You never know who's watching

My first impression after reading this:

Get a life Mr Scout! You seem more impressed with yourself than maybe you should be. These are HS kids and they are going to go out to Prom, Homecoming dance, etc. If you can't be aware of this get another job. He's a JERK IMO.

I'm with BOF on this one. The overall message is true in that you never know who is watching but the scouts I've talked to or interacted with realize these kids have other things in their life going on. And after last year I've been around a bunch of them. Yes you never know who's watching and you should give it your all everytime your on the field but if you got the goods or look like you might have them you will get more than one look.

If you get seen 5 or 6 times and each time is a lackadasical attitude or something along those lines then yeah you can be chalked up as a lost cause but not after one appearance.

As a coach, I really don't care if they have been out all night. Your "job" is to play hard. It is really the only thing I ask. If you can't play hard, then you should be sitting...period.

As a player, I have been in this situation and played when less than 100% due to my own extra curricular activities. I never used it as an excuse since it was MY CHOICE to partake in said activities. I still played hard even though I may have been a step slower. That's just the way I was taught.

From a scout's perspective, I think he kinda overstepped his bounds by addressing the team. I don't think he is a jerk, but he wanted to make a point. Chalk it up as good information delivered...poorly (possibly). I'd never consider doing such a thing unless I knew the coach very well and I was invited to talk to them. If given the opportunity, I would probably say the same things.

There are players who have been sick and performed very well.

There have been players who are injured and performed very well.

There are players who have been tired and performed very well.

Effort is a critical ingredient!

You must answer the bell!

I suppose I'm wrong about this, but if I see lack of effort even once on a baseball field, it leaves a negative impression that is hard to forget. I automatically assume it will happen again.

That said, it is not a scouts job to try to correct this. A scout shouldn't have to tell a kid he needs to show more effort. His job is to simply notice it!

Many things can cause a bad performance in baseball, but it should never be lack of effort. I'm sure others might have a different opinion.

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
There are players who have been sick and performed very well.

There have been players who are injured and performed very well.

There are players who have been tired and performed very well.

Effort is a critical ingredient!

You must answer the bell!

I suppose I'm wrong about this, but if I see lack of effort even once on a baseball field, it leaves a negative impression that is hard to forget. I automatically assume it will happen again.

That said, it is not a scouts job to try to correct this. A scout shouldn't have to tell a kid he needs to show more effort. His job is to simply notice it!

Many things can cause a bad performance in baseball, but it should never be lack of effort. I'm sure others might have a different opinion.

agreed

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
...I suppose I'm wrong about this, but if I see lack of effort even once on a baseball field, it leaves a negative impression that is hard to forget. I automatically assume it will happen again...

I agree wholeheartedly. What will be the next excuse?

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
…Many things can cause a bad performance in baseball, but it should never be lack of effort. I'm sure others might have a different opinion.

How does one differentiate between a lack of effort and some other reason for a poor performance?

quote:

Originally posted by Stats4Gnats:
How does one differentiate between a lack of effort and some other reason for a poor performance?

What other reasons?

I remember about 6 or 7 years ago when I was managing a LL team and because of a shortage of ball fields was at a local small park in a residential neighborhood where we laid out our own bases. We had a hitting net as the backstop. Not the ideal situation, but neither was playing ball in the street when I was a kid, but it still worked.

Anyway, I was teaching run-down plays when I glanced over my shoulder and saw an elderly man standing there watching. I nodded at him and he smiled. I thought it was one of the boys' grandfather. After a few minutes he walked up to me and handed me his card and said, 'Coach, you're doing a great job, this is exactly the way we teach it in camp' as he shook my hand. I took a second look at his card and was surprised to see John Gracio, Area Scout, Los Angeles Angels.

I thought for a moment one of my friends was punking me, but thought better of it and asked him to stay as we were shutting down practice and asked if he would talk to the team.

