Are the rosters you currently see on the schools websites their fall roster? I’ve been told to compare fall/spring rosters to get an idea on turnover. I’m sure there are many variables that go into differing rosters, but did want to save a fall roster on several schools and see how they change in the spring.
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Most in SEC are not and a lot of D1 rosters are not posted until spring. You won't see all of them until right before spring season starts. Have to research to know whether it is last years or this years. Look at freshmen and see when they came in is easiest.
Most of the fall rosters that you see in D1/D2 & some D3 are made up of returning players and high profile transfers that are sure to be on the spring roster. Freshmen & JuCo transfers are often not shown on fall rosters at 4 year schools. Even at some JuCos all players are not listed. For all of these reasons it’s best to get your information from someone that is (or has been) in the program.
Ours currently only shows returning players.
Anyone interested in looking at 4 year rosters, google "2023 baseball rosters".
Depending on how you value your time and the effort involved, all available 2022 Fall rosters have been published as 2023 preliminary.
In free version of Team Roster Turnover Dashboard, some information is limited
For our demo schools (e.g. UConn or LSU), you can see all information and drill down on the details
https://collegebaseballinsight...nover-insights-free/
E.G Conference USA - UNC Charlotte
Team Roster Turnover Dashboard
Team Roster Turnover by Position
Outgoing Players
Incoming Players
Total No. of Transfers on Roster
Team Roster Insights
All but 1 kid (a walk on RHP) on our fall roster. 35 now and walk on would make 36. This is last week of fall team training.
@used2lurk posted:All but 1 kid (a walk on RHP) on our fall roster. 35 now and walk on would make 36. This is last week of fall team training.
Important to note that we were told there was a roster spot for each commit and there was. The walk on will most likely make the roster with at least 2 covid seniors.
@used2lurk posted:Important to note that we were told there was a roster spot for each commit and there was. The walk on will most likely make the roster with at least 2 covid seniors.
Curious about what level of program you are talking about. D1, D2, D3, NAIA, JuCo?
Ours has every player listed including recruited walk ons except a couple of walk ons that were just added after a tryout. We are at 44 and with the Covid Sr rule can keep the max of 40. The new walk ons put us at 47 I think.
@d-mac posted:Ours has every player listed including recruited walk ons except a couple of walk ons that were just added after a tryout. We are at 44 and with the Covid Sr rule can keep the max of 40. The new walk ons put us at 47 I think.
This should not be allowed to happen! If the max roster spots are 40, there should never be more than 40 on a fall roster. BS!!!
@BaseballMOM05 posted:This should not be allowed to happen! If the max roster spots are 40, there should never be more than 40 on a fall roster. BS!!!
I don't have a problem going over as long as it isn't too much. 44 for 40 spots isn't too bad when you consider one kid is going to miss his girlfriend, one will get in trouble and a few will get hurt. I don't count the other guys because they are probably just bodies to help through the Fall.
@D-mac - I am going to disrespectfully disagree with that. I think a 40-man roster is too many to begin with. I get and agree with all that you said - miss his girlfriend, bad grades, get in trouble - but there is NOT a need for 40 kids on a college baseball team. 2X for each field position, 10 pitchers and a few utility players - 30, maybe 32 tops. I have always thought that! I don't think there need to be 70-80 kids on a football roster either! Just my opinion.
BaseballMom:
When I coached SSU in 1979 we had a roster of 15 players in the Northern California Conference. Everyone pitched and the team chemistry was outstanding. We won 9 games.
Bob
@BaseballMOM05 posted:This should not be allowed to happen! If the max roster spots are 40, there should never be more than 40 on a fall roster. BS!!!
Here is my simple take, Fall baseball are tryouts for the spring, this is no different than any other tryout an individual might attend.
Note, factoring in existing player attrition, the coach cast a wide net for incoming players (HS, Transfers, walkons, etc).
Some incoming players get athletic scholarship $$, some walk-on status.
Prior to coming on campus, players have passed certain criteria to be invited (accepted) to participate in fall tryouts with the opportunity to maybe be on the spring roster.
Once on campus, the coaches can run through whatever battery of test to determine if the player meets is spring qualifications.
This is where players and families need to understand, nothing is guaranteed, nothing is owed.
IMHO, the issue from the student and parent is the definition of commitment.
Note for 4 or more years, the families have invested time and financial (7 to 10k) per yr in order to reach this milestone.
So we as families are looking for something more concrete
I know that I'm preaching to the choir.
With that being said, whatever the coach wants to bring in that is his choice.
Now if my son was in this situation, I want only 30 players during the fall (lol)
With all due respects, I would be comfortable with 40 to 45, but of course we would have done some roster research understand the coaches tendencies.
Bottom line do your homework
@adbono posted:Curious about what level of program you are talking about. D1, D2, D3, NAIA, JuCo?
Division 1 in the Missouri Valley Conference.
@CollegebaseballInsights posted:Here is my simple take, Fall baseball are tryouts for the spring, this is no different than any other tryout an individual might attend.
I don't recall when I signed my college NLI that my coach told me it was a "try out" for my sport. I was told that I was being offered a scholarship because I was a great player and the team wanted me.
