Deleted. Personal attacks will not be tolerated. Baiting will not either.
So the AFLAC game was good to watch.
quote:Originally posted by Dtiger:
So the AFLAC game was good to watch.
Having said this.. anyone thought about a 5 game series? Featuring pitchers that get to be seen more then 1 inning?
just a thought..
I wouldn't be opposed to 3... but 5 seems a little much. It's the end of the season, arms are tired. The game is to showcase the best, 1 game does that... it showcases. I would like to see pitchers to get more time, but in a 5 game series there would be too much pressure to go a long distance... and as anyone saw, it aint easy to pitch against those stacked of line-ups.
Kinda like the 16U BCS finals huh!!!
Originally posted by Dtiger
Kinda like the BCS finals...
(Thats a little clearer)
quote:it aint easy to pitch against those stacked of line-ups.
Kinda like the BCS finals...
(Thats a little clearer)
Ya I was originally confused. The hardest thing for me at the 16U BCS finals wasn't the line-ups... it was throwing 3 times.
well I dont truly think throwing 1 inning showcases your skill at all. Heck, one bad inning or one really good inning could change a scouts perspective on you. I think all of those pitchers should have gotten 3-4 innings of work
On Baseball America website theres announcement
Robert Stock will be skipping his senior year
to enroll and play baseball at USC. His dad stated
he did not want his son to have to make a decision between the money of pro ball or going to college.
This way he'll have the best of both worlds in three short years.
Robert Stock will be skipping his senior year
to enroll and play baseball at USC. His dad stated
he did not want his son to have to make a decision between the money of pro ball or going to college.
This way he'll have the best of both worlds in three short years.
I have played against him when I was 14. 
and lets just say he is AMAZING
Clemente21....I think its great for a kid to go to school and get his education. HOWEVER; the father is an idiot. That kid will make bigtime money, SWAC pocket change 
, in the first round.
What happens if injury occurs? Then what? I know he has a college education. IMO...I would rather have 7 figures in the bank in case I got injured. There is no guarantee the kid will make it. The only one I know will make it plays CF for Duncanville!!
What could your son do with 7 figures if injury happens within those 3 short years? TAKE THE MONEY KID.
, in the first round.What happens if injury occurs? Then what? I know he has a college education. IMO...I would rather have 7 figures in the bank in case I got injured. There is no guarantee the kid will make it. The only one I know will make it plays CF for Duncanville!!
What could your son do with 7 figures if injury happens within those 3 short years? TAKE THE MONEY KID.
Money isn't always the primary motivation, Train. You know that much. 
quote:Originally posted by Train:
What could your son do with 7 figures if injury happens within those 3 short years? TAKE THE MONEY KID.
The kid could get an unlucky investment and lose it all. He could accidentally buy too much stuff than he can afford... and he wouldn't have an education to fall back on. I agree that Stock is a stud and he's going to get good money... but there are what ifs. Many MANY professional athletes have wasted away hundreds of millions of dollars. Perfect example: Mike Tyson. This may be the nerd in me, but give me a solid college education and a steady paying job any day over a 3 year minor league career where I make... lets say... 8 million total (probably generous)that I'm going to have to make last for my whole life. I'm sure most people say you should be able to do it, but what if a kid needs medical treatment, insurance, and without an education and understanding economics and business... it's almost like walking into a dark cloud. Not to mention, I'd go crazy if I had to do work and have it not be something I love. Baseball is something I would never consider work.
I totally agree with Dtiger, for once 
,
I think that WAY to often people are hyped up to be studs and then BAM inury right when they step into the minor leagues. With nothing to fall back on education wise, its really tough. That money you made will not last you as long as you think, unless you get a good money manager and dont go buy a 2 million dollar house and fancy cars like im sure many of people, including myself, would be in this situation. I understand its alot of money, but go play college ball, and if somehow you get hurt then, hey you got a good solid start in a higher education that can take you somewhere
,I think that WAY to often people are hyped up to be studs and then BAM inury right when they step into the minor leagues. With nothing to fall back on education wise, its really tough. That money you made will not last you as long as you think, unless you get a good money manager and dont go buy a 2 million dollar house and fancy cars like im sure many of people, including myself, would be in this situation. I understand its alot of money, but go play college ball, and if somehow you get hurt then, hey you got a good solid start in a higher education that can take you somewhere
Reminds me of something Dale Hansen said many years ago when Herschel Walker was trying to decide whether or not to stay at Georgia or come out early and play for the Generals of the USFL.