Once the boys were gathered together, Mr Gracio began his address. Keep in mind these are 11 and 12 year old boys, but it didn't matter to him and he spoke to them as if they were in high school or college. I don't know if the boys really understood what he was saying, but I did and so did my 2 coaches. Any of you who may know John Gracio and have heard him speak know he is definitely an old school, rough & gruff and tells it like it is...'work hard', 'listen to your coaches, parents and teachers', 'get good grades' because 'show me a good baseball player and I will show you a good student'. If you don't want to do all that then 'stay home'.

In the years following my introduction to Mr Gracio, I've had the opportunity to see more of him in his Angels Amateur Baseball organization and his message has not changed for those who want to play baseball beyond LL...Always, always give your best effort in whatever you do. Anything less...well...'stay home'.

I always tell my son you never know who is watching, so if you dont feel like you are at your best then you need to sit out because not only are you hurting yourself but your team also.

His mom always tells him you better not go out there and embarrass me, I think he takes that more to heart than anything I tell him

If I am the scout watching a player, lack of effort would strictly be my opinion. Even poor performance would be my opinion. Others might have a different opinion or they might share mine.

Scouting is all about someone's opinion. Unfortunately, those opinions can count a lot. It takes "obvious" lack of effort to form a strong opinion.

Poor performance can be caused by many things. It just happens at times. Sometimes it is caused by lack of ability. It should never be caused by lack of effort. JMO

quote:

Poor performance can be caused by many things. It just happens at times. Sometimes it is caused by lack of ability. It should never be caused by lack of effort. JMO

Every kid who makes it to Freshman baseball should understand what this means...very well said PG

I'm an idiot. After reading all your replies and rereading the opening post I'm wrong. I'm going to chalk it up to temporary insanity of being a Monday after a hard loss Friday night.

After I read some of your responses I asked myself what would I do and realized I wouldn't stand for a lackadasical effort. I can agree the scout probably overstepped his bounds but the message is true. So I wish to take back my first post since I'm an idiot.

quote:

Originally posted by redbird5:
What other reasons?

I don’t know, that’s why I asked the question. No player I know gives a great performance every time out in a sport where the norm is a 70% failure rate, so I’m trying to find out how one can make a distinction between reasons for failure.

Being the SK for a HS team, I can generally watch a Sr who’s been in the program for 4 years and tell when his “dogging” it. I could certainly tell with my son when he played too. But I’d sure be unwilling to label a kid as being one who “dogs it” that I wasn’t very familiar with, just in case I misread what was going on.

Of course that’s me, and I have a problem with labels of any kind.

quote:

Originally posted by wbethea13:
I always tell my son you never know who is watching, so if you dont feel like you are at your best then you need to sit out because not only are you hurting yourself but your team also.

His mom always tells him you better not go out there and embarrass me, I think he takes that more to heart than anything I tell him

Believe me, I understand the underlying message here, but what you’re saying just doesn’t make sense. If feeling at your best was a prerequisite for playing, very very few players would be in the lineup at the end of a long season.

And what about the general feeling that 80% of player “A” is better than 100% of player “B”? How’s that work if player a should be sitting on the bench?

I think there is a big difference between a scout having an opinion and actually labeling a kid. Unless it is a scout who talks too much. Even at that, labeling is going to happen, players need to be aware of that. Nobody complains when the label is a good one.

Even in our arena where we scout kids, we have lots of opinions that do not get to the public. I don't think we have ever mentioned lack of effort in a player. Doesn't mean we didn't think that, though.

coach2709,

quote:

I'm an idiot

Welcome to the club. We have many members in our club.

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
If I am the scout watching a player, lack of effort would strictly be my opinion. Even poor performance would be my opinion. Others might have a different opinion or they might share mine.

Scouting is all about someone's opinion. Unfortunately, those opinions can count a lot. It takes "obvious" lack of effort to form a strong opinion.

