When do they start throwing inside

"Giving a message" is a nonsensical, egotistical thought that shouldn't exist in the game of baseball. Moving a player off the plate is a very good strategy for pitch sequencing purposes, as it allows the pitcher to establish the ability to change the hitter's balance and sight lines pitch-to-pitch.

I'd imagine kids are not pitching inside because

A) they're afraid to hit kids

and

B) batters are not yet strong enough to hit outside pitches with authority.

Both will change as they get older. Pitchers will gain more command and batters will gain more strength. Please don't teach kids to "send a message." It's bad enough when it happens at the big league level.

In the wood-bat Perfect-Game events, my kid tells me that that he's always getting pitched inside and out...

But in BBCOR (Metal/Composite) HS games almost every at bat he is pitched away...

I think it depends on kid. 

This weekend in a tourney championship game, pitcher (PO) for our team was cruising...then the SS threw a 3rd out away (one run scored). Next batter (#40) came up and  drilled a triple over RF head. Two more runs in. This was in top 5. 

Top 7, two outs bases empty. #40 came up to plate. And got a fastball to the ribs. I turned to Mrs. SoulSlam and said that was on purpose. Asked 2016 the next day and he concurred. 

The coach did have a very animated discussion with pitcher afterwards. 

My son was a freshman college pitcher this year.  All batters have their toes on the line to crowd the plate as much as possible.  You can get away with throwing inside some but most hitters at this level can take the inside pitch over the fence.  Outside pitch is harder to hit out. 

I agree with JH, it's much less than being about "sending a message" than it is establishing that you can throw strikes on the inside to set up working the outside.  At our HS, we teach the same principal as most, due to the fact that we don't have elite pitchers with great command, and that is to work middle away.  My oldest who just graduated, started working the inside last yr(sr yr) with great results after exhibiting great command, confidence and the ability to spot.  

This isn't the point of this thread, but I'd like to expound on this a little further.

I pitched in college as well, and wasn't a particularly hard thrower. I was (still am) left-handed, and threw a two-seam fastball with some run, a big curveball, and a circle changeup. Left-handed hitters were aware most of the curveball, and tended to dive over the plate against me in order to eliminate the opportunity to get them out in front against the pitch. The problem I ran into against higher level competition, however, was that buzzing them inside with a fastball wouldn't suffice, because they were still able to pull their hands in and get around on my mediocre velocity.

My first two years of college I was used predominantly as a relief pitcher, and I was scheduled to move into the weekend rotation as a junior. Knowing I needed to tweak my approach, I worked to improve command of all my pitches. In August before my junior year, I was fortunate enough to be invited to a MLB game with a friend, who's dad was on the coaching staff of one of the teams. The game featured the Mets, and among the players I got to meet was Johan Santana. This was in 2010, so while Santana was hurt at the time, he was still in the forefront of my mind in terms of having one of the premiere changeups in the game. I had a discussion with Santana for a few minutes and the concept of pitching inside to same-side hitters came up. He asked me what type of changeup I threw, and then proceeded to tell me to throw changeups inside to left-handed hitters. Have the ball run down and in and off the plate. If the hitter makes contact, he'll do nothing but pull it foul. If he doesn't, it's an effective ball. 

Santana's point was that showing the batter the ability to throw an off speed pitch inside would make him cognizant of my ability to do so in the future, which would allow me to throw a fastball in the same location and ensure that he did not open his hips as early to yank the ball. I worked on this all fall and throughout the winter, in hopes of being able to execute the same-side inside changeup during the spring and figure out a way to prevent left-handed hitters from leaning over the plate.

It worked, and I was the Friday starter my junior year.

Again, I realize this is not entirely the point of the discussion. However, throwing inside, as I noted, is an effective pitch sequencing philosophy - but it doesn't have to be solely dedicated to high velocity pitches. Johan Santana taught me that…and I thought that was pretty freakin' cool.

My youngest son's travel coach is teaching this now (13U/14U) to the better pitchers.  They tend to miss over the inside part of the plate (rather than off the plate) and they get mashed.  Part of the learning process.

