what is it?How does this effect lifelong minor league players.
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An average minor league player in A ball makes $1000/month, AA, $1600.00, AAA, 2300, and when a player becomes a free agent after 6 years he is able to negotiate and can make some decent money in AAA, avg. 7 to 12 thousand a month, for the season, which is only 5 months.
quote:Originally posted by bballdad17:
An average minor league player in A ball makes $1000/month, AA, $1600.00, AAA, 2300, and when a player becomes a free agent after 6 years he is able to negotiate and can make some decent money in AAA, avg. 7 to 12 thousand a month, for the season, which is only 5 months.
R u saying they only get paid for the 5 months of the year? so 2300 x 5 months = 11,500
Thanks
That is what I am saying, 5 months. Just about poverty, and they don't pay for your living expenses either.
The minor league salary range is as follows:
>>Rookie, short season low A, low A, and high A) --- $1,100 per month
>>AA -- $1,500 per month
>>AAA -- $2,100 per month
I believe that there are adjustments depending on the length of service and where the player begins the season. However, I am not clear as to exactly what those are. Perhaps 'bbscout' can fill us in.
The salaries are paid during regular season only ... April (or mid-June for first year players) through early September and pro rated if the team advances to play-offs so that the players continue to be paid as long as their team is playing. Granted the player's living expenses are not covered, but the players receive a per diem when they travel and their hotel cost is covered.
During the summer, my son and his wife shared a 6 bedroom house with 7 other players, a couple of whom were married as well. Their living expenses were minimal at that point.
Spring training costs for living are covered, depending upon the arrangements. For my son's team, the players who were not married and who had not been with the team for a long period of time, were required to live in a hotel with other teammates, which was paid for by the team. They received $25 per diem for meals etc. If a player was married or was at the AAA level, or had been with the team for several years, they were not required to live in the team hotel. They received $40 per diem for housing and food allowances. Depending on where the players live, they can rent a decent apartment for about $500 a month and if they are splitting the cost with another player, are relatively "comfortable" during spring training. Also, some teams provide morning meals for the players.
Every player that we know who did not receive a hefty signing bonus works during the off season. Some people think this is ridiculous, but you know what "they" say ... some of these boys would pay to have this opportunity, they go into it (for the most part) with eyes wide open and learn to make the necessry adjustments.
We have had many many discussions on this board in the "Draft" forum and in the "Going Pro" forum that discussed this very concern. Some of our posters have a hard time with it, feeling as tho the players are being taken advantage of by MLB. That may be so, but again, that is their choice and if they want to make it to the Bigs, they have to live with the system as it is ... unless someone succeeds in changing it somewhere down the line. There are a lot of adjustments to make and learning to live without the assistance of Mom and Dad all the time ... well, that is just part of growing up.
>>Rookie, short season low A, low A, and high A) --- $1,100 per month
>>AA -- $1,500 per month
>>AAA -- $2,100 per month
I believe that there are adjustments depending on the length of service and where the player begins the season. However, I am not clear as to exactly what those are. Perhaps 'bbscout' can fill us in.
The salaries are paid during regular season only ... April (or mid-June for first year players) through early September and pro rated if the team advances to play-offs so that the players continue to be paid as long as their team is playing. Granted the player's living expenses are not covered, but the players receive a per diem when they travel and their hotel cost is covered.
During the summer, my son and his wife shared a 6 bedroom house with 7 other players, a couple of whom were married as well. Their living expenses were minimal at that point.
Spring training costs for living are covered, depending upon the arrangements. For my son's team, the players who were not married and who had not been with the team for a long period of time, were required to live in a hotel with other teammates, which was paid for by the team. They received $25 per diem for meals etc. If a player was married or was at the AAA level, or had been with the team for several years, they were not required to live in the team hotel. They received $40 per diem for housing and food allowances. Depending on where the players live, they can rent a decent apartment for about $500 a month and if they are splitting the cost with another player, are relatively "comfortable" during spring training. Also, some teams provide morning meals for the players.
Every player that we know who did not receive a hefty signing bonus works during the off season. Some people think this is ridiculous, but you know what "they" say ... some of these boys would pay to have this opportunity, they go into it (for the most part) with eyes wide open and learn to make the necessry adjustments.
We have had many many discussions on this board in the "Draft" forum and in the "Going Pro" forum that discussed this very concern. Some of our posters have a hard time with it, feeling as tho the players are being taken advantage of by MLB. That may be so, but again, that is their choice and if they want to make it to the Bigs, they have to live with the system as it is ... unless someone succeeds in changing it somewhere down the line. There are a lot of adjustments to make and learning to live without the assistance of Mom and Dad all the time ... well, that is just part of growing up.
