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base awards

B baseballcoach07624Member
It is amazing to me how often youth umps and coaches are confused about base awards on balls thrown out of play.

My understanding is that for all balls thrown out of play on batted balls, the award is 2 bases from the last legally touched base at the time of the pitch (in the case of first play by infielder) or the time of the errant throw (all other cases). Balls thrown out of play by the pitcher from the rubber result in a one base award. Some older umps will say that the rule of thumb is "one from the infield, two from the outfield." I know that this is a simplification, but it doesn't really address the subtleties of where the runners are when the ball is thrown, etc.

My question is in regard to the base award when a pitcher throws the ball out of play on a pickoff attempt. If a left-handed pitcher throws the ball away on an attempt at first base, it's easy to see why that's one base (throw from the rubber). But what about a RHP on a jump step throw to first? Or after a step off the rubber and throw to first? Or on a fake-to-third-then-throw-to-first play? I thought that if the pitcher comes off the rubber he is considered an infielder, and the award should be 2 bases, even though there there is no batted ball to field. Does the runner on first go to second or third in each of the above scenarios?
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jjkjjk500+ posts
My question is in regard to the base award when a pitcher throws the ball out of play on a pickoff attempt. If a left-handed pitcher throws the ball away on an attempt at first base, it's easy to see why that's one base (throw from the rubber). But what about a RHP on a jump step throw to first? Or after a step off the rubber and throw to first? Or on a fake-to-third-then-throw-to-first play? I thought that if the pitcher comes off the rubber he is considered an infielder, and the award should be 2 bases, even though there there is no batted ball to field. Does the runner on first go to second or third in each of the above scenarios?

For the RHP, unless he steps off (disengages) prior to the throw to 1b, he is considered in contact, so a jump turn, jab step are both considered in contact. 1 Base.

For the RH F1 on the 1-3rd move, he is considered to have disengaged upon the fake to 3rd hence a ensuing throw to 1B would be a 2 base award.
N NavyUmp10+ posts
Any time a pitcher disengages the rubber properly he becomes an infielder and if he subsequently throws the ball out of play it is 2 bases from time of throw.

with a legal jump step, it is considered from the rubber.

On the fake to third-throw to first. It is possible for the pitcher to legally remain engaged OR be disengaged. the award would be depend on what the pitcher does
Michael S. TaylorMichael S. Taylor1,000+ posts
The most basic simplification is one from the rubber, two from the field. That is a good basic beginning point but it needs to be broken down.
One from the rubber:
Forget RHP & LHP. One set of rules for both. Any throw while engaged is one base. As stated already, a jab step, jump step or spin on the rubber is one base. If he disengages by stepping back or dragging his foot off in a 3/1 move the he is an infielder and it becomes two bases.
Two from the field:
Any throw from a fielder will be two bases. First play by an inielder is TOP. Second play by an infielder or any play by an outfielder is TOT. The last part makes you have to know where the runners were when the fielder releases the ball.
Ball carried out play:
One base from the time the fielder accidently carries the ball out. Two bases if you feel he carried it out on purpose.
U UxbridgeBaseballMember
quote:
Originally posted by Michael S. Taylor:
The most basic simplification is one from the rubber, two from the field. That is a good basic beginning point but it needs to be broken down.
One from the rubber:
Forget RHP & LHP. One set of rules for both. Any throw while engaged is one base. As stated already, a jab step, jump step or spin on the rubber is one base. If he disengages by stepping back or dragging his foot off in a 3/1 move the he is an infielder and it becomes two bases.
Two from the field:
Any throw from a fielder will be two bases. First play by an inielder is TOP. Second play by an infielder or any play by an outfielder is TOT. The last part makes you have to know where the runners were when the fielder releases the ball.
Ball carried out play:
One base from the time the fielder accidently carries the ball out. Two bases if you feel he carried it out on purpose.


