willing to take a last minute opportunity with a coach/school/program/team which he has not researched? Is he willing to let baseball guide the choice or are academics and other "fit" items like size of the school, quality of education, class size, cost, geographics and the like the drivers, with baseball following or just being one factor?
If he wanted exposure to great DIII's with great academics, along with Ivy/academic type private DI's, he probably needs to see if he can get into the FLA. Headfirst Camp. I don't know when it is but it usually is the first 2 weeks in December. When he was the recruiting coordinator for a DIII, our son was at that Camp in 2008 and identified some players he then recruited to his school.

In my book it is time to "hit the road." Assuming that he has the grades and test scores that most colleges want to see, my advice is to make appointments with coach/recruiting director at as many colleges that "make sense" for him to visit. Go to the school, take the tour, meet with admissions; find a school where he will be happy.

Then "sell yourself" to the coach. Coaches recruit kids that they want in their program. If the coach likes you and thinks that you would be a positive addition to his program he may be willing to "evaluate" you as a recruit. Most recruiting is based first on baseball talent; what I am suggesting is that you reverse the order and get the coach to evaluate you as a person to get his interest and then hopefully he will figure a way to evaluate your baseball talent.

You have missed most of the easy opportunities to be seen; you may have to work harder but you can find a good opportunity if you do your research and make the effort.

Does he have an idea of what he wants to study and at what level?

Are his marks strong enough to get him to one of these places?

Has he got a list of schools that he would like to attend? Has he got a realistic list of schools that he would like to attend?

Can you get to some of the Propect Camps of schools that are nearby?

Instead of a rush decision to get into a D1, would he be better to go to a nearby JUCO for a year, and then make a more informed decision? It would save a year of eligibility if he makes the wrong decision at a D1 in haste.

I think having a good understanding of where it is he would like to go to study can simplify the decision.

I should have included more info regarding grades, interest, etc., however at this point we do not want to leave any stone unturned.
His desire to play D1 baseball might not match up with his current skill level despite being as "projectible" as some have said. A perfect fit for him(at any level)will be a pitching coach who sees his potential since he is still growing and in his boys body despite being 6'4" 190. The fact that he throws in the mid 80's and has only touched 88 has not sparked a lot of interest so far, yet his performances at recent events have been decent.

As to college applications, he has filled out a few fall back applications, but he is adamant about being able to play baseball no matter where he goes. Since he eventually wants to go to medical school, he ideally would get into a school via baseball that he would not have the grades to get in otherwise. He is a good student averaging 3.7 over 3 years taking AP and Honors classes, but that will not cut it at the top academic colleges. Now if he does not get into a top academic school we do not want him going to a slacker school either, just to play baseball. So we might wind up with a conflict down the road, but hopefully not as we are normally on the same page with him.
Anyway I have to run for a while, but hopefully this will give some more info regarding his plans at this point.

If camps, travel teams, recruiters, etc. have worked, please feel free to suggest anything you have a positive experience with that could help.

quote:

Since he eventually wants to go to medical school, he ideally would get into a school via baseball that he would not have the grades to get in otherwise. He is a good student averaging 3.7 over 3 years taking AP and Honors classes, but that will not cut it at the top academic colleges.

This statment tells me more than anything you can tell me about his baseball skills. Pre-Med is VERY DIFFICULT when you are playing baseball. My sense is that Pre-Med kids work much harder and have a much more difficult road to travel. Over my son's four year career there was only one Pre-Med ballplayer and he did not travel to any mid-week games. Additionally, it was not uncommon for him to skip a road weekend series becuase of the riggers of his academics.

Without knowing his SAT's; on the surface a 3.7 with a tough academic profile WILL get him into some of the best colleges in the country. More than likely he will find that the top D3 programs throughout the country will be the best fit for his academic profile and his best chance to play ball while working towards a Pre-Med major.

quote:

Originally posted by Vector:

As to college applications, he has filled out a few fall back applications, but he is adamant about being able to play baseball no matter where he goes. Since he eventually wants to go to medical school, he ideally would get into a school via baseball that he would not have the grades to get in otherwise. He is a good student averaging 3.7 over 3 years taking AP and Honors classes, but that will not cut it at the top academic colleges. Now if he does not get into a top academic school we do not want him going to a slacker school either, just to play baseball.

