Can competitive athletes be developed this way?

The Positive Coaching Alliance is a good thing. The league you witnessed went well beyond what they teach.

Just as long as they're not cheering when a kid goes back to the dugout who struck out looking at three pitches down the middle and is one of those kids who can't get the bat off their shoulder. That used to drive me crazy. You're not doing the kid any good by applauding failure. What's positive about a kid who stands there as a statue and the parents and coaches pat him on the back and say "nice try", you'll get em next time" when realistically you know the kid will stand there like a statue his next AB.

In our world today it appears that failure is accepted -- that does not bode well for a kids future

I wouldn't know one way or the other if the PCA has anything to do with the mentality of today's coaches or parents. I would assume they probably don't but it still baffles me why failure is applauded. The only good that comes out of failure is you learn and grow from it which is a big positive but you don't applaud failure.

Whatever happened to just enhancing one's strong points and working on strengthening one's weaknesses.

i'm not sure you can teach kids to be competitive athletes.maybe i'm wrong,all the clapping in the world wouldn't make my kids smile if they k'd.

there is a bold line between what we had growing up and today. my coaches may have been arrested today.

Doesn't matter, as little league isn't where competitive athletes are developed. The more I look back on those years, which we really enjoyed, the more more I realize how unimportant any of it was for competitive development.

When I hear about T-ball all-stars, I laugh out loud. That is for parents trying to out-do other parents through their 5 year olds.

And for those that think this bodes poorly for our future, I also say "it doesn't matter". Every person will learn about competetiveness at some point in their lives.

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i'm not sure you can teach kids to be competitive athletes.maybe i'm wrong,all the clapping in the world wouldn't make my kids smile if they k'd.

My son got one of those participation trophies in LL when he was 9. The first thing he asked when he got it was "what's this for? we didn't win." I told him everybody gets one. He asked" why?"

He hated to lose then as he does now. However, when he was little and pushed the reset button on video games because he knew he was gonna lose, he had to learn to be a better loser and as he matured, he did. But he still hates to lose.

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Originally posted by Blprkfrnks:
Doesn't matter, as little league isn't where competitive athletes are developed.

You can not learn the competitive edge unless the rest of the crowd is on the same page. The biggest drop off of LL participation is after the majors and that alone should tell you where the heart is. If you can't teach "take no prisoners", you might as well go for the best trait a kid can have and the is respect for others because that is missing many times in todays society.

This sounds like our high school parents. They still say it is okay, good try, you'll get them next time on ground balls and fly balls dropped and watching strike three after watching strike one and two. I look like the evil king when I tell my son at first that if it thrown at him it should be caught in the air or bouncing at his feet.
I'm so sick of this it will be okay mentality. I think kids need to know that a ball hit to them is to be caught and a pitched ball is to be hit.
(Thanks for allowing me to rant.)
Let me give you the mood of our team. Two weeks ago we had five players walk out of the dugout in the fourth inning at 4:30 to go to the prom that did not start til 8:00. I could not believe that parents would encourage their player to walk off the field to go to a dance in the middle of a game. But that is what our sports world has come to.

What I see in the work force is two types: those with a sense of entitlement (no matter what the results), and those who are there to do the job and strive for better results.

I don't think I hang the entitlement mentality on LL, more of a function of what "we" as parents do when the kids get older. Some parents tell their kids just quit the team (mid-season) if you don't like how it's going for you. Seriously, it is disturbing.

I will say this: A confident player is a better player. Whatever instills confidence is the best way from where I sit, whatever that might be. As far as kids walking out of the dugout in the fourth inning, it would be the last day they were on any team I coached. There are lots of proms, but only so many baseball games. (Seriously, who is the genius who scheduled the game the same day as the prom?)

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There are lots of proms, but only so many baseball games. (Seriously, who is the genius who scheduled the game the same day as the prom?)

Disagree here. For ballplayers, there are plenty more baseball games and practices than one senior prom in their lifetime. From my experience, many of these ballplayers would rather have that day off and go to the prom with their date. The only ones who'd rather play ball can't get a prom date. The prom only comes around once for these kids and they don't want to miss it.

Scheduling ballgames on prom days makes no sense at all and is too much distraction for these kids. Some flexibility in the schedule should be in place so that games can be rescheduled if possible.

