I have liked the vast majority of my players. There have been some that I did not like. But as long as they did what we asked them to do and followed the team rules the best players play regardless of wether I like them or not. It should not be an *** ******* contest as to who gets on the field. As far as the parents I have liked most and some have been a pain in the neck. I have never held anything against a player because the parent was a pain. The kid can not help it if the parent is a nut case. But we dont recruit. As a college coach I can sure understand passing on a kid if the parent is percieved as HM. I dont have that luxury in HS. If we have a parent that is HM we just tell them face to face. It is their decision if they feel that they need to go play somewhere else. If the problem persists and they choose to stay in the program (HM parent) we take the steps to keep them away (practices etc). Now if a player is HM we just cut them. They either do it the way everyone else is expected to do it or they find another place to play. JMHO
This is quite the interesting discussion. It seems to me that coaches today want to emphasize rules, rules, rules. What is the responsibility of coaches to these kids? There is an epidemic of arm injuries in baseball today and the discussion is about HM parents. These kids deserve better. The traditional pitching motion is done, busted, kaput. Where are ths coaches that will step forward and change the way kids pitch? How many coaches so hell bent on rules know when each of the important growth plates close? How many of you know the damage supinating the release of pitches causes to these kids. Your reapnse: find another program! How many coaches know the primary muscles involved in pitching a baseball? Arm injuries cost baseball teams in the vicinity of $100MM per year and you look to the hot pitcher du jour to guide you.
Who is calling what to pitch on your team? I rarely see a team where the coach let's the pitcher pitch or lets the catcher call the game. Kids are taught to obey rules and be tough. Great. Russians were good ast that but it did not do much for their creativity. If these kids are going to compete in the larger game of life I strongly suggest you give the game back to the kids and stop worryiong about the HM parent.
Who is calling what to pitch on your team? I rarely see a team where the coach let's the pitcher pitch or lets the catcher call the game. Kids are taught to obey rules and be tough. Great. Russians were good ast that but it did not do much for their creativity. If these kids are going to compete in the larger game of life I strongly suggest you give the game back to the kids and stop worryiong about the HM parent.
URKMB,
Thanks
I think HS sports are part of our children's education because they provide a "safe" environment for testing and developing character. Sports are a microcosm enabling fast learning, chances to stretch oneself, tests to learn how to behave when you really care, and the opportunity to observe both the intended and unintended consequences of one's choices (including the choices of parents and coaches). Ultimately, success in the real world (professional success, family success, social success, spiritual success, etc.) is governed by our charcter - a life long development project that our sons are now in charge of for themselves.
Thanks
I think HS sports are part of our children's education because they provide a "safe" environment for testing and developing character. Sports are a microcosm enabling fast learning, chances to stretch oneself, tests to learn how to behave when you really care, and the opportunity to observe both the intended and unintended consequences of one's choices (including the choices of parents and coaches). Ultimately, success in the real world (professional success, family success, social success, spiritual success, etc.) is governed by our charcter - a life long development project that our sons are now in charge of for themselves.
I would agree and also add that HS sports can often provide a wonderful opportunity for an individual to learn what it is like to be part of a high performance team. When I ask clients to describe when they have ever experienced being part of a high performance team, they almost always describe experiences they have had at the high school or college level - usually (although not always) in athletics.
Hey everyone if you wanted a definition of HM check out Kharma. Seriously Kharma do you really have a clue? We have rules we have expectations of our players just as parents do, I hope. On one hand you suggest that we controll the pitches a player throws then go on to say that we should allow the catchers and pitchers to call the games. I personally want my catcher to have the ability to call a game but he has to be mature and experienced enough to do it. Sometimes they are and sometimes they are not. It depends on the kid and what we have at that particular time available to us. Most HS coaches that I know are very protective of their players health and care greatly about them on and off the field. Maybe you have had a bad experience. If so I am sorry. Your comments lead me to believe that you are not very informed about what you are speaking about. I dont mean to sound abrasive but I am speaking honestly to you.
Wow!!! I didn't know I was such a problem 
Coach May:
It sounds like you have been coaching awhile. Have any of your pitchers ever hurt their arms. Did you blame it on the kid? Was his arm slot wrong? BS. Was he not bending far enough at the waist? BS. Was his arm slot incorrect? More BS. Do you agree that there is an epidemic of arm injuries? Do you allow your kids to supinate the release of their curve balls (turn their thumb up)? Or do you let yourself off the hook by saying arm injuries are just a part of baseball? The worst BS!
Something tells me you will refrain from answering my specific questions. It's so much easier to revert to name calling.
