Can you stand another one about TERRIBLE HS Coaching?

Good Grief.............wondering what the parents of the boy who threw 80 pitches yesterday have to say???

That's really a shame. Hang in there!

_______________________
"People ask me what I do in winter when there's no baseball. I'll tell you what I do. I stare out the window and wait for spring." Rogers Hornsby, Hall of Famer

guess the observation about them not belonging on the same field was "a bit premature"

lefties? - - - they just aint right!

That's just an average day at the park around here.

Mr. and Mrs Baseball


What do the parents have to say? to who

No doubt the coach was wrong to bring in the previous days pitcher, however, it sounds like alot of excuses being made for the rest of the game. "Bee" made a good point!

By Will:

quote:

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Mr. and Mrs Baseball


What do the parents have to say? to who

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You are kidding right? You cannot be that blind. or whatever.........

the Florida Bombers
"I love the HSBBW"

Not knowing the situation, why hasn't your son faced a battter in three weeks?

Voodoo,
Do not feel that you are alone. I will follow what RD says, that also is an average day in the park around here as well. The coach should have been shot for putting in the kid who threw the day before.
Bighit,
I am not sure I understand your comment to MM baseball.

quote:

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Originally posted by eck10:
Not knowing the situation, why hasn't your son faced a battter in three weeks?

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He's the #3 pitcher on his team & we've played a string of games against very tough teams / district games & with my Son being new to the program the Coach doesn't have enough confidence in him to have pitched him in those games. I have no problem with that. However, our Coach has done a poor job of seeing to it that my Son got his regular work in during this period of inactivity.He's only played catch to warm up & made throws from the outfield.

If I hadn't taken the initiative to have him work with his personal pitching Coach twice last week he would have had one 10 minute bullpen session in the entire 3 week period. Tough to be sharp with so little opportunity to get on a mound.

Prior to last night's debacle my Son was 2-0, 1 save, 1.63 ERA, 13 K's in 10 inn. with a no-hitter.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bee:
guess the observation about them not belonging on the same field was "a bit premature"

You're right... because of the disadvantage we had in the Coaching dept.

As to position players, hands down their 1B would start for us & their CF MIGHT play LF for us. In pitching, their #1 would be our #3. Beyond that, their other kids would not leave the bench.

My comment was to to Will. I copied his quote. His quote was to MM.

the Florida Bombers
"I love the HSBBW"

Bighit,
Ok see it now.......

quote:

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Then tells the team there's practice tomorrow so they can work on how they played. When does he work on his pathetic coaching?

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Voodoo

At least he understands that the kids have elevate their game to overcome his bad coaching.

Ever seen a kid get caught stealing third then the coach yell at him like he missed the sign? Thats classic.

Welcome to my world.

I sympathize...our kids won last night - 10 runned a team and the coach griped them out for about 20 mins about how poorly our team hit...we beat a team couple of weeks ago that last year went to the state semi finals and our boys got griped at then, too...we just tell our son to hang in there

Just like in Umpiring, you don't always get the best coach, just the most available coach. Many very highly qualified coaches can't coach HS baseball due to the conflict in work schedules.

A sad but true fact is that much of HS baseball that I see is run by the AD/Head football coach, coached by the JV football/wrestling coach and the middle school basketball coach. Baseball experience and qualifications come secondary to availability.

The one telling statement in this whole thread is " Then instead of taking the blame for a TERRIBLE job of coaching he tells the kids he doesn't have much to say because he's "furious" at the ump for the walks". If his team wins it wins, if it loses its the Umpires fault.

Good coaches rarely blame umpires. (even if we have contributed to a loss Blown call etc.)

BBmom2.....
sometimes winning the game is not indicative of the way a team played....you can win on the scoreboard and play sloppy and not hit well. It all depends on the team and the potential....one of the best coaches I ever knew would gripe at his kids more when they won sloppy than if they lost but played well.....

Hitting good, running the bases properly, doing the everyday things well, might be what he was looking for.....

[QUOTE]Originally posted by piaa_ump:
Good coaches rarely blame umpires. (even if we have contributed to a loss Blown call etc.)