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Originally posted by jemaz:
...As far as kids walking out of the dugout in the fourth inning, it would be the last day they were on any team I coached. There are lots of proms, but only so many baseball games. (Seriously, who is the genius who scheduled the game the same day as the prom?)

I'll bet "walking out" of the dugout was done with the coaches blessing. If not, I'm with Jemaz in regard to the "last day" threat. On a lighter note..... Jemaz, you must have paid a mint for tux rentals if your sons school has "lots of Proms" . As far as scheduling games on the day of prom...the guy who does it is either......

1. Not aware of the schools social schedule
2. Never went to his own prom and is still "working through it" in therapy sessions.
3. Is a father of daughters who does not trust bb players so he creates a "conflict" to blow up the date.
4. His HS team had games on prom day so everyone else should suffer if he had his say.

It seems we have lost track of what differentiates the competative player and the casual player. In little league it's okay to have everyone feel good and have fun. The player seeking more will have found a more competative arena to be playing in by Majors so why should we worry about others just having fun?
High shcool is the same way unfortunately. They fill the rosters with kids who don't have the same levels of passion and often I notice the entire level of play diminished by now in the season. That is happening on my son's team now. We actually employ a "rotation" to make sure it is mostly fair playing time. The errors and lack of basics like understanding the roll of a cut off man are killing me. I can barely go to the game. We could field a very competative team but choose to play little league style in high school. It is ridiculous. But unlike little league where you find a better place to play, high school has a monopoly. It kills me when we have a handful of potential college players who play 1 out of every 3 games so the little league graduates can kick the ball around the field on their turn.
While I do see a place for the feel good approach, it should clearly stop by high school!

rz and zomby:

I agree with you both. I was hoping my sarcastic point would come through. It is simply astounding to me that the game was scheduled on the day of the prom. The situation should never have existed.

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Originally posted by calisportsfan:
It kills me when we have a handful of potential college players who play 1 out of every 3 games so the little league graduates can kick the ball around the field on their turn

What you're saying is cut or bench those classmates who do not have the tools and let those few players who will be going on to play college ball play all the time . IMO, HS baseball is the last opportunity for the kids who will not go one to play at the next level to represent their school and play the sport they have passion for but average skills.

My son played on a team with many of those "average kids" and he felt good when they got a chance to play in front of their parents and peers. He had a baseball future, they will only have baseball memories. That is a hard concept for many parents of "elite players" to accept. The set rotation is a little weird, but sharing time at the right moments should be embraced by one and all.

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But unlike little league where you find a better place to play, high school has a monopoly. It kills me when we have a handful of potential college players who play 1 out of every 3 games so the little league graduates can kick the ball around the field on their turn.
While I do see a place for the feel good approach, it should clearly stop by high school!

Does this apply to varsity or JV & Freshman teams? If this is going on during JV & freshman games, the coaches might be more geared to finding how who can or can play and who will make an impact at the varsity level. They probably already identified those who could play.

If they use this approach on the varsity level, that would seem odd since the emphasis on is on winning at the varsity level than splitting playing time for development which is why there's JV and freshman teams.

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Originally posted by jemaz:
rz and zomby:

I agree with you both. I was hoping my sarcastic point would come through. It is simply astounding to me that the game was scheduled on the day of the prom. The situation should never have existed.

LOL..sometimes, it's easy to miss the sarcasm on a board post, however, you're right, that situation shouldn't have existed or at least, an effort should have been made to avoid this schedule conflict.

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IMO, HS baseball is the last opportunity for the kids who will not go one to play at the next level to represent their school and play the sport they have passion for but average skills.

I agree with that in that most HS players don't play beyond HS and many varsity coaches will look for spots to get their seniors that ride the bench some playing time they might not get as underclassmen which is a good thing. Decent coaches know how to do this seamlessly.

As for the average skill players, that's true but there are also many above averge players who hang up the spikes after their senior year as well who could've done well at the college level but have decided to move on after HS.

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IMO, HS baseball is the last opportunity for the kids who will not go one to play at the next level to represent their school and play the sport they have passion for but average skills.

-----------------------------

In our district, JV is for development and varsity is for competition, so no one is guaranteed time at the varsity level. Let the below average kid represent his school at the JV level.