On a related note, there's a very interesting chapter in "Juicing the Game" discussing how the game changed when the league office took the inside of the plate away from pitchers in order to improve offensive production. This enabled hitters like Jeter to own the whole plate and drive outside pitches hard the other way.  Completely changed the pitcher/hitter dynamic.

BBCOR took effect the year after my son graduated from high school. He's not pitching anymore. Against non BBCOR metal bats a pitcher can still get ripped coming inside. The bats have huge sweet spots. Pitching against wood in the summer starting in 16u he came inside. He broke a lot of hitters bats.

There's no need to throw at hitters. But pitchers can't be afraid to come inside out of fear of hitting batters.

I'm sure the coach did. That move by the pitcher makes zero sense at all.

My son started throwing inside a lot more when his FB got over 90. Not really rocket science.  That said even with a good pitch inside you can get those flair hits off the handle of a BBCOR that were broken bats in wood bat leagues. 

Off subject a bit, but related, the key for him was to stay down and miss down, he found that it did not matter how much a batter was over the plate, if he could throw a FB kneecap down on the outer half with decent velo he was going to get them out ALOT more often than not.  

Unless your son is facing Mike Trout… http://www.fangraphs.com/zoneg...grid=10&view=bat

When my son was in the 4th grade I was co-coaching him on a local rec team.  He was, like every other kid on the team who wanted to be, a pitcher/position player. Anyway, I always preached to him... if you want to pitch you have to be willing to come inside to batters.  Not to hit them, but to make them a little uncomfortable (which can be easy at that age).  I know he was a little nervous about it as all of the players on the other team were his friends and he didn't want to hurt one of them (he could throw hard for his age and didn't have great control).

So first batter comes up and during the at bat I call for a fastball inside.  He drills the kid, who goes down in a heap crying (he was fine).  From the mound my son yells to me, in front of everyone that was there, you see dad that's why I don't want to pitch inside.

Ever since then he has learned it's part of the game if you want to be able to pitch effectively.  He's hit a few every year and he gets hit as well.

Unless your son is facing Mike Trout… http://www.fangraphs.com/zoneg...grid=10&view=bat

 

JH my son may do a lot of wonderful things in life but facing Mike Trout is (likely) not one of them. (hey we can dream). But even if he did he (well maybe not him)  would still get him out 80% of the time if I read the data correctly, which I am clearly not thinking about it. 

Originally Posted by J H:

Unless your son is facing Mike Trout… http://www.fangraphs.com/zoneg...grid=10&view=bat

 

JH my son may do a lot of wonderful things in life but facing Mike Trout is (likely) not one of them. (hey we can dream). But even if he did he (well maybe not him)  would still get him out 80% of the time if I read the data correctly, which I am clearly not thinking about it. 

I faced Trout in high school summer ball in 2007 and 2008. He probably definitely doesn't remember it, but I sure do.

I don't know about 80% of the time…but your son would probably get the job done every once in a while. 

hahaha... falls under the "kids say the darndest things".  Could have been worse... he could have just yelled "why'd you tell me to do that, dad?"

Oh yeah, that would have been much worse. 

Mine had a great 13/14U travel coach that made him throw inside, and told him it was OK if he got hammered a few times.

He was fearless in HS.

 The only thing I remember as 14U at 60' was "I hope it gets there" Big adjustment, 

In the not so long ago days of the BESR there was good reason not to pitch inside to a hitter and a player really wouldn't see a lot of inside pitching until the player was using wood bats.  And there are two reasons I could think of, is that one, pitchers are inconsistant and less so as one moves up to the higher level of play; and two, with the BESR bats a pitcher was more likely to get jacked.   It was pretty evident in the Gorilla Ball we used to see at the college level.  BBCOR bats have changed that some, but players can still get better hits with BBCOR bats than one might with wood on inside pitches.  So, if a player makes it to the minor leagues, that's where he's going to see a LOT more inside pitching. 

...and really really cold.