Future NCAA Athlete providing lessons for $$?

3fingerglove hasn't posted in years, but he was the "encyclopedia on NCAA Rules". You might try sending him a pm. 

Rick at Informed Athlete is a current poster here, so address a pm to him, too.

I don't think he can "work" in the same sport that he will be playing...

BaseballMom, thanks. 

I thought the issue was the amount of compensation. When the local D1 runs clinics, it uses its players to staff it and pay $10/Hr. Likewise, when the local youth baseball league began an academy program, it was staffed with players from the local NAIA and D1 - again for $10/Hr.

During summer ball, we paid college Cape players for lessons and, when his time came, S gave lessons - again for a bit more than $10/Hr.

I think the problem lies in being paid to play rather than paid to give lessons, or help run camps, etc. 

Call the NCAA, however, I am pretty sure he will be ok.

I know my kids organization uses some as paid coaches over the summer.  Shouldn't be "illegal" for a kid to have a summer job.  If your kid has signed, can he check with the schools compliance people?  

Once again, the issue is with playing. Do not call the schools compliance. You may not get the correct info.

It extends beyond just NCAA.

http://usatodayhss.com/2016/no...ted-amateurism-rules

Thats not giving instruction.

Once again, contact the NCAA for best answer.

(nine years ago) My daughter was home over Thanksgiving. She was offered a job at an academy working with preteens over Christmas break. Her college coach told her to get permission with the NCAA. The job was approved. Unfortunately the approval came in May.

This has been discussed on the Board before, often comes up this time of year as we head into summer months.  The consensus in the threads I've read is that it's fine.  However, PLEASE do not take my word for it, or anyone else's.  Make a call to the NCAA and write down the name of the person you talk to.

There are plenty of current college players who coach youth Travel Ball in the summer around here.  It adds to how laughable some of these Travel Programs are when you've got parents paying $2500-$4000 plus travel expenses for their kid to get coached by a 20 year old with very little coaching experience, if any, who is good enough to play college Baseball but not good enough to play in a Summer league.  But I digress!

3and2Fastball posted:

There are plenty of current college players who coach youth Travel Ball in the summer around here.  It adds to how laughable some of these Travel Programs are when you've got parents paying $2500-$4000 plus travel expenses for their kid to get coached by a 20 year old with very little coaching experience, if any, who is good enough to play college Baseball but not good enough to play in a Summer league.  But I digress!

I have to agree with you on some points. 

No offense to anyone, but if I remember correctly as good as son was in HS going into college, there is no way he could instruct a youth pitcher correctly, and do it for a fee.

Leave instruction and lessons to the professionals.

JMO

The UIL governs Texas HS sports. Their phrasing of the rule says it is fine, as long as students are only being paid "reasonable and normal" rates.

Basically, no giving a high school kids $100/hr for some youth instruction.

My guess is if the UIL is good with it than it must kind of line up with NCAA regulations.

RJM posted:

(nine years ago) My daughter was home over Thanksgiving. She was offered a job at an academy working with preteens over Christmas break. Her college coach told her to get permission with the NCAA. The job was approved. Unfortunately the approval came in May.

Beautiful!

ironhorse posted:

The UIL governs Texas HS sports. Their phrasing of the rule says it is fine, as long as students are only being paid "reasonable and normal" rates.

Basically, no giving a high school kids $100/hr for some youth instruction.

My guess is if the UIL is good with it than it must kind of line up with NCAA regulations.

 

As of a few years ago in Idaho, the going rate was $50 - $60 per hour for lessons, so I wouldn't be surprised if people pay more elsewhere.

3and2Fastball posted:

There are plenty of current college players who coach youth Travel Ball in the summer around here.  It adds to how laughable some of these Travel Programs are when you've got parents paying $2500-$4000 plus travel expenses for their kid to get coached by a 20 year old with very little coaching experience, if any, who is good enough to play college Baseball but not good enough to play in a Summer league.  But I digress!