100% in agreement with you. If you're good enough to win, you should be able to overcome a blown call or 2. Our game shouldn't have been close enough to put the ump in a position to influence the outcome at all.

"Sports do not build character. They reveal it."
Heywood Broun

I pose this question----

If a player does not get the work that he (or his dad) thinks he needs in practice what stops the boy from getting the work done on his own ?

Did Joe Torre tell Roger Clemens how to do his work outs--I think not !!!!

To be a good player one needs to do things on his or her own-- if does not happen at practice then he /she does it on their own at home.

TRhit

I do agree about working out on your own. My son was in basketball playoff recently, so he missed the first 3 weeks of baseball and those early scrimmages, as did 5 other players...

My son worked on his own during that time, 4 times a week with long toss, light bull pen, and he was already getting the running in basketball practice.

He didn't want to get to baseball and start throwing to hard to fast and wanted his arm to be ready...

He did this on his own...

Also, I might add that our JV coach had a death in the family last week, so Varsity coach had to cover at the last minute for that game...

He told Varsity guys to go to the tunnel, work out on their own, hitting and thowing, etc...

Guess how many went?

I think less than half...

It was clearly stated the the kid got work on his own, the complaint was that he never got to see live hitters. How do you overcome that? Join a second team? We are not talking about Joe Torre and Roger Clemons. We are talking about a HS coach and a kid. We are also not talking about out of season workouts. We are talking about in season practice. The analogy does not apply.

the Florida Bombers
"I love the HSBBW"

Bringing in posistion players in the middle of innings is nothing new in High School baseball. I dont think there are too many teams that have a pitching staff that does not play the field. Kids pitch in High School because they have strong arms and because of this they also play the field. He should have had him warm up between innings because the kid pitching has a tender arm. Do you warm up all your potential posistion players between innings because the guy on the hill might blow up. Posistion players should be loose because they throw between before innings anyway. Are they loose as in ready to pitch probaly not. But they get on the hill get their 8 pitches and do their job. I cant put my #2 #3 ot #4 on the bench so I can have them in the pen. They are three of my best players and I need them in the game. What do you do when #1 blows up in inning 1 and cant get anyone out? Bring in the water boy because you have time to get him loose because hes not in the game. No you bring in a posistion player and he does his job. Some of the stuff the coach did is ridiculous like bringing in the kid that pitch 80 pitches etc. But there also seems to be alot of excuse making going on here too.

If you read the original thread you will see that the only reason they lost to this inferior team is coaching. The kids had nothing to do with the loss and the winning team had nothing to do with the win. Is this also the case when you win? I bet its not. How about a little personal responsibility. I see the coach as a complete idiot for putting in the kid that pitched the previous day. Other than that I see a lot of cry babies. If your a stud then shut the door and if you cant, take it like a man. If you cant do that then blame the coach that always works.

As far as bringing in the boy that pitched 80 pitches the night before, that should not have happened. I don't have a problem bringing in a positional player to pitch out of a jam. I also think that sometimes we don't give other teams any credit for beating the "superior" teams. Last night for instance our team lost to a team that really didn't have as much talent as us, but beat us 13-12, largely in part to 5 HB, and 6 BB. Having said that, you can't cheat them out of their win, they won, and they deserved to win. To call a team inferior to yours, and they beat you doesn't say much for your team. Every team goes through horrible umpires, bad calls, bad breaks. It is the good teams that fight through it and find a way to win, even when they are not playing their best game. Don't know about anyone else, but last night that "inferior" team beat the heck out of us, because of one reason, they wanted it more. Good luck to everyone this baseball season, and hope to see you down the road.

You know as a Coach I know when the other team if more talented than mine. And I know when mine is more talented. I won alot of times over more talented teams and I've got it handed to me by inferior talented teams. But the umpires never beat me. The field conditions never beat me. The weather never beat me. Ive made some bone head calls at third that contributed to a loss. Ive made some bone head substitutions that contributed to a loss. Ive made some good coaching moves that contributed to wins and Ive made some good substitutions that contributed to wins. But in the end the players win and the players loose the games. As soon as players start thinking that the outcome of a game is out of their controll and in the hands of coachs or umpires or whatever then they have lost.