I've discussed this topic before and haven't changed my opinion of the attitude that is displayed by the MLB. Talk about lack of respect for themselves, their fans, and their players.
This type of attitude is borne out of the fact that the MLB suffers from a lack of competition, so they can afford to be cavalierous and assume a take-it-or-leave-it posture.
It is unprincipled, which means amoral. Men without a conscience.
Making the Federal Government pay the cost of their players so they these young men can't hold their heads up high with pride that they belong to organizations that show a sense of responsibility for taking care of their people...it's shameful.
Then the one that frost me the most is using the motivation and desire of a young man to aspire to play in the Majors as a wedge to keep him and his wife in poverty while having young married couples living off of food stamps and assistance.
It's worse than a "Welfare Queen" living in the heart of the Biyou having babies...cause the MLB knows what they are doing is wrong.
If your son doesn't sign for multi-millions of dollars to offset the poor remuneration in the Minor Leagues...plan on supporting him for a long time.
This type of attitude is borne out of the fact that the MLB suffers from a lack of competition, so they can afford to be cavalierous and assume a take-it-or-leave-it posture.
It is unprincipled, which means amoral. Men without a conscience.
Making the Federal Government pay the cost of their players so they these young men can't hold their heads up high with pride that they belong to organizations that show a sense of responsibility for taking care of their people...it's shameful.
Then the one that frost me the most is using the motivation and desire of a young man to aspire to play in the Majors as a wedge to keep him and his wife in poverty while having young married couples living off of food stamps and assistance.
It's worse than a "Welfare Queen" living in the heart of the Biyou having babies...cause the MLB knows what they are doing is wrong.
If your son doesn't sign for multi-millions of dollars to offset the poor remuneration in the Minor Leagues...plan on supporting him for a long time.
quote:Every player that we know who did not receive a hefty signing bonus works during the off season. Some people think this is ridiculous, but you know what "they" say ... some of these boys would pay to have this opportunity, they go into it (for the most part) with eyes wide open and learn to make the necessry adjustments.
FBM... Thanks for sharing your son's experience. "Where there's a will, there's a way!"
Mine son has often said that the game is more important than the $$$'s. Now, he's coming from a teenage perspective, where we are still supporting him. But, I agree with him...It's about his passion & how far his talent will take him.
He's very resourceful & I feel certain that if "things happen", he'll find a way to make it.
He understands that the first few years would be likened to an apprenticeship.
Always a controntational and revealing(eye-opening) subject.
Our son certainly did not sign for "multi-millions" when he was drafted out of high school. He did manage to use his wits(combined with advice from those already there) throughout his days in the minors to find ways to make his salary stretch the furthest.
Sort of reminded me of the early days that I experienced when I first left the nest(parent's home) to be on my own. Only difference was that the son actually had a regular paycheck for at least part of the time each year as well as a little supplemental income from card and glove endorsements. A good agent is a big asset to minor league players.
Also, he had off-season jobs every year and after the first season lived away from home even during the off-seasons- guess he liked that taste of total freedom from parental over-sight(or perhaps he now saw his parents as the fuddy-duddies that they were rumored to be).
Minor league life helps young men to grow up and see the real world without "Mommy and Daddy" while they get paid to improve their game, see a lot of the country that they probably would never have seen, make life-long friendships and build toward the opportunity to make a very good income when (and if) they manage to make it to the major leagues.
Good luck to all of those who are making this journey.... I am proud for each and every one!
OPP
Our son certainly did not sign for "multi-millions" when he was drafted out of high school. He did manage to use his wits(combined with advice from those already there) throughout his days in the minors to find ways to make his salary stretch the furthest.
Sort of reminded me of the early days that I experienced when I first left the nest(parent's home) to be on my own. Only difference was that the son actually had a regular paycheck for at least part of the time each year as well as a little supplemental income from card and glove endorsements. A good agent is a big asset to minor league players.
Also, he had off-season jobs every year and after the first season lived away from home even during the off-seasons- guess he liked that taste of total freedom from parental over-sight(or perhaps he now saw his parents as the fuddy-duddies that they were rumored to be).
Minor league life helps young men to grow up and see the real world without "Mommy and Daddy" while they get paid to improve their game, see a lot of the country that they probably would never have seen, make life-long friendships and build toward the opportunity to make a very good income when (and if) they manage to make it to the major leagues.