Poor performance can be caused by many things. It just happens at times. Sometimes it is caused by lack of ability. It should never be caused by lack of effort. JMO

What you’re saying is, the whole thing is totally subjective, and I totally understand that. But here’s a problem I have with that mentality. If you don’t define any standards of measurement, how’s anyone supposed to act or perform? You put players in a “****ed if you do and ****ed if you don’t” situation where only you have the final say so.

I’m really not trying to give you grief, but it does bother me when someone can say they didn’t think a player gave enough effort, and put a big black mark on him for the rest of his life. I also think its unfair to say a player didn’t perform well who made 5 outs while one who went 5 for 5 on duck farts, bloops, and seeing eye hits was the MVP. There’s just a lot more to it than that.

That’s the problem with subjectivity. It wouldn’t be so bad if there was only one guy out there making these judgments, but there are literally hundreds of evaluators running around out there, and they all have their own standards. I’d really like to hear an “obvious lack of effort” described in a way that from the time I see it, I’ll know 100% of the time when it happens again.

There’s been a few times when I was asked to assist with evaluations, where there was a player who was so superior to those around him, he didn’t need to put out a max effort to be better. Should that kind of player get blacklisted? I know I wouldn’t do it.

Look, I think that what’s happening is, people are trying to describe evaluating players in 140 characters for Twitter, when to do it any justice at all would take at least a mini encyclopedia, and all that does is confuse things.

quote:

Originally posted by wbethea13:
I always tell my son you never know who is watching, so if you dont feel like you are at your best then you need to sit out because not only are you hurting yourself but your team also.

How does this work, do you just tell the coach you don't feel like pitching that day or that you want out of the lineup or put in a sub? Or do you dog it and just act like you are hurt or sick, never have I ever heard this type of advice.

Coach, don't worry, you are not an idiot!

No I am going by my son's personal experience when he has played with a broken wrist and didnt tell anyone and had a bad game when he knew he was hurt. Also since he plays football there have been times, which has been recent, that he was banged up from the game and he told his coach his situation and the coach didnt have him catch and just bat.

I dont mean as a mental standpoint im talking about physically because like I said from personal experience my son will play regardless hurt or not. So I guess I am the idiot..lol

quote:

Originally posted by Stats4Gnats:

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
If I am the scout watching a player, lack of effort would strictly be my opinion. Even poor performance would be my opinion. Others might have a different opinion or they might share mine.

Scouting is all about someone's opinion. Unfortunately, those opinions can count a lot. It takes "obvious" lack of effort to form a strong opinion.

Poor performance can be caused by many things. It just happens at times. Sometimes it is caused by lack of ability. It should never be caused by lack of effort. JMO

What you’re saying is, the whole thing is totally subjective, and I totally understand that. But here’s a problem I have with that mentality. If you don’t define any standards of measurement, how’s anyone supposed to act or perform? You put players in a “****ed if you do and ****ed if you don’t” situation where only you have the final say so.

I’m really not trying to give you grief, but it does bother me when someone can say they didn’t think a player gave enough effort, and put a big black mark on him for the rest of his life. I also think its unfair to say a player didn’t perform well who made 5 outs while one who went 5 for 5 on duck farts, bloops, and seeing eye hits was the MVP. There’s just a lot more to it than that.

That’s the problem with subjectivity. It wouldn’t be so bad if there was only one guy out there making these judgments, but there are literally hundreds of evaluators running around out there, and they all have their own standards. I’d really like to hear an “obvious lack of effort” described in a way that from the time I see it, I’ll know 100% of the time when it happens again.

There’s been a few times when I was asked to assist with evaluations, where there was a player who was so superior to those around him, he didn’t need to put out a max effort to be better. Should that kind of player get blacklisted? I know I wouldn’t do it.

Look, I think that what’s happening is, people are trying to describe evaluating players in 140 characters for Twitter, when to do it any justice at all would take at least a mini encyclopedia, and all that does is confuse things.

