WS Game Observation

FINALLY! During the break to fix the mound McCarver says the ump has squeezed Kazmir.

Is this the best argument to condense the playoffs? What an absolutely miserable situation, weather wise, to play the biggest game of the year.

Were's Bud? Nice warm skybox. Is he even there?

As for the umpires, if it is in the air and toward the hitter, I am calling it a strike. If there was ever a need for a 2 hour game this is it.

I hear ya Moc1. I am not really hoping for one team or the other, just hoping for a great WS but I personally think that the officiating has been very lopsided. There were many calls that one pitcher would get that the other wouldn't (not to mention other calls) and this seems to be a theme throughout this whole series. I usually don't say much as I know that it is a very hard job. But, these guys get paid a lot of money to get things right. I certainly hope that the officials must sit down and review after all this. Too bad, could have been a good series.

What are the chances this game gets called due to weather?

It is too bad how the officiating has affected the World Series. They can give all the excuses to say it is due to the collective bargaining unit, but you can't say that these are the best.

Would they add insult to injury by calling the World Series?

I'd hate for the WS to end due to weather.

Let's hope Upton scores here then they can stop the game while it's tied.

Has a WS game EVER been played in worse weather? This is what they should be playing the Super Bowl in.

It is the top of the inning, if they stop the game now or in the bottom of the inning, it goes back to before the inning starts.

Oh, they just said they won't end the WS on this rain delay...they'll just suspend the game until tomorrow.

They are saying it will be a suspended game since it is tied, that is weird.

The whole situation with the umps and the CBA is idiocy. Big games, best umps, period.

They let that clown Marquez ump the Twins/Sox playoff where he blew three calls in one game. Next thing I know, he's doing the ALCS too.

There are good umps sitting at home right now watching these guys stink up the joint.

Yeah, I'm not sure I understand what's going on. I'm just glad they can't end it here.

How about that tag on Rollins last night? How obvious was that?

Last night was bad too. Sonnanstine had a bunch of pitches early on that could have easily been called strikes, but you never saw the k-zone till after the 3rd inning. By then it was too late. Granted the phillies out slugged the rays last night but they screwed with Sonnanstine early and he never recovered and it just went downhill from there.

I'm a NL guy (Cards fan) so I've been rooting for the Phillies but I have to say this has been the worst umpired series I've ever seen. The calls on the bases are obvious screw ups, but the plate umpiring has had a bigger effect IMO. Stuff like Hamels throwing a 3-0 pitch high and in and gets the bail out strike call then gets a double play grounder on the next pitch. Compare that with the strike zone Kazmir got tonight.

Hamels and Moyer both had clear strike zone advantages from the PU in each of their games. Ridiculously inconsistent again tonight. I'm sure hard core Philly fans don't really care...they'll take what they can get. I don't really blame them.

But I'm kind of hoping the Rays win game 5 now given how bad it's been in the Phillies favor.

I don't buy the COO saying - "oh the fact that it is tied is irrelevant - we would have called the game here anyway"... not a chance, they were playing until it was tied and then calling out the tarp...

Complete ripoff...

I told my wife the same thing watching the last couple innings. I told her MLB was praying the Rays would score top 5 or top 6 so they could stop play. I was laughing as Bob Dupuy was saying that. What a load of ****.

Here it is 11:05pm, if the Rays had not scored, they'd still be playing LOL.

I was kind of hoping the weather would ruin the world series. When the Yankess aren't in it, i usually root for these logistical nightmares or anything that embarrass Bud the Salesman.

And with MLB selling out to networks with games being played at 2am, they deserve playing in the snow.

zomby,

I sure hope you're kidding. I can understand not being as excited when your team isn't in the big game, but to wish for logistical nightmares?

Come on, it's baseball and we should be rooting for the best possible games we can get.

I like both of these teams equally, maybe lean a little toward the Rays since they knocked out my Red Sox (and your Yankees a LONG time ago!). But I really hate to see the season end so I'm hoping for 7 games.

And what a terrible thing (even though you cannot control the weather) for the Series end due to weather. I'm sure the Phillies fans feel differently but 6 or 7 games would be great for baseball.

