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19 replies

When to change pitching mechanics

RJMRJMHSBaseballWeb member since 2007
I have an idea of what I believe I'll do. But I'm curious for other's input. ......

My son has developed a flaw in his pitching motion. It probably occured from rapid growth in the past year. Sometimes kids don't have a feel for their bodies as they grow.

His flaw has not affected his effectiveness. But I do feel there's potential for arm problems long term (in years ahead). He's been used as a closer on the high school JV team. He'll be used as a middle man and/or closer on travel. He's not pitching the innings a starter pitches. The varsity coach would like him to become a starter.

My thoughts are on when to work on changing his delivery. I feel if I do it during the season it will make him ineffective and unusable as a pitcher for a couple of months. His control and command could go to hell.

I figure off season is the best time to make a change. The thing is offseason is only November to the end of January. I've always kept him from throwing these three months. The one thing that's changed is he's not a hard throwing little kid (5'4" in 8th grade) where I've wanted to protect his arm by resting it. He's grown (5'11" in 9th grade/projected to be 6'2") and is physically stronger now.

I'm curious on people's opinions of him making the changes in the offseason and not having a winter off from throwing. I'm thinking if he throws 3/4 velocity over the winter while making the changes he won't hurt his arm. We need to burn a new muscle memory into his body. He'll also be playing high school basketball during his baseball offseason.

** The dream is free. Work ethic sold separately. **

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J jdfromfla100+ posts
How radical are you talkin here?
What is the flaw he has developed?
Is he working with someone and if so what are their thoughts?
What is your approach and strategy?
I am not a huge fan of changing things in a big way.
But I'm not on the ground with you. It would be nice to see a video of what he's doing now and hear what you'd like to change. As to changing over winter...my sons active rest has always been 30 days solid and he's never had an arm issue, so particularly if you keep him at those velocities 60-75% it shouldn't be an issue.
So it's a flaw but hasn't effected him but can cause long term injury issues...hummm I'd sure like to see what you mean. All kinds of things come to mind but none of them dictate a complete change of mechanics.
BOFBOF10,000+ posts
First there is no "right" answer just what is best given your circumstances.

1. Most belive a shut down is a shut down. Going 2-3 months w/o throwing is good. 60-75% is not a shut down. Weight work will be important also. You may find that after his body fills into his frame his flaw may be gone. That said one year keeping up throwing is probably not going to hurt him.

2. The best place to change mechanics is in front of a mirror. Very difficult to get kids to do it, but highly recommended.

3. Why not start now? In reality who cares about summer ball. Your travel coach, or HS coach?. Start working it now, work on it in the bull pen, mirror, and then video him in games and review it with him. Summer ball should be used to work on new things.

Good Luck!
B BobbleheadDoll5,000+ posts
I agree mostly with jd. The flaw is the key to what you should do.
Even MLB pitchers develope flaws. Some flaws are minor adjustments and can be worked on immediately and others need a complete break down. My son a JR in college has developed a major change in mecchanics that has made him a battibg practice pitcher. You know its mechanics when it doesn't matter who you pitch agaionst you get beat up. He even knows what he is doing now but is struggling to change back to what he did before. He will start out with an improved delivery and then slip back to the bad habits. That is muscle memory and it has developed over the last year. The 1st time I saw his video I was in total shock. Before when he was here I would tweak his delivery and stop the problem from taking over. Unfortuately it has become ingrained in his muscle memory.
I don't think it is a result of growth. Usually it is a result of trying to gain velocity and possibly someone trying to get him to change. Often to they will watch the hard throwers and emmulate them.
My son has never taken time off other than a couple weeks at Xmas. His tewammates also played year round and most are healthy and playing college ball.
Need to know what you think is a flaw in yous son's delivery.
J jdfromfla100+ posts
quote:
60-75% is not a shut down.


Sorry for not being clear, my son does very well on 30 days (Recommended by both a major leaguer and a D-1 pitching coach)...using the other 60 to work at 60-75% shouldn't be a problem (But absolutely beyond a doubt..active rest has to happen). More to the point...As BOF said, no reason not to start now, I completely agree. Usually...generally...possibly, his summer ball coach has enough going on to help out. I believe in incremental change. And I also agree with BOF looking at what you do can be of immense assistance.

Bobble...your obvious pain touches me. I can only say a prayer for your boy and hope that his desire overcomes his challenge.
Last edited by jdfromfla
S spizzlepop1,000+ posts
quote:
My thoughts are on when to work on changing his delivery. I feel if I do it during the season it will make him ineffective and unusable as a pitcher for a couple of months. His control and command could go to hell.


Assuming the correction isn't radical, I would say do it now. The longer you let it go the deeper ingrained the flaw will become. I've seen lots of pitchers tweak mechanics mid-season. A few, my own son included, have changed things more significantly and gotten immediate results. If he responds well to the proposed change and buys in then it should be fine.
G GapFinder100+ posts
Is this something the player is wanting to do?
If so.
The longer he pitches with what you say is a flaw, the more ingrained in muscle memory it becomes.