I must be an idiot too, Coach!

quote:

Originally posted by Stats4Gnats:


What you’re saying is, the whole thing is totally subjective, and I totally understand that. But here’s a problem I have with that mentality. If you don’t define any standards of measurement, how’s anyone supposed to act or perform? You put players in a “****ed if you do and ****ed if you don’t” situation where only you have the final say so.

I’m really not trying to give you grief, but it does bother me when someone can say they didn’t think a player gave enough effort, and put a big black mark on him for the rest of his life. I also think its unfair to say a player didn’t perform well who made 5 outs while one who went 5 for 5 on duck farts, bloops, and seeing eye hits was the MVP. There’s just a lot more to it than that.

That’s the problem with subjectivity. It wouldn’t be so bad if there was only one guy out there making these judgments, but there are literally hundreds of evaluators running around out there, and they all have their own standards. I’d really like to hear an “obvious lack of effort” described in a way that from the time I see it, I’ll know 100% of the time when it happens again.

There’s been a few times when I was asked to assist with evaluations, where there was a player who was so superior to those around him, he didn’t need to put out a max effort to be better. Should that kind of player get blacklisted? I know I wouldn’t do it.

Look, I think that what’s happening is, people are trying to describe evaluating players in 140 characters for Twitter, when to do it any justice at all would take at least a mini encyclopedia, and all that does is confuse things.

Ok, I'll bite.

In your opinion, based off this post, how should "it" go then? The line between "traditional scouting" and Moneyball isn't so fine. Where do you differentiate between the two to be successful?

And just for reference, the part about the superior player knowingly dogging it: yes, I would hold that against him. A lot.

Did the scout perhaps know these players personally? Perhaps he has followed this group as it is local and so is he. If so he should step up and give them an earful, the next guy watching may not know them at all and will move on to the next team quickly.

This past May, my son's HS team was preparing to play one of the top rated teams in the nation in the first round of the CIF (state) playoffs on a Friday afternoon. The day prior, on Thursday night/early Friday morning, the seniors had the option to participate in Grad Night festivities at Disneyland with their classmates. Four of the eight seniors (incl. my son and two other starters) on the team chose to skip the function and stayed home to get proper rest. The other four attended Grad Night and had a great time, but they did not play in the CIF game. The game was scoreless until the 14th inning, but we lost 1-0. One of the young men that chose to attend Disneyland was our senior catcher that platooned at the position, and usually caught my son. He hadn't slept in 24 hours, but was close to being needed for the game as our starting catcher had taken a foul ball off his wrist in the 5th inning...fortunately he toughed it out. But how would the other player had done on No sleep if we needed him in the game? We'll never know?

My wife and I bought him and his girlfriend tickets to Disneyland two weeks later. The park wasn't crowded, the lines for the rides were short, and they had a nice time. It was the least we could do...as he had given up his Senior Grad Night for his team. We were proud of him, he pitched the first nine shutout innings in a pitcher's duel. Ironically, his current college teammate/roommate scored the winning run in that game...my son won the battle head to head with him, but his roommate ultimately won the war.

I realize that we can't compare a playoff game with a Fall Ball game, but some people tend to prioritize better than others.

I think this thread got sidetracked a little bit. The OP expressed disgust with players showing up after Homecoming sleep deprived (or maybe hung over?!?!)

This isn't a lack of effort, this is a blatant disregard for the game, for their teammates or for the baseball gift they have and their potential future.

quote:

Originally posted by Stats4Gnats:
If you don’t define any standards of measurement, how’s anyone supposed to act or perform? You put players in a “****ed if you do and ****ed if you don’t” situation where only you have the final say so....

I’d really like to hear an “obvious lack of effort” described in a way that from the time I see it, I’ll know 100% of the time when it happens again.

