verbal commitments

The player hasn't signed anything yet. Legally he's free. But if you're a coach how would you view a player who backed out on his word. The reality is how it may be seen by other coaches is based on how talented is the player. A kid throwing 95 can be anything short of a serial killer.

I was just wondering how some other parents kids have handled the situation

I told my son not to give his verbal commitment until he was as close to 100% sure as he could be.  In our house, your word is your bond.  That is how I was raised and that's how I've tried to raise my kids.  I know it sounds old fashion, but that is me in a nutshell.  My son understood he would have to honor his word, with only very few exceptions.

I think most everyone would agree that the best thing to do is NOT to verbally commit until you're certain.  If a kid thinks he likes the school, but isn't ready to commit, then tell that to the school.  "Coach, I really think I'd like to play for you and go to your school, but I'm just not ready to commit yet."  

younggun posted:

I told my son not to give his verbal commitment until he was as close to 100% sure as he could be.  In our house, your word is your bond.  That is how I was raised and that's how I've tried to raise my kids.  I know it sounds old fashion, but that is me in a nutshell.  My son understood he would have to honor his word, with only very few exceptions.

I completely agree with this.  110%.

But I guess we've been asked a serious question that may have good reasons for it?

sportsmom - Why has your son (or you) begun thinking there is a better fit?  Better program that has caught his fancy?  Lesser program that fits his skills better?  Something the coach did?

Like others above, we told our sons the search was completely over when they made a 'commitment.'  We never let the door open even by a crack once that was done - and with our younger son, it certainly could have been opened by bigger name schools.  But we did not let that happen.  But perhaps you have a reason that is reasonable?

While backing out of commitments has sadly become common in football and basketball, I don't sense that it is in baseball...yet.  You should be ready for some negative blowback if you do it - including from the coach you back away from.

Like others have mentioned, do your homework before making ANY commitment.  I guess one question I would have is why a person would continue to entertain other options once a verbal commitment is made?  Unless there is a coaching change or something significant regarding the school/program (i.e., NCAA violations/investigations, major school scandal, etc.), of there is some significant life event on your side (death of bread winner, loss of income, etc., that impacts your financial abilities) my belief is that when you verbal, you are off the table and stop "shopping".  Kind of like a guy continuing to date after getting married.

I get that situations change (i.e, another verbal strong or stronger than your son at his position by the school, etc.), but these are known risks going in and all the more reason you should be as close to sure as you can be before giving your word.  I'm in complete agreement with Young Gun and Just Baseball.

As I've mentioned on other threads, I do believe that these earlier commitments are going to lead to baseball being no different than football and basketball with commitments becoming nothing more than a bookmark until a player finds another suitor.  Just this year a kid committed/decommitted to Ole MIss, South Carolina and finally LOI'd at Miss State.  Sadly, I expect to see much more of this in the future.

You may, indeed, see more of this. I fear baseball may become more like football and basketball with commitments. A few schools at the top have started offering crazy numbers of freshmen. If you think you want to play for one of these schools, you aren't in a position to wait until you're 100% sure. These schools who already have 8 or 10 2019's committed will simply move on to the next guy if you hesitate. This will eventually lead, by necessity, to other schools continuing to recruit already committed players in the same way football and basketball programs do. 

"Your word is your bond."  Do you hold the school/coach to the same standard? 

Golfman, frankly I didn't care about the school/coach as I don't/didn't know him.  That was all part of our evaluation when looking at schools.  But yes, when I look a man in the eye and shake his hand, I expect him to keep his word or his word will never mean anything to me again.  If something had changed with coaches assessment of my son, I would have expected a meeting in person to discuss said changes and what changes he felt would be appropriate moving forward.  At that point, I think it would be fair for son to have changed his mind as well.  

I was just curious how often this happens

Son decommitted. I have told this story several times, but in a nutshell. Verballed in fall of senior year to a "guaranteed walk on" spot. I do have to say, that school honors those spots as far as I can tell every time. He had no athletic money coming to him so no NLI was signed. In spring of senior year had a significant outing in front of 2 MLB scouts who had him in the low 90's consistently (he worked really hard and focused off season to getting better for first time ever- so did come into a 3-5 MPH jump consistently). That night had multiple MLB scouts call and a few colleges when they heard he did not have an NLI. Several offered. Original college really upset but did come up withy an offer within 2 days. In End he is playing for the team he verballed at with a very nice NLI offer. He loves it there. BUT the reason he decommitted was simply a ton of money was put on table that original school did not initially offer.

