2011 Colonial District Tournament

I thought Tucker and Deep Run were tied, and had split their two games. Are you saying Tucker holds the tie breaker on Deep Run? Or has Tucker just gotten ahead of DR in the standings?

Yes they did split but as of right now Tucker is 9-3 in district and Deep Run is 7-3, Deep Run has herm on friday, and maggie walker today.

Tucker has PH thursday and John Marshall on friday

so if districts start monday, and all these games get rained out, tucker has better win percentage

in those circumstances, where they can complete thei scheduled games, dont you think they would be consideed "tied" and play each other to determine who is which seed?

Some interesting stuff going on with this.
Does weather play a true factor in determining who would be the #2 vs. #3 seed?
Regardless, being an Innsbrook area guy, I am a bit confused how DR chose to not play games on Fri and Mon? Tucker played at Herm Fri and at Freeman last night with both games being completed without delays. All of these teams are not that far apart in location, Herm is literally right down the street from DR. How did they play Fri and Dr did not? How did Tucker/Freeman play last night and DR at home did not?
Are the rain Gods THAT controlling where these schools that are all in what, a 5-7 mile radius, have no rain while others get downpours?
Just wondering.....
Regardless, BBisLife is right-DR is 7-3 and Tucker 9-3 in District. I can't imagine it coming down to actual games played. Doesn't look like anyone is playing tonite based on the rain at Inns today.
Will a playoff decide?
Anyone with insight, please enlighten us all-thanks.

Did DR hve games scheduled Fri and Mon. that were postponned due to rain?

I believe that DR was scheduled to play Friday night and bumped a non district game scheuled for Monday to make up the game from friday's "rain out".

Another way to break the tie is to add total runs for and against when they played eachother.
Deep Run has a total of 9 in 2 games
Tucker has a total of 13 in 2 games.

Im pretty sure Tuckers win percentage will do enough to make them the 2 seed though.

Like said before, Tucker played the last two days as Deep Run said they didn't want to.

in a six team format being #2 and not #3 is huge!

#3 will play an extra game as #1 and #2 autoatically advance to semi finals.

3-6 play a first round game.

The total runs crossed my mind too, but a split is a split.
Still lost on DR not playing Fri. It seems like everyone in the District played that night except them.
Certainly understand how it can rain one place but not another, but twice in 4 days?
And in the same area?
Just kinda odd, but I can see why DR may want to duck JM too BBisLife!!
It should be a fun-filled couple weeks for all us baseball fans throughout the Commonwealth.
Its clear that several Districts/Regions will have the same concerns as discussed on here based off the weather. Its also clear that this isn't the first time this has ever happened, so I would imagine prior plans will come into play this season.
Best of luck to all squads out there!!

Well, the weather is royally messing things up. DR is likely to play a game Saturday if things progress as the forecast indicates currently.

quote:

Originally posted by Pirates45:
The total runs crossed my mind too, but a split is a split.
Still lost on DR not playing Fri. It seems like everyone in the District played that night except them.
Certainly understand how it can rain one place but not another, but twice in 4 days?
And in the same area?
Just kinda odd, but I can see why DR may want to duck JM too BBisLife!!
It should be a fun-filled couple weeks for all us baseball fans throughout the Commonwealth.
Its clear that several Districts/Regions will have the same concerns as discussed on here based off the weather. Its also clear that this isn't the first time this has ever happened, so I would imagine prior plans will come into play this season.
Best of luck to all squads out there!!

Does anyone know where the tiebreakers and such are listed? I couldn't find it for the life of me on the VHSL website.

I am sure that the DR players want to play. Unfortunately, they are not calling the shots over there. I would imagine that if they were, things would be a lot different.

Wahoos80, I'm not sure why you took yet another shot at the players being unhappy angle at DR in a thread discussing the weather cancelling games and the upcoming district tournament. Player unhappiness at DR has been discussed ad nauseam on here and I really don't think that's relevant to the current topic.

I don't think the VHSL decides the tiebreakers. I think they are specific to each district. For example, I read (from Central Region Tom) than the Capital, Colonial, and Central district all have a one game playoff for first place even if one of the two teams swept the other (example was last year when Atlee swept Lee-Davis but finished tied for first and L-D won a one game playoff). Conversely, the Dominion includes a provision where a season sweep is a tie breaker for first place.