"If you don't comeout early and you turn down the millions, you better stay in school son and learn why you turned down the millons".
If I remember correctly, it was many millions!!
"If you don't comeout early and you turn down the millions, you better stay in school son and learn why you turned down the millons".
If I remember correctly, it was many millions!!
Why do so many succesful and RICH professional athletes return to college to try to get their degree? Because no matter how rich or "successful" they are the still have the label "non-graduate" or even worse "college drop out" attached to their name.
Yes I know there are plenty of successful people in and out of sports who do just fine as college drop outs (Michael Dell for one) but society as a whole still views a college degree as something worthwhile and in some ways a reflection of the character of the individual.
Money can buy alot of things but it can't buy respect. And multimillion dollar athletes probably don't like to be lumped in with hamburger flippers at least in regard to both being high school graduates with no further education.
Yes I know there are plenty of successful people in and out of sports who do just fine as college drop outs (Michael Dell for one) but society as a whole still views a college degree as something worthwhile and in some ways a reflection of the character of the individual.
Money can buy alot of things but it can't buy respect. And multimillion dollar athletes probably don't like to be lumped in with hamburger flippers at least in regard to both being high school graduates with no further education.
There is no doubt anyone could get bad financial advice, hit by a bus, etc. If reports are correct, close to 3M, out of HS ....TAKE THE MONEY.
You can always go back to school. What happens if he plays for USC and takes one off the eye socket and career's over? The 3M looks pretty good then doesn't it?
OP would you turn away 3M from HS?
You can always go back to school. What happens if he plays for USC and takes one off the eye socket and career's over? The 3M looks pretty good then doesn't it?
OP would you turn away 3M from HS?
My dad went out of highschool and played 5 years, i think he only made about $30,000 back in 81 but now he works and is successful without a college degree, but if I was able to make 3 million then I would take it... but thats just me.
I think we have to be realistic in a topic such as this. Without doing research, I'm guessing even if your a high draft pick (top 5 rounds), the odds are still against you. Going to college will help this kid develop his already unbelievable skills. His bat, arm, speed, strength will all improve which will help him later. And honestly, I think the people who are wondering why he isn't going in the draft out of HS, I'm wondering why he'd miss his senior year. Is that not suppose to be one of the best years of a kids life? Not to mention, with him on the hill... I'd be pretty confident about my HS team's chances.
let's see..... (doing the math) graduate college, enter the real world, get job lets say $50,000 per year (yeah right) in 20 years he has made 1 million dollars. And he could sign for 2 million out of High School. (no brainer)
Get 2 million signing bonus, put in bank (would take several) if baseball doesn't work out then OH THAT'S RIGHT HE WILL GET HIS COLLEGE PAID FOR IN FULL FROM THE CLUB THAT DRAFTS HIM! Looks like Daddy has it all figured out.
Get 2 million signing bonus, put in bank (would take several) if baseball doesn't work out then OH THAT'S RIGHT HE WILL GET HIS COLLEGE PAID FOR IN FULL FROM THE CLUB THAT DRAFTS HIM! Looks like Daddy has it all figured out.
Dtiger....your age is showing! I know you have grown from the shoulders up by being here since you get so many compliments on your post, and I think thats wonderful. But do you really understand what your saying here?
Life isn't a label of Non graduate or college dropout. Its based on success. You'd be amazed at the top 500 most wealthiest that do not have a degree.
Society views? who cares what society's view is. Its what you do with your life thats important. Its how you raise your kids. Its how you live your life. Its what you do when no one is watching. Its how you treat others. Its the impact you have within your small world that matters. Your character has nothing to do with college. Ever hear of a guy named Larry Lavin?
A college degree doesn't buy you respect either.
Dtiger, do you have any idea how much money you would get annually(thats every year) for life. If you were to put 2 million in the bank and just live off about 8% interest?
Is there a college degree that guarantees you 2 million in a bonus once you get your degree? or even $100,000. In pro ball you get Medical and health insurance and even a life insurance policy.
I'll bet you there are millions and millions of people with a college degree and they still DON"T understand economics and business.
Education doesn't guarantee you anything and it surely doesn't guarantee you respect!