Not big on decommitting and  he and his family were not even looking. It just came to him because of a couple really outstanding outings. We did it because of the $ that was thrown his way. He (I) went from being responsible for roughly $15k a year to $0. If it had be $2-5K a year doubt he would have even considered it. But for not being in debt 60K after 4 years, we listened.

I know this is not the popular opinion. I am a committed person as well. But about 15 years ago, a company came looking to try to hire me. I loved where I worked and was making OK money for what I do. The offer blew me away and I made my family much more secure. 5 years later I left, because the job was ending (worked for a food contractor and they cancelled contract). With that I searched and found my present location where I have been for 10 years, love my job, and make that same "blown away" money plus a bit. Reality is if I had not taken the job with contractor for the blow away money, I would probably still be at original place and make significantly less money for that last 15 years. I am old enough now, and settled, with high end for what I do money, that I will retire from where I work. That is my expectation. But if someone comes and  offers me a  25% raise for doing same thing, I will listen.

 

In some ways for son this was the same. He really liked coaches, university, his opportunity, but someone came back with "blown away" offer. For him, he was blessed because the coaches liked him enough to find the money to keep it at the place he loves 

My son verbally agreed to the same type of agreement,  'guaranteed walk-on' because of the high amount of academic money ( it really didn't seem a big deal at the time.)  He verbally committed in July, went on to qb our football team to the state final and made all state baseball.  He was offered numerous scholarships in football and several D1 offers in baseball but stuck to his word because we raised him that way.  Two days before the season started in the spring he was cut loose without any warning.  In fact, had been issued all of his game equipment and had to go turn it back in.  So unfortunately the morals and keeping your word isn't a two way street.  He has since transferred to a D2 and received a very good athletic and academic package.  

Overthehill posted:

My son verbally agreed to the same type of agreement,  'guaranteed walk-on' because of the high amount of academic money ( it really didn't seem a big deal at the time.)  He verbally committed in July, went on to qb our football team to the state final and made all state baseball.  He was offered numerous scholarships in football and several D1 offers in baseball but stuck to his word because we raised him that way.  Two days before the season started in the spring he was cut loose without any warning.  In fact, had been issued all of his game equipment and had to go turn it back in.  So unfortunately the morals and keeping your word isn't a two way street.  He has since transferred to a D2 and received a very good athletic and academic package.  

These types of stories are tremendously disappointing to read.  Very sorry that your son (and you) had to go through that.  I'm pretty sure that in the long run your high standards will ensure things work out well for your son.

May all the best be in your son's future. 

College coach's offer to kids, but they're always looking for a better player.  It's not a two way street.  Delay accepting as long as you can, keep your word, but with eyes wide open.  If you've increased your level of play substantially you need to tell the coach the magnitude of your improvements.  If the improvements are that significant, I would think the coach is aware you're likely getting unsolicited attention.  He may want to up the offer or make an actual offer if only a walk on to keep you committed to his program.  

There's a risk in extending too many early offers, the coach's are creating an environment similar to football and basketball. 

With this day and age of high college debt incurred by college graduates, every player and parent has to be fiscally responsible with their own situation.  If you're a walk on recruit and serious money steps up, you should be addressing how circumstances have changed and renegotiate  the deal.   

 

 

just heard about  this situation yesterday- 2016 grad that we know, son has played against him several times.  Had a "guaranteed" walk on spot to a school he was very excited about.  Was told this week that he does not have a spot any longer.  Stinks for him because the young man was all in.  Very excited about the opportunity. To find out in March of your senior year is not good.  Lucky for him he's a lefty hitting catcher, and has several schools interested even at this late date.

