Velocity.... again

Watching same thing. Are New Orleans & Grambling D1 baseball? Son asked me earlier today. Told him didn't think so but haven't checked.

It's early, some really won't  be at peak velocity yet,so I would imagine the velo will rise as temps rise.

Grambling and Southern are both members of the SWAC. D1 in all sports, and FCS - formerly 1AA in football.

 

I've got to wonder where the teams that fall in bottom of D1, say teams evaluated to be among the bottom 250-298 are in comparison to good D3 teams. Grambling, Southern, and New Orleans all three would fall into that category according to Boyd's ISR rankings from last leason.

 

I ask because I don't know. 

You can probably break the D1 teams into thirds.

 

Top 1/3: most of the top pitchers throwing in the 90'. Very competitive top echelon college baseball.Lots of 3Y and done players. 

 

Mid 1/3: Maybe 40/60 90's throwers. Some pretty good teams, but drops off at the bottom end. 

 

Bottom 1/3: Probably would be beat by the top D3 programs day in and day out. I have no idea on their velocity profile, but likely not very competitive when compared to the top 1/3,  

 

My son's D3 (top 10) has probably 4-6 kids throwing in the 90's in any given year. They would compete on any day with the mid group of D1 teams. (pitching depth is the main issue)

 

For ref the bottom 1/3 of D3 could likely be beat by the top HS programs. 

 

The gradients are pretty steep at the bottom of both conferences IMO. 

       
       


Well that gun must be broken. All college and most high school pitchers are over 90 hahaha. Sorry couldn't help my self. I had season tickets to vanderbilt for a few years and the number of pitchers sitting above 90 is much more rare than what seems to be discussed or believed.

 

Division 1 "status" is no guarantee that a team that isn't competitive within D1 would be competitive with teams from other divisions.

 

It wouldn't surprise me if top D3 teams could beat bottom D1 teams; however, since those bottom D1 teams aren't competitive within D1, I'm not sure what it would mean if they did.  

Noticed the same in Grambling vs LSU today. Last night watched Univ New Mexico @ Univ San Diego. 11 innings and maybe 8-10 pitchers threw. Not sure I saw any pitches over 85 mph. Most FBs were 78-82 all night long. I know it's early, but doesn't seem possibly accurate. My assumption is that the gun used by USD or by Fox Sports SD was just off somehow. Also caught parts of Jacksonville @ TCU, Rice @ Stanford, and Baylor @ Arizona St... No velos shown during those broadcasts. 

Seriously…very seriously doubt that pitchers from those 2 teams were 78-82 with their fastball.  Had to be something wrong with the gun.

Only watched the LSU Southern/Grambling games. Some of the LSU pitchers showed upper 80's so doubt the gun would have been that far off; can't speak for the other games cause I didn't see them. The Southern & Grambling pitchers looked pretty slow.

LSU pitchers should be in low 90s even now.  Doubt that gun was right either.

Don't think it would have been more than two or three mph off. Announcers were talking about one of the LSU pitchers hitting up to 92 & fastest I saw was 89 on several pitches. Add 2-3 mph to Southern & Grambling pitchers & it's still slow.

I don't think the gun was off. I did not see any relievers from LSU, but:
1.  LSU starter was a (stud) freshman LHP who, when I was focused on his velo, sat 87-89 and I know touched 90 or 91 (don't remember exactly).  So, very believable, especially when the velo numbers the coach said in the in game interview were about where he was throwing (though I think coach said he can touch 93 when he gets warmed up.
2.  Starter for Grambling was a finesse pitcher (aka, "junk baller"), and I think I saw him hit 84 and maybe a little higher once.  But, he did sit 80-82 and that still blew me away.  Announcers said at outset what type of pitcher he was and he threw a ton of off speed.
3. The reliever who came in for Grambling was a senior who they said didn't have much experience.  Kid was throwing so slow, they didn't even show the velo.  It was unbelievable.
4. It was all like BP for LSU hitters (and they started several freshman, the coach said), just a question of whether they pulled it foul or hit it at someone
5. One reliever for New Orleans in the earlier game was consistently 88-90.

More detail than anyone needed (and some of it may be a little off), but I, too, was very surprised and was glad to see someone post on it.  BUT, I am convinced it was not the gun and that it was b/c (1) those schools (other than LSU, of course!) simply have little to no P depth and (2) it's mid Feb.

That sounds more realistic BucsFan.  I went to Stanford/Rice yesterday and both teams had pitchers touching 90+, but not mid or high 90s.  Of course they both had LHPs in the mid 80s too.  All in all - about right at this time of year.

Took Jr. and a friend to TCU game Friday night. Finnegan was consistently 92-93 and hit 95 a couple of times (based on scoreboard radar). Didn't look all that fast from the upper deck at Lupton :-) 

To the OP.. Ahhh... the old sitting vs maxing confusion.... again.

