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17 replies

Elbow pain and stop playing

D dolphindan1100+ posts
My son a freshman was called up to varsity at the end of the JV season...he pitched in almost every game on JV only started once but came into relieve and 2 or 3 games he came in the 1st or 2nd inning in relief and finished the game...He is a lefty and throws decent....he was clocked last summer at 72...so I would venture to guess he is 75ish...anway they call alot of curveballs, the pitching guy is in love with them...My son played for the same pitching coach in travel ball and again lots of curveballs for about a year straight...My son says they call 1 or 2 a batter...well now he has been complaining of elbow pain...inside of elbow between funny bone and inside bone...he has been icing and taking ibuprofen and I told the varsity coach about it...He says ok no throwing bullpen or outfield...anyway My sone picks up his clean clothes last night and about hits the floor in pain...I tell the coach and I schedule an appointment the next day but they cant see him till next week...whats funny when I tell the coach about the appointment and what happend with the clothes he tells me well he has been favoring it in practice....this after I told him he has been hurting...My fault I guess...My question is do I stop him from playing till the appointment or what? He says there is no pain when he throws just after he gets home....they have no conditioning for pitchers or throwing...all they do is tell the pitchers to go throw about 20 pitches and its un-supervised...they never threw bullpen in JV practice they just went game to game and pitched...So I am a bit frustrated about the lack of instruction they are getting...anyway what do i do about the rest of this week...2 practices and a game? and perhaps a playoff game on saturday....thanks for any advice
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coach2709coach270910,000+ posts
Rest while waiting to go to the doctor. Find out what the doctor says and possibly get a second opinion to verify what the first one found. Your son is probably done for a significant amount of time since he at least needs to rest his arm.

Your son doesn't owe these guys anything because they didn't try everything in their power to protect him.
D dolphindan1100+ posts
Just wanted to update...My son went to Orthapedic Dr and he didnt do an MRI but did an xray for somereason. saw nothing...He did put his arm thru a series of tests and basically said he may have a minor tear, to rest it for 6 weeks and we are gonna send him to Physical therapy...Now I had scheduled a second opinion appt before this appointment. My question now is do I take him to that appt or go with what first Dr says...

He says he didnt want to do MRI because he would inject a contrast into elbow and it would swell it for 4 or 5 days and would hurt and that would keep him from playing but says he should rest for 6 weeks...weird
Bulldog 19Bulldog 195,000+ posts
quote:
My son went to Orthapedic Dr and he didnt do an MRI but did an xray for somereason. saw nothing


He likely did an x-ray to rule out bone spurs and possible growth plate problems. He likely didn't do an MRI because those are EXPENSIVE so if his clinical evaluation didn't warrant concern about a possible rupture he's not going to take that step right away.

quote:
My question now is do I take him to that appt or go with what first Dr says...


That is something that falls completely on you. Are you comfortable with the answer you got from this physician? If not, take him to the other appointment and see what happens. But don't be surprised if you get told the same thing...
slottyslotty500+ posts
The New York Times, October 28, 2011

Sports Medicine Said to Overuse M.R.I.’s
By GINA KOLATA

Dr. James Andrews, a widely known sports medicine orthopedist in Gulf Breeze, Fla., wanted to test his suspicion that M.R.I.’s, the scans given to almost every injured athlete or casual exerciser, might be a bit misleading. So he scanned the shoulders of 31 perfectly healthy professional baseball pitchers.

The pitchers were not injured and had no pain. But the M.R.I.’s found abnormal shoulder cartilage in 90 percent of them and abnormal rotator cuff tendons in 87 percent. “If you want an excuse to operate on a pitcher’s throwing shoulder, just get an M.R.I.,” Dr. Andrews says.

He and other eminent sports medicine specialists are taking a stand against what they see as the vast overuse of magnetic resonance imaging in their specialty.

M.R.I.’s can be invaluable in certain situations — finding serious problems like tumors or helping distinguish between competing diagnoses that fit a patient’s history and symptoms. They also can make money for doctors who own their own machines. And they can please sports medicine patients, who often expect a scan.

But scans are easily misinterpreted and can result in misdiagnoses leading to unnecessary or even harmful treatments....


http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10...ad-doctors-warn.html
Last edited by slotty
G Golfman2510,000+ posts
Go get the second opinion. He did the X-ray cause it is cheap and fast. Will show bone and growth plate issues.

Also call your insurance company and ask if they have any special providers for an MRI. I found out by luck that my company, aetna, has special preferred provider and it cost only about $500 for a recent MRI. I would push to get one done. If you have a serious issue you can start on a fix sooner rather than finding out later that physical therapy isn't enough. Good luck.
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
I agree with the article and that the second opinion will probably be the same.

Your insurance may not allow an MRI until after the PT. So be prepared to possibly pay out of pocket, depending on your insurance.

And what will you do if he has a slight tear, operate? They don't even do that on the pro level, they rehab first.

Asking if he should continue to play this week just boggles my mind, if he is in pain, why would you, or perhaps if he went to play basketball it really isn't as bad as it appears?