Interesting case arose at a game a couple of weeks ago. R1, pop fly to F5. F5 overthrows first base, but R1 had taken off for second and still hadn't tagged back to first base. Which base should R1 be awarded?
Last edited by UxbridgeBaseball
Michael S. TaylorMichael S. Taylor1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by UxbridgeBaseball:
quote:
Originally posted by Michael S. Taylor:
The most basic simplification is one from the rubber, two from the field. That is a good basic beginning point but it needs to be broken down.
One from the rubber:
Forget RHP & LHP. One set of rules for both. Any throw while engaged is one base. As stated already, a jab step, jump step or spin on the rubber is one base. If he disengages by stepping back or dragging his foot off in a 3/1 move the he is an infielder and it becomes two bases.
Two from the field:
Any throw from a fielder will be two bases. First play by an inielder is TOP. Second play by an infielder or any play by an outfielder is TOT. The last part makes you have to know where the runners were when the fielder releases the ball.
Ball carried out play:
One base from the time the fielder accidently carries the ball out. Two bases if you feel he carried it out on purpose.


Interesting case arose at a game a couple of weeks ago. R1, pop fly to F5. F5 overthrows first base, but R1 had taken off for second and still hadn't tagged back to first base. Which base should R1 be awarded?



R1 should get third if he is between first and second but he must tag up or be liable for an appeal at first.
Take another play:OBR
Pop to center, looks like it is going to drop so R1 is off and running. The fielder catches it and throws to first to double off R1. When the throw is made R1 was still beyond second. The award is is home because that is where he was TOT. The problem is he is still required to retouch first. If he does so then the award changes to third.
Under Fed rules R1 can't retouch so the award would stay home but he liable on the appeal.
C copsox65Member
I have a question on an overthrow from a game that I coached today...Batter hits a single into the right/center gap, as he tries to stretch it into a double he knows that hewill get thrown out, he retreats back to first and after the second baseman gets the throw from the right fielder he throws to first to get the runner.. The throw is wild and goes out of play..,I say the runner should get third because of the overthrow and he had already obtained first base...the ump awarded him second because once the throw came into the infield the rule reverts to a one base award..who is right?
D dash_riprock1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by copsox65:
I have a question on an overthrow from a game that I coached today...Batter hits a single into the right/center gap, as he tries to stretch it into a double he knows that hewill get thrown out, he retreats back to first and after the second baseman gets the throw from the right fielder he throws to first to get the runner.. The throw is wild and goes out of play..,I say the runner should get third because of the overthrow and he had already obtained first base...the ump awarded him second because once the throw came into the infield the rule reverts to a one base award..who is right?

You are. Next time you see him, shovel dirt on his shoes and tell him to RTFRB.
F 3FingeredGlove1,000+ posts
Well, the OBR and NCAA rule books are not so very clear on this issue. Fortunately, NFHS is definite that for the award to be TOP, it must have been the first throw by an infielder who has just fielded a batted ball.

There are a few resources that umpires use in addition to the rule book. One of those is referred to as Jaksa/Roder, and their interpretation matches the NFHS rule: the infielder must have fielded the batted ball.

However, all rule sets state quite clearly that if the batter and all other runners have advanced one base at TOT, then the award is unconditionally from TOT. And I imagine that in your situation, if there were any other runners, they too would have reached the next base before the bad throw was made. If so, your umpire was clearly wrong.

7.05(g) Approved Ruling is: If all runners, including the batter-runner, have advanced at least one base when an infielder makes a wild throw on the first play after the pitch, the award shall be governed by the position of the runners when the wild throw was made. Note the phrase "on the play after the pitch". Although the approved ruling doesn't directly refer to the situation in which some runner hasn't reached his advance base at TOT, it helps to clarify the rule makers intent.

In summary, for the award to be TOP, it has to be the first throw folowing the pitch. And if all runners have advanced one base at the time of the errant throw, the award is always TOT.
Last edited by 3FingeredGlove

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