IMHO, there's nothing wrong with competition at the high school level. You are not doing an 18 year old a favor by letting him play if he's not as good as the others. Life doesn't work that way.

Competitive atheletes are probably born that way IMO. They either have overwhelming talent or high talent and high work ethic. How they are treated at LL age will not effect they're competitive spirit.

There are more traumatic and frequent incidents along the way that will effect them more than a pat on the back for striking out.

Positive reinforcement is always a good thing although in cases like this it should be doled out with constructive criticism and instruction.

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Originally posted by twotex:
In our district, JV is for development and varsity is for competition, so no one is guaranteed time at the varsity level. Let the below average kid represent his school at the JV level.
That sounds like the words of an "elite" players parent . I basically agree with the statement but I think our locations dictate our difference in opinions. In our area there are very few cuts, schools with 1500 students are considered huge, there is no baseball from Oct thru March. We have two types of players. A few who go to the next level, and the pack who have some good skills but not recruitable, or have no plans to attempt to play at the next level. As a result IMO the inner-team intensity and negative parental involvement is probably not at the same level as yours. Most of our kids play for the passion of the game, there is very little separating #'s 5-15.


IMHO, there's nothing wrong with competition at the high school level.
Absolutely, it only makes players and the team better

You are not doing an 18 year old a favor by letting him play if he's not as good as the others.
If he's just going to be an a$$ on the bench....CUT him, or is he just there to carry equipment ?

Life doesn't work that way.
I'm guilty of using that cliche at times, and it's often from the elitist POV.

I wonder if my opinion would be different if I were the parent of the kid who works his a$$ off, does not see the game as the kids next step to immortality, and has to listen to Moms and Dads who perch their sons on a throne while belittling those less talented. I'll bet my attitude toward HS sports may be different than those who use it as a virtual stepping stone to the next level.

Can you use this phrase describing HS baseball "competitive atmosphere, in a social surrounding, with classmates enjoying a team environment, and where when all is said and done lifelong memories outweigh the team record"?

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If he's just going to be an a$$ on the bench....CUT him, or is he just there to carry equipment ?

Exactly. If a player is that much worse than his peers, you cut him. A HS senior who has made it all four years in a program or made the varsity at some point typically are good enough players to be where they are and if the coach calls their number, it's assumed they are capable of doing the job. Personally, in a tight spot, I'd be less confident with an inexperienced underclassman with more talent than the senior who grinds it out and less talent because I feel is less likely to be overwhelmed/overmatched in a key situation.

On the prom subject, it was the junior prom and 2 of them did not even have dates. The game was scheduled as part of a tournament and the game was changed. The coach had to let them go but not freely.
I will say that some of the comments on here are the ones I expected from the LL crowd. Everybody play, have fun, enjoy life. That is for LL, rec, and middle school not varsity baseball. I believe the best should play and you play to win. If you are not good enough, don't play and they should be cut.
I had major problems with the kids and their parents that walked out. The interesting part is most are football players, so is my kid, and would be appalled if a player walked off the football field at halftime to get ready for a dance or anything else.
Our world has become so politically correct that it is now wrong for a coach to kick a kid off who walks out on his teammates. What happened where varsity baseball became a place for everyone to play rather than playing to win?

First of all, I think they're applauding the effort, not the result although I do think they go overboard at times....However, I'd much rather see that than the overly competitive 'stud' fist pumping every strikeout of an overmatched opponent....(and I won't even mention the parents in the stands)

My son plays small school baseball. There are no cuts but the best nine play. Consequently, the team is 'self-cutting' and by senior year anyone not starting has quit. I don't really understand why, in a big school with FR and JV teams, seniors that weren't good enough to play V would still be around if they were unhappy with the situation.

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
Our world has become so politically correct.....

PC is a 4-letter word to me. However I see it more as a knee-jerk reaction that attempts to separate itself from the thug mindset that began to take hold years ago. While I don't fall into the PC group I can see where it is a very safe place to be.

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That sounds like the words of an "elite" players parent . I basically agree with the statement but I think our locations dictate our difference in opinions. In our area there are very few cuts, schools with 1500 students are considered huge, there is no baseball from Oct thru March.