This is all just meant to say that I don't think the VHSL site is going to be much help. I don't know if/where all the rules are written down. I would seriously doubt that any non-first place ties are decided by a playoff game, but who knows. My guess would be something like record vs. 1st place, then record vs. 2nd place, etc until one team has a better record. I'm not sure what they would do if the teams didn't play the same number of games.

Cman I am not sure why you are consistently pitting temas against eachother and consistently trashing players from other Colonial District teams that are not players on your son's team.

BTW- Don't you aready have a thread out there fretting about the weather??

If you really want to take personal shots at me and the threads out there I made, send me a PM or two. Other than that, I'd like to return this thread to the topic of district tournaments, the weather, and tiebreakers.

Sounds like Deep Run will be gunning hard to get those district games in no matter what. The city teams are usually gimmes, so you'd think they'd save pitching for that Hermitage game. Lord knows they have enough arms to cover all the innings and still save particular guys for one game.

I will say, if Tucker finishes # 2, wouldn't you make D.J. Engler the favorite for District POY?

Cman-not sure where the shot at the DR players being unhappy came from? Wahoos stated that "I'm sure the DR players want to play"
I would imagine that if it were raining buckets, the players would want to be out there.
Its the coach's and the Ad's that make these decisions, and as I threw out, not real sure what fueled this decision.
I don't think anyone on here has anything against any of the DR players, but I do think that several folks are under the impression they have underperformed, not due to their ability, but perhaps other factors, specifically coaching decisions. More than a handful of posters throughout this season have made this thought process clear.

man you westenders are sumthin else!

Let's all go over to Home Team Grill and have a beer and a group hug? Need directions you non westenders?

quote:

Originally posted by Midlo Dad:
I will say, if Tucker finishes # 2, wouldn't you make D.J. Engler the favorite for District POY?

If Godwon wins the district I would think they might a player or two to be considered for POY

quote:

Originally posted by BaseabllIsLife5:
Another way to break the tie is to add total runs for and against when they played eachother.
Deep Run has a total of 9 in 2 games
Tucker has a total of 13 in 2 games.

Im pretty sure Tuckers win percentage will do enough to make them the 2 seed though.

Like said before, Tucker played the last two days as Deep Run said they didn't want to.

Sorry this was just kind of funny to me. So youre trying to imply that Deep Run was avoiding playing a game against John Marshall? As if they didnt want to play? Really? While Tucker "wanted to play" two games on the road, where they had zero impact on the decision as to whether the game would be played or not. How can you imply that Deep Run chose to not play when the field is sitting under a puddle?

There will be a coin flip if both teams stay with 3 losses, and the winner of the flip will be 2nd place.

Also, the 3v6 winner will play the 2 seed Tucker/Deep Run and the 4v5 winner will play Godwin, not as stated above.

I also think that Engler should be in SERIOUS consideration for POY in the district. He has been impossible to get out all season, having a really outstanding year offensively, on the mound, defensively and on the base paths.

"I would imagine that if they were, things would be a lot different."

This is the quote I interpreted as a shot at player unhappiness. However, if I misinterpreted it, then my fault.

quote:

If Godwon wins the district I would think they might a player or two to be considered for POY

I agree they might be considered, too, but Godwin has a couple of guys who lead that team, so it's hard to settle on one. In contrast, to my observation Engler is the leader of that Tucker team. He's their top pitcher and their offensive spark, too. I think Godwin could survive the loss of any one player, but Tucker would not be where it is without the season D.J. has had.

The AD made the decision not to play on Friday/Monday for DR/JM. It also had to do with fact that the city schools have to pay for buses and they didn't want to make the drive if there was a chance the game was going to be cancelled. It was supposed to be at JM, but they had a problem with their field. DR's field was still too wet on Monday, so game was automatically rescheduled to Wed. The rain yesterday resulted in more water on the field. As of now, if all district games are played by the end of the week, #2 & #3 spots would be decided by coin flip. The ADs are meeting this week to figure out what to do if games aren't played by Sat.

anyone else here about deep run being down 10-0 in the 1st to john marshall?
despite the win that is very sad for them to say the least

and from what i understand john marshall has forfeited the last game against tucker.
Tucker is now 10-3 in district, and plays tonight at home for senior night against PH.

think that is a good argument for who is team MVP but what does that have to do with who had the best season in the Region?

Sounds like there were some great games tonight with huge tournament implications in the Colonial. The short version is that both Tucker and Deep Run won to remain tied for 2nd place.