Good luck to all of those who are making this journey.... I am proud for each and every one!
OPP
Before I read any of the posts I thought how I felt about the minor league salary with a son in the minors. I am right there with FBM. My son is able to continue to chase his dream and he’s getting paid to do it. I don’t think any minor leaguer looks at where he is and thinks he’s made it. I think he looks at it as being on the right track. My son was a 6th rounder which gave him enough money to buy himself a new vehicle and has enough money to use as a cushion to continue to play for a number of years. If he falls short of the big leagues it will be something other than money that stops him. I can’t believe I’m saying this but I’m glad my son is not being paid 100K a year to play minor league ball. At this point in his career he needs to focus on baseball.
I have a very good friend whose son graduated from college two years ago. The young man said he wanted to do two things before he had to settle down and face the real world. He wanted to work on a fishing boat in the Florida Keys and then work at a ski resort in Colorado. He’s in his second year of working on a fishing boat out of Islamorada, Florida in the southern Keys and having a large time. My son is also having a large time but he has a new vehicle, money in the bank, and he doesn’t have to cut bait.
Fungo
I have a very good friend whose son graduated from college two years ago. The young man said he wanted to do two things before he had to settle down and face the real world. He wanted to work on a fishing boat in the Florida Keys and then work at a ski resort in Colorado. He’s in his second year of working on a fishing boat out of Islamorada, Florida in the southern Keys and having a large time. My son is also having a large time but he has a new vehicle, money in the bank, and he doesn’t have to cut bait.
Fungo
Well Fungo it's very nice of you to let the MLB know that you're happy that they won't ever have to worry about paying your son 100k/yr.
Have a friend whose son graduated from Chico State with a degree in Construction Management.
His first job...$65,000/yr, plus car and expense account, medical insurance and stock options...well over $100k package...and he's mature enough to handle the responsibility of his position as a construction manager.
So let me see if I understand your position, you are saying that your son, after all his dedication, commitment, and countless hours of hard work is not worth $100k package and it's good for him to struggle in poverty.
It is obvious the MLB and some parents think that playing baseball shouldn't be treated just like any other profession, and the time and effort it takes just to be considered good enough to get drafted shouldn't be considered as an equivalency degree in sports entertainment as a professional entertainer in baseball.
Once again the only reason baseball doesn't pay the going rate for the talent commensurate with other professions that require 8 to 12 years of experience and education, like it does for a doctor or lawyer, is because the MLB has no competition. If they had competition from another pro source you would see a complete difference in their approach to their hiring practices.
I'm a capitalist, not a socialist, I'm not against young men making a decent income after they have "earned" the right to be drafted. I think ballplayers as a group are underpaid across the board.
Baseball is moving toward a more socialist model and I think it will keep players underpaid. Ballplayers need to earn a decent income at the younger ages so they can start building a nestegg for themselves. Especially since so many of them get injured and cannot compete anymore.
Only socialist don't worry about building assets for themselves based upon their earnings potential because of the grand schemes of government programs. The only thing that those produce is poverty. I hope baseball will reevaluate their approach to compensation and start treating ballplayers as professionals, not "objects of doing business".
Just a difference in philosophy.
JMO
Have a friend whose son graduated from Chico State with a degree in Construction Management.
His first job...$65,000/yr, plus car and expense account, medical insurance and stock options...well over $100k package...and he's mature enough to handle the responsibility of his position as a construction manager.
So let me see if I understand your position, you are saying that your son, after all his dedication, commitment, and countless hours of hard work is not worth $100k package and it's good for him to struggle in poverty.
It is obvious the MLB and some parents think that playing baseball shouldn't be treated just like any other profession, and the time and effort it takes just to be considered good enough to get drafted shouldn't be considered as an equivalency degree in sports entertainment as a professional entertainer in baseball.
Once again the only reason baseball doesn't pay the going rate for the talent commensurate with other professions that require 8 to 12 years of experience and education, like it does for a doctor or lawyer, is because the MLB has no competition. If they had competition from another pro source you would see a complete difference in their approach to their hiring practices.
I'm a capitalist, not a socialist, I'm not against young men making a decent income after they have "earned" the right to be drafted. I think ballplayers as a group are underpaid across the board.
Baseball is moving toward a more socialist model and I think it will keep players underpaid. Ballplayers need to earn a decent income at the younger ages so they can start building a nestegg for themselves. Especially since so many of them get injured and cannot compete anymore.