 

 

pabaseballdad posted:

just heard about  this situation yesterday- 2016 grad that we know, son has played against him several times.  Had a "guaranteed" walk on spot to a school he was very excited about.  Was told this week that he does not have a spot any longer.  Stinks for him because the young man was all in.  Very excited about the opportunity. To find out in March of your senior year is not good.  Lucky for him he's a lefty hitting catcher, and has several schools interested even at this late date.

 

 

That stinks.  More reminder it's not a two way street and the Coach's are always looking for better talent.  Happy to hear the player has interest from other schools.

Nuke83 posted:

Like others have mentioned, do your homework before making ANY commitment.  I guess one question I would have is why a person would continue to entertain other options once a verbal commitment is made?  Unless there is a coaching change or something significant regarding the school/program (i.e., NCAA violations/investigations, major school scandal, etc.), of there is some significant life event on your side (death of bread winner, loss of income, etc., that impacts your financial abilities) my belief is that when you verbal, you are off the table and stop "shopping".  Kind of like a guy continuing to date after getting married.

I get that situations change (i.e, another verbal strong or stronger than your son at his position by the school, etc.), but these are known risks going in and all the more reason you should be as close to sure as you can be before giving your word.  I'm in complete agreement with Young Gun and Just Baseball.

As I've mentioned on other threads, I do believe that these earlier commitments are going to lead to baseball being no different than football and basketball with commitments becoming nothing more than a bookmark until a player finds another suitor.  Just this year a kid committed/decommitted to Ole MIss, South Carolina and finally LOI'd at Miss State.  Sadly, I expect to see much more of this in the future.

Maybe the kid has gotten a lot better and got a better offer somewhere else.  Coaches are always getting to "do what's best for their family" and make "businesses decisions".  Why is it that the player's word is bond?   

People change their minds.  Happens all the time.  Engagements get called off. People take new and better jobs.  Players get traded.  Coaches get fired for a guy who might win more- hello Mark Richt.  Players transfer after the season.  Players are asked to transfer. Scholarships don't get renewed. All types of things happen. 

Players shouldnt be be held to some unique standard. 

I think ive shared my son's (our) story. He de-committed 6 months after a verbal. He wanted to stay closer to home (previous school was 12 hour drive) and so changed his mind. We knew less about recruiting, offers/value, timing and frankly, may have rushed a bit. All things to avoid/learn from that i would share to the next family in the process if asked. He knew there was a chance that other schools had no more money, wouldn't want him (he broke his word), or had no spot for him. He was prepared to stay local and walk on if nothing came of it. Big learning experience and the previous school's coach wasn't happy when he did it. It worked out and knowing what i know now, it was the best thing he did. Oh, and not one single coach that recruited him afterwards made any hay out of the decommit. I tell everyone now to wait and trust the process/data, unless its a dream school. I too agree that coaches move on, change situations for their own gain and rarely consider the kids...it's part of the business. 

Teaching Elder posted:

Nuke83 posted:

Like others have mentioned, do your homework before making ANY commitment.  I guess one question I would have is why a person would continue to entertain other options once a verbal commitment is made?  Unless there is a coaching change or something significant regarding the school/program (i.e., NCAA violations/investigations, major school scandal, etc.), of there is some significant life event on your side (death of bread winner, loss of income, etc., that impacts your financial abilities) my belief is that when you verbal, you are off the table and stop "shopping".  Kind of like a guy continuing to date after getting married.

I get that situations change (i.e, another verbal strong or stronger than your son at his position by the school, etc.), but these are known risks going in and all the more reason you should be as close to sure as you can be before giving your word.  I'm in complete agreement with Young Gun and Just Baseball.

As I've mentioned on other threads, I do believe that these earlier commitments are going to lead to baseball being no different than football and basketball with commitments becoming nothing more than a bookmark until a player finds another suitor.  Just this year a kid committed/decommitted to Ole MIss, South Carolina and finally LOI'd at Miss State.  Sadly, I expect to see much more of this in the future.

Maybe the kid has gotten a lot better and got a better offer somewhere else.  Coaches are always getting to "do what's best for their family" and make "businesses decisions".  Why is it that the player's word is bond?   

People change their minds.  Happens all the time.  Engagements get called off. People take new and better jobs.  Players get traded.  Coaches get fired for a guy who might win more- hello Mark Richt.  Players transfer after the season.  Players are asked to transfer. Scholarships don't get renewed. All types of things happen. 