Coach May---Right on!!

It's so simple---Throw the ball, catch the ball.

Coach May,

If a coach puts a kid out on the mound with a history of tender arm, then the coach should have somebody warm up lightly between at bats. I have done it and there is no excuse not to think ahead.

I cannot condone a coach putting in a kid who threw a complete game the night before. That being said, if he does that I am not going to give him the benefit of the doubt on the other stuff. I would never defend a coach who did something like that. I can't. He has proved his ineptitude. I will pick my battles in which I defend or give the benefit of the doubt to a coach.

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Last night for instance our team lost to a team that really didn't have as much talent as us, but beat us 13-12, largely in part to 5 HB, and 6 BB. Having said that, you can't cheat them out of their win, they won, and they deserved to win.

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You said nothing different than VoodooChile did.

the Florida Bombers
"I love the HSBBW"

BIG

Have you not heard of friends taking BP and fielding practice together--- you don't need a coach--if the kid is not seeing live hitters then he gets his buddies together for some old style BP--as in "hey guys lets go to the field--I hit first"

Why didn't you say so?
LOL
You are assuming they still do that!

That I agree with.

Hey I like this text color thing.

TR, WHEN does the kid do this? Read the post. IN season so daily practices; around here those run from cleats-on after to school till too-dark-to-see. Week ends they are in tourneys or games. He can get regular on own work in offseason not in season. Quit trying to blame the Kids ALL the time. You are worse than those who constantly bitch about the coaches; your posts all read there are no bad coaches only bad kids. Jeez go play so cc er or sumthin

Big hit 15

Yes I guess I am blind. I asked the question as to who they should adress their concern. To the AD to the coach to the principal maybe get a lawyer(smile) as this seems to be the mode of the day. I guess you have to go to somebody. Lets set some sort of system. Maybe after each game the coach could have sort of a meeting (like a press conference) with the parents. field questions about why he did what he did. why so and so did not play. this would eliminate any phone calls or letters or sniping in the stands. Get it out in the open. What do you think?

This may not have to do with original post, but here are some intersting issues. I always felt that if a game was close, everyone was hitting, pitching was fine it comes down to the better coached team as to who will win or who will lose. But sometimes there are circumstances.
Our team is weak on pitching, yet we have two good pitchers who have not pitched because they "hurt" somewhere. They have been hurting since the end of summer, just recently went to doctor. Can not blame this on the coach, why did the parents wait so long? He finally gave an ultimatum to the kids. One of our best hitters had to sit out game the other night, he got in trouble in school, rules are when that happens, you sit the bench. Even if it should mean the game. In this case, he could have made a difference in those 3 runs we lost by.
After the game I met up with one of the kids who plays position and supposed to be a reliever. He pitched just a few innings so far this year. Since my son is the #1 pitcher they rely on, I asked him why he is not pitching to help out(thinking it was the coach). His answer was he feels that the coach doesn't give him enough time at practice to work on his pitching! With infield practice and hitting practice, there is just not enough time. He went into a game as a reliever and was pulled after two innings and refuses to pitch now because he "lost his confidence". And besides, he feels he is not a reliever. Hello..... I told him this was HS ball not major league here. I asked him why he didn't take lessons (plenty of money) to work on improvements, there was no answer . I was just floored. Here's another one, our #2 pitcher has highest BA in our district (in 6A). He is not bad pitcher, not doing well this year. However, coach told me that he is on him everyday about concentrating more on pitching skills in practice, he spends most of his time in the cage. What is with these kids?
Whenever we lose a game the blame falls on the coach. I am sure this is common. Sometimes we just don't know all that coaches have to put up with, especially on the HS level.
I know Voodoo child takes personal responsibility for seeing that if his son doesn't get in his workout at school he works with a pitching coach, does what he can as a parent to help his son improve. I don't know much about his son's coach. However I am learning little by little a coach only has so much to work with, sometimes it is not always poor pitching, poor hitting, poor umpiring or poor coaching. In our case I think there are too many i's in team here.
HS coaching is what it is.

justme

The three week period apparently had a spring break and no games--- during that period the players if they are not getting enough work in practice they can work on their own

You don't need a coach around to practice on your own===

Will your post has very little to do with this thread.