Stats,
Many things are not specifically measurable to a percentage point but still very relevant. Body language, posture, decisions and actions, facial expression, vocal tone, awareness, alertness, etc. Experts in their fields (in this case, scouts) can determine alot by some of these things. Is it 100% fool proof? Not always, but often experts will look to these things above stats. Sorry, not saying stats aren't important. There is just so much more that a trained eye can see.

quote:

There’s been a few times when I was asked to assist with evaluations, where there was a player who was so superior to those around him, he didn’t need to put out a max effort to be better. Should that kind of player get blacklisted? I know I wouldn’t do it.

I probably would, depending on the situation. A talented player who feels he doesn't need to put out max effort is definitely a bit of a red flag to me. I'm speaking from a coach standpoint vs a scout but I imagine there would be similarities.

(Shoot, you guys write too fast... like 4 posts while I was putting together some thoughts. Great story, 247. JH, you beat me to it.)

quote:

Originally posted by Stats4Gnats:
I also think its unfair to say a player didn’t perform well who made 5 outs while one who went 5 for 5 on duck farts, bloops, and seeing eye hits was the MVP. There’s just a lot more to it than that.

Now, to get back to the off-track talk.

Any scout/evaluator worth his salt surely knows the difference between five lasers hit right at fielders vs. a batter who reached base less-than-impressively.

This is why stats mean so little to many real baseball people.

How about this? How do you evaluate a right fielder who doesn't get a single play all game? Well, did he run to and from his position every inning? Did he work hard in warmups? Was he up on the railing supporting his teammates?

There's more to this than numbers.

quote:

Originally posted by J H:
Ok, I'll bite.

In your opinion, based off this post, how should "it" go then? The line between "traditional scouting" and Moneyball isn't so fine. Where do you differentiate between the two to be successful?

And just for reference, the part about the superior player knowingly dogging it: yes, I would hold that against him. A lot.

I think you’re missing my entire point. I don’t believe I mentioned anything about ‘”Moneyball” at all. All I was trying to say, was that using only subjective standards without definitions is really a poor way to evaluate anyone for anything.

If you weren’t familiar with that player, how would you be so sure he was either superior or dogging it?

quote:

Originally posted by biggerpapi:
I think this thread got sidetracked a little bit. The OP expressed disgust with players showing up after Homecoming sleep deprived (or maybe hung over?!?!)

This isn't a lack of effort, this is a blatant disregard for the game, for their teammates or for the baseball gift they have and their potential future.

We had 2 starting players go to a pro tryout the day before a playoff game in direct violation of state rules. That game was allowed to stand, but they were DQ’d for the next game. They sure didn’t get drunk or stay up all night, but one got drafted in the 3rd round.

So where’s the line in the sand? Is it on the side of the team and the school, or the game?

Your performance may not be 100% but your effort should be

quote:

What you’re saying is, the whole thing is totally subjective, and I totally understand that. But here’s a problem I have with that mentality. If you don’t define any standards of measurement, how’s anyone supposed to act or perform? You put players in a “****ed if you do and ****ed if you don’t” situation where only you have the final say so.

Stats,

Not sure I said that at all! There are some areas that are defined standards of measure. Effort is not one of those.

If you take subjectivity away, you will eliminate scouting. Scouting is all about a persons opinion. However, one opinion does not make anything the final say. Even if an Area Supervisor sees something he likes, he might call in a regional Crosschecker in order to get another opinion. Then if everyone likes a player enough they might call in a national Crosschecker (all clubs are not set up exactly the same). Then if everyone likes the player enough in comes the Scouting Director and he will have an opinion.

Scouting is a game of comparisons. An experienced scout has seen thousands of players. Some within a certain area, others across the nation. The crosschecker is who compares the player in North Carolina to the player in California. Statistics are not very important unless they show a major red flag. The standards of measurements are well known.

It all boils down to OPINIONS! Millions of dollars are spent based on OPINIONS! There are too many variables to do it any other way.