Life isn't a label of Non graduate or college dropout. Its based on success. You'd be amazed at the top 500 most wealthiest that do not have a degree.
Society views? who cares what society's view is. Its what you do with your life thats important. Its how you raise your kids. Its how you live your life. Its what you do when no one is watching. Its how you treat others. Its the impact you have within your small world that matters. Your character has nothing to do with college. Ever hear of a guy named Larry Lavin?
A college degree doesn't buy you respect either.
Dtiger, do you have any idea how much money you would get annually(thats every year) for life. If you were to put 2 million in the bank and just live off about 8% interest?
Is there a college degree that guarantees you 2 million in a bonus once you get your degree? or even $100,000. In pro ball you get Medical and health insurance and even a life insurance policy.
I'll bet you there are millions and millions of people with a college degree and they still DON"T understand economics and business.
Education doesn't guarantee you anything and it surely doesn't guarantee you respect!
Do you have any idea how much is left of that $2 million when the IRS 
gets through?
{Yes, half of two mil still ain't too bad...}
{Yes, half of two mil still ain't too bad...}
Vance - Dtiger is not the one who stated the reasons why some athletes go back to get their college degree. I did.
And I was not saying that a kid should not sign right out of HS and go straight to pro ball. I was just giving the argument about maybe why Robert Stock did what he did. I have no opinion either way - I think that over the years it has been proven that there is more than one "best" route to take.
I do, however, think that it is interesting how many millionaire professional athletes express regret in interviews about not having a college degree or how many actually go back and work on getting one even though they have (or at least SHOULD have) millions in the bank. There IS a certain satisfaction obtained from getting a higher education.
In regard to a $2 million signing bonus I assure you that a 18 year old kid cannot live off that without gainful employment sometime during his life. By the time the IRS, his agent, plus the first few "toys" are bought that original $2 million will be well below 7 figures.
Not pocket change for sure but nothing to enable a 18 year old to retire either.
And I was not saying that a kid should not sign right out of HS and go straight to pro ball. I was just giving the argument about maybe why Robert Stock did what he did. I have no opinion either way - I think that over the years it has been proven that there is more than one "best" route to take.
I do, however, think that it is interesting how many millionaire professional athletes express regret in interviews about not having a college degree or how many actually go back and work on getting one even though they have (or at least SHOULD have) millions in the bank. There IS a certain satisfaction obtained from getting a higher education.
In regard to a $2 million signing bonus I assure you that a 18 year old kid cannot live off that without gainful employment sometime during his life. By the time the IRS, his agent, plus the first few "toys" are bought that original $2 million will be well below 7 figures.
Not pocket change for sure but nothing to enable a 18 year old to retire either.
Crawdad, I responded to Dtiger specifically. 2nd, what is wrong with you people? You make it seem like a college degree assures you of alot of money? Ever talk to a high school teacher or a high school coach? AND thats just one example?
and I'll assure you that there aren't many who go to college get a chance at saying "ok, 2 million or college, 2 million or college" you would be amazed at the NON BASEBALL PLAYERS who would TAKE that 2 million and run!
Crawdad, how long would you have to work to make 2 million. Forget the tax issue! everyone pays taxes on their wages! Its alot of money no matter how you slice it, stop pretending that its not!
and I'll assure you that there aren't many who go to college get a chance at saying "ok, 2 million or college, 2 million or college" you would be amazed at the NON BASEBALL PLAYERS who would TAKE that 2 million and run!
Crawdad, how long would you have to work to make 2 million. Forget the tax issue! everyone pays taxes on their wages! Its alot of money no matter how you slice it, stop pretending that its not!
I don't think it's my age showing, it's my... personal situation talking in me. Chances are I'm not going to be a first round draft pick. Chances are I wont be faced with going to college or taking 3 million dollars. I personally am going to use baseball to get into a a more challenging school than I may have been able to get into without it. Having said that, every counselor I've talked to says have plan B. Yes I know how much money someone can make with 2 million dollars sitting in the bank. I also know how much money someone can spend on a family, with a wife, 2 kids, their children's sports, their medical issues. A smart person (college degree or not) could most likely make 2 million dollars work for a lifetime, but for me... I guess I'm nerdy and want to be safe. Do you see my point? I don't disagree with anyone going to pro ball out of HS or leaving early. I agreed that Clayton Kershaw should've went being that high of a draft pick. I guess my point of view goes for some of the HS players that wont be number 1 picks. Plus, there's something said for being a kid... or a young adult. College is a great experience. As great as playing professional baseball???? That's another debate. I'll finish with saying this, what's meant to be will always find a way to happen. If I'm meant to play pro ball then somehow... I'll find a way. If I'm meant to go to college, get a degree, get a masters, become a lawyer... I'll do it. I don't think anyone can initially say right off the bat if someone is right or wrong for leaving school early. Of course, I guess that's why we have second guessing.