It sounds like you have been coaching awhile. Have any of your pitchers ever hurt their arms. Did you blame it on the kid? Was his arm slot wrong? BS. Was he not bending far enough at the waist? BS. Was his arm slot incorrect? More BS. Do you agree that there is an epidemic of arm injuries? Do you allow your kids to supinate the release of their curve balls (turn their thumb up)? Or do you let yourself off the hook by saying arm injuries are just a part of baseball? The worst BS!
Something tells me you will refrain from answering my specific questions. It's so much easier to revert to name calling.
Kharma...what is your point??? That coaches are horrible and parents can do no wrong.
The subject was about HM parents...and yes they do exist.
In regards to coaches you are right there are plenty of coaches that have issues as you note in your earlierrants, oops I mean points. BUT thats not the subject. Your points may warrant a separate topic discussion.
In regards to coaches blaming the kid, or arm slot issues etc... If you have a kid who is a pitcher and don't have faith in a coaches pitching knowledge either get him private lessons from a instructor who has the background and expertise and/or get him off the team if you think he is hurting the kids arm. Most of these coaches try their best but they are doing this out of love for the game on nights and weekends between a job and and everything else in life.
IMO...there are very few coaches who can coach pitching at an advanced level. To be able to take a kids natural motion and adjust the player as an individual vs. trying to get every kid to pitch the with the exact same motion. To be a pitching coach takes a special talent and gift.
A HM parent may not see it that way though...and blame the coach
The subject was about HM parents...and yes they do exist.
In regards to coaches you are right there are plenty of coaches that have issues as you note in your earlier
In regards to coaches blaming the kid, or arm slot issues etc... If you have a kid who is a pitcher and don't have faith in a coaches pitching knowledge either get him private lessons from a instructor who has the background and expertise and/or get him off the team if you think he is hurting the kids arm. Most of these coaches try their best but they are doing this out of love for the game on nights and weekends between a job and and everything else in life.
IMO...there are very few coaches who can coach pitching at an advanced level. To be able to take a kids natural motion and adjust the player as an individual vs. trying to get every kid to pitch the with the exact same motion. To be a pitching coach takes a special talent and gift.
A HM parent may not see it that way though...and blame the coach
My thoughts, and a healthy dose of reality
We will all encounter a few HM parents, as well a a few HM coaches over our baseball years, some more than others. Many of us have even been the HM parent/coach on a rare occassion.
Now if you are one of those parents who has encountered MOSTLY HM coaches, or you are a coach who feels the MAJORITY of parents are HM then it is time to take a long hard look in the mirror.
YOU ARE THE PROBLEM. No one is that "unlucky".
Ever seen what happens when two bulls collide? Ever notice how even the meakest animal can become viscious when backed into a corner?
Your own actions can be a major contributing factor to the problems you are having.
We will all encounter a few HM parents, as well a a few HM coaches over our baseball years, some more than others. Many of us have even been the HM parent/coach on a rare occassion.
Now if you are one of those parents who has encountered MOSTLY HM coaches, or you are a coach who feels the MAJORITY of parents are HM then it is time to take a long hard look in the mirror.
YOU ARE THE PROBLEM. No one is that "unlucky".
Ever seen what happens when two bulls collide? Ever notice how even the meakest animal can become viscious when backed into a corner?
Your own actions can be a major contributing factor to the problems you are having.
AParent,
A very wise observation!
A very wise observation!
.
First...Kudo's.
OverseasDad...your last post about sports as an arena for testing and building character has to be one of the most astute statments I have seen made about sport in a long,long time. I nominate this for the Hall of Fame thread section all by itself!
Second....with all due respects...
While IMO I too feel that a coaches attitude and burn out level in great part dictates how many Jerky High Maintenace parents (JHMP) he creates and perceives....
I do also believe that the very reason that thread like this even exists and has such long life is that we all feel that the JHMP factor is seriously on the rise and has been for some time.
As the pressure ratchets up, as the emotional, and monetary cost of creating, marketing and placing college athletes increases, the perceived reward on investment for the involved parents increases dramatically. And the temptation to manipulate that process increases. Frankly I see it increasingly in my travels in the four sports I am involved with. I would be willing to be you all see it in yours as well....
For the sake of brevity I won't go into specific instances but I've got lots of stories and IMO you'd have to be blind not to see the increase.
.
First...Kudo's.
OverseasDad...your last post about sports as an arena for testing and building character has to be one of the most astute statments I have seen made about sport in a long,long time. I nominate this for the Hall of Fame thread section all by itself!
Second....with all due respects...