Only socialist don't worry about building assets for themselves based upon their earnings potential because of the grand schemes of government programs. The only thing that those produce is poverty. I hope baseball will reevaluate their approach to compensation and start treating ballplayers as professionals, not "objects of doing business".
Just a difference in philosophy.
JMO
quote:Then the one that frost me the most is using the motivation and desire of a young man to aspire to play in the Majors as a wedge to keep him and his wife in poverty while having young married couples living off of food stamps and assistance.
...
If your son doesn't sign for multi-millions of dollars to offset the poor remuneration in the Minor Leagues...plan on supporting him for a long time.
Ramrod ...
As you have stated many times, you find this approach distasteful and you are again making broad brush statements that may be true in some respects but far from the truth as we see it, as our son sees it, etc. We know quite a few professional players personally, and our son knows a whole lot more. Few if any of them are being supported by their parents, NONE of them are living on food stamps and government assistance, and MOST of them were not signed in the high bonus rounds ... many were 15th round or later. You are making extreme statements again as tho you speak the truth for all minor league players and you do not. Your distaste for the way this is handled by MLB is very apparent but I wonder if you would discourage your own son from pursuing a dream and playing professionally ... taking the "knocks" along the way ... because of your views. All the players that we know have gone in with their eyes open ... they have known enough other minor leaguers to have the information they need to make an informed decision. They have made decisions to "intern" (if you will) in professional baseball and are doing what they can to progress to the next level.
Our son is working part time and working out the rest of the time ... which he obviously does NOT get paid to do ... because he knows that this is what he needs to do to succeed ... much like doing extra research at school to gain more knowledge and expertise. He is newly married (11 months) and his wife supports him ... emotionally ... 100%. (The life for her is much harder than for him because of the relocations, but she does not regret her decision to marry a "baseball intern".) They are not living in poverty at all and we are in a very "high rent district" here in Orange County. It takes planning and some sacrifice, but for our son to reach his dream, he feels it is all worth it.
As the parent of a dedicated minor league "intern", I wish the broad statements with extreme generalizations were not being made about this subject. You have never given us any specific examples of players you know who are living in the "horrific" situations you describe so I personally would appreciate your not being so extreme. Quite a few of us have witnessed, are witnessing, and/or have lived the life and do not find the situation as you keep describing it.
As far as your interpretation of Fungo's statement ... "I can’t believe I’m saying this but I’m glad my son is not being paid 100K a year to play minor league ball. At this point in his career he needs to focus on baseball." Fungo did NOT say his son was struggling in poverty or that he thinks his son is not worth the money ... what I read is that he feels the value of the hard work and focus necessary at this point is more beneficial than having a lot of money to spend that could easily be a distraction. (Fungo ... let me know if I am wrong on that interpretation
)So again I ask that you not speak for our sons or for us parents ... we definitely do NOT see this as you do and we are living it and watching our sons live it.
Besides the personal barbs back and forth this is an interesting subject for those of us with kids in school and with the dream of playing professional ball.
Thanks for the information!
Thanks for the information!
you're waaay off track, againquote:by RR: It is obvious the MLB and some parents think that playing baseball shouldn't be treated just like any other profession
RR, "entry level" jobs in any profession are exactly that, entry level
as such, entry level jobs are not intended to set people up for life, allow a house in the suburbs with 2 cars a HD plasma TV & a dog, nor guarantee them a nest-egg
your friend from Chico State? - poor analogy -
if he was "entry level" he'd be an intern making a low wage or NO WAGE
.
Way to go FBM & Bee!!
Ramrod...Appropriate moniker btw...Your comments have nothing to do with the original question...
I appreciate the responses from OPP, FBM, Bee, bbscout who have experience, so my son can make an informed decision.
Ramrod...Appropriate moniker btw...Your comments have nothing to do with the original question...
I appreciate the responses from OPP, FBM, Bee, bbscout who have experience, so my son can make an informed decision.
Ramrod,
Perhaps if you understood both Macro and Micro Economics you wouldnt feel the same way.
Actually - if MLB were to provide even more money to the minor league salary structure as you suggest - you would in fact be moving toward a more Socialist model.
Market forces will continue to determine minor league salary structure. Like it or not.
Perhaps if you understood both Macro and Micro Economics you wouldnt feel the same way.
Actually - if MLB were to provide even more money to the minor league salary structure as you suggest - you would in fact be moving toward a more Socialist model.
Market forces will continue to determine minor league salary structure. Like it or not.
ramrod,
This is a free country. Every player has the right to turn down the offer to play professional baseball and go build a nest egg.