This has absolutely been the most abysmally umpired WS I have ever seen. Buck and McCarver FINALLY started getting all over the umpires...and went and explained that the current system is due to the CBA with the umpires, like CPLZ said. They also said that the current CBA is up after either the 09 or 10 season, and that it would be an opportunity to fix things.

But blaming the CBA implies that there are only 12 umpires in MLB.

Does everyone get a turn or are they put in by some sort of merit?

I have a hard time arguing about the strike zone but some of the calls on the field have been just plain silly.

And isn't it interesting how one or two players can completely change a game?

Pena and Longoria finally get their hits and all Upton has to do is get on base. Whole different game!

quote:

Originally posted by biggerpapi:
But blaming the CBA implies that there are only 12 umpires in MLB.

Does everyone get a turn or are they put in by some sort of merit?

I have a hard time arguing about the strike zone but some of the calls on the field have been just plain silly.

Umpires cannot work in consecutive post-season series or even work in consecutive World Series. That alone is going to lessen the quality.

Just wondering- but what happens if the weather makes the game unplayable tonight? Forcast does not look great?

quote:

Originally posted by JT:
Umpires cannot work in consecutive post-season series or even work in consecutive World Series. That alone is going to lessen the quality.

I understand that. But to me this implies that there are only six good umpires...the ones who worked last year.

Lefty34,
Selig has said that the game will be played if they have to stay in Philly until Thanksgiving. The next two days look bad but I would guess that as long as it is not raining or snowing they would restart the game.
Maybe this umpiring crew has a side job tomorrow and they can wait for them to leave.

quote:

Originally posted by biggerpapi:
zomby,

I sure hope you're kidding. I can understand not being as excited when your team isn't in the big game, but to wish for logistical nightmares?

Come on, it's baseball and we should be rooting for the best possible games we can get.

LOL...I say that every year the Yanks don't make it...However, as I post this, believe it or not, we're getting heavy snow! Who'd of thought the baseball gods took me serious. My car is covered and it's sticking!. Unbelievable that we're getting snow in October.

However, with MLB selling out to the networks, this is the chance they take by playing late October night games. Baseball should be over by the 2nd week of October.

What baseball needs to do is shorten the regular season back to 154 games to counter the extra playoff rounds that extend the season. It'll never happen though because of the $$$$$.

Look at this, a Yankee fan and a Red Sox fan having a civilized conversation!

I'm all for baseball season lasting as long as possible. If it wasn't raining, it would have just been a chilly evening. And if the Dodgers had beaten the Phillies, we wouldn't even be talking about this.

What bothers me more is starting these games so late in the evening. And I'm not on the East Coast.

What's wrong with a 5pm or 6pm start? This 8:30 ET is ridiculous. More than half the population can't afford to stay up that late to catch the end of the game.

quote:

What's wrong with a 5pm or 6pm start?

That would have 40% of the population at work while the games are being played. It's more likely people on the east coast will stay up than just lock out the people in western time zones who are working. There's nothing wrong with an 8pm start. The problem is the additional advertising between innings making the games run so late.

I'm old, I remember day games for the WS. There's much to be said for skivving off work or secreting a radio on your person while in class to listen to The Game. But that's not going to happen any more.

Apparently they've called it off for tonight as well due to weather. Ah, well.

I would think a whole lotta people on this board would be rooting for the Rays. An organization that got this far with a large core of rookies rather than high-priced vets shows the potential value of young players. Or are those of you with sons with MLB dreams happier to support the teams in love with multimillion dollar vets holding on to one of those 750 jobs for say, 8-20 years?

Who remembers sneaking a transitor radio into school to listen the the WS when they were played in the afternoon.
RJM, the entire country was at work in those days. Obviously money dictaes when all sporting events start nowadays.
The combination of the late start time and horrible announcers and you have a really long night.

quote:

Originally posted by fillsfan:
Who remembers sneaking a transitor radio into school to listen the the WS when they were played in the afternoon.

I do!

We actually stopped class and watched it on TV, "educational purposes" only

quote:

Originally posted by Orlando:
I'm old, I remember day games for the WS. There's much to be said for skivving off work or secreting a radio on your person while in class to listen to The Game. But that's not going to happen any more.

Apparently they've called it off for tonight as well due to weather. Ah, well.