While IMO I too feel that a coaches attitude and burn out level in great part dictates how many Jerky High Maintenace parents (JHMP) he creates and perceives....
I do also believe that the very reason that thread like this even exists and has such long life is that we all feel that the JHMP factor is seriously on the rise and has been for some time.
As the pressure ratchets up, as the emotional, and monetary cost of creating, marketing and placing college athletes increases, the perceived reward on investment for the involved parents increases dramatically. And the temptation to manipulate that process increases. Frankly I see it increasingly in my travels in the four sports I am involved with. I would be willing to be you all see it in yours as well....
For the sake of brevity I won't go into specific instances but I've got lots of stories and IMO you'd have to be blind not to see the increase.
.
IMO.....high maintenance parents only appear when coaches allow them to appear. Coaches who are good and professional are able to prevent any potential HM parents from becoming a distraction to the team, the team's preparation, and the players on the team. That is why there are more HM parents at lower levels of athletics, and fewer at the higher levels.
.
I, for one, have in the past underestimated the ablity of HM parents to disrupt even the best laid plans of the best coaches.
I have watched HM high school parents use libelous internet accusations, letters, calls, angry confrontations of Principals, athletic directors, and school boards, anonymous phone calls regarding minor or phantom rules violations, calls to local papers, petitions, lawsuits....
.
I, for one, have in the past underestimated the ablity of HM parents to disrupt even the best laid plans of the best coaches.
I have watched HM high school parents use libelous internet accusations, letters, calls, angry confrontations of Principals, athletic directors, and school boards, anonymous phone calls regarding minor or phantom rules violations, calls to local papers, petitions, lawsuits....
.
Kharma,
NC dad answered for me. Sorry you had a bad experience. I wish you the best.
NC dad answered for me. Sorry you had a bad experience. I wish you the best.
Grateful 44
They will appear no matter what the coach does or does not do.
They will appear no matter what the coach does or does not do.
observer 44
Talking to other coaches and from personal experience when the HM parent or parents get together they can be very disruptive. The anonymous phone calls and letters are the tools of choice for some.
Talking to other coaches and from personal experience when the HM parent or parents get together they can be very disruptive. The anonymous phone calls and letters are the tools of choice for some.
I am certified to teach K-8. I would not even attempt to educate high school kids. It takes a special person to understand and tolerate this age group. Most high school baseball coaches are teachers first and coaches second, giving up many after school hours to work with our kids. Can you imagine trying to force history or math into these kids all day, then spending from 3pm till dark with a group of energetic teenage boys in the spring, when kids begin to lose focus on school? Especially seniors! Then throw in HM parents to deal with off the field! And all at the expense of your own family.
I haven't always agreed with everything our high school coach has done, but I know his heart is in the right place and I cut him some slack! Let the coaches coach and let the kids play. We're all in this for the same reason... we want these boys to get all the benefits of playing the greatest game ever and being a part of a life-learning experience. Unless the coach isn't qualified to work with kids and you feel he is inflicting harm upon children, parents need to step back and let the baseball happen. It may not be perfect, but few things in life are. Even the negative lessons become important life-lessons! The good usually outweighs the bad in the end.
I haven't always agreed with everything our high school coach has done, but I know his heart is in the right place and I cut him some slack! Let the coaches coach and let the kids play. We're all in this for the same reason... we want these boys to get all the benefits of playing the greatest game ever and being a part of a life-learning experience. Unless the coach isn't qualified to work with kids and you feel he is inflicting harm upon children, parents need to step back and let the baseball happen. It may not be perfect, but few things in life are. Even the negative lessons become important life-lessons! The good usually outweighs the bad in the end.
Hi Coach May:
As I expected you did not answer my very specific questions. Neither did NC dad. You chalk up tough questions to HM parents. You take the easy way out by saying you're doing your best and if you don't like it find another team/coach. The America love it or leave it mentality. I'm sure you tell the parents that you want the kids to give 100%. My question to you is when are you going to give 100% of you mental energy. How many of your impressionable players have to ruin their arms because you are trying your best. Sometimes your best isn't good enough. I suspect you can do better. I know you van do better
You called me out as an HM parent. For the record my son's coaches have probably been much like you. Well intentioned men who sincerely believe they are doing their best. I'm here to tell you that you are not doing your best and you should keep an open mind. You must change the way you teach your kids how to pitch. But then you may have to irritate the NC dads of the world who think they know baseball.