I too, think minor leaguers should make more money, but I understand the system. There is risk involved in everything. Major League clubs want Major League players. Those underpaid in the minors sometimes end up with a real BIG nest egg. But that's if they accomplish what their employer hired them for (be a MLB player).
Players are hired to make the Big Leagues except with some organizational types. How much value does the Big League Club get out of the player who never gets past A ball?
Your example of the Chico State grad can not be compared. I would bet the company that hired him is fairly certain he will contribute to their business profiting much sooner than 5 years.
Everyone always has a choice as to what they do for a career. There is a great big carrot dangling out there in front of minor league players. Many are willing to take the risk, for the chance to reach the top. Maybe even the Chico State grad if he was a good enough baseball player.
This is a free country. Every player has the right to turn down the offer to play professional baseball and go build a nest egg.
I too, think minor leaguers should make more money, but I understand the system. There is risk involved in everything. Major League clubs want Major League players. Those underpaid in the minors sometimes end up with a real BIG nest egg. But that's if they accomplish what their employer hired them for (be a MLB player).
Players are hired to make the Big Leagues except with some organizational types. How much value does the Big League Club get out of the player who never gets past A ball?
Your example of the Chico State grad can not be compared. I would bet the company that hired him is fairly certain he will contribute to their business profiting much sooner than 5 years.
Everyone always has a choice as to what they do for a career. There is a great big carrot dangling out there in front of minor league players. Many are willing to take the risk, for the chance to reach the top. Maybe even the Chico State grad if he was a good enough baseball player.
Ramrod,
How does ankle taste? I know you've got your foot stuck down your throat at least that far!
In case you have not noticed, there are a LOT of highly drafted players who get a very large amount of $ just to sign to start play in the minors who do not ever reach the point of being major league contributors.
It would seem obvious that throwing more $ toward players(even those identified as VERY GOOD alread, based on being high draft picks) is not a guarantee that they will be worth the investment.
Flame on!
OPP
How does ankle taste? I know you've got your foot stuck down your throat at least that far!
In case you have not noticed, there are a LOT of highly drafted players who get a very large amount of $ just to sign to start play in the minors who do not ever reach the point of being major league contributors.
It would seem obvious that throwing more $ toward players(even those identified as VERY GOOD alread, based on being high draft picks) is not a guarantee that they will be worth the investment.
Flame on!
OPP
quote:Once again the only reason baseball doesn't pay the going rate for the talent commensurate with other professions that require 8 to 12 years of experience and education, like it does for a doctor or lawyer, is because the MLB has no competition.
RR, one of the utter failures in your analysis is the inability to recognize the horrendous amounts of debt incurred while pursuing those stated professions. A doctor or a lawyer will have upwards of $100,000 or more in debt/loans incurred for tuition, etc before they even start in their profession. Residents in medicine are known to work unbelieveably long hours for relatively little pay, in order to develop their expertise.
I can assure you that not every lawyer walks into a $100,000 job out of law school. In fact most don't but they still have the debt. For the lawyers that do walk into the $100,000 job, they are expected to bill upwards of 300 hours per month and to perform at the very highest level. If they do not perform, both billing and quality of work, they are quite quickly shown the door and another found to replace them.
Whether you like it or not, the quality of life of a minor league player is not measured in money. Would I like mine to earn more?
In the meantime, while he is getting this opportunity, I don't have any complaints and will stand behind him every step of the way and provide the support necessary. It may have some unfairness about it, but so do many parts of life.
futurebackmom | NoviceDad | Bee> | baseballmom | OPP
I know that all here want to be good troopers and go along to get along...that's understandable especially if you have your son in one of these organizations. God knows the peer pressure from parents and the orthodoxy prevents any dissent.
I don't worry about that sort of thing, why, because I found over my life that nothing changes when you're silent and operate out of fear.
I just disagree with the orthodoxy of the way baseball is run now. I think it is way to slanted financially to benefit the owners at the expense of the players.
I would agree with your motives to go along with the program as is if the the "risk" associated with achieving the "dream" wasn't been borne completely by these young men.
Tell me what risk the owners have? They amortize their operating cost and losses as "depreciated asset" and pass it on to all of us tax payers...give me a break. But I don't have a problem with it, as that's the way we run business in this country.
But don't tell me they aren't underpaying these young men. Believe me these young men may be interns out of HS but they are well beyond interns coming out of colleges, and by the time they get to the minor leagues.