May be as public service you could identify a few "slacker schools" Here's a tip... Take a look at any rostered players bio, in any division for baseball and see how many list pre-med as their major. That should answer a few questions. Although it's not uncommon for players to gain admittance to a school through baseball that he would not normally qualify for. Then drop baseball once admitted,to pursue a major, which is not conducive to the demands of the sport

quote:

Originally posted by Vector:
I should have included more info regarding grades, interest, etc., however at this point we do not want to leave any stone unturned.
His desire to play D1 baseball might not match up with his current skill level despite being as "projectible" as some have said. A perfect fit for him(at any level)will be a pitching coach who sees his potential since he is still growing and in his boys body despite being 6'4" 190. The fact that he throws in the mid 80's and has only touched 88 has not sparked a lot of interest so far, yet his performances at recent events have been decent.

As to college applications, he has filled out a few fall back applications, but he is adamant about being able to play baseball no matter where he goes. Since he eventually wants to go to medical school, he ideally would get into a school via baseball that he would not have the grades to get in otherwise. He is a good student averaging 3.7 over 3 years taking AP and Honors classes, but that will not cut it at the top academic colleges. Now if he does not get into a top academic school we do not want him going to a slacker school either, just to play baseball. So we might wind up with a conflict down the road, but hopefully not as we are normally on the same page with him.
Anyway I have to run for a while, but hopefully this will give some more info regarding his plans at this point.

If camps, travel teams, recruiters, etc. have worked, please feel free to suggest anything you have a positive experience with that could help.

Vector,

If your son does indeed throw in the mid to upper 80's with a 6'4" 190lb frame, he will receive some love, especially if you take advantage of the right camps and showcases. You've stated that his velocity may not be enough to pitch at a D1 school? I disagree, my kid doesn't have a 92+ FB and he signed at a D1. He has hit 90/91 on a couple occasions, but for the most part he sits comfortably at 85-88. The kids that sit in the low 90's and throw strikes are most likely going to be drafted, or will attend a Top 25 program and make an immediate impact. Coaches/Recruiters are looking at a number of factors...How does he compete? What are his secondary pitches like? What type of command does he have? Also, a 3.7 GPA doesn't necessarily scare away Ivy League schools. Bsbl247 son was heavily recruited by an Ivy, and his GPA is only 3.5. If your son has the ability athletically and academically, he'll get an opportunity somewhere.

I agree with ILBB's assessment, you may want to concentrate on some of the top D2/D3's if your son wants to pursue a Pre-Med major? I would like my son to major in Mechanical Engineering, in fact, every "Career Test" that he's taken the past couple years on collegeboard.com and other sites have pointed him in that direction. However, he knows how tough it will be to balance baseball and school and will more likely go in a diffent direction. Honestly, if he was dead-set on Engineering as a major, I would have pointed him towards another school and ironically the school he's attending has a great program.

Have you gone online to colleges within a 2 hour radius of your home and checked to see when their winter camps are being held? That's probably your best bet, along with the PG showcase you're sending him to in January. I wish him the best of luck, keep us updated on his progress the next couple of months.

Vector, you have a PM.

quote:

Originally posted by dswann:
May be as public service you could identify a few "slacker schools" Here's a tip... Take a look at any rostered players bio, in any division for baseball and see how many list pre-med as their major. That should answer a few questions. Although it's not uncommon for players to gain admittance to a school through baseball that he would not normally qualify for. Then drop baseball once admitted,to pursue a major, which is not conducive to the demands of the sport

I actually didn't have a specific school in mind that would be considered a slacker school. Furthermore I would not post something like that anyway so as to not offend someone who attended or has a kid in the school. But lets face it, some school have a party first reputation, and the support systems to help the graduates succeed is not as strong as other programs.

I suspect most pre-med students major in Biology since few campuses seem to have a specific major called "pre-med". My sons dream like most kids who play is to become good enough to make it to the professional ranks. If he ever became good enough to do so, I suspect he'd put his grad school ambitions on hold. By then he will be an adult and be able to make his own decisions, but until then he knows he needs to get at least a 4 year degree at a decent school.

Vector - you have a PM.

quote:

I suspect most pre-med students major in Biology since few campuses seem to have a specific major called "pre-med".

Very true. It is a BA in sciences as their major but not necessarily so!

[ Pre-Med is VERY DIFFICULT when you are playing baseball. My sense is that Pre-Med kids work much harder and have a much more difficult road to travel.]

Absolutely right. But it can be done. When I worked at a mid major D1 University we had pre-med and even engineering kids play baseball very successfully. Probably still do as far as I know ...