It is your responsibility as a parent to do your homework on conditioning and routine for pitchers and not have him play for a coach that has no clue what he is doing.

If that coach says he noticed your son favoring his elbow and didn't stop him from playing or notify you, he has no clue what he is doing.

JMO.
Last edited by TPM
B bball123100+ posts
You're got some good advices here. Shut him down until you can root cause the issue. When my son was 11, he had a elbow sore. His FB was about 62 and was throwing CB. I could not figure out if it's the FB or CB that causes it. When to the doctor, had the MRI. Luckily he was fine, a little fluid in the elbow. Doctor said no more CB and rest. I shut him down for the rest of the season, no all stars etc.. Last year, he was 12, allowed to only throw FB, got away with it as he could throw faster than most batters could swing. However, he started in almost every game and pitched way too much. He started to develop a sore on the upper arm at the end of the season. Another round of PT and six month later, he is fine now. So take care of the issue early on.
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
I just read over your previous posts.

I see issues, I wouldn't blame everything on the coach.

Read over your own posts, especially the one in "Do your pitcher's practice pitching?"

I can see why you felt the need to get another opinion. You probably can't buy into the fact that your son may have a tear somewhere, with all the pitching and playing he has done, I would not be shocked.

If you felt it was too much you had a right to stop it, but according to my opinion, with you , as with so many, more is better.

In other words, you are the parent, it's time to take control and responsibility if your son is injured.
D dolphindan1100+ posts
Easy TPM...I dont feel that way at all...I was only trying to get thoughts from people who had been through it before...thats all...for the record 3 pitchers from same program were over used...one had torn ligaments in his shoulder and in obvious pain and had an obvious loss of velocity and the coach tells him to toughen up...

You are right I should have said something and did...when he was called up I told coach he would not do any pitching, until he was cleared...well he dressed and never practiced or played after that....

He ended up having a growth plate issue and the "Tommy John Ligament" was weak..The second opinion Doctor was great...My son went to PT 2 times a week and was cleared to play yesterday He was also diligent in doig the PT at home and not doing anything with his arm...He still has some soreness occasionally but doctor said to start easing into throwing and if it gets bad again come back and see him...He said he is noticeably stronger in elbow and shoulder form the PT

His showcase coach has been great and told him no pitching in first tourney this week...and they will ease him into it with only a inning or two in his first action the next tourney, want him ready for the PG tourney in Atlanta...and caba WS in July

I tried hard to talk him into taking the summer off but he wants to give it a go...we will see what happens...I also told him if he stays at current school I will have a hard time letting him play for them...I am sure on this site I will get blasted for saying that too...but I dont really care blast away

Thanks for all the responses...I even appreciate the ones that put all the blame on me for considering a second opinion and saying I only cared about him getting his time...I think thats totally BS
Bulldog 19Bulldog 195,000+ posts
quote:
I tried hard to talk him into taking the summer off but he wants to give it a go...we will see what happens...I also told him if he stays at current school I will have a hard time letting him play for them...I am sure on this site I will get blasted for saying that too...but I dont really care blast away


Here is where you have to be the adult and TELL HIM to take the summer off. I am not a proponent of all the summer activities as it is (you can find that in my previous posts all over) but with a recent injury I definitely DO NOT support it. If he continues to push it, further injury will come...

I went with one of my athletes to her doctor's appointment the other day. She is coming off of surgery for an unrelated injury. The question came up about summer activities and the PA basically told her "if you're not in the top 5% in the country forget about it." Wait until the season comes back.
CADadCADad5,000+ posts
The x-ray is virtually required by the insurance companies before allowing any other type of imaging. 2nd opinions are almost always a good idea. My son went to see the surgeon who is currently probably the most popular for the pro's out here on the west coast. He was fairly useless in my son's case. He went to a second doctor who came up with a conservative treatment program that helped some. In the end, surgery would've been required to give him a chance to pitch again with not that great of a chance of success so he gave up on pitching.

1 to 2 curves a batter doesn't seem totally out of bounds especially for a soft tossing lefty.

It is interesting that there would be some indication of UCL problems at that velocity. I guess curves may contribute to elbow soreness.

I agree that the best course would be to take most or all of the summer off. I also realize that it is difficult for parents and kids to get themselves to do it.

BTW, I can remember my son being told that one should play long toss the day after soreness from pitching - because that's what Dice-K did.
Last edited by CADad
D DPElite9910+ posts
based on experience I would shut down ANY throwing and run to get an MRI. My son started having issues and we went to two respected orthopedic groups in our area who just did xrays and both blamed it on Tendonitis. Their advice; "sometime you will have to play through pain".

We then asked around and found a very good surgeon who deals with many baseball players. He tok about 60 seconds to diagnose a torn UCL and confirmed it with an MRI. The UCL was for all practical purposes gone, destroyed. As a result my son lost both his sophomore AND junior HS seasons. With 18 months hard work he is finally back and improving. Only wish I could have gone to this surgeon initially.

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