It's beyond me why anyone can't understand macro economics and the effects of what a monopoly or oligarchal practices does to distort market values, and secondly, micro economics of a command structure like that of baseball.
I would not want your son to be less compensated then what fair market would bring if the economic structure of baseball had less collusiveness and more open competition where the player "really" had more control over his future.
As for my son, I hope he plays as long as he enjoys the game whether he plays in a more formal setting or not. But the truth of what our sons go through to play this game deserves a lot more respect for their efforts IMO.
I know that all here want to be good troopers and go along to get along...that's understandable especially if you have your son in one of these organizations. God knows the peer pressure from parents and the orthodoxy prevents any dissent.
I don't worry about that sort of thing, why, because I found over my life that nothing changes when you're silent and operate out of fear.
I just disagree with the orthodoxy of the way baseball is run now. I think it is way to slanted financially to benefit the owners at the expense of the players.
I would agree with your motives to go along with the program as is if the the "risk" associated with achieving the "dream" wasn't been borne completely by these young men.
Tell me what risk the owners have? They amortize their operating cost and losses as "depreciated asset" and pass it on to all of us tax payers...give me a break. But I don't have a problem with it, as that's the way we run business in this country.
But don't tell me they aren't underpaying these young men. Believe me these young men may be interns out of HS but they are well beyond interns coming out of colleges, and by the time they get to the minor leagues.
It's beyond me why anyone can't understand macro economics and the effects of what a monopoly or oligarchal practices does to distort market values, and secondly, micro economics of a command structure like that of baseball.
I would not want your son to be less compensated then what fair market would bring if the economic structure of baseball had less collusiveness and more open competition where the player "really" had more control over his future.
As for my son, I hope he plays as long as he enjoys the game whether he plays in a more formal setting or not. But the truth of what our sons go through to play this game deserves a lot more respect for their efforts IMO.
Ramrod,
Did you ever work for a professional sports organization in an executive capacity?
Were you ever responsible to its shareholders and employees?
Do you have any practical knowledge whatsoever concerning the subjects at hand.?
My educated guesses (thats debateable I am sure - LOL) are as follows.
No - No and No.
As for understanding macro and micro economics - it is very obvious to me that you have no understanding whatsoever. None.
You are embarassing yourself - just some friendly advice.
Did you ever work for a professional sports organization in an executive capacity?
Were you ever responsible to its shareholders and employees?
Do you have any practical knowledge whatsoever concerning the subjects at hand.?
My educated guesses (thats debateable I am sure - LOL) are as follows.
No - No and No.
As for understanding macro and micro economics - it is very obvious to me that you have no understanding whatsoever. None.
You are embarassing yourself - just some friendly advice.
-RAMROD
When you carry the cross do you walk barefoot or do you wear shoes? I am just curious
When you carry the cross do you walk barefoot or do you wear shoes? I am just curious
RR,
Tsk,tsk,tsk....
How many of these baseball players coming out of college have been majoring in BASEBALL???
I am probably ignorant of just exactly which college gives scholarships so that their baseball team members can get degrees in BASEBALL.
Amost all career fields have entry levels that are lower than the ultimate, potential salary...which is only achieved by displaying superior ability.
Until someone decides to pay a player(whatever amount), the player is just "playing"- no matter how much you may espouse "...what our sons go through to PLAY this game deserves a lot more respect for their efforts IMO."
You may be just a little concerned that your son may be out playing minor league ball for a lot less $ after you pay for at least part of his college education than your wildest imagination wants to see. This is what has become of your son's education and your $? This would be a legitimate concern, but hey, at some point little Johnny will be off living his own life in spite of what a parent will desire.
OPP
Tsk,tsk,tsk....
How many of these baseball players coming out of college have been majoring in BASEBALL???
I am probably ignorant of just exactly which college gives scholarships so that their baseball team members can get degrees in BASEBALL.
Amost all career fields have entry levels that are lower than the ultimate, potential salary...which is only achieved by displaying superior ability.
Until someone decides to pay a player(whatever amount), the player is just "playing"- no matter how much you may espouse "...what our sons go through to PLAY this game deserves a lot more respect for their efforts IMO."
You may be just a little concerned that your son may be out playing minor league ball for a lot less $ after you pay for at least part of his college education than your wildest imagination wants to see. This is what has become of your son's education and your $? This would be a legitimate concern, but hey, at some point little Johnny will be off living his own life in spite of what a parent will desire.
OPP
itsinthegame | TR
Slinging "S" again.
Deal with the issue, see if you string some cogent thoughts together...it might serve to enhance the discussion IMO.
