Video / Swing Analysis

Here's another, trying to get dialed back up towards 100% effort. He said 7 out of 10 here. We're definitely taking it easy after that long period off.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCvw15UTmrQ

I will throw out a few comments. This is meant to be positive to help him out. I say this all of the time, but you have to be careful on getting advice on a bulletin board, yours truly included. The clip is short and poor quality, so you really need to get someone who has good video equipment and a local instructor who can help you. You cannot change all of this at once. I would start with grip and stride/balance first.

Starting with the grip he looks like he is swinging an ax. Get the fingers in the right position and hold the bat “like a bird”. Just like a golf swing the bat swing starts with a proper grip.

His hands drop and look like they are away from the body so he is not swinging inside out. Lots of bat drag, and poor bat plane. All of this is related to grip and dropping the bat and not starting with the hands in the proper position. Poor lower body action as a result of all of this. Once he gets the grip and bat in the right position he will have to learn to swing with his hips not upper body as he is doing now. The best way to put this is he is “muscling the bat”.

Too big a stride and lack of balance. He spins out away (3rd base line) and his bat throws are off plane and late toward third. Get him on the inside of the balls of his feet so he finishes balanced toward the pitcher. The bat coming up and off plane at the end of the swing is a result of everything before it being off kilter.

He might be able to hit lower level pitching, but when he gets to HS Varsity level he will never catch up to an inside fast ball and won’t drive the ball with authority.

My advice would be to get an instructor you trust as he will have to rebuild his stroke and this is going to take some time. Do it now as the off-season is coming up. Again my comments are only to be of help and I am certainly no expert, just someone who has had my son work with some good guys.

Good luck!

I agree with BOF.

You might just start with this first, and see where you are...

At toe touch (after the stride), make sure his hands are near his arm pit/shoulder (have him touch his shoulder with an extended thumb).

If you like, he can leave his hands asis in the stance, then move them toward his shoulder during the stride.

Appreciate the input. Here's what is confusing. I looked at those swings and thought much of the same thing you did.

However he has never struggled against better pitching. The last two 15U travel tournaments we faced several pitchers that were throwing into the 80's. He had no trouble turning on and driving the FB and actually had a couple of nice line drives on outer half off speed stuff as well.

I'm wondering if I need to get video of game swings before I do anything.

I don't think you need game swings until you find someone you trust and can work with. A good instuctor will have his own video and will be able to show it to your son after one session.

There are just way too many moving parts for your son to hit against high level pitching. There is a reason you hear the term "short to the ball, long through it" To be able to hit a high 80's FB on the hands and then wait for a change or a curveball you have to be short.

I will also say this you may end up with several instructors. My son worked very hard with a guy who was big on video, getting the "proper" mechanical swing, etc. They broke his swing down in the off season and worked on it for months.

He came back in his Jr season as was doing well, but something was missing. His scout ball instuctor was really in to timing and being loose and fluid. He worked with him on being fluid and not so mechnical and he exploded.

So be patient and work at it one thing at a time.

I guess I should clarify his status a bit more. The swing in the videos isn't representative of his swing. Long story short he sprained his left wrist late Summer 2010. (school PE is the devil). Then during Middle School basketball tryouts he complained of his foot hurting. Turns out it was a broken bone. They put him in a walking cast. He got that off a week or two before JV tryouts. Turns out the height difference in the cast kinked his back (L4/L5 pain). He made the JV team and played through back pain the entire season before letting anyone know.

I noticed his swing had changed, even though he hit well, his power wasn't where it should have been. Makes sense now, since he apparently changed his swing where it didn't hurt as much. The pain was worst when turning on the baseball with his lower half.

After extensive PT, he was cleared to hit maybe a month ago. Then just recently cleared to pitch. He's pain free now, so we're just getting to work on the swing.

He and I looked at the video last night and he mentioned why his arms looked "funny" in the clip. We went back to basic and we did some dry swings last night.

As for the stride..that's always been his timing mechanism. It's not exactly a long stride, if you watch where his stride foot is when he picks it up and where he puts it down, it's not long at all.

He's on me to do some BP tonight, so we'll see what progress we can make. We also talked about grip and getting the bat more in his fingers...as that changed too.

Guess it makes sense...it hurt to use his lower half so he tried to compensate by using more of his hands to hit the ball.

Well I came home to find the kid's new BBCOR bat had come in. So he nags me to go hit. We had talked about his getting long and gone over the video and he did a bunch of dry swings to feel the difference. I wasn't expecting him to be able to FEEL the difference in short vs long and put it to work so fast in the cage. He said he could definitely feel the difference, and I could definitely see the difference in the ball coming off the bat. Of course I forget the camera. I'll do my best to get some video tomorrow evening.

Have him hold a 90 degree angle bend in his lead arm until his stride foot lands. There's no way he can stay short and inside the ball with his lead arm barred all the way like that. Yes, Griffey did it, and some others. Most do not.

quote:

Originally posted by Sandman:
Have him hold a 90 degree angle bend in his lead arm until his stride foot lands. There's no way he can stay short and inside the ball with his lead arm barred all the way like that. Yes, Griffey did it, and some others. Most do not.

Yeah we worked on that a bit tonight. Got some video but I think the batteries were low in the camera, as the video is real "jumpy".