As I expected you did not answer my very specific questions. Neither did NC dad. You chalk up tough questions to HM parents. You take the easy way out by saying you're doing your best and if you don't like it find another team/coach. The America love it or leave it mentality. I'm sure you tell the parents that you want the kids to give 100%. My question to you is when are you going to give 100% of you mental energy. How many of your impressionable players have to ruin their arms because you are trying your best. Sometimes your best isn't good enough. I suspect you can do better. I know you van do better
You called me out as an HM parent. For the record my son's coaches have probably been much like you. Well intentioned men who sincerely believe they are doing their best. I'm here to tell you that you are not doing your best and you should keep an open mind. You must change the way you teach your kids how to pitch. But then you may have to irritate the NC dads of the world who think they know baseball.
Kharma.....I don't know you and I don't know Coach May. Are you trying to tell us that there is not one coach in the country that gives a complete offort in his coaching?
Grateful: I couldn't agree more! To run a successful organization takes alot of different skills and the knowledge and wisdom on how and when to use them. If HM parents have to be dealt with then it can be expected,to be successful,that plenty of those skills will be required to keep them in check. It may prove wiser to employ those skills upfront and maneuver in a way that eliminates the HM parent altogether. That of course is easier said than done.
Do HM parents exist in fantasy baseball? Maybe 'trading cards' with their most notable escapades ond outbursts listed would be helpful! Only the HM parents that have made it to the 'majors' would be printed up... and sour apple bubblegum! Topps, Donruss, Upper Deck can you hear me!?
Do HM parents exist in fantasy baseball? Maybe 'trading cards' with their most notable escapades ond outbursts listed would be helpful! Only the HM parents that have made it to the 'majors' would be printed up... and sour apple bubblegum! Topps, Donruss, Upper Deck can you hear me!?
Grateful: My comments on agreeing with you were generated from your post on Sept. 25 and not the one just above posted earlier today. Didn't want you to be confused!
going back to the original post and how you can diffuse the troublesome parent- usually asking them to help (help prep the field, held raise funds, help make calls, help in anyway) usually shuts them up and sends them running. It's usually the ones that never contribute their time and effort that have all the suggestions and complaints.
Grateful"
Coached May called me out as a HM parent. I don't think he knows me but that's fine so I thought I'd probe him on his ability as a coach.
To answer your question, the vast majority of coaches are not giving a complete effort when it comes to the correct way to teach the skills of baseball, especially pitching.
This is my last post on this subject. This seems to be a very collegial web site. My post are akin to bringing up the war in Iraq. We only want happy news. Ergo, the Coach Mays will be happy to know that I will be easing off the site. Just think what they used to call Ralph Nader when he insisted that seat belts be put in cars. The way we are teaching are sons is akin to not wearing seat belts.
Coached May called me out as a HM parent. I don't think he knows me but that's fine so I thought I'd probe him on his ability as a coach.
To answer your question, the vast majority of coaches are not giving a complete effort when it comes to the correct way to teach the skills of baseball, especially pitching.
This is my last post on this subject. This seems to be a very collegial web site. My post are akin to bringing up the war in Iraq. We only want happy news. Ergo, the Coach Mays will be happy to know that I will be easing off the site. Just think what they used to call Ralph Nader when he insisted that seat belts be put in cars. The way we are teaching are sons is akin to not wearing seat belts.
Kharma,
Please don't "ease off" the site. Leave quickly LOL
I think you are full of **** and I sincerely hope you are removed as soon as possible.
No easing here pal.
Please don't "ease off" the site. Leave quickly LOL
I think you are full of **** and I sincerely hope you are removed as soon as possible.
No easing here pal.
Kharma you dont know anything about me. As a matter of fact you probaly dont know any HS coaches with the exception of the one that you think did you wrong. You paint everyone with the same wide brush out of ignorance. Please dont go away mad, just go away.
How do parents become High maintenance is a question that should be asked.
Will: Some HM parents become that way because they are not rooted in reality when it comes to the ability of their sons or daughters.
When their perception of reality conflicts with actual reality they, by virtue of their personality, kind of go nuts and spin out.
Sometimes athletes are genuinely dissed for who knows what reason and everyone can agree that some response,including parent involvement, is justified.
When it is apparent to all of those watching that parent involvement is NOT justified then you have a HM moment... and often it isn't pretty.
If all parents could somehow be rooted in reality with reasonable expectations then this HM problem may diminish.
When their perception of reality conflicts with actual reality they, by virtue of their personality, kind of go nuts and spin out.
Sometimes athletes are genuinely dissed for who knows what reason and everyone can agree that some response,including parent involvement, is justified.
When it is apparent to all of those watching that parent involvement is NOT justified then you have a HM moment... and often it isn't pretty.
If all parents could somehow be rooted in reality with reasonable expectations then this HM problem may diminish.