Slinging "S" again.
Deal with the issue, see if you string some cogent thoughts together...it might serve to enhance the discussion IMO.
RR,
Lame response IMO.
Answer the questions.
And please - debate my contention that a move towards higher salaries - immediately as you contend - in the minor leagues is not a move consistent with socialist economic policy.
Give it a shot. LOL
P.S. You WILL lose. And then we can further discuss the concept of cogency - without all the fancy words. LOL
Lame response IMO.
Answer the questions.
And please - debate my contention that a move towards higher salaries - immediately as you contend - in the minor leagues is not a move consistent with socialist economic policy.
Give it a shot. LOL
P.S. You WILL lose.
And then we can further discuss the concept of cogency - without all the fancy words. LOL
RR
Lets go to the videotape.
Cogency - basically means "persuasive relevance".
I submit that based on the responses so far - Ramrod is not persuasive. At all.
As for relevance - the results are even worse.
So much for cogency.
Try again.
LOL
Lets go to the videotape.
Cogency - basically means "persuasive relevance".
I submit that based on the responses so far - Ramrod is not persuasive. At all.
As for relevance - the results are even worse.
So much for cogency.
Try again.
LOL
Ramrod,
Agree with you 100%.
MLB rips off minor leaguers BIG TIME. What they "sell" is that DREAM IN EVERY MOMMY AND DADDY'S EYES AND SONNY'S EYES OF MAKING IT TO THE SHOW!!!! We all fall for it. It's hypnotic.
Play for 3 months and then try to get a "decent" job while you are hoping to get ready for inx league and then spring training.
Impossible to do without mom and dad helping pay the bills.
Don't listen to anyone. You can't live civilly on $1000.00 per month GROSS, likely $750-800 net just out of high school or college. No bonus...equals you starve without mom or dad's help.
I've said this since I've been a webster. Let baseball open its books to me and a couple of accountants; and, WALLA, every team will be making money!!!!!
Doesn't make sense to be paying the guys $15 million a year when $1 million of that could help all of the players in the minors of a single organization!!!! Imagine, they would be able to eat, too.
Agree with you 100%.
MLB rips off minor leaguers BIG TIME. What they "sell" is that DREAM IN EVERY MOMMY AND DADDY'S EYES AND SONNY'S EYES OF MAKING IT TO THE SHOW!!!! We all fall for it. It's hypnotic.
Play for 3 months and then try to get a "decent" job while you are hoping to get ready for inx league and then spring training.
Impossible to do without mom and dad helping pay the bills.
Don't listen to anyone. You can't live civilly on $1000.00 per month GROSS, likely $750-800 net just out of high school or college. No bonus...equals you starve without mom or dad's help.
I've said this since I've been a webster. Let baseball open its books to me and a couple of accountants; and, WALLA, every team will be making money!!!!!
Doesn't make sense to be paying the guys $15 million a year when $1 million of that could help all of the players in the minors of a single organization!!!! Imagine, they would be able to eat, too.
Beenthere,
I was going to send you a couple hot dogs (from Shea Stadium) and a Coke for Christmas.
Now cancelled.
I was going to send you a couple hot dogs (from Shea Stadium) and a Coke for Christmas.
Now cancelled.
quote:Originally posted by BeenthereIL:
I've said this since I've been a webster. Let baseball open its books to me and a couple of accountants; and, WALLA, every team will be making money!!!!!
Beenthere,
Seriously, I think you would be shocked at what you find.
The majority - not just in baseball - are major dog losers.
Just trophy stuff for the owners - who are billionaires or large corporations prior to purchase.
Without network money. Bye bye.
Example - at The height of NY Knicks and Rangers frenzy in mid-late 90's - in arguably one of the major medias centers of the world (NY City) - they were dog losers money wise.
Flat out dog losers - even with the network money.
You would be shocked at how bad the numbers are.
What a great thread! It's amazing how RR can articulate his opinion (and he only claimed it as his own) so well only to be decended upon like an intruder in a hen house. It's one thing to present a contrary view, but quite another to assail one's character and credibility. Sorry folks, those of you who did that resemble your own remarks. Cluck cluck cluck...
itsinthegame:
Didn't our experience at Abu Grahaib teach you anything?...now lay down those jumper cables before someone else takes another snapshot!
quote:Seriously, I think you would be shocked...
You would be shocked...
Didn't our experience at Abu Grahaib teach you anything?...now lay down those jumper cables before someone else takes another snapshot!
