Update/arm pain

Glad you feel that you got some good help.  But you should also understand that even the best mechanics only REDUCE THE RISK OR FREQUENCY of problems.  Nothing eliminates all risk. 

Some of this is just a hazard of the game.  Overuse is not a necessary hazard and should be avoided in any event, but even with great mechanics and no over use, you can have an injury. 

In other words, not every injury is someone's fault.

I agree 100% with this statement. As the saying goes, throwing a baseball is not something the arm was meant to do. Even with the best mechanics and overuse prevention, injuries are going to happen.

IMHO, it is not "if" but "when" an injury is going to happen to a baseball pitcher. Pitch long enough and ever pitcher eventually has some sort of arm issue.

baseball mom,

there are MANY coaches/instructors around that are NOT the answer.  If you would like some free advice in this area, let me know. There are probably 4 core things I could suggest that will make huge differences for you son.

Good luck, For Love of the Game

Baseballmom's son is clearly in very very capable hands with Ron Wolforth, To lump him with "MANY coaches/instructors..." might suggest a serious lack of knowledge in this area. I am not sure if you meant it this way but it seems like you don't even know who he is. 

Glad you've found someone good to help your son.

To agree with another poster though, I will emphasize that an injury is not necessarily indicative of bad mechanics.  Bad mechanics make injuries more likely, but good mechanics don't fully prevent injuries.  Likewise, trying to avoid overuse is great to prevent injuries but it still can become a factor.  For instance, if son gets another arm issue after working with Mr. Wolforth...it might just be bad luck and not necessarily the program or mechanics.  

Hopefully, it's no big deal though.  Most trips to the ortho are just a blip on the map in a long baseball career!

I read the post as if it was a "camp" and nothing on a regular basis. Breaking down mechanics and working on any corrections is an ongoing process.  And yes, I am aware who he is.  I once attended a Nolan Ryan/Tom House camp with my son as a invited instructor.  Just because my son was in attendance that one session does not mean he is under Tom House's tutelage.

I have a program that takes in consideration all the ASMI science and new research and has been implemented at 3 of the top D1 programs in the last 2 years.  I have used this for 2 years as well and it is definitely THE program to help pitchers mature through the troublesome youth years and to limit risk of injury.  That's all I am saying.

Would you care to share that with us?

Your welcome.  Just be sure to keep your eyes wide open as an involved parent(s).  Knowledge as a parent is superior to anything or anyone when you are seeking instructional help elsewhere than your own back yard. "Titles" or "facilities" do NOT always equate to smart advice is all I am saying, without pointing a finger at any specific name on here.

As said, I have a program that has been a HUGE success for several pitchers.  If you need any advice or need to bounce something off me that you are seeing or being told, just let me know.  This is NOT a solicitation either.  I am known to help without financial agenda's because I believe in the game and financially I am blessed.  With this said, good luck.

For Love of the Game~

Hey,

coach Rod,

am I missing something in your comments? are you implying that science research is the cause of bad advice and instruction etc?  please clarify your statement, science research is actually the new norm for those of us who who are smart enough to learn from it. when science research info.comes from experts such as Dr. Andrews, Dr. Fleisig, Dr Tom House and those other experts who bring their findings out to those of us who are smart enough to learn from the people who do the research and learns how a pitchers body in motion from the rubber to it's final follow through position should operate/function "INDIFFERENCE" as to how a pitchers body in motion does just flail around, hesitates, short strides over rotates among several other unnecessary elbow and shoulder damaging movements, The research that has came from the "AMERICAN SPORTS MEDICINE" "RESEARCH INSTITUTE" in Bermingham Alabama has in particular brought to the table that the pitchers body in motion from start/acceleration to finish/deceleration should operate/function within a series of sequenced, chain reactive movements and which very importantly in part are three pivots executed with  "HIP TO SHOULDER SEPARATION" at stride foot touch/plant down, #1"The Hip Pivot" to be executed at or just the split second prior to stride foot touch/plant down,       #2."THE COLLAR PIVOT" to be executed immediately following the "HIP PIVOT." #3. THE SHOULDER PIVOT," to be executed following the"SHOULDER PIVOT" which brings the ball in hand, elbow and fore arm on through from the arms externally extended lay back position in a mouse trap movement on to it's internally extended ball release position and on to a nice arm relaxing flat back fielding position. if and when any one part of the chain is broken the arm and smaller muscles of the upper torso/arms take over and the body/ large muscles of the lower body decease to furnish their momentum and power to deliver the ball to it's target with top velocity and most importantly puts undue strain on the elbow,shoulder and all other body parts negatively effected during the throwing movement/motion. now it is well known or should be known that nothing can be done to eliminate injury all together but what sports science has brought to the table concerning body movement certainly can curtail injuries under certain conditions and proper throwing methods.

It's getting late so I will sign off.

Don Ervin

dfervin32@yahoo.com

OOPS,

Pivot movement order error, in my above comments in the order of pivots I meant to say that the shoulder pivot which brings the elbow through the internal position followed by the fore arm with ball in hand on through in a mouse trap movement from it's externally extended lay back position on to it's internally extended fore arm ball release position, on to a nice arm/shoulder relaxing flat back fielding position follow through, follows the collar pivot, not shoulder pivot follows shoulder pivot

kom_don

playing catch every day lowers the possibility of arm injuries

Not sure how you misconstrued my post(s) but science IS the new norm.  In fact, I have said that on other posts and have been an advocate for a more science approach for the last 2 years.