Just want to chime in with a great example / role model of "pre med + baseball." Our Trumbull CT hometown star Craig Breslow played 4 years at Yale, studied for pre med (as a biochem major I believe) and passed the MCATS. Decided to pass on the opportunity to go to med school, is now a relief pitcher for the Oakland As. Of course his nickname is "the smartest man in baseball" so he is a pretty exceptional person!

Vector, This was probably stated before, but I think an Ivy/NESCAC/D3 place, where the focus is on academics 1st, a baseball player might be able to adjust schedules, make his science labs, miss a game here and there, would be the best route to consider for pre med. Most of them have January 1 deadlines (some Jan 15 / Feb 1) so your son needs to jump on those apps! If I were the parent in this case I might be a bit more firm on getting some apps out ASAP to good schools regardless of baseball ---- you only get one shot at this and the clock is ticking! There are some terrific D3 (or low level D1s) liberal arts colleges out there who do an awesome job getting kids into med schools. Maybe file a few carefully selected apps to places where the education is solid, and work on coach interest later.

PS, 'pre med" is never a major. And, one can be a history/any major and still go to med school as long as you take the required sci classes ....

Good luck -

quote:

Originally posted by BaseballmomandCEP:
Most of them have January 1 deadlines (some Jan 15 / Feb 1) so your son needs to jump on those apps! If I were the parent in this case I might be a bit more firm on getting some apps out ASAP to good schools regardless of baseball ---- you only get one shot at this and the clock is ticking!

That was our thinking as well. However his school counselor said it would be better if he was not turned down if baseball was a viable possibility at a particular school. Another words, if he applied to say Harvard for example, and was turned down, but the baseball coach wanted him to play for them, it would be a greater hurdle for them to get him on the team if he had already been turned down by the admissions office. She claims to have seen it happen before.

Another thing that sticks out in our mind is what happened to a kid last year from his school. He was a decent baseball player, but assumed he would not be able to play at his dream academic school which was Notre Dame. So he applied having a 4.2gpa, great SAT/ACT scores, a 3 sport athlete, Eagle Scout, huge community service record, etc., and yet was denied admission. That is just one example, but if a kid like that cannot get into a higher academic school, what chance does our son have?
He has most of what his schoolmate has, but with lower grades and test scores. He is a good student, but not a great one like his former teammate.

We are just hoping his baseball abilities are good enough to where a baseball coach can go to bat for him, and get him admitted to a school he might otherwise not be considered at. Schools like ND, VT, Duke [EDIT-used for examples]are prime examples of schools he'd love to attend, but doubt his grades would cut it without being a student athlete.

Anyway, if there are any cant miss events, camps, etc. between now and spring, that you all can think of, please suggest them.

Vector, if ND, VT and Duke are his dream schools than you may want to bring him to one of their winter/prospect camps. Send his info to those coaches and see what the reply is.

I believe should a coach really want you, then yes, getting into a higher academic school is a possibility. But, can the player handle the demands.

Expand your search by looking on Collegeboard.com or Naviance websites to broaden the search. You can also look into a JC, so he can develop for a year or two, both as a player and academically, and then become more appealing to the Top DI he dreams of...Good Luck

I don't think the counselor's advice is correct.

First of all, you aren't officially rejected until they mail the responses. Many of the highest academic schools don't do that until late March. Secondly, how in the world is it in your interest to be walking around like Diogenes with the lantern looking for the unique situation college coach you think you need (probably correctly) and all the time have nothing working for you in the normal course of applications that other people are all doing. This is what most people call a "run for luck". Some would call it a terrible strategy.

Of your short list there, VT is a lot more forgiving on grades and scores than are Duke and ND. All of them set the bar pretty high on current athletic ability. Use the college boards college finder and screen for D1 baseball schools (if that's what you're looking for) and then sort the list by declining SAT score to get a rough ranking by academic status. You'll be surprised at the list.

I wish you good luck. My opinion on this process is that it is a lot more competitive than anyone realizes. The world is not overflowing with good pitchers who throw above 85 and have board scores over 1300, but.........there are enough of them nationally to fill up the ivy's nescac, Duke, Northwestern, Stanford, ND, Georgetown and others. There are exceptions who "sneak in there" at such places, but they are usually exceptions on only one of the athletic or academic measurements. Not on both, which is kind of what you seem to be describing, at least with respect to scores.

Go ahead and work like mad on unearthing a baseball opportunity for your son. Just make sure you cast your "normal application process" net widely enough to ensure that you are not optionless in May. Just my viewpoint.