However, the way both teams won is pretty amazing (disclaimer- this is all via RTD, so I will proceed cautiously hoping it is accurate). Patrick Henry took a 2-0 lead into the bottom of the 7th against Tucker. But Tucker got two runners on and Kyle Butler hit a walk off three run homer to send the Tiger faithful home with a smile.

Meanwhile, Hermitage and Deep Run engaged in a back and forth marathon with Deep Run finally prevailing on a walkoff hit by Skyler Stone in the 12th inning. Apparently Hermitage did tag Boyle for seven runs in seven innings.

So, at the end of a long strange season, I guess a coin flip will be huge to see who gets a bye in the tourney.

A day after DR gives up 10 in an inning to John Marshall and 11 for the game on the same night that Godwin beat Hermitage 15-0, Hermitage plays Deep Run and puts up 4 runs in the 1st and played 12 innings before losing by a run. I don't know what that says but it says something.

quote:

Originally posted by Midlo Dad:
I will say, if Tucker finishes # 2, wouldn't you make D.J. Engler the favorite for District POY?

if dr wins tonight against mwgs, tie with tucker. the tie-break, believe it or not is a coin toss saturday.

quote:

Originally posted by Pirates45:
Cman-not sure where the shot at the DR players being unhappy came from? Wahoos stated that "I'm sure the DR players want to play"
I would imagine that if it were raining buckets, the players would want to be out there.
Its the coach's and the Ad's that make these decisions, and as I threw out, not real sure what fueled this decision.
I don't think anyone on here has anything against any of the DR players, but I do think that several folks are under the impression they have underperformed, not due to their ability, but perhaps other factors, specifically coaching decisions. More than a handful of posters throughout this season have made this thought process clear.

thgere were 2 small pockets of HEAVY rain that hit DR fri and mon. for the jm game wed, the outfield was so wet the ball pretty much stopped dead when it hit. the outfielders could not keep their feet, so it had nothing to do with desire to play.

Again-if anything, it was stated the players did want to play. On numerous posts.
Regardless, its all over now and almost all games have been played.
No matter what happens with the coin flip, someone will be short-changed. All of these boys on both teams have put in a ton of hours to get to this point to have a 50/50 shot of either getting a bye, or likely throwing your #1 or 2 guy on Mon.

It seems like there should be a better tiebreak system in place. To have a coin toss potentially determine a teams chances in the Districts(few teams would have 3 starters, much less 3 that can shut down strong competition) in 4 days.
Both teams overall W-L records are tight and that could be a source of tiebreak, but then no one would be encouraged to play a tougher out of district games, much like college football.
Maybe they could do a runs for/runs against either head to head, or in District for the season?

Lots of potential other answers, but IMO, a coin flip is far from the best solution.

Coin flips are certainly not a great thing but having a playoff game is not great either. You burn pitchers. Runs scored could easily lead to one team trying to run up the score in games "just in case" its needed. If 2 teams have the same record and one team was swept then that could be a solution but if they split the coin flip my be the best of the worst case choices. just saying

quote:

Originally posted by Local8SS:
Coin flips are certainly not a great thing but having a playoff game is not great either. You burn pitchers. Runs scored could easily lead to one team trying to run up the score in games "just in case" its needed. If 2 teams have the same record and one team was swept then that could be a solution but if they split the coin flip my be the best of the worst case choices. just saying

Why not have 8 teams and no bye? If 2 are tied for 8th, there's a play-in.

[Why not have 8 teams and no bye? If 2 are tied for 8th, there's a play-in.[/QUOTE]

Use to be 4 teams then 8 teams now 6. If you have a play in game you again burn pitching. Number 2 what if the play in game gets rained out? What if it gets rained out twice? You are looking at backing up the regional and the state tournment and they can sometimes get backed up as it is....Good suggestions but there is not one perfect sugesstion.

If you ask me Tucker is well more deserving in many categories than Deep Run.

Tucker has a +4 run advantage in the two games they have played.

Tucker finished 11-3 in district and the best Deep Run can finish is 10-3

Tucker has played better lately.
Deep Run started off a little better, but it doesnt matter how you start its how you finish.

If you ask me, the tie breaker should be district win percentage, which Tucker has over DR.

If tied in that category it should be runs scored and runs against between the two teams.

It would be ridiculous if Deep Run gets it over Tucker, Tucker has played more games, and won more district games. and same amount of losses.

Winning percentage seems like a poor choice as the number of games played is not within the control of the team - and both teams are in compliance with district rules in that regard.

Agree that coin toss is hard to swallow.