My son's school has fewer than 500 students so no one who showed up to play was cut. There's no baseball from November until April, so maybe our situations are similar. My son does get plenty of playing time, so maybe that colors my views.

I would add that your disagreements were very politely stated, and I respect that you see things in a different way.

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Originally posted by twotex:
I would add that your disagreements were very politely stated, and I respect that you see things in a different way.

I thought you stated your point with solid opinion which I respect. I also think it goes to show that there are different strokes for different folks. Many of my HS opinions are based on experiences 7+ years ago. Some may call that "recent", it is still 2 generations of HS classes, so what do I really know?

Times change, mindsets change, and you can't turn back the clock, but, IMO the best way to build your own opinion is to breakdown the "looks" of others, old and new. This site is chocked full of opinions, listen, support those you agree with and respectfully disagree with those you differ with....if you have something constructive to say.

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Two weeks ago we had five players walk out of the dugout in the fourth inning at 4:30 to go to the prom that did not start til 8:00.

The kid who did this on my son's high school team was benched. He skipped the game.

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A HS senior who has made it all four years in a program or made the varsity at some point typically are good enough players to be where they are and if the coach calls their number, it's assumed they are capable of doing the job.

If a kid sticks it out for four years, there's an extra uniform and the kid understands his place on the team I believe it's ok to keep him on the team. My son's varsity had one last year. He chased foul balls and was an active cheerleader on the bench. He was liked well enough and respected enough to lead from the bench.

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Originally posted by RJM:
[QUOTE]QUOTE]If a kid sticks it out for four years, there's an extra uniform and the kid understands his place on the team I believe it's ok to keep him on the team. My son's varsity had one last year. He chased foul balls and was an active cheerleader on the bench. He was liked well enough and respected enough to lead from the bench.

From what I've seen when my son played, the active cheerleaders or those who played little didn't return their senior year. I don't blame them. What's the point putting all that time in when they'll never see the field while they could be working after school making some loot or just doing something else other than ride the pine and watch others play. I know if my son was a bench warmer or cheerleader on the HS team, or no matter what he did in tryouts/preseason that he wasn't gonna play, he would've quit and not waste his time.

However, if you got one of those players just happy wearing the uniform and leading the team from the bench, then that's fine I suppose as long as he's content with that. It beats getting into trouble because they're bored after school.

As for those players who walked out of the dugout to leave the game 4:30 for an 8:00 prom, I'd bench those players too. While scheduling games on prom days makes no sense, these players are on the team, made a committment and I would support a coach for benching these players who left the team that day. You just don't do that.

I don't think it would be fair to bench them. I would cut them.

I just did not understand the need for guys to leave 3 1/2 hours early for a dance, especially the ones who couldn't get dates. But this same group does not understand why my son will leave the first week in June and be home 2 days until July 23 for baseball. They say it is not worth it and that he should have fun. His statement is that baseball is what I love and playing all summer is fun.
It goes back to the mindset that in most high schools (not all) there are a few, maybe one in some schools, that really love baseball and then there are those who just want to play. The problem is that it presents the mindset of playing for the love of it or just playing for the fun of it.
I guess that is why we love summer ball. Almost everyone is out there for the same reason and gives their all, all the time.

Our HS coach rescheduled games on prom day and the week of the Sr.trip he excused the Sr's who were going.
I think the high school now has half day on prom day.
It could take 3 1/2 hrs to pick up a tux, get cleaned up pick up your date,take pictures then back home for more pictures and then there is pre prom.

I think there is more to the high school experence than sports. there needs to be balance between work and play. A good coach will understand that and work with the school and the players.

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I think there is more to the high school experence than sports. there needs to be balance between work and play. A good coach will understand that and work with the school and the players.

Couldn't agree more. The prom is a big deal and we too had half day on prom day. I think my son had a half day too. You do need those 3½ hrs and some more for the running around and getting ready for the big night.

Baseball is just part of the school experience as it should be.

So, would you guys agree that a player would walk off a football field at halftime to get ready for the homecoming dance afterwards. What is the difference? If you are committed to playing and I think this is the problem between those who want it and those who are playing for the fun of it, then you would make it work.
Again, I could see if it was in lieu of prom but this was hours before.
The coach let them go but I would have had them sit the next game. There has to be some retribution for walking out on your teammates for most circumstances.
I don't think the coach has as big a problem as the players who were left there to play when their teammates walked out on them.