I don't think any athlete in any sport considers a verbal offer, signing a NLI and then receiving a scholarship as a "tryout".
For the record I think I would be ok with a couple of extra kids in the fall as long as expectations communicated to kids. You never know who might get injured training over the next couple of months.
Going into the fall you generally have a couple of players that get injured or are recovering from some surgery and want to be able to have enough arms for inner squad scrimmages. I know that there are a couple of arms coming back this fall but not facing batters yet and at least 2 maintenance surgeries are scheduled for the next 2 weeks...
@BaseballMOM05 posted:I don't recall when I signed my college NLI that my coach told me it was a "try out" for my sport. I was told that I was being offered a scholarship because I was a great player and the team wanted me.
I don't think any athlete in any sport considers a verbal offer, signing a NLI and then receiving a scholarship as a "tryout".
Walk ons are not guaranteed anything.
I think some coaches bring in more than needed because they need enough for scrimmages, especially if players are hurt.
I am still waiting to hear what coachs cuts players on a regular basis.
@TPM posted:Walk ons are not guaranteed anything.
Not talking about walk ons.
Have you read these threads or taken a hard look at rosters for the past 2 years? I get your son is a coach, but you can't turn a blind eye to what is happening in college baseball these days.
@BaseballMOM05 posted:Not talking about walk ons.
Have you read these threads or taken a hard look at rosters for the past 2 years? I get your son is a coach, but you can't turn a blind eye to what is happening in college baseball these days.
Well in response to your snarky post, yes I know what's going and and to be honest, I don't stand to always believe second hand info.
edit. There are so many players who tend to not really belong where they end up. But it's very important to so many parents that their athletes go to the best.
FWIW, coaches don't pull scholarships mid season unless the player has violated NCAA rules or indicates he wants out.
I agree TPM. Give us names. The only one that has been named is Texas A&M and LSU and that is a unique position because they were hired for a lot of money to fix a messed up program. The only way to do that is to get rid of guys who can't help you win and replace them with players you think can whether that is juco, portal, or freshman. Not a good situation for those cut or told they will not play but unless it continues to happen it was a unique situation. If it continues to happen it will hurt recruiting of middle level freshmen classes but won't hurt his portal recruiting. Guys will still want to go play there especially with the NIL deals both have and will take their chances.
@TPM Sorry you felt that was a snarky response. Everyone is certainly entitled to believe what they want based on the information that is available.
I believe that coaches make it uncomfortable which forces players to leave. Also I do agree that the huge turnover has created situations where coaches need to make changes. But there are plenty of programs, all types where freshman recruits will always be #1 and coaches will fill in using the portal to fill in for some who choose another option, like draft or JUCO.
@used2lurk posted:Division 1 in the Missouri Valley Conference.
Wow. From a roster management point of view I can’t stress enough how unusual (in a good way) your situation is.
@BaseballMOM05 posted:@TPM Sorry you felt that was a snarky response. Everyone is certainly entitled to believe what they want based on the information that is available.
I have been here longer than your son's age. I don't believe in calling out coaches on a message board, but I can assure you I know what's going on.
Your job is to help your son secure a scholarship, not worry about what is happening to others. JMO If you need assistance, I can give you names of those who will help find the right program for your player.
@used2lurk posted:Division 1 in the Missouri Valley Conference.
People seem to forget there are other divisions besides P5s and they do it right!
There seems to be specific parts of the country that hS issues, coaches will scoop up players so the other big in state D1s won't get them.
JMO
@BaseballMOM05 posted:I don't recall when I signed my college NLI that my coach told me it was a "try out" for my sport. I was told that I was being offered a scholarship because I was a great player and the team wanted me.
I don't think any athlete in any sport considers a verbal offer, signing a NLI and then receiving a scholarship as a "tryout".
I was a college athlete as well and I’m older than you I’m sure. Even way back then scholarship players were subject to being cut. Sometimes for disciplinary reasons but also sometimes for poor performance or related issues. It didn’t happen like it does now though.
The main difference between then and now IMO is the blatant over recruiting that has become the norm rather than the exception. Evaluating baseball talent is not easy once you get past the top tier players. D1 coaches have flat out told me that they miss on half their freshman recruits. So they bring in twice the amount they need and have all fall to evaluate which half they want to keep. In this sense it actually has turned into an extended tryout whether a player signed a NLI or not. I don’t like it either but it has been going on for over a decade. Now that administrations have figured out they can use the hope of playing on a sports team to increase tuition revenue you can bet that practice isn’t going away.
@TPM posted:I have been here longer than your son's age. I don't believe in calling out coaches on a message board, but I can assure you I know what's going on.
Your job is to help your son secure a scholarship, not worry about what is happening to others. JMO If you need assistance, I can give you names of those who will help find the right program for your player.
LOL! Thanks for your offer; however, we are just fine in our recruiting process. And myself, my son, his coaches and the colleges that are recruiting him, all know what are the right programs for him.
But, what is happening to others, is effecting baseball as a whole. So, actually, worrying about what is happening with others is my job. It's my job to be informed and keep a pulse on roster management trends and recruiting practices and keep up with the coaching changes.