Players shouldnt be be held to some unique standard. 

All true, but to us it wasn't about what others do or might do. I never found that to be a very good excuse in life.

Once you commit you should keep the commitment unless something changes. If the coaching staff changes , your financial situation, loss of family member etc... by all means do what you have to do for your family.... it's baseball after all.....

  IF you are a walk on with no NLI.... and a better deal comes along, I have no issue in de-committing and  taking the offer.  In this situation the coach is not giving you anything and will cut you in a second if he needs a roster spot.  So don't feel bad about that.   But if nothing really changes you should honor your commitment.

Coaches change all the time .... all they say is  "its best for my family"  well if it's best for your family to de-commit do it.... who really cares at that point what a bunch of college coaches think.  I can tell you once you de-commit they will move on and it will not take them long.   If you change schools and your throwing 95 the scouts will still be there   Know the game your in

justbaseball posted:

Teaching Elder posted:

Nuke83 posted:

Like others have mentioned, do your homework before making ANY commitment.  I guess one question I would have is why a person would continue to entertain other options once a verbal commitment is made?  Unless there is a coaching change or something significant regarding the school/program (i.e., NCAA violations/investigations, major school scandal, etc.), of there is some significant life event on your side (death of bread winner, loss of income, etc., that impacts your financial abilities) my belief is that when you verbal, you are off the table and stop "shopping".  Kind of like a guy continuing to date after getting married.

I get that situations change (i.e, another verbal strong or stronger than your son at his position by the school, etc.), but these are known risks going in and all the more reason you should be as close to sure as you can be before giving your word.  I'm in complete agreement with Young Gun and Just Baseball.

As I've mentioned on other threads, I do believe that these earlier commitments are going to lead to baseball being no different than football and basketball with commitments becoming nothing more than a bookmark until a player finds another suitor.  Just this year a kid committed/decommitted to Ole MIss, South Carolina and finally LOI'd at Miss State.  Sadly, I expect to see much more of this in the future.

Maybe the kid has gotten a lot better and got a better offer somewhere else.  Coaches are always getting to "do what's best for their family" and make "businesses decisions".  Why is it that the player's word is bond?   

People change their minds.  Happens all the time.  Engagements get called off. People take new and better jobs.  Players get traded.  Coaches get fired for a guy who might win more- hello Mark Richt.  Players transfer after the season.  Players are asked to transfer. Scholarships don't get renewed. All types of things happen. 

Players shouldnt be be held to some unique standard. 

All true, but to us it wasn't about what others do or might do. I never found that to be a very good excuse in life.

This is a tricky, nuanced and relative matter. Yes.  A word should be bond.  But, one also needs to understand the situation.  I may give you my word, but if you have deceived me, should I be bound to my word?  I'd say that in many situations, no.  Could there be exceptions?  Probably. 

 

Should i I do what's right even if you don't?  In some cases yes.  In others maybe not. Things can get situational sometimes b

Teaching Elder posted:

All true, but to us it wasn't about what others do or might do. I never found that to be a very good excuse in life.

This is a tricky, nuanced and relative matter. Yes.  A word should be bond.  But, one also needs to understand the situation.  I may give you my word, but if you have deceived me, should I be bound to my word?  I'd say that in many situations, no.  Could there be exceptions?  Probably. 

 

Should i I do what's right even if you don't?  In some cases yes.  In others maybe not. Things can get situational sometimes b

Yes it can be nuanced and situational, you are correct.  However, in a general form of this situation, if I am deceived that may indeed change the game.  But if I might be deceived because others were deceived in far away lands?  No, I don't think that changes the game.

If some coaches break their words, it should not give me permission to break my word with any or all coaches.

A guaranteed walkon spot could be(?) a grey area for reasons others have outlined.  We never faced that issue.

We had very straightforward and serious conversations about this with our sons before they were allowed to commit.  We also had very frank conversations with coaches about their 'commitment' beyond the initial one and beyond the initial year as well.  There would have been no wiggle room for anyone to back out without it being completely clear about a lack of trustworthiness.

Simple solution - don't make an early commitment unless you're 100% sure.