So is the system something that works? Are the best players playing in the Big Leagues? Are there some better players out there doing something else for a living? I suppose the answer to both those questions is YES!

Stats,

I'm curious... Does this stuff really bother you or do you just enjoy debating it?

I think you will know it when you see an "obvious" lack of effort. And you will also know when something appears to look effortless for an outstanding athlete. The truth is there is no such thing as effortless.

quote:

Originally posted by cabbagedad:
Many things are not specifically measurable to a percentage point but still very relevant. Body language, posture, decisions and actions, facial expression, vocal tone, awareness, alertness, etc. Experts in their fields (in this case, scouts) can determine alot by some of these things. Is it 100% fool proof? Not always, but often experts will look to these things above stats. Sorry, not saying stats aren't important. There is just so much more that a trained eye can see.

Here’s the problem with that premise. For HS players, how many scouts bother to even look at the stats, other than just in a glancing way? So in the case of scouts, either college or pro, I’d say they were going 95% esoteric and subjective things and 5% factual. So what’s being said isn’t that stats aren’t important, its that they don’t exist.

quote:

I probably would, depending on the situation. A talented player who feels he doesn't need to put out max effort is definitely a bit of a red flag to me. I'm speaking from a coach standpoint vs a scout but I imagine there would be similarities.

Why would you care as an evaluator of talent? If you being asked to determine if a player is a good person, or a good fit for your program, that’s one thing. But if you’re looking purely for the talent, why should you care if he beats his dog and smokes a joint or two? Now there are some colleges and pro programs that care, but judging by some of the fine citizen athletes we produced in this country, I’d say talent trumped all.

quote:

Originally posted by Stats4Gnats:

quote:

Originally posted by biggerpapi:
I think this thread got sidetracked a little bit. The OP expressed disgust with players showing up after Homecoming sleep deprived (or maybe hung over?!?!)

This isn't a lack of effort, this is a blatant disregard for the game, for their teammates or for the baseball gift they have and their potential future.

We had 2 starting players go to a pro tryout the day before a playoff game in direct violation of state rules. That game was allowed to stand, but they were DQ’d for the next game. They sure didn’t get drunk or stay up all night, but one got drafted in the 3rd round.

So where’s the line in the sand? Is it on the side of the team and the school, or the game?

I thought players had to provide scouts with written permission from the school in order to attend try out during the season

quote:

We had 2 starting players go to a pro tryout the day before a playoff game in direct violation of state rules. That game was allowed to stand, but they were DQ’d for the next game. They sure didn’t get drunk or stay up all night, but one got drafted in the 3rd round.

So where’s the line in the sand? Is it on the side of the team and the school, or the game?

I don't think you can equate 'cheating' with 'poor judgement' that leads to a 'lack of effort' except that both show a disregard for your teammates.

A third-rounder doesn't need to run off for a tryout the day before a game. He's going to get another chance (or two or three....)

Stats for Gnats,

You seem to be laboring under the misperception that "subjective" means arbitrary or capricious. It doesn't. It means determined by the conditioning and idiosyncrasies of an individual mind.

If the individual mind has years of coaching and evaluating thousands of players, subjectivity is likely to render a more accurate opinion faster than objective measures.

You lose a lot of credibility when you take your hyper-objective Spock-like rationality to extremes and pretend people can't tell when a player isn't giving full effort.

We know much more than we can prove, and I think you know this. People get through life relying on subjective judgments much more than they rely on objective evaluations.

quote:

Originally posted by biggerpapi:
I think this thread got sidetracked a little bit. The OP expressed disgust with players showing up after Homecoming sleep deprived (or maybe hung over?!?!)

This isn't a lack of effort, this is a blatant disregard for the game, for their teammates or for the baseball gift they have and their potential future.

To add just a little more insight . . .

Coach had a medical emergency and a parent was asked that morning to step up and volunteer to coach the game.