Also, while it doesn't seem to be the preferred method of cultivating interest, I would think the short time and your situation might be helped with a video that would allow you to cover more ground more quickly Others could chime in here on this.

Vector: You and his GC make some good points. For schools where he won't get in on his own (ie Duke) perhaps it is best to wait and see if coaches will pull for him.

But for one example, look at VT for general admissions. On the surface it sounds to me like Tech might be a reach for baseball but not necessarily for academics... and getting the app in sooner rather than later might be a wise move.

My main point, however, is to go 'off list' in terms of baseball and pick a nice place like a Susquehanna, Allegheny, Gettysburg, Fairfield, Marist, etc where his academics might be a fit (I don't know his whole profile but those sound like they would work) and use Naviance, as the other 'mom' said, to make sure its a fit. Get 2 or 3 of those apps in! so he has a good college home while he works on the baseball dream. (And, some of those might end up being better baseball homes than he thinks!)

Midnight tonight is EA deadlines for a bunch of really fine schools, and wouldn't it be nice to get at least 1 academic yes in December?

Just my 2 cents ---- work with a lot of college bound kids each year and I know what it feels like to not get some EA /rolling decision 'yes' replies in December. Stress for many months after that! Cheers ---

Vector, time for a reality check, your son does not have the grades nor the velocity as a pitcher to be considered by a place like VT. What makes you think the coach would be remotely interested in your son then? Get real and find a place where he can REALISITCALLY play and excel academically. Lets assume that he somehow could get into a place like Duke or VT with substandard grades, now he is going to be competing with the best and the brightest academically, he might be able to handle it if this is the only thing on his plate. Now add on top of it a first tier D1 baseball demand and he is trying to fight his way on to the roster. He is now trying to fight two battles at the same time. Even if this could all happen you are setting your son up for failure.

On one hand there is lots of time find a place, however he should have in place a plan on where to go if it does not pan out. This is clearly a JC, or possibly a DIII. If he really wants to play at a place like VT, etal then a 85MPH FB is not going to get a coaches interest regardless of projectability. IMO don't waist too much time with these schools other than letting them know you are interested and are looking for options for him to develop and play there at some point in the future. (after a few years at a JC) Find a few DIII’s where he fits and as some one posted hit the road. In parallel get him squared away with a slot at a JC and you have a good chance of finding him a home. To be thinking about stretch schools at this point in time is not realistic and you are wasting valuable time. I am not trying to be harsh just trying to give you a sense of what you are up against. I wish you the best of luck.

Whoa guys & gals,

I didn't mean to imply that ND, VT, and Duke were the only possibilities. In fact I doubt they are going to be interested based on where my son is today.
I just mentioned those as top academic schools he could see himself going to IF they wanted him baseball wise.

Hi Vector--- my bad, I didnt mean to sound like I was jumping on you at all...or even intend to be in the least bit crtical at all.....

Personally I am not looking to make a 'reality check' because a) I know very little about baseball and b) I think your situation is a great teachable moment for lots of folks!

In fact I love VTech for a kid with his profile, its a great school! So maybe applying there makes some sense. And absolutely pursue the baseball dream....

Also as a product of a mid sized college, with middle of the road athletics, and having worked at one for a dozen years, I think they do an amazing job of of offering a scholar athlete the right mix of academics and sports. Havin his dream of using baseball to get into a top tier school mights still be very possible.

Didn't another thread have lots of good info about 'unsigned seniors' that would also appy to Vectors son?

Vector,
Your last post answered my initial question and seems to clearly relate your son and your family are waiting for DI baseball at a top ACC program like Virginia Tech or a top Big East school like ND to make that happen.
As BOF relates, the odds are very, very much against a 2011 RHP who is not even on the radar of those coaches and schools.
My initial thought was to completely agree with BOF because I think he is talking the reality of your son's situation. But, you can dream.
My view is your son can try and reach his dream. He needs to contact Coach Aoki at ND and Coach Hughes at VT and get to their Camps, whenever the next one is offered.
But, in addition to his dream, it might be the very best for you and your son to acknowledge and accept what BOF described. Your reach/dream schools come with odds at this point that are slim to nearly non-existent both on an academic and baseball slant. Reality strongly supports the choice to expand the horizons on the D3 and D2 front.
Your son might want to(should) investigate and contact schools like Rhodes, Millsaps, Oglethorpe, Trinity(TX.) along with the D2's that are all through Fla. and Georgia.
To be candid, your son might well have a battle for innings in the D3's I have mentioned, but he might well get the eye and support of guys like Jim Page at Millsaps and Tim Scannell at Trinity for baseball and whatever academic boost/support they could offer.
Vector, some of us learn the hard way. I did and our son did. The fact that your son is in the middle of his senior year and has no DI opportunity means something. The silence means something and my best suggestion is to listen.
Maybe your son will be one of those lucky stories like Chris Lambert that PG posted. I sure hope he is because your son is close to that type of position in having a "choice" of colleges.
There are not many Lambert stories for a reason.
Not every player/pitcher can play at their dream schools, especially the ones on your list, and many, many pitchers with velocity and talent have already been identified by your dream schools with some being offered NLI's and some passed over.
In my opinion, you and your son are pushing a large boulder up a steep hill with the path you describe.
I wish you the best. I hope he is another Lambert.
I would plan on a different result and be surprised when/if he is.
Good luck.