MIFdad,
Hopefully - those of us that do not agree with Ramrod - (or put in other words - those of us that believe he is talking from his hind quarters) LOL - will all survive your harsh personal review. I pray that occurs.
Additionally - your post is quite similar to what you are actually railing about. Like watching TV - showing a TV with the TV on - etc.....
I think you need to do a little Ramrod reading (and other assorted aliases) that go back for the last 12 months.
Hopefully - those of us that do not agree with Ramrod - (or put in other words - those of us that believe he is talking from his hind quarters) LOL - will all survive your harsh personal review. I pray that occurs.
Additionally - your post is quite similar to what you are actually railing about. Like watching TV - showing a TV with the TV on - etc.....
I think you need to do a little Ramrod reading (and other assorted aliases) that go back for the last 12 months.
mifdad:
Are they taking applications down at Chick-fil-A?
Save one for me...I'll be right down!
Seriously...Welcome to the HSBBW.
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you and your family.
quote:Cluck cluck cluck...
Are they taking applications down at Chick-fil-A?
Save one for me...I'll be right down!
Seriously...Welcome to the HSBBW.
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you and your family.
quote:Originally posted by gotwood4sale:
itsinthegame:quote:Seriously, I think you would be shocked...
You would be shocked...
Didn't our experience at Abu Grahaib teach you anything?...now lay down those jumper cables before someone else takes another snapshot!
LOL
Dont you be looking at the books gotwood!
"According to the New York Daily News, the Evil Empire lost between $50 million and $85 million last season,..."
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/story/371464p-316044c.html
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/story/371464p-316044c.html
itsinthegame:
Don't worry...you don't have to hide the books from me. Even if I had a month to study them I still wouldn't have a clue as to what I was reading... Called-up Share capital or Washed out Denim...it's all the same to me!
Don't worry...you don't have to hide the books from me. Even if I had a month to study them I still wouldn't have a clue as to what I was reading... Called-up Share capital or Washed out Denim...it's all the same to me!
Dad04,
I love listening to people talk about what pro teams make - or dont make - yet they have never spent a single day working for one.
Not even in the mailroom.
Can you imagine being the Director of Corporate Finance for one of these big guys? LOL
Money dogs - most of them. NHL, NBA - NFL and MLB.
Losing dogs.
I love listening to people talk about what pro teams make - or dont make - yet they have never spent a single day working for one.
Not even in the mailroom.
Can you imagine being the Director of Corporate Finance for one of these big guys? LOL
Money dogs - most of them. NHL, NBA - NFL and MLB.
Losing dogs.
quote:Originally posted by gotwood4sale:
itsinthegame:
Don't worry...you don't have to hide the books from me. Even if I had a month to study them I still wouldn't have a clue as to what I was reading... Called-up Share capital or Washed out Denim...it's all the same to me!
Gotwood,
In that case, "Have I got an investment for you!" LOL
There is this bridge in Brookyln - its really an architectural marvel and..........
And if that doesnt interest you - there is this baseball stadium in Queens,NY - the Mets play there - its a beauty. Yours for only --------
Itsinthegame
I read the article about the Yankees and follow the math. They lost alot of money, which means the Red Sox lost alot of money.
Its not difficult to project income and expenses and see there is little black ink floating these guys.
I read the article about the Yankees and follow the math. They lost alot of money, which means the Red Sox lost alot of money.
Its not difficult to project income and expenses and see there is little black ink floating these guys.
itsinthegame:
That marvelous bridge in Brooklyn...don't bother me...I bought the thing...twice!
And that eater's emporium, where they play some ball, in Queens...I've got that one wrapped up with 300 easy monthly payments of 1M per month...what a steal...I'm glad that guy didn't see me coming! I'm the talk of the town!
That marvelous bridge in Brooklyn...don't bother me...I bought the thing...twice!
And that eater's emporium, where they play some ball, in Queens...I've got that one wrapped up with 300 easy monthly payments of 1M per month...what a steal...I'm glad that guy didn't see me coming! I'm the talk of the town!
Thanks It's...your post seemed a bit addled but I think I sort of see where you're coming from.
I missed it the first time, but a second review of your contributions to this thread did reveal a sentence or two that were on-point...unfortunately it was hidden amongst all of the remarks questioning RR's right to formulate an opinion...that's why I missed it.
I missed it the first time, but a second review of your contributions to this thread did reveal a sentence or two that were on-point...unfortunately it was hidden amongst all of the remarks questioning RR's right to formulate an opinion...that's why I missed it.