Camera was acting really odd. But I got a decent clip of his left handed swing.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/XRXMPGnoMB0?hl=en&fs=1

Not much balance nor extension through the ball. The arm bar is causing the "release" of the swing to happen too soon.

I'd bet that he hits a lot of pull side ground balls and opposite field flairs in games. He also probably hits the ball hard but foul on the pull side.

If this is the case he should work on that lead arm angle Sandman was suggesting and shorten up the portion of the swing prior to contact. This will allow for more extension and a greater chance to stay on the ball with authority.

BOF also had some good advice regarding his balance and the grip.

http://www.TheBatJack.com

quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy33:
I'd bet that he hits a lot of pull side ground balls and opposite field flairs in games. He also probably hits the ball hard but foul on the pull side.

If this is the case he should work on that lead arm angle Sandman was suggesting and shorten up the portion of the swing prior to contact. This will allow for more extension and a greater chance to stay on the ball with authority.

BOF also had some good advice regarding his balance and the grip.

http://www.TheBatJack.com

Are we talking about the RH swing or the LH swing?

If we're talking the RH swing, actually no. If he gets a FB middle / in, the majority of his shots will be from LC to RC. He tends to hit outer half and off speed stuff from CF to RF.

Got the chance to swing a bit tonight. The kid understands what he does now, vs what he needs to do. The video, and him seeing it has helped greatly.

It's not going to be an overnight change. He knows that. I'm going to get some game swings this weekend on video (Wood Bat tournament).

Any other tips / drills to help with the hands going back to far?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvqpWKJ31X0

And here are some LH swings. Keeping in mind he's only recently started swinging from that side...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNZjxGeG1hU

Played two wood bat games today. Kid hit the ball hard...but last at bat he hit a line shot over the LF head..one hopped the HS fence we were playing at.

On the way home the kid says...

"you know what's messed up? I held my shirt with my fingers (to keep his hands close) on that last at bat..."

It was a rocket. A little more lift and it would have been gone.

Maybe he's getting it in his head now.

quote:

Originally posted by ctandc:
Got the chance to swing a bit tonight. The kid understands what he does now, vs what he needs to do. The video, and him seeing it has helped greatly.

It's not going to be an overnight change. He knows that. I'm going to get some game swings this weekend on video (Wood Bat tournament).

Any other tips / drills to help with the hands going back to far?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvqpWKJ31X0

And here are some LH swings. Keeping in mind he's only recently started swinging from that side...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNZjxGeG1hU

I like the right-handed swing! It's good, and it'll improve as he gets older.

However, I would not let him sway back, because it can lead to coiling back and then going forward. Let him pick up his leg, but go back as little as possible. Teach him to load his hands up/ back as he drives his rear knee in. He'll get more power that way.

As for the hands and the arms, I've personally had success with the cue "walk away from the hands" rather than "pushing them back". Show him a clip of Williams and ask if he wants to go to Tip n' Rip, because I think he'll benefit from it. It doesn't have to be as exaggerated, but it provides a lot of power with very minimal effort.

Can you ask him what he feels when he swings?

quote:

Originally posted by ctandc:

quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy33:
I'd bet that he hits a lot of pull side ground balls and opposite field flairs in games. He also probably hits the ball hard but foul on the pull side.

If this is the case he should work on that lead arm angle Sandman was suggesting and shorten up the portion of the swing prior to contact. This will allow for more extension and a greater chance to stay on the ball with authority.

BOF also had some good advice regarding his balance and the grip.

http://www.TheBatJack.com

Are we talking about the RH swing or the LH swing?

If we're talking the RH swing, actually no. If he gets a FB middle / in, the majority of his shots will be from LC to RC. He tends to hit outer half and off speed stuff from CF to RF.

The left.

quote:

Originally posted by Jimmy33:
The left.

We just started working on the LH swing awhile back.

quote:

It's good, and it'll improve as he gets older.

Why?

Eyesight improves, bone strength becomes greater. Anticipation (mental game) becomes better, mechanics typically improve with age because of unconscious adaptations to competition/ through emulation.

quote:

Originally posted by Low Finish:
Eyesight improves, bone strength becomes greater. Anticipation (mental game) becomes better, mechanics typically improve with age because of unconscious adaptations to competition/ through emulation.

Do you have some medical evidence that eyesight improves with age? I'd like to see it please. Same with "bone strength".

Would also love to see some evidence of mechanics becoming typically better barring deliberative practice and through emulation.

I do not see any way that his swing will become better simply because he grows older.

Now if he gets hitting instruction from a good instructor, works diligently and practices deliberately, there is no doubt he will improve. Not because he gets older.

ctandc,
I would take him to a reputable hitting instructor.

I agree with BOF too.

Agreed, get him to an Epstein instructor. As he gets older, he'll get bigger.

As he gets older, he'll observe good hitters doing things he doesn't do. He'll pick them up and start doing them. Slowly but surely, he'll improve.

Hitting by osmosis. Interesting concept.

quote:

Originally posted by NDD:
Hitting by osmosis. Interesting concept.

I've made it sound more complicated than it is. 99% of all MLB hitters got to the MLB because of emulation (picking things up). The other 1% got to the MLB on luck.

Basically, if your son has an "internal camera" and can duplicate the moves of Albert Pujols, you have nothing to worry about. IMO, more players are coached out of the pattern rather than into it.