Outstanding advice by everyone in this thread.

Vector - based on your description of your son, I think he very well may be a higher end prospect. It might take him a few years of development to realize that however. Work this from the bottom up rather than the top down. Find one JUCO coach out there who loves him but be honest with the coach. Tell them his intent is to attend the JUCO but if a top D1 offer comes up between now and next spring that you will take the offer.

That is how my son and I did it and ended up lucky he got that one offer. In our case, there was a D3 school where the coach called our son almost everyday for several months. We were up front with him about the D1 ambitions but were confident of the fallback plan. We told the D3 coach we would commit after attending a D1 camp at the very end of October - senior year. If no offer came of that, we would go to the D3 who were D3 college world series semi-finalists this year.

Recruiting is a game of musical chairs as has been posted here many times. Metaphorically, don't let your son wind up standing while all the other kids of his ability level are sitting. Over 100,000 players competing for less than 15,000 seats

quote:

Playing in College

High School seniors = 114,159
College "seniors" (or sophomores when related to juco's) = 13,137
That means their are 114,159 graduating high seniors versus 13,137 slots open

114,159/13,137 = 10.1

1 high school player in every 10 has a chance to play in college

Listen to the music...............

Vector,

The advice you are getting is truthful, helpful and timely in my opinion. Speaking of timely, TIME is your biggest enemy right now. You can pretty much write off the D1s in almost all cases right now. Elvis has left that building. D1 coaches are done with 2011s and looking at 2012s. You don't have the time luxury of looking for that D1 needle in the D1 haystack unless you have a D1 opportunity in the pipeline.

My two cents......Take a quick inventory. Good baseball prospect, very good student who aspires to pre-med. If he was my son, I would suggest at this time focusing on D3s and a JUCO as a safety immediately as CD (and others) suggested. Time is not your enemy there, and it is possible to land an elite D3 with the right approach and energy. After you get the D3 and JUCO identified, come back to the D1s that interest you. Maybe (cross your fingers) something happened and a D1 is looking for somebody for whatever reason. Miracles happen.

My point is....Hit the single first. Then come back to hit the homerun if you feel the need.

quote:

I would suggest at this time focusing on D3s and a JUCO as a safety immediately as CD suggests.

This is a bit off topic, but fenwaysouth and others previously often discuss D3 with JUCOs and do not mention D2s. Can someone please explain why this is? Is it that D1 and D2 timelines are similar?

Thank you.

quote:

Originally posted by fenwaysouth:
My point is....Hit the single first. Then come back to hit the homerun if you feel the need.

I love metaphors and that was a good one

BTW - I should have credited FO for the musical chairs metaphor because I believe he is the one who came up with it.

What a lot of people may not realize is that it is indeed possible to hit a homerun at any division level of college as long as the "fit" is correct. There are some great baseball programs at some great academic institutions out there that may not have the D1 tag but might be better fits for your son.

Vector,

I agree with everyone, excellent advice thus far. As FO said, listen to the music...broaden your search for your son, and pursue all options. The good news is that the D1 door isn't completely closed, there will be a number of 2011 players that sign in the spring. A 2010 pitcher on my kid's HS team signed at a Big West school in the spring of last year. IMO the majority of members are advising that you should be honest with yourself, and more importantly your son, while assessing his abilities to play at the next level. You've stated in previous threads that you got a late jump, and he hasn't participated in any noteworthy events/showcases. You advised Vector Jr. not to play basketball his senior year to work on baseball specific training...so my simple advice would be to train hard, attend college camps (target schools within his playing ability), and sign up for a showcase or two within your budget. Some colleges will offer a written evaluation, take advantage of it. Hopefully you're sending him to the PG showcase in January? If so, he'll receive an evaluation and grade, and you'll have a better idea of what to expect come spring. Good luck...

quote:

Originally posted by FormerObserver:
Listen to the music...............