Whether they're playing HS baseball for fun or those who want it is irrelevant. It's HS and HS is more than about baseball. Everybody plays HS baseball for different reasons


Walking off the field isn't the right thing to do and don't have a problem with some sort of penalty. Now if the coach approved them leaving early and was prepared to replace the players, then that shouldn't be a problem. The best thing is for the coach to work with the school so things can be scheduled accordingly.

Jeff Connell wrote:

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But this same group does not understand why my son will leave the first week in June and be home 2 days until July 23 for baseball. They say it is not worth it and that he should have fun. His statement is that baseball is what I love and playing all summer is fun.

Mister Wheat, I'd like to introduce you to Mr. Chaff!

I understand the mindset your son's teammates possess. But I find it really refreshing when I read about kids who are directed and passionate about a pursuit enough to forgo what other kids would call "fun" to follow their chosen passion. Sounds like your kid is the wheat and his buddies are just the chaff!

David

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So, would you guys agree that a player would walk off a football field at halftime to get ready for the homecoming dance afterwards. What is the difference?

Nothing about the homecoming dance occurs before the game is over. There's a lot more involved with a prom. We (when my daughter was in high school) had a pre prom picture taking party at our house that started at 5:30pm before the kids went out to dinner before the prom. It would be impossible to play a game that starts at 3:30 and be dressed and at someone's house at 5:30. A prom may also involve limo arrangements. Some kids get picked up one by one. We had limos waiting at our house for everyone.

The key is the AD shouldn't schedule a baseball game on the day of or after the prom. The prom is a big deal.

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What's the point putting all that time in when they'll never see the field while they could be working after school making some loot or just doing something else other than ride the pine and watch others play.

It was the year the new coach turned it around. Everyone knew it was coming. The player wanted to be around for the fun. He played in a handful of one sided games. He started a non conference game. He also wants to be a teacher and a coach.

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
So, would you guys agree that a player would walk off a football field at halftime to get ready for the homecoming dance afterwards. What is the difference? If you are committed to playing and I think this is the problem between those who want it and those who are playing for the fun of it, then you would make it work.
Again, I could see if it was in lieu of prom but this was hours before.
The coach let them go but I would have had them sit the next game. There has to be some retribution for walking out on your teammates for most circumstances.
I don't think the coach has as big a problem as the players who were left there to play when their teammates walked out on them.

My son wanted "it" and he has worked very hard at baseball since he was a kid. But he went to his Sr. prom..
Those players did not walk out on their team, they and the coach made arrangements so they could attend the prom.
What if there was a game during graduation (I know it wouldn't happen but) should they miss that also? What if a players brother was getting married on a game day ? There is also nothing wrong with playing for fun.


(Had son missed the prom he never would have played baseball again because his date (now his wife) would have killed him)

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What if there was a game during graduation (I know it wouldn't happen but) should they miss that also?

My son is missing a game to attend his sister's college graduation one thousand miles away. His coach doesn't have an issue the situation.

I know several guys that missed their graduation to attend a playoff game.
I and many of the other parents and teammates do see it as walking out on their teammates. They walked out of the dugout in the middle of a game. What is that if it is not walking out on your teammates? I know it is still affecting their season today a month later.
Again, maybe it is just me but I don't see how missing a game is okay. It is a lack of dedication to the team. I understand it is priorities difference but it doesn't make it right.
And no, my son would not miss a game for a graduation, his or his siblings.

Or you can do like the Mamaroneck HS coach did a few years back---the team was in the State Finals the weekend of the school prom---players were forbidden to attend the prom and HAD TO be with the team---instead coach rented a hall for the following weekend, hired a DJ and a caterer and the team had their prom--OH ! And Yes they won the state title

.

I didn't know you could rent the hall...



Good for the coach and congratulations to the team!




.

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What if there was a game during graduation (I know it wouldn't happen but) should they miss that also?

Absolutely. Anything related to the school academically always comes first. The whole purpose of going to school for 12 years is to get that HS diploma. Nothing is bigger than that day to this point in their school life. Certainly not a baseball game. Baseball is an extra-curricular activity in school, not the primary function. IMO, if somebody thinks a baseball game is bigger than a graduation or some major family event, their priorities seem to be really mixed up.