I will repeat what I wrote earlier.

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I cannot condone a coach putting in a kid who threw a complete game the night before. That being said, if he does that I am not going to give him the benefit of the doubt on the other stuff. I would never defend a coach who did something like that. I can't. He has proved his ineptitude. I will pick my battles in which I defend or give the benefit of the doubt to a coach.

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I know that you feel there are bigger issues and that everything is all the parents fault.

There is a lot of overcoming going on out there!

Here in the NE you cannot play outside HS during season---saves a lot of wear and tear

Overcoming is often referred to paying your dues. I agree that there is bunches of it going on, but if it don't kill'ya it'll make you stronger.

The coaching situation is all relative to ones situation. If your playing for Joe Torre, all is wonderful, people are great, the games are a blast, the team wins non-stop.

If you're playing for some wack job, your situation could be viewed as somewhat less fullfilling.

My point is those outside the situation, even just from the perimeter of the situation, are much less informed than those fully involved.

If someone tells me that the coach is qualified or not, in their particular situation, who am I to say they are wrong.

quote:

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Originally posted by Bighit15:
There is a lot of overcoming going on out there!

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First, I mean no disrespect to BigHit15 on this post. I'm simply using his quote to demonstrate a point.

I understand that there are "bad coaches" out there just as there are "bad parents." I also think that few realize the position of being a high school coach. You're told in the interview that winning isn't the most important thing but then again, if you lose then you're fired. We are expected to be experts in the classroom and on the playing field. That in itself is a monumental task. You accept it with the positions. Then, as in my case, you're expected to be a husband, father and community role model.

What the public does not see is the rest. This past month, my Mother-in-Law has passed away after a 5-year vegetative state. My Uncle (My Mom's 1st brother) died and was buried Monday. My Mom's other brother had to have his legs removed that same day and may die any day now. My Aunt, who is my Mom's sister is in critical condition with pneumonia. My Dad receives word tonight on where he has lung cancer or not. My Mom in now in a wheelchair because of all of this stress. Of less importance, our stud colt broke its neck because the horse trainer turned him into the wrong pen and he panicked. My daughter failed the first test of her life because we are not home for her to study. She is devastated since she is the only girl on "High Honors" in her class and now she might just be "Honors."

Take all of this into account and then figure in we had a referendum fail and so, my program was one of 3 programs in our school that will lose a coach. My coaching staff is comprised of guys that I hand picked to turn this program around. I have been here 6 years. We have won back to back Regional Championships. In the history of this school, they only won two and so, we have doubled that. We have averaged 22 wins per year and have won a couple of conference championships. I had to put a name on a desk this morning of one of the best guys and most loyal people I know to be cut out of my program. I only hope that by Friday, I don’t lose a level. On Friday, we play our first game. It is pouring outside right now. I just found out that we can't get a gym tonight. ALL NIGHT! Believe me, I could go on and on. This isn't half of the list I created after reading the comment of overcoming. Are there bad coaches out there? Sure? Are there good coaches out there? You bet! When anyone speaks of overcoming, walk a mile in their shoes and then be the judge.

A friend of mine who coached for years and is now a principal...

he said he remembers how if you win, everyone wins...and everyone takes credit...

but if you lose, you lose alone....

TR and Coach MAy: READ THE FRIKKIN POST! TR Its not a period of inactivity for the hs team; it is in fact a period of high activity with TEAM games and practices. The problem is the individuals INACTIVITY with respect to getting enuff pitching work in WITHIN THE FRAMEWORK of the REQUIRED team activity. Sounds like there is no plan for actually working the pitchers AS PART OF THE NORMAL TEAM ACTIVITY. There should be dont you think? I mean wouldnt you think it strange if they didnt have batting practice? or infield practice?
Coach May its not an outside team; its the same team.
You guys kill me. You are in such a rush to condemn the player you dont even take time to read the post, which clearly describes a poorly run program that doesnt have a ptching program in place. Open your eyes.