The problem is the radio has been on but no one has been tuned in.

Vector,
You have gotten excellent advice, same excellent advice you have gotten in your previous posts. I understand your frustration, but it still seems like your waiting for teh phone to ring.

We understand the preferences your son may have, but those preferences don't always mean a good "fit". The advice given regarding JUCO also was great advice, but I get the impression that might be an option you consider as a "slacker" schools.

Sit down and discuss this rationally with your son, what exactly does he want to do? Play baseball, be a doctor, go to graduate school. How about working on one goal at a time, sometimes that's easier for a 17,18 year old to handle.

I am sure that you are thinking D1 is the best route because that is where the majority of college players are drafted from. The players that made up son's AA team last year came from D1, D2, D3, JUCOs and no college. Once you get to the pro level, it doesn't matter where you come from, talent, luck and tons of hard work move you ahead.

Spend some money and go to the showcase and get an evaluation that will help in determining where his best fit is according to his talent, based upon what he would like to major in. Work butt off for spring and continue to do so, join a good travel team. I get pm's here from folks from all over the country asking about FL travel programs that have contacted their players, you live here and no one has noticed your son?

I know that you are completely perplexed, why hasn't someone taken notice of my 6'4" RHP that gets people out and shows projection that he MIGHT throw harder. There are lots of guys like that out there. The thing is,you got to work harder to throw harder and I haven't gotten that impression that he has, as yet. I am sorry the more you want it the harder you work for it and that goes for everyone. If you or your son think that just because of his height and projection it will be easy for him, all I can say if not so.

He (and you) also has to be willing to accept the fact that he has to be realistic, I too get the impression nothing but top baseball programs would be acceptable, when you think in those terms, it aint gonna happen.

Vector, just from what I read please look into Dartmouth and UCSD

He sounds he might fit both places.

Both these schools play good ball, you kid sounds projectable and their athletes all take academics seriously.

Just wanted to say that V Tech recruits from the JC schools.Many of the highscademic schools recruit from the JC ranks. USC, UCLA,(prob not Stnford)V tech, I beleive even someone stated that Cornell recruited a kid from a JC.It is easier to get into these schools from a JC than highschool.A 3.0 in a JC will get you into UCLA,USC for baseball.

I will say this having a son at a extremely academic school, when you mix it in with high end D1 baseball it is a 60 hour a week commmittiment.Many think their kids can do it.many fail at it.They fail at it, because they have No idea what it entails.

My won went to a JC for a year first and I am so grateful that he did.he got a taste of living on his own, and being in college before going to college.

Many parents think they want D1, many players think that and when they get there it is often way more difficult then ever imagined.

Look at other options.And if your son is not a top tier prospect, the chances are a lot tougher to go to these types of programs.

When you get to these programs, if you do not outshine the other guys on the field you will not play.So if your not a top tier player and you go to these types of programs and you do not beat out the other guys, you will see limited time on the field.

Many rosters change because many players leave.They arent getting play time, sometimes they get their scollys reduced if coaches dont see them as being a major contributor to their program.

And every fall they will bring in new guys, good guys and walk ons Its a business, the business is to win.That is what college baseball in a top program is about.It is a tough life, and it is a tough pill to swallow when, and if you getthere you ever play.

Not trying to be a negative poster, or bust anybodys sons dreams.Just go in and be aware.

I have read on here what people ask coaches when they are being recruited, asking them about this or that.Every college coach will tell you they have a shot at being on the field.The reality is that only 9-12 guys will get the majority of play time.Almost every guy out there is very good.

Find the level you can have a shot to play at.And if that isnt what your son wants then go to a JC and see how much he develops in two years there.

My own son wanted the top of the heap, he was told he would never get there,he wouldnot settle for less, so he went to the JC for a year.He got his dream school, conference D1 baseball. He went in and got to play.But it could easily change if he does not produce or play to the potential they expect out of him.That is the reality.And there is nothing you can say or do that will change that.

Just have open eyes when seeking out where your son has a chance to play.Now many kids do get into good schools as walk ons and never make the teams.They are ok as they got into their dream schools.

quote:

Originally posted by playfair:
Vector, just from what I read please look into Dartmouth and UCSD

He sounds like a great fit both places.