@adbono posted:The main difference between then and now IMO is the blatant over recruiting that has become the norm rather than the exception.
This ^^^^ 100! This is the whole point. And, with the over recruiting has come the cutting of players and forcing players to find other programs after committing to a program.
@BaseballMOM05 posted:@TPM Sorry you felt that was a snarky response. Everyone is certainly entitled to believe what they want based on the information that is available.
Where's the information?
@PitchingFan posted:I agree TPM. Give us names.
You are being serious? Why would any parent potentially put a target on their son's back. But I'll give you another one that is public knowledge. Texas Tech. Look up the twitter uproar about him cutting freshmen after they moved to Lubbock but before school started. This is not hard if you do some research. I see it everywhere so I'm not sure how you've avoided it. Another program that made it to Super regionals...dad told me 3 weeks ago that he got a call from the HC asking that his son, who just came off TJ, give up his scholarship. Why would we make this stuff up?
@baseballhs posted:You are being serious? Why would any parent potentially put a target on their son's back. But I'll give you another one that is public knowledge. Texas Tech. Look up the twitter uproar about him cutting freshmen after they moved to Lubbock but before school started. This is not hard if you do some research. I see it everywhere so I'm not sure how you've avoided it. Another program that made it to Super regionals...dad told me 3 weeks ago that he got a call from the HC asking that his son, who just came off TJ, give up his scholarship. Why would we make this stuff up?
I agree. This isn’t a regional issue. It’s a national issue.
@TPM posted:Where's the information?
It's everywhere. Just do the research. Isn't that what everyone here has preached for years? "Do your research before your son commits." "Look at roster management." "Look how many kids have committed per class." "Look how many are still there a year or 2 later."
I mean, this is what y'all said and we do it and you ask for the information? I'm not putting any school/coach information on here under my name because I know who is on this forum and who can access it.
@baseballhs posted:You are being serious? Why would any parent potentially put a target on their son's back. But I'll give you another one that is public knowledge. Texas Tech. Look up the twitter uproar about him cutting freshmen after they moved to Lubbock but before school started. This is not hard if you do some research. I see it everywhere so I'm not sure how you've avoided it. Another program that made it to Super regionals...dad told me 3 weeks ago that he got a call from the HC asking that his son, who just came off TJ, give up his scholarship. Why would we make this stuff up?
My opinion as per a conversation with a poster here, is that there is so much bitter competition in your part of the country, there are issues.
Take a look at the 2022 rosters, loaded with grads and transfers. You might not want to believe, but most D1 programs will "fill in" with grads and transfers.
There are plenty of coaches, all levels, who rebuild each year, not reload.
My opinion if a player arrives hurt and will miss the season, the coach, unless against NCAA rules an ask for the player to give up that scholarship for 1 year. JMO
@TPM posted:Where's the information?
This isn't an attack on your son. I certainly know there are some coaches that are good men...even good men who have to make tough decisions. That also doesn't mean that other people's sons experiences aren't legitimate...or that there aren't some self centered coaches who aren't great men.
"My opinion if a player arrives hurt and will miss the season, the coach, unless against NCAA rules an ask for the player to give up that scholarship for 1 year. JMO"
Are you saying they should be able to ask for the scholarship for one year?
@BaseballMOM05 posted:It's everywhere. Just do the research. Isn't that what everyone here has preached for years? "Do your research before your son commits." "Look at roster management." "Look how many kids have committed per class." "Look how many are still there a year or 2 later."
I mean, this is what y'all said and we do it and you ask for the information? I'm not putting any school/coach information on here under my name because I know who is on this forum and who can access it.
There are no rules on a commitment limit. There is on roster limits. So if a potential committ wants to attend, and the incoming class is huge ( usually the P5s), why do you want to come?
You want to come because mom and dad want you to play at their alma mater, or its the best school in conference, state school close to home and reality is, the player believes he will make the team.
Is the coach wrong for over recruiting, yes I agree. But the ball is in his court, so to speak.
FWIW, this problem isn't a new one.
I just posted recently. Back when son went to school, fall rosters in big programs were 45+. Some conferences had limits, others not. There were plenty of players that had to transfer and sit out. Everyone was unhappy. Especially when the coach left, and players had to stay.
Now they can transfer without penalty and some are still not happy. What some want is the perfect scenario.
There isn't one.
@BaseballMOM05 posted:I don't recall when I signed my college NLI that my coach told me it was a "try out" for my sport. I was told that I was being offered a scholarship because I was a great player and the team wanted me.
I don't think any athlete in any sport considers a verbal offer, signing a NLI and then receiving a scholarship as a "tryout".
Pretty sure coaches are required to hold an open tryout for walk-ons. I've seen a ton of posts from D1-D3 about information for players wishing to tryout for a spot on the team. If one of those players is good enough he will take a roster spot of another player. There are lots of kids about to sign their NLI who will likely never play for that school.
Here is an article from Whole Hog Sports on the 2022 Arkansas fall roster - 44 with 28 newcomers per the article.