Go ahead and speak to the Manager of summer team and explain what it is you are wanting to work on. And start working on it now, it is possible it will cause some games where he is "off", but from reading some of your post this spring maybe the flaw is caused some the games where he was not effective, when he was on the mound.

Young players definetly need 2-3 months of NO Throwing. Let his arm and shoulder rest from the repetitive motion of throwing a ball during the winter months.
RJMRJMHSBaseballWeb member since 2007
He's pitching the way and infielder throws. He's snapping off his pitches rather than getting his arm back. I worked with him a couple of nights ago. He said it felt awkward. The ball was all over the place. I think he hit the bull in Durham.

My thinking is if I force a change on him in midseason he'll become completely ineffective. He was very effective as a freshman on JV. Part of success is confidence. If he's fixed at the right time I think he'll believe he'll be that much better, rather than now and thinking he's not effective as a pitcher.

I told him when he's warming up before practice to focus on getting his arm back rather than snapping off throws. He's even started snapping throws from the outfield the handful of games he played center. He's played outfield before this year and not snapped throws.
C Coachric1,000+ posts
I would not allow the kid to go further with mechanics that may lead to injury, inconsistency or both. When a flaw is detected, thats the time to work on it. He won't be losing a season, just work on getting it corrected. The proof will be in the pudding though, as the mechanical changes should also improve his pitching while benefitting his arm health. He may have some initial inconsistency, but from the sound of things, that has already started with his current mechanics.
S SPARKY1100+ posts
RJM

Lots of good anwers here. Definitly get him doing some dry work in front of a mirror (everyday)as someone stated. Its different actually seeing it as oppossed to what your mind is seeing.

Nothing wrong with a midweek bullpen to take it out to a hill. Sounds like he is cutting himself off a little by being shorter as you said. Your snapping off may be the same as what I call cutting himself off. Instead of worrying what the backside is doing try to make him think exstension on the front side. Might force him to be a little longer out front. Less snapping off.

Wink
Last edited by SPARKY1
B BobbleheadDoll5,000+ posts
There are actually coaches who teach short arming the ball like an infielder who has to get rid of the ball quickly.
It becomes more of an arm throw than getting the body into the throw. He is probably not striding as long as he should as well, To change this you need to break down his delivery into the various steps. I would get a good P coach and let him work with him. They tend to listen better when it comes from a former ball player.
It is common to hear guys who feel awkward when taught how to throw properly and see a short term loss in effectiveness.
Last edited by BobbleheadDoll
RJMRJMHSBaseballWeb member since 2007
I may have zeroed in too much on his arm. He hasn't pitched for a week in a game so I'm having trouble getting a mental image. But, it makes sense he may be snapping the ball from not striding far enough. He's seven inches taller this year. He may not be striding to the correct spot.
Last edited by RJM
RJMRJMHSBaseballWeb member since 2007
I became so fixated on his arm mechanics I failed to notice his footwork. Not bad for a former college pitcher! crazy (closest I could come to a duh icon). Last night I made a mark on the mound and told him to stride to that point. He practiced striding without throwing the ball. When he started pitching to a catcher he looked mechanically correct. I thought I had a big fix on my hands. I just need to watch (along with PC) that he maintains a proper stride.

Bobble ... Thanks for pointing out what should have been the obvious. It just didn't look like there was resistance from his body from understriding. This is something I usually notice right way with pitchers. It's common among those in the rapid growth stages.
B BobbleheadDoll5,000+ posts
RJM it is hard to see the obvious until you really stop and look. Iused video and snapped shots to see what was hard to see in full speed.
I was watching a game here last night and a RHP i have know for years came in in relief. He was a hard thrower and has been in the USA for 3 years. I was amazed at how well he was throwing He had matured and his mechanics were excellent until the 2nd inning and then the old mechanics started coming through. Fortunately the coach straighted him out and he pitched well for the next 2 innings. Mechanics are so important in throwing consistant strikes and getting control over the stuff you throw.
BM Brilliant Mind10+ posts
Pitching is the highest velocity human action (about a joint) obtainable. It is faster than the human eye can assimilate.

Velocity is neither a function of arm positioning, "short throwing" or any of these. It is a function of the transference of a kinetic chain of force through the body and to the ball however that athlete atains it.

If you cannot see the arm clealry in pitching progress, how can you determine where it is in space about the pitcher at any biomechanical point in time? Whose to say that this level of anterior rotation or that vector created is the cause of (reduced/increased) velocity. Biomechanical scientists find that no two arm motions are the same or can be adjudged best. Significant research says a pitcher may achieve varying levels of force from nearly the exact leverages and joint angles blah blah blah.

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