Does your kid compete? You seem like a guy who's kid definitely plays for fun. My kid goes to school to play ball. (not completely but he would say so). I think there are kids who play ball for the fun of it and for the letters on their school jackets then there are those who see high school as a step in the ladder of the whole aspect.
But it comes from priorities. I did not walk in my college graduation and went to school for the degree not the experience.
I reckon it is what you are wanting to get out of it. The party and fun or the future.

HS baseball for most kids is a "social event"---there are very few that take it that seriously---sure they want to win but if there , in their minds is somthing better to do--they bail out

Not every kid is a devoted to the game as your kid but there is such a thing as team loyalty--this is where I get concerned---what do they they do the next time a "party' arises?

This is where our country is going

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My kid goes to school to play ball.

My kids are competitive athletes as much as anyone. If they ever told me they go to school to play ball I'd take sports away from them until they get their priorities in order. The only time this statement would be reasonably acceptible would be in a major college program with an opportunity to be a top twenty round draft choice. But the education would still be very important.

My son will be missing one high school game to attend his sister's college graduation. He doesn't have a choice. He cleared it with his coach. Had it been a playoff game we probably would have let him stay home. If you think I don't get it from lack of experience, I played college ball. Education will always come first until someone is dangling as much baseball money in his face (most likely won't happen) than an education will help him earn.

My daughter had to chose playing senior year of college versus a prestigious internship in DC. Had she chosen to play softball I would have had her head examined. The internship will provide advantages early in her career until she proves herself professionally.

I fault high school AD's for some of the problems. Some don't check the school schedule or work out accommodations. Our AD once got a district playoff game rescheduled to accommodate graduation.

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My kids are competitive athletes as much as anyone. If they ever told me they go to school to play ball I'd take sports away from them until they get their priorities in order.

Agree 100%....

We are not talking about missing class. We are talking about missing a party, that is what Prom is. I don't even see the big deal of graduation. It is just walking up an aisle and getting a piece of paper. I would have a problem if my child was not making the grades but he does. I have no problem when he is excited about playing ball. That is what he lives for and has worked hard for. That is what will pay for college and possibly pay him large sums later in life. Again, the difference in casual ball and sold out.
That is what makes this site interesting. Many of you who have no problem with the players missing a game also say your kids have no chance of getting paid to play or going top D1. Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious. That is why things are discussed and we learn from each other.

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
Does your kid compete? You seem like a guy who's kid definitely plays for fun.

My son played baseball competitively for 12 years starting from t-ball, rec, all-stars, aau-travel, played in national tournaments American Legion and HS ball. As a HS player, he was a starting outfielder for his varsity team. He was extemely competitive, hated to lose and worked as hard as anybody in practice so that he was ready and prepared every game. He was a two-sport athlete (team captain in one sport)and a former legion team captain and third team all-conference in his HS winter sport. Not only was he competitive, he was a team leader.

And yes, he played for fun. Both sports he played for fun. I don't know how anybody can play and not have fun at that age. That's what it's all about. Isn't it? But don't confuse that with being a competitor. He was as competitive as anybody being sought after by D1 schools. The only difference was that baseball was a part of who he is, not all of who he is.

And when he went looking for colleges, along with his grades, it didn't hurt having an athletic background and being able to show he can not only make the grade but also doing it with a busy after school schedule lettering in two sports. He got accepted into the college of his choice so it worked out for him.

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
We are not talking about missing class. We are talking about missing a party, that is what Prom is. I don't even see the big deal of graduation. It is just walking up an aisle and getting a piece of paper.

I think you have to put your feet in the shoes who are doing the walking. As we get older our opinion of what is important to a 17/18 year old becomes fuzzy and many times wearing extra large blinders demanding answers that fit our opinions. At that age I hated when my Dad tried to do that. JMO

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Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious.

That is insulting to those not perched on the D1 and/or draft pedestal, and probably embarrassing to many that are. But then again the air can get thin up there when looking down on the masses.

I see the word "us" used and wonder whos dream/life is it anyway, and whos driving this bus?

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Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious. That is why things are discussed and we learn from each other.