Players arrived late and the team stud was in street clothes. He didn't warm up because he was getting dressed in the dugout. Too many examples of disrespect to enumerate here. Others made halfhearted attempts at warmups, etc.

It's my understanding that the scout was trying to make a solid point, as well as have the back of the parent who was merely stepping up and being disrespected on the field.

quote:

Originally posted by 2013 Parent:

quote:

Originally posted by biggerpapi:
I think this thread got sidetracked a little bit. The OP expressed disgust with players showing up after Homecoming sleep deprived (or maybe hung over?!?!)

This isn't a lack of effort, this is a blatant disregard for the game, for their teammates or for the baseball gift they have and their potential future.

To add just a little more insight . . .

Coach had a medical emergency and a parent was asked that morning to step up and volunteer to coach the game.

Players arrived late and the team stud was in street clothes. He didn't warm up because he was getting dressed in the dugout. Too many examples of disrespect to enumerate here. Others made halfhearted attempts at warmups, etc.

It's my understanding that the scout was trying to make a solid point, as well as have the back of the parent who was merely stepping up and being disrespected on the field.

With that info, I see the situation in a different light, why didn't you provide us with that info from the beginning?

Swampboy- Great point. Exactly where I was trying to go with my "Moneyball" comment, but said 100x better.

quote:

Originally posted by PGStaff:
Not sure I said that at all! There are some areas that are defined standards of measure. Effort is not one of those.

You may not have said that, but its pretty much how I interpreted what you were saying.

quote:

If you take subjectivity away, you will eliminate scouting. Scouting is all about a persons opinion. However, one opinion does not make anything the final say. Even if an Area Supervisor sees something he likes, he might call in a regional Crosschecker in order to get another opinion. Then if everyone likes a player enough they might call in a national Crosschecker (all clubs are not set up exactly the same). Then if everyone likes the player enough in comes the Scouting Director and he will have an opinion.

Scouting is a game of comparisons. An experienced scout has seen thousands of players. Some within a certain area, others across the nation. The crosschecker is who compares the player in North Carolina to the player in California. Statistics are not very important unless they show a major red flag. The standards of measurements are well known.

It all boils down to OPINIONS! Millions of dollars are spent based on OPINIONS! There are too many variables to do it any other way.

So is the system something that works? Are the best players playing in the Big Leagues? Are there some better players out there doing something else for a living? I suppose the answer to both those questions is YES!

I think I said that there was a lot more to it than a 140 character line, and I meant that in the most respectful of ways. Far too many people try to explain something as complicated as scouting in these little 2 sentence paragraphs that make it impossible to get the entire story across, and I think its why there’s so little understanding about how the system works.

quote:

I'm curious... Does this stuff really bother you or do you just enjoy debating it?

I think you will know it when you see an "obvious" lack of effort. And you will also know when something appears to look effortless for an outstanding athlete. The truth is there is no such thing as effortless.

What really bothers me is when people blow off opinions that differ from dogma just because they either can’t or won’t take the time to explain them fully. There’s way too many cliché’s and dogmatic phrases and stories in baseball, and while they can be entertaining, when someone really wants an in depth answer, where are they gonna get it?

You say the best players are playing in the big leagues, and I take issue with statements that concrete. There’s absolutely no way to know if every player in the big leagues was the best player playing at the time he was chosen to move up. Life doesn’t work that way. In every walk of life there are people who fall through the cracks. I get that, and I understand it. I just wish there were some way to take some of the subjectivity out of it, but so far as I know, very few people even tries, and when they do they’re denigrated.

Its like my friend say. When he was scouting, he did everything possible he could to find the best players in Ca, Or, and Nv, but he knew it was an impossible task. He knew there were players out there getting missed and accepted it, but he didn’t try to make himself believe they were all being found. ;

No harm in a little debate, is there?

"The truth is there is no such thing as effortless."

The good ones just make it look that way