Just curious what people have seen at previous Headfirst Camps?
We were at the high academic game at AZ Fall Junior Classic and I was pleasantly surprised with the talent of pitching.... my guess was the average velo was 84/85 with a few kids hitting 88-90.
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My 2017 attended the Summer HF after his junior year. Not sure how different that one is from the one this weekend. But I would say velocity at HF Sacramento was lower than what we have seen at other showcases that cast a wider net of players. Lots of kids were around the low 80's and maybe only a handful in the high 80's from what I saw.
I did see a fair number of kids with great location and multiple secondary pitches, which is a magnet for the high academic D3s. HF lets the kids pitch both days so there is ample chance to demonstrate more than just velocity.
I agree with the above - lots of low to mid-80s pitchers in the mix in the games I saw. I know there was at least one LHP there who has been clocked at 90 and was probably in the high 80s at our HF camp but I didn't see him pitch. In my 2016's games the pitchers were consistently in the 80-85 range and the ones with multiple secondary pitches were the ones that stood out.
been to 2 HF showcases and would say MOST pitchers were in the 70's. The overwhelming majority were underwhelming in short. Let's say 40 - 60% of pitchers.
Then there is a huge chunk in low 80's -- 25-40%. Smaller selection above 85/86 maybe 10 - 15%. 16 teams with 250 boys and lots of pitchers. We had one kid this year hit 91 and every single coach dropped everything and watched. Felt sorry for the other 3 games going on at same time. Kid could not pitch well and was wild, but ended with an Ivy offer.
I watched the radar gun pretty consistently, so this is my take.
Gov posted:Just curious what people have seen at previous Headfirst Camps?
We were at the high academic game at AZ Fall Junior Classic and I was pleasantly surprised with the talent of pitching.... my guess was the average velo was 84/85 with a few kids hitting 88-90.
Is your son going as a 2 way player, David? If yes, I want to point out that at the one HF my 2017 attended, I saw many, many hitters have very rough camps due to their inability to adjust to the camp's use of 1 ball / 1 strike count to start, and having balls and strikes called from behind the mound by camp staff. I saw soooo many kids strike out multiple times. With a 1 -1 count a smart pitcher would either drop something soft in for a called strike, 2 or get a called strike on a borderline outside fastball. Then the poor hitter would either watch a curve float through the zone and get rung up, or swing vainly at a fastball above the hands or in the dirt for strike three.
Can you tell I'm not a fan of the 1-1 count and no real umps? It's not personal - my kid did great at HF and got a lot of interest from it, but I saw many good players struggle mightily. There was one big kid in particularly on my son's team. He was went oh-for the first day but figured it out on day two. First pitch, first at-bat he sat on a curve and knocked over the fence.
From a D1/Ivy perspective, I wonder how many pitchers get discovered and/or offered as a result of Headfirst or a similar academic based event.
JCG posted:Gov posted:Just curious what people have seen at previous Headfirst Camps?
We were at the high academic game at AZ Fall Junior Classic and I was pleasantly surprised with the talent of pitching.... my guess was the average velo was 84/85 with a few kids hitting 88-90.
Is your son going as a 2 way player, David? If yes, I want to point out that at the one HF my 2017 attended, I saw many, many hitters have very rough camps due to their inability to adjust to the camp's use of 1 ball / 1 strike count to start, and having balls and strikes called from behind the mound by camp staff. I saw soooo many kids strike out multiple times. With a 1 -1 count a smart pitcher would either drop something soft in for a called strike, 2 or get a called strike on a borderline outside fastball. Then the poor hitter would either watch a curve float through the zone and get rung up, or swing vainly at a fastball above the hands or in the dirt for strike three.
Can you tell I'm not a fan of the 1-1 count and no real umps? It's not personal - my kid did great at HF and got a lot of interest from it, but I saw many good players struggle mightily. There was one big kid in particularly on my son's team. He was went oh-for the first day but figured it out on day two. First pitch, first at-bat he sat on a curve and knocked over the fence.
2018 is not going as a two way player...showing up as a hitter this weekend. He experienced 1-1 count at both AZ Fall Classic and Stanford... I'm not a fan either. It was quite an adjustment at AZ Fall Classic academic game that evening with a different pitcher every inning, 1-1 count. And I was surprised with some of the velo and quality pitching that showed up.
Son was mentally prepared for 1-1 counts at Stanford camp, but not prepared for the AZ Classic 1-1 count two weeks ago. 1-1 counts require a shift in mental approach and the player needs to understand the coaches want them to swing the bat. Have to be aggressive.
Regarding two player, son's throwing velo has really popped... 85 off mound, 88 from SS.... but we were advised by some experienced members here to focus on SS play and strength.
Headfirst is more like Stanford than AZ in that it's totally self-selected. Any kid with $1K to burn can sign up so the quality and velocity of pitchers varies widely.
I found that the 1-1 count really favored the pitchers. Hitters dont want to walk so that reduces the number of good swings they can have . Most have never seen the pitchers before and only face them one at bat so the pitcher has all of the advantage.
I thought the same thing with the showcases my son went to with the 1-1 count. Then I sat through the All Academic game at the Senior Fall Classic this year when they did not institute a 1-1 count until the batter had been hit by pitch or walked with the regular count and then got another chance to hit.
The umpire for that game did not get the memo that this was meant to be a showcase and that they wanted kids to swing. So he had a really tight strike zone, called lots of balls, kids did not swing, and the game took over 4 hours to play with only 10 innings. I think most of the coaches were gone after three hours, and I felt bad for kids who were scheduled to pitch the final innings and nobody was there to watch them.
At least for HF, the counts keep the game moving and kids may wind up with more ABs than they would get with the regular counts. I agree the pitchers have an advantage, but batters should adjust and be ready.
My oldest went there three years ago as a HS sophomore. In the games he caught and hit, he faced and or received from pitchers throwing upper 80's / low 90's. Highest was 92. The velocity I'm stating was from the coaches sitting behind the plate. The impression we had from the camp and some of the coaches was that they were there looking for arms, that was about it.
As far as the HF pitcher velo opinions on this thread, I'd say everyone is correct.
Yeah, lots of kids 76-79, most 80-84, some 85-87. I've never seen 88 at the two HF events son has been to, and I too am a "Stalker stalker," annoyingly peering over the shoulder of the college coaches with guns.
The wide range of velos however does match the wide net that HF does a great job of casting for both skill levels in prospects and NCAA division levels of the schools they draw to their events. Look at the list of coaches attending a HF event. You've got many small Division IIIs all the way through top D-1s. So with the wide range of schools there, HF must also have a wide range of arms for all types of schools. And that they do. And I think they do it well, the mixing of 78mph arms, with 87mph arms, for a well run recruiting event for all parties involved.