Noticed same thing as everyone else...the Grambling, LSU, New Orleans, Southern, only a few pitches from LSU even hit 90, and many of the pitchers were low 80, or high 70's.

 

Also watched USD vs. UNM - and the average FB was in upper 70's...There was nothing wrong with the gun, UNM brought ONE guy in late in the second game, and he hit 92, so the earlier readings of mid 70's were accurate....as far as being a low end D1 school, I would not consider UNM or USD low end of the D1 spectrum by any means.

I'm glad someone else can verify what I saw in that UNM @ USD game. I noticed the same 92 reading from UNMs closer. But you'll recall that that pitch got launched for a game tying line drive HR. It's the only pitch I saw above 85 all game... Most FBs 78-81; breaking stuff ~66-70ish. So I wondered if it was actually the exit speed of the ball off bat getting recorded on that 92mph HR ball? If so, then is it possible that maybe someone inexperienced was using a manual gun for the readings, and that they were catching the velos late instead of out of pitchers' hand? No idea if that's plausible, but would explain the low velos all game across so many different arms.

92MPH guy did get touched up with a HR., but don't think it was a one pitch outing, pretty sure I saw at least one other from in in that range, such that it was not the exit speed after hit....

 

U. Louisiana has a freshman that lit up the gun this weekend, hitting 100. His velocity jumped from high 80's to high 90's in a year. Hence, his mid-major scholly and 33rd round draft pick last June. The kid really should be in AA learning how to get outs there.

 

http://www.theadvertiser.com/a...eyes-by-reaching-100

 

 

I guess there's no way to know for sure, but would be interesting to know because those were some really low velos for what I would consider mid major programs. Having a hard time believing it. I tend to think most college and MLB scoreboard readings are +3 mph or so just for "entertainment value"... This was the opposite effect.

Anecdotally only, the scoreboard gun was consistently 2 MPH above the several Stalker guns held by scouts at the games I saw this weekend. So, the kid hitting 100 on the scoreboard was only 98 on Stalker.

 

There is a wide range of velocities in D1, obviously with lots of 90's at the major schools, which I define losely as the top 30, or so. after that you see lots of 80's with bunches of mid 80's at mid majors. I think the overall range of team quality from  30 down to say, 150-180 is very, very wide.

Scouts don't always sit right behind the catcher, so their guns could be a little slower, if they were at a sharp angle to the ball.

Exactly. Compare these teams to elite D3 teams like Marietta or Linfield (current champions) and see what you get. Or elite NAIA schools like LC State, Lee, or Bellevue. Or even big time JC programs like State College of FL or Weatherford! (Weatherford's closer hits 96-98 in games!)

 

D1 is no guarantee of elite playing ability, especially if you pick from small conferences in geographically weak areas. Especially in Feburary, of all months - MLB pitchers don't even have their best velos in April. It's still pre-season for NCAA teams, so it stands to reason most aren't cruising at their max gear.

 

All you have to do is turn on Fullerton vs. Washington State or Oregon State vs. Indiana next week if you want to see some real D1 arms.

Some of them aren't "turned up" on purpose. Washington State here (as well as many minor league stadiums, and even some major league ones) use the old black/red JUGS guns which read 2-3 MPH higher than the generally accepted Stalker Sport and newer JUGS guns. So it's not entertainment value necessarily but rather just older equipment that isn't as precise as what we have today. (And the reverse problem existed in the 70's and 80's - the guns read 2-3 MPH slower)

I have a Stalker radar gun and as long as you are within 5 degrees inline of the pitcher-catcher there is not much error.  My gun can compensate for the error (up to 30 degrees) by changing the cosine angle in the menu. 

 

I'm wondering if its more of discrepancy between Dad radar eyes and actual readings? 

What difference does it make what the reading is, as long as it’s the same gun being used for everyone at the game? Remember, for people watching on TV or in the park, a gun reading is only entertainment. Prospective teams are gonna use their own guns, and I venture look at more than one game before they offer anything other than a “look”.

I am no math expert, but I think 5 degrees would only be about 8 feet off of center (if they are close to the backstop).  I see many scouts standing or sitting 15 or more seats away from center.

For example, if you were talking to the scouts at the edge of this crowd, their guns would be slightly off.

In college, velocity helps but getting guys out is more important. Throwing to location at the pace of the coach's pitch calling (slow) is more important than anything. I've seen guys at 92 get rocked. I've seen a guy topping at 75-79 throw a complete game win in the PAC-12. It's all about real estate, location, location, location and changing speeds even if it slow, slower and slowest.

Have to laugh at this stuff. My 2015 RHP and I went to FL this weekend to catch some D1 baseball. There was a student Athlete charting pitches for his team and using a Stalker Sport that looked like if belonged in the Smithsonian. He was getting some wacky numbers from it and would occasionally thump it against his knee as if to fix it. My son said it looked like a milk carton/radio shack project. Those who possessed newer devices saw starter hit 94 while sat 90-92.