Both these schools play good ball, you kid sounds projectable and their athletes all take academics seriously.

How can one determine what is a good fit for a player they have never seen play or just from what a parent has posted?

Every player has to take their academics seriously, or they are out the door, doesn't matter where you go.

quote:

Vector, some of us learn the hard way. I did and our son did. The fact that your son is in the middle of his senior year and has no DI opportunity means something. The silence means something and my best suggestion is to listen.

Good points infielddad.

This is one of the best recruiting threads of all time. The advice has been impeccable by all who have posted.

Everything fanofgame has posted is true. Her son saw his D1 dream come true by playing one year at a JUCO. He will also get his chance at the next level someday imho because I trust infielddad's appraisal of him when USC traveled to Stanford. That's right - PAC-10 baseball for the young man because he was not too proud to take one extra year to develop

Wait for the phone to ring and this could all be over in a hurry. Make it happen and it will.

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:
I get pm's here from folks from all over the country asking about FL travel programs that have contacted their players, you live here and no one has noticed your son?

Now I'm not exactly sure what you mean by this comment, but if you are talking about travel teams interested in him, yes he get emails on a regular basis. However if you are familiar with some of the travel teams in Florida, you know some are worthless, others only interested in the money. I probably made a mistake not having him on a travel team his junior year, and started looking too late this year. Still he managed to play at different events with teams he joined last minute and gave his typical performance.

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:
I know that you are completely perplexed, why hasn't someone taken notice of my 6'4" RHP that gets people out and shows projection that he MIGHT throw harder. There are lots of guys like that out there. The thing is,you got to work harder to throw harder and I haven't gotten that impression that he has, as yet. I am sorry the more you want it the harder you work for it and that goes for everyone. If you or your son think that just because of his height and projection it will be easy for him, all I can say if not so.

It is not me saying he will throw harder, it is everyone who has evaluated him (both paid and unpaid). How hard will be the question, not if he will throw harder. When I say he has a boys body, I mean it. If you were to look at him he barely has facial hair, and is not very developed. If he is like me, I was 6'5" in HS and grew another 2 inches by 19. Only once I reached 6'7" did I start to fill out. Funny enough his pitching coach said we should hope he does not hit 90 at any of the showcases because then the seedy underbelly of college baseball will descend upon us. I'm still not exactly sure of what he meant by that, but in hindsight I wish we had that problem as opposed to what we are facing now. Then again, maybe it is worse than I imagine.

Regardless of what he will or will not reach velo wise, we are trying to give him every opportunity to get exposed to as many coaches/scouts as possible. The fact he gave up basketball shows an extra level of commitment he has not shown in the past being a three sport athlete.

My purpose in starting this thread was to make a list of suggestions that we could do between now and February to help him. Talking about what schools might and might not be a fit for him is all fine and dandy, but it is not really the type of information I am looking for at the moment. It is not as if a bunch of D3's and JUCO's are beating down our door either. So rather than take the cart before the horse, we need to get as many schools interested in him as possible, then worry about which ones to choose from.

It might be more relaxing for you if you get some D3 or JC schools interested.have a fall back plan for your son. It was very relaxing for us going into senior year that we knew several JCs wanted our son and asked him to come play.having something is better than nothing.You can change your mind.Esp here in Cali as JC doesnot give scholllys.

There are some fine D3 schools that would love to hear about your son.

My opinion is if you are going to listen to anyone, read fanofgame's posts carefully.

Great example of a player that wanted to play D1 ball (and even turned down a D1 school because he knew it wasn't the right place at the right time) and took the time he needed to adjust to a new situation and use that time to work on maturing physically and emotionally. I am sure that his parents will tell you that it didn't hurt their pride to tell people their son was headed off to JUCO first. When fanofgame tells you that she is glad her son took that first year at JUCO, she is RIGHT.
This is not an unusual situation, sorry to repeat myself but 2 of son's CU mates both went to JUCO first, drafted and now both 40 man guys. One of the players actually worked his butt off in JUCO to go to his dream school but that didn't happen the second time around either, that's how it happens sometimes.
I am a strong believer that everything happens for a reason. Success and always wanting you want right away doesn't come easy, and the most important thing to remember that it often comes at different times in different ways for most.

In some ways, I think this website does a disservice.

It can lead you to believe that all the 'successful' players have 50 schools from which to choose.

I just don't think that is the case except in maybe the top 100 players across the country.