Vance, where did I say that getting a college degree would get you a lot of money? In fact I said the opposite - that a college degree gave you something that money could NOT buy - the satisfaction of getting and earning a higher education.
Everything is not dollars and cents - or at least it should not be. If you judge everything by how much money you have grossed over your lifetime than that is your business. I am just pointing out that SOME athletes go back to school to get their degree and it has vey little (if at all) to do with money.
Again, I am not taking a position either way. I was just giving a justification for going to school versus going pro right out of HS.
Relax.
Everything is not dollars and cents - or at least it should not be. If you judge everything by how much money you have grossed over your lifetime than that is your business. I am just pointing out that SOME athletes go back to school to get their degree and it has vey little (if at all) to do with money.
Again, I am not taking a position either way. I was just giving a justification for going to school versus going pro right out of HS.
Relax.
Vance34 I am with you 
We could buy DTIGER an ice cream cone with the spare change.
Its a no brainer.....even SWAC can figure that one out take it easy new buddy.
We could buy DTIGER an ice cream cone with the spare change.
Its a no brainer.....even SWAC can figure that one out
take it easy new buddy.quote:Originally posted by Train:
Vance34 I am with you
We could buy DTIGER an ice cream cone with the spare change.
Its a no brainer.....even SWAC can figure that one out
I for one thing that Stock did a very intelligent thing and very strategic. He is a very intelligent guy and so is his father. They have spent a lot of time figuring out what is best for Robert. The kid is just short of being a genius and wants to learn a little more before hitting the big leagues and maybe win a College World Series. Wow, what an option he had that many kids only dream of having. Our hat is off to Robert Stock, and best of luck for your Senior HS/Freshman College year. We will be watching for you on TV.
(Just taking the economics only)... I feel That anyone would be forced to take a bonus of around
$750,000 and up. Example... $750,000 bonus just being slightly creative with taxes you can come home with $500,000(probably more) Buy car,sibling or mom a car,few high end items,ect.. $400,000 now invested conservatively this will easily return 7%-8% per year that is 28K-32K per year return. that alone will nicely augment any salery, let alone pay for college. (Remember I am speaking of econmoics only, a college experience/degree is immesurable) Not to mention a small salery in the minors plus per diem,health,medical,life insurance ,and DO-NOT forget the pension! MLB pension is outragious.
$750,000 and up. Example... $750,000 bonus just being slightly creative with taxes you can come home with $500,000(probably more) Buy car,sibling or mom a car,few high end items,ect.. $400,000 now invested conservatively this will easily return 7%-8% per year that is 28K-32K per year return. that alone will nicely augment any salery, let alone pay for college. (Remember I am speaking of econmoics only, a college experience/degree is immesurable) Not to mention a small salery in the minors plus per diem,health,medical,life insurance ,and DO-NOT forget the pension! MLB pension is outragious.
A question I'd like to throw out there while talking about economics in baseball is, do you have to pay seperate taxes for each state you play a game in? I've heard this before but never anything definate.
All I got to say is.....................
If Gage Guthrie is offered 3 million dollars out of HS..............
He is taking it.
The theory behind the college experience over rides the money is absolutely crazy in my opinion.
If Gage Guthrie is offered 3 million dollars out of HS..............
He is taking it.
The theory behind the college experience over rides the money is absolutely crazy in my opinion.
Also wondering... any possibility Stock thinks the money is going to be greater in 3 years? Or is that stretching it?
quote:Originally posted by Dtiger:
Also wondering... any possibility Stock thinks the money is going to be greater in 3 years? Or is that stretching it?
That's like worrying if your GPA is 3.5 or 3.6.
quote:The theory behind the college experience over rides the money is absolutely crazy in my opinion.