I would think a whole lotta people on this board would be rooting for the Rays. An organization that got this far with a large core of rookies rather than high-priced vets shows the potential value of young players. Or are those of you with sons with MLB dreams happier to support the teams in love with multimillion dollar vets holding on to one of those 750 jobs for say, 8-20 years?

I am with you O, I am a NL fan but I am going for the young rookies and what they have accomplished.

Some day, when or if their sons are drafted by an organization that holds rookies back for years as they waste away instead of moving them forward, they'll understand.

As far as the officiating, how disgraceful. And they KNEW that storm was coming, the game should have been postponed.

JMO.

Last season, when the Storm was playing the Giants affiliate, Omar Vizquel was on a rehab assignment. He's covering second when the Storm player slides in and, what with being Omar, the DP is completed. Storm guy gets back in the dugout and the coach asks him why he didn't take Vizquel out. (Awestruck) "Because he's Omar Vizquel". Coach says that's exactly why he should be looking to take him out "It's guys like that that prevent a couple dozen of you guys from ever making it!"

Now, I'm not suggesting going all Tonya Harding on MLB players, but a little support for the rooks is in order on a baseball parents website!

Quote:
I would think a whole lotta people on this board would be rooting for the Rays. An organization that got this far with a large core of rookies rather than high-priced vets shows the potential value of young players. Or are those of you with sons with MLB dreams happier to support the teams in love with multimillion dollar vets holding on to one of those 750 jobs for say, 8-20 years? Wink

Orlando/TPM:
The Phillies are what Tampa Bay hopes to be in five years. The core of the team (Howard, Utley, Burrell, Rollins, Hamels, Myers....) are home grown draft picks who have developed into top notch MLers.
TB has the young talent and has to find a way to keep them in the next few years.
TPM, should the Phillies get rid of a couple of these guys so prospects can be moved up in the organization.
Howard actually stayed in the minors for an extra year while Jim Thome played first.
I understand your thinking but it certainly doesn't apply to the Phils at this time, when all these guys are in their prime. Just a tough break for players behind them in the minors.

TB hope to be like the Phillies in 5 years? Aren't they already there with their younger players (championship game)? I don't get that one.

I never stated they should be taken out and replaced by younger players. I said I agreed with Orlando about rooting for the young rookies. I also root for the teams that bring up their younger players and do not hold them back for the expensive, I am over the hill guys, if the Phillies don't do that, then it's cool.

I think what really got my goat is the negative remarks about Longoria and the TB guys who have been struggling the past few games. What the heck, they are a group of young guys who played their guts out to get where they got to. Sometimes that takes the wind out of the sails. Now you have a group of warm weather hitters and pitchers in freezing temps, it's hard to adjust. I haven't heard complaints from them, while there were several complaints frpm players of other teams about not being successful at Tropicana because the lighting stinks and it's hard playing under a white dome.

As a parent of a young pro player, I respect each and every player who ever makes it to MLB, it's not easy, but I gotta go with the rooks, always will and always have, no matter which team. So I give up my NL allegiance to the young American Leaguers, just because they are just rookies.

quote:

Originally posted by fillsfan:
RJM, the entire country was at work in those days. Obviously money dictaes when all sporting events start nowadays.
The combination of the late start time and horrible announcers and you have a really long night.

This is a different era. Now there's too much money involved to blow off a large segment of fans.

In 1967 I remember Jim Lonborg writing 10,000 in on his glove as motivation. 10,000 was the World Series winner's share. Lonborg said he need the extra money to supplement his regular pay.

In the offseason Tom Yawkey was accused of ruining the salary structure of baseball. He signed Yastrzemski to a three year deal for 500K. My God! Where would the motivation come from with a three year deal? And 167K per year! Outrageous!

quote:

Originally posted by Orlando:
I would think a whole lotta people on this board would be rooting for the Rays.

I can't support a team that isn't supported by it's own town. There are far more deserving baseball fans over all the country who deserve a winner long before the people of Tampa. Phillies fans are among that group. 2008 attendance - over 3.5 million.

If the Phils win the fans of Philadelphia can collectively unclench their keisters after twenty-five years of frustration. However, if the Phils blow a 3-1 lead, sports talk radio would sure be entertaining.

As a transplant to the area without emotional ties to any of the teams, observing the psychotic nature of Philadelphia fans is entertaining.