Those same players are likely to be selected, at some point in time, in the first three rounds of the MLB draft.

In my son's case, he had one solid D1 offer.

But, many, many juco opportunities in our area.

Many would have believed that he would have had his choice of schools across the country.

Until you have seen the scouts at the juco schools practices and learn of the communication between the juco coaches and the D1 coaches, its hard to understand the role the juco plays in the careers of many players.

Many of those juco coaches are former players for the D1 schools.

Juco's offer more full rides, have easier academic admission requirements, are much easier to contact, and offer the same basic classes that any major university offers in it's first two years.

And, the baseball is very competitive. Many players with strong MLB tendencies attend Juco out of high school.

Especially, 6'5" 190 lb. pitchers.

If you are a 6'5" 190 lb. pitcher, you need to experience the fitness program of a collegiate program and you need innings against solid competition.

More than likely you are not going to get many innings at a four year school, and, could get redshirted very easily.

Look at the roster of your dream school and see how many innings 6'5" 190 lb. freshman pitchers got last season.

In my opinion, juco players are the most scouted players by both upper level universities and MLB.

Not many freshman players crack the lineup at the D1.

Starting at a juco allows for another year of player growth, provides for a smoother transition into college academics, likely a little closer to home, allows your son to assess his talents against stronger competition, and exposes him to a longer baseball season.

I don't look down my nose at jucos.

TPM, you are the very fastest to jump. I bet your sparq rating is amazing.


I said "look into X, "sounds" like it might be a good fit.


Just some constructive pointing.

Here is some more constructive pointing. If you dont have something nice to say, butt out.

FormerObserver, nice post.

quote:

Originally posted by Vector:

quote:

Originally posted by TPM:
I know that you are completely perplexed, why hasn't someone taken notice of my 6'4" RHP that gets people out and shows projection that he MIGHT throw harder. There are lots of guys like that out there. The thing is,you got to work harder to throw harder and I haven't gotten that impression that he has, as yet. I am sorry the more you want it the harder you work for it and that goes for everyone. If you or your son think that just because of his height and projection it will be easy for him, all I can say if not so.

My purpose in starting this thread was to make a list of suggestions that we could do between now and February to help him. Talking about what schools might and might not be a fit for him is all fine and dandy, but it is not really the type of information I am looking for at the moment. It is not as if a bunch of D3's and JUCO's are beating down our door either. So rather than take the cart before the horse, we need to get as many schools interested in him as possible, then worry about which ones to choose from.

Dude... That train has left the station. Time for plan B.

Here ya go, I did it for you.

Dartmouth

28 Spencer Venegas RHP R/R 6-3 200 Fr. Costa Mesa, Calif. (Mater Dei)

He pitched one inning in 2010.

UCSD

20 Hudson, Nick RHP 6-1 185 Fr. Benicia, CA (De La Salle HS)
45 Kilbury, Richard LHP 6-2 190 Fr. Monrovia, CA (Monrovia HS)

Hudson pitched 4 innings in 2010
Kilbury pitched 10 innings in 2010.

ND

Adam Norton FR RHP/INF 6-1/175 Highland, IN/Andrean
Patrick Veerkamp FR RHP 6-2/180 Fort Wayne, IN/Homestead

Norton played a sigificant amount as in INF and pitched 20.2 innings.
Veerkamp pitched 7 innings in 2010.

Duke

17 Chase Bebout RHP 6-6 210 Fr. Lake Worth, Fla. (American Heritage-Boca)
38 Devin Burke RHP 6-1 200 Fr. Darien, Conn. (Darien)
31 Matt Morris LHP 6-3 195 Fr. Newport Beach, Calif. (Corona Del Mar)

Bebout did not pitch in 2010.
Burke pitched 27.2 innings in 2010.
Morris pitched 5.0 innings in 2010.

VT

37 Patrick Scoggin Fr. P 6'4" 270 Richmond, Va. Douglas Freeman
40 Joe Mantiply Fr. P 6'4" 204 Danville, Va. Tunstall

Scoggin pitched 19.0 innings in 2010. (He's full grown.)
Mantiply pitched 57.2 innings in 2010.

"we need to get as many schools interested in him as possible"

You have plenty of time Vector. Really. I would suggest requesting an invite to the PG World Showcase. Out here on the So Cal, there are several camps that showcase player to coaches like John Stupor from Yale and the like.

Look up ABD academy camps or "academic baseball camp".

Keep on it. It may feel late but it is really early.