Just because a player doesn't play summer ball doesn't mean they aren't talented enough to do so.  This is especially true of pitchers.  My son has been told each year to not pitch in the summer due to the amount of innings he pitches in the spring.  He's had many offers to do so, but he turns them down every time, because his coaches tell him to take the summer off.

TPM posted:

3and2Fastball posted:

There are plenty of current college players who coach youth Travel Ball in the summer around here.  It adds to how laughable some of these Travel Programs are when you've got parents paying $2500-$4000 plus travel expenses for their kid to get coached by a 20 year old with very little coaching experience, if any, who is good enough to play college Baseball but not good enough to play in a Summer league.  But I digress!

I have to agree with you on some points. 

No offense to anyone, but if I remember correctly as good as son was in HS going into college, there is no way he could instruct a youth pitcher correctly, and do it for a fee.

Leave instruction and lessons to the professionals.

JMO

I can see your point, the young guys aren't going to be as good as a seasoned, veteran coach, but saying that they need to leave it to the professionals isn't 100% correct.  A 20 year old, college stud, has had many lessons, many coaches, and I would say they have plenty to offer a young kid.  Maybe they aren't worth the $50 - $60 per hour they get in Idaho, but I am sure they could provide value.

ironhorse posted:

The UIL governs Texas HS sports. Their phrasing of the rule says it is fine, as long as students are only being paid "reasonable and normal" rates.

Basically, no giving a high school kids $100/hr for some youth instruction.

My guess is if the UIL is good with it than it must kind of line up with NCAA regulations.

 

I believe I read that "reasonable and normal" rates are acceptable and that you cannot "profit" from your position at an institution.  If you are giving lessons, you cannot advertise yourself as a college phenom nor can you "lend" yourself to a camp and allow them to use your name.  $10/hr, or maybe even $20/hr should be fine, but if you get up around $50/hr, you had better have something to offer other than showing up at the local park's batting cage and sitting on a bucket shouting encouragement.  Saw a very interesting article (long since lost) about how colleges come up with pay schedules for their players to work summer high school camps.  They seem to be able to pay multiples of minimum wage, but the camp advertisements cannot highlight the likely participation of any particular player.

rynoattack posted:

3and2Fastball posted:

There are plenty of current college players who coach youth Travel Ball in the summer around here.  It adds to how laughable some of these Travel Programs are when you've got parents paying $2500-$4000 plus travel expenses for their kid to get coached by a 20 year old with very little coaching experience, if any, who is good enough to play college Baseball but not good enough to play in a Summer league.  But I digress!

Just because a player doesn't play summer ball doesn't mean they aren't talented enough to do so.  This is especially true of pitchers.  My son has been told each year to not pitch in the summer due to the amount of innings he pitches in the spring.  He's had many offers to do so, but he turns them down every time, because his coaches tell him to take the summer off.

Agreed.  A school we visited said they give their catchers the summers off to recover. 

rynoattack posted:

TPM posted:

3and2Fastball posted:

There are plenty of current college players who coach youth Travel Ball in the summer around here.  It adds to how laughable some of these Travel Programs are when you've got parents paying $2500-$4000 plus travel expenses for their kid to get coached by a 20 year old with very little coaching experience, if any, who is good enough to play college Baseball but not good enough to play in a Summer league.  But I digress!

I have to agree with you on some points. 

No offense to anyone, but if I remember correctly as good as son was in HS going into college, there is no way he could instruct a youth pitcher correctly, and do it for a fee.

Leave instruction and lessons to the professionals.

JMO

I can see your point, the young guys aren't going to be as good as a seasoned, veteran coach, but saying that they need to leave it to the professionals isn't 100% correct.  A 20 year old, college stud, has had many lessons, many coaches, and I would say they have plenty to offer a young kid.  Maybe they aren't worth the $50 - $60 per hour they get in Idaho, but I am sure they could provide value.