Ken
Bet you won't go up to pro vs college and tell so of them that
Get it while the gettins good-Shep's motto
I think we should tap the brakes a bit on the $2-3M -- the kid is 16. Sandwich picks make like $1M, give or take a few hundred thousand, so unless he was to be in the top 5-10 picks, it probably wasn't going to be $3M. If the kid's catching skills are unrefined, playing at USC may raise his stock (no pun intended).
And the talk about the college degree is a bit premature as well. If he goes after 3 years, chances are he is still 1.5 - 2.5 years away from a diploma.
So, if we direct the discussion back to more "realistic" money.....is he "crazy" passing up $1M?
And the talk about the college degree is a bit premature as well. If he goes after 3 years, chances are he is still 1.5 - 2.5 years away from a diploma.
So, if we direct the discussion back to more "realistic" money.....is he "crazy" passing up $1M?
Yeah anyone but the ultra wealthy would be crazy to pass $1m. Just on social economics... If the kid is "projected" to be top 30 in next years class he will be financially rewarded as such almost anywhere he is drafted. High schoolers are typically paid more because they have leverage (college). look at the last few years drafts and see that some of the 3-5 rounders are getting IMO enough to tip the scales toward pro's...BTW i work with a kid (26) pitched for NC charlotte, 2 tommy johns later he wishes he signed out of H.S.
I hope one day to have such a choice to advise my son about. Right now the choices are which summer team to play for and which pitching coach or hitter coach to go with. ( Don't worry Catcher - we are staying put) We just hope he gets a chance to earn his Varsity letter some time in the next three years.
....But I do love to dream. Meat and I talk about the future,
first thing is when asked where he is going to college... the answer is "where they give me the most money"
the second thing is if he gets drafted out of HS the answer is that he will sign if the offer includes a promise to pay for 4 years of college if he doesn't make it to the big leagues....of coarse if he is a first or second rounder then it is "take the money & play ball".
JMHO
....But I do love to dream. Meat and I talk about the future,
first thing is when asked where he is going to college... the answer is "where they give me the most money"
the second thing is if he gets drafted out of HS the answer is that he will sign if the offer includes a promise to pay for 4 years of college if he doesn't make it to the big leagues....of coarse if he is a first or second rounder then it is "take the money & play ball".
JMHO
quote:Originally posted by MeatsDad:
first thing is when asked where he is going to college... the answer is "where they give me the most money" JMHO
Highly advise against this.
quote:Originally posted by Ken Guthrie:quote:Originally posted by MeatsDad:
first thing is when asked where he is going to college... the answer is "where they give me the most money" JMHO
Highly advise against this.
Totally understand your advise. I have been training him this way for several years just to make sure he knows the first high level goal is to get into college and that we have to consider all our options.
If Arkansas offers a 1/2 ride and South Carolina offers 1/2 ride then we look at who needs pitching more, the coach and the other talent on the team combined with what the final tuition will be....but if UT offers a 1/4 ride at the same time... he is Austin bound.
We know their are a lot more likely scenarios and we would be glad (very blessed) to have to choice between a UTA and DBU or a good JUCO program.
My wife reminds me all the time that this is all in God's hands and I remind her that I am just trying to be a good steward.
I will make my last comments about this situation. The kid is obviously very very talented and will go/should have gone HIGH in the draft. I wish him the best of luck.
Family has decided to remove him from that distraction? I still am confused about it and came up to this conclusion:
The family is hiding something about the kid. Something is going on here. Mark my words it will come out sooner or later. There is no way any kid/family would pass the opportunity to grab 1-2M for their kid out of HS. The risk is too great for injury and not receiving any money at all if he waits.
I know some of you are saying "THE TRAIN" again but come on common sense here folks....we all want whats best for our kids and putting 1-2M in their bank account after HS would get them started. Tell me one kid it would hurt??
IMHO...there is something more here that someone is hiding.
Family has decided to remove him from that distraction? I still am confused about it and came up to this conclusion:
The family is hiding something about the kid. Something is going on here. Mark my words it will come out sooner or later. There is no way any kid/family would pass the opportunity to grab 1-2M for their kid out of HS. The risk is too great for injury and not receiving any money at all if he waits.
I know some of you are saying "THE TRAIN" again but come on common sense here folks....we all want whats best for our kids and putting 1-2M in their bank account after HS would get them started. Tell me one kid it would hurt??
IMHO...there is something more here that someone is hiding.