When figuring WHIP (hits+walks per innings pitched) what would one do with "hit by a pitch" figure it in as a walk, or omit it entirely. Seems to me it would/should be considered.....
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Hit by pitch is not figured into the stat. As weird as it may seem, it is strictly Walks+Hits. No other situation is to be figured in.
I find itinteresting that the hit by pitch is not also figured into the "whip" because its exactly the same thing as a walk or hit- runner charged to the pitcher. I am not a big fan of the "whip" stat in high school because it doesnt take into account the errors that prolong a pitchers efforts in an inning. For instance, one of our high school pitchers has a high "whip" because of all the errors made behind him. Over half of the hits this pitcher has given up have happened after errors when he should be out of the inning. Going back through the books and reconstructing innings, he should have the lowest WHIP on the team, not the highest.
Mine is at the college level now so no more figuring..but a group of us were talking the other day and it came up. So that brought up what do you/they do with HBP figure (Batter gets it for OBP) So one would think it would figure in for pitcher in WHIP....Thanks for respones!
GWTW62,
You’re correct. It SEEMS that HBPs should be figured in it someplace, but the fact is they aren’t. They aren’t because the fellow who dreamed up WHIP didn’t put them in the calculation for some reason only he knows.
http://www.infosports.com/scor.../images/whipplus.pdf
What people don’t seem to understand is, if someone doesn’t believe the stat is truly reflective of something, they’re allowed to change it! I do that quite frequently, and as can be seen in the 1st page of the link, I’ve done it with WHIP, and I’ve added HBPs into the equation to make it WHIPPLUS. But you’ll also notice I also show the “standard” equation and result so people who don’t believe what I believe will not have my opinion forced on them.
Also, if you look at the 2nd page of the link, you’ll see my interpretation of what “Pitchers’ Mistakes” are. I think its important to look a players in as many ways as possible, and this is my way of adding another judgment method for pitchers. My point is, no one twists anyone’s arm to use any given stat exactly the way it was originally thought up. If you think HBPs should be computed into WHIP, do it yourself or ask your team’s statistician to do it for you. As you can see, its an easy thing to do.
Skylark,
I don’t understand what difference it makes if a walk or hit comes after there should have been 3 outs or not. WHIP doesn’t have anything to do with earned runs, but rather only shows how pitchers fare against batters they face. You’re making it sound as though if the 1st 3 batters in a game reached on errors, even if the pitcher made them, from then on in the game the pitcher shouldn’t have had to face any other hitters.
But WHIP doesn’t care about when a pitcher should have faced a batter, all it cares about is how he did when he faced that batter. If you want to reconstruct the innings, when the 3rd out should have been made, you don’t start the next inning with the batter who really did lead off the inning, you should start with the 1st batter after the 3rd out should have been made and count what he did.
GWTW62,
You’re comparing apples and oranges when you compare OBP and WHIP. If you want to compare a pitcher’s OBP, you’d compute it the same way you compute a batter’s OBP, except you take the total of all hits+ the total of all walks+ the total of all HBPs and divide it by the total of all ABs + the total of all walks+ the total of all HBPs + the total of all sac flies and you’d have the OBP against a pitcher.
Likewise, if you wanted a batter’s WHIP, you’d add all of his hits + all of his walks, and divide them by the number of outs he’s made divided by 3. However since batter’s done typically have their stats done by innings computed as 3 outs, doing the computation using outs rather than outs divided by 3would make more sense. That way you’d get a WHPO, or Walks+Hits/Outs.
Stats,
It makes a ton of difference on a pitchers WHIP if multiple and frequent errors are committed while he is pitching by the fielders behind him. Errors prolong innings which directly translate into more walks and hits- more than necessary. For instance, the lowest WHIP stat recorded on our team is by a pitcher who has only had 7 errors committed by the defense. Another pitcher, one of the aces, has a much higher WHIP but when you look at the errors through the same amount of innings it doubles to 14. Going back and reconstructing innings minus errors shows the ace to have the lowest WHIP. Its "walks +hits per inning pitched". If the defense is so horrible that the pitcher is facing more batters than necessary in an inning, then of course it increases the odds of giving up more hits and walks per inning thus increasing his WHIP. There needs to be an adjusted WHIP that factors in errors so that it truly reflects a pitchers ability.
It makes a ton of difference on a pitchers WHIP if multiple and frequent errors are committed while he is pitching by the fielders behind him. Errors prolong innings which directly translate into more walks and hits- more than necessary. For instance, the lowest WHIP stat recorded on our team is by a pitcher who has only had 7 errors committed by the defense. Another pitcher, one of the aces, has a much higher WHIP but when you look at the errors through the same amount of innings it doubles to 14. Going back and reconstructing innings minus errors shows the ace to have the lowest WHIP. Its "walks +hits per inning pitched". If the defense is so horrible that the pitcher is facing more batters than necessary in an inning, then of course it increases the odds of giving up more hits and walks per inning thus increasing his WHIP. There needs to be an adjusted WHIP that factors in errors so that it truly reflects a pitchers ability.