JPontiac,

          "PITCHING"

Good mechanics, Bad mechanics. what are they? there are way too many uneducated opinions on what good or bad pitching mechanics consists of, Dr. Andrews and his scientific research associates have brought the absolutes of how the pitching body in motion should function/operate they have finally boiled it down to what proper mechanics are/should be, they have taken the guess work out of the question and for the smart ones who will learn from them such .opinion should no longer be a factor, believe in, study and learn from these bio mechanically and scientifically educated human anatomy research people and our aspiring young pitchers to be will benefit tremendously.they have proven that no matter what kind of a pitcher one is their mechanics are basically the same.

If you talk to ten different opinionated coaches,parents,players etc. you will most likely get all kinds of opinions as to what good or bad mechanics actually are, which boils down to the popular norm, which is old out dated conventional "OPINION" which what most teachings/instructions are all about unless the teachings/instructions come from those who are highly experienced and knowledgeable in the scientific research findings, such experts as Dr. Andrews, Dr.Fleisig, Dr.tom House, who write the book on what I feel is tremendous break through on how the pitchers body in motion"SHOULD" function/operate "INDIFFERENCE" as to how it normally operates/functions from the start/rubber throughout it's full series of sequenced chained reactive body movements to a nice flat back fielding position.numerous others who are  scientific and bio mechanical minded such as Brent Pourciau, {Top Velocity.net} a great web.site for pitching, Rick Peterson, {3P Sports} another great source for pitching info.for those who want to keep up to date with what the main scientific researchers are bringing to the table on proper body function, arm and shoulder abuse relief for the pitcher.

The proper sequenced mechanical pitching movements consist of ground force acceleration in a sideways body position to deceleration/front foot touch/plant down followed by "HIP TO "SHOULDER" "SEPARATION" which if and when executed properly allows the forward momentum built up from the ground force initiated by the ground pressure of the drive foot and flexion of the drive foot leg knee to carry on up through the hips on into the upper torso/shoulders on into the arm out through the arm and out through the throwing hand/finger tips, if and when any part/section of the body movement chain is broken these very important series of body movements will cease to function properly which then leaves the arm to take on the brunt/physical load of the throwing movement which also adds tremendously to the unnecessary abuse and strain to the arm and shoulder.

Now that I have thoroughly confused those who read these comments I will sign off.

Don

kom_ervin

dfervin32@yahoo.com

Coach Rod,

So sorry about my misinterpretation I certainly do apologize. I have just gotten back on this site after being off for three years and too I find that I should have read your other comments first.

I have been following and learning from Dr. Andrews, and his associates at his American Sports Medicine Research Institute since shortly after he opened up in 1987, plus I follow several other baseball experts who have the time which I do not have to attend Dr. Andrews and other experts important seminars etc.

Well; enough said.

Good Base balling.

kom_don

I am still waiting to hear about that program.

Do you have scientific evidence to back that up? Pitchers toss everyday and still get hurt. Especially to those that are all arm.

In order to decrease chance of injury a lot more has to be done than play catch everyday.

HI,

Baseball mom32

Thank you for your comments and good for you for taking a stand, not that I am for sticking my nose in there and interfering with a coach but there are times when coaches need to back off especially when it concerns the safety of their players especially pitchers there are so many parents and even athletes out there who just sit back there and actually let a coach ruin a players chances of becoming the best the player can become., if you do not mind would give me a run down of your son's age and activities starting three months prior to the time he hurt his arm, what  was he doing that hurt his arm?, throwing hard, easy etc. how long has he been throwing prior to the session you cancelled?how many days in a row did he have a good whole body dynamic moving stretching warm up prior to throwing?, how many good constructive whole body dynamic moving stretching warm ups has he executed at least one month prior to the day of the mound throwing that you cancelled? does he have arm pain at any time? throwing every day under normal circumstances poses no problem.pitchers should have a catcher to play catch with them at all times, pitchers pitchers should always be moving through their full throwing movements whether in the stretch or wind up position even when they are just playing catch, "HAVE A PURPOSE"Mechanics over use, please explain, did he mean just plain overall arm and shoulder over use?three days per week is very good if you go say,Mon.Wed.FRI, which is the system i use day on, day off, day on with only two days off,which gives him a regular revolving cycle which allows for his learning curve to perpetually grow, this system is my perpetual learning curve cycle.something was said about over usage as not being something to worry about, well statistics will prove that over usage is very high on the chronic sore arm, elbow and shoulder injury's and operations list. take it from me, I have been on all three sides of the game as a player,amateur and professional and coaching from the college level right on down to youth leagues and safety preventative measures are not to be slighted in any way shape or form, I am always very concerned about player safety.you mentioned something about high elbow, the elbow is very instrumental during the throwing movement especially for pitchers and catchers who have or should have a quick hand route from glove to ball release when possible.without dropping their elbow and pushing the ball.

When coaches no matter where they are give lessons,clinics, camps or just talk about basic pitching mechanics in general do not start their conversation and demo. first with the body starting from the ground up through the drive foot and leg into the hips on up into the upper torso/shoulders on into the arm on through the arm on to and out the finger tips with a mouse trap movement to ball release simply are not giving those who are watching and listening and wanting to learn what they need to know, also all pitchers and parents,and coaches etc. should know and teach what science research has proven which is that all pitchers no matter what kind of pitcher they are their basic mechanics are basically the same,  pitchers, coaches and parents also should known that the pitchers body in motion/movement from the rubber to ball release and final flat back finish position should operate/function within a series of sequenced, chained reactive movements.consisting of three pivots starting at stride foot touch/plant down #1.Pivot Hip pivot, #2.Pivot collar pivot,#3.Pivot shoulder pivot, these pivots are very instrumental in moving the momentum up and through the body on to and through the arm and out the finger tips for top velocity, wif and when any part of the body chain is broken the body momentum is lost which leaves the arm and shoulder.to take over.

 well I seem to repeat myself although many things need to be repeated over and over to gain success.I hope you can decipher my comments best of luck with his arm and his baseball.

kom_don

dfervin32@yahoo.com