What is it they take more serious?. When they're on the field, other than maybe the skill level, how does one determine who takes the game more serious. By time these players are in HS, they're the best players from their respective towns/cities and didn't get there by goofing around to get to that level.

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Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious.

What a condescending comment! There are a lot of kids in high school and college ball working as hard as anyone playing the game who won't make a living playing ball. There are a lot of college players and minor leaguers who think they are going to earn a living playing ball who won't.

How would you feel if it was turned around to "Those of us whose kids are National Honor Society take school more seriously than kids like yours?" I know the odds are huge in favor of a kid's education taking him further in life than sports. The D'backs GM once said there's a 1% chance a minor league baseball player will earn a living playing pro ball. There are D1's interested in my son. Education is still more important. I'll hang my son's chances on education. If anything big happens in baseball it will be a plus.

I believe in balance. I don't want my kids to think they've lost their identity when sports ends. I've seen it happen. It's not pretty. And sports will end whether it's LL, high school, college or pro. At that time there will be a lot of life left to live where being an athlete will not be the personal identity.

Do you believe Myron Rolle has his priorities out of order?

quote:

Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
We are not talking about missing class. We are talking about missing a party, that is what Prom is. I don't even see the big deal of graduation. It is just walking up an aisle and getting a piece of paper. I would have a problem if my child was not making the grades but he does. I have no problem when he is excited about playing ball. That is what he lives for and has worked hard for. That is what will pay for college and possibly pay him large sums later in life. Again, the difference in casual ball and sold out.
That is what makes this site interesting. Many of you who have no problem with the players missing a game also say your kids have no chance of getting paid to play or going top D1. Those of us who know our kids will be D1 and drafted take it more serious. That is why things are discussed and we learn from each other.

Wow.

I'm one of the parents who doesn't have a problem with players being excused by the coach to attend certain school functions and my son makes a living playing baseball. so yea we took baseball seriously.but I also don't think HS baseball is about being a stepping stone for future pro players.

To me there is no clear cut answer that fits everyone. It's not a matter of which one a person feels is most important. Everyone should understand that in most cases in order to succeed you gotta get the job done both ways. If someone is all out dedicated to baseball and it helps them get an education, that seems alright to me.

I'm sure there are many differing opinions as to the importance of prom night vs a baseball game! That is an individual thing, so how can we tell someone else what is most important to them? There is no "sin" involved either way.

All that said, Scheduling a baseball game on prom night had to be a mistake. However, we do that every year. Some miss the games, some don't. Some figure out how to do both.

quote:

I'm sure there are many differing opinions as to the importance of prom night vs a baseball game! That is an individual thing, so how can we tell someone else what is most important to them?

Difference is, the playoff game represents a commitment made to the coach and other players, to be there and to contribute. The kid and parents need to recognize how that commitment might play out toward the end of the season, and realize that they are signing up for those possibilities the minute they accept the jersey.

It's not even really about whether you'd rather be at the game.

No one said it was a play off game.. It was a tournament. Was it even part of the HS schedule.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeff Connell:
I know several guys that missed their graduation to attend a playoff game.

This dude did.

But the other cases are worth talking about. The principal of understanding the commitment is the guideline to me. If the coach agrees that he's good without you, or that the game might not be that critical, then I think it doesn't matter.

But if coach thinks they'll need you, then hey, you signed up.

If your girl wouldn't rather be at the game then prancing around in Taffeta, I'd say get rid of her anyway.

**If you go to coach to tell him you want to miss a game to go to prom, maybe you should consider wearing the Taffeta when you ask...

Granted, this guy was talking about play-off game vs. graduation, not prom.

You're right, Graduation vs the game is much trickier, because in some families, HS graduation represents the pinnacle of their intellectual career. The whole family comes from all parts to sit in the hot auditorium for two hours, just for that that one 5 second moment where they scream out "way to go, Billy!!!" That can be pretty important to some people.

By contrast in some families, HS graduation is kind of a given lowest-common denominator, and they only really go so they won't feel guilty later.

Regular season HS game vs. graduation is a non-conversation, because if you go to a school dumb enough to schedule both on the same day, then you probably don't really want the diploma.

Tournament Team game vs. Graduation is the tough one. Was the tournament scheduled at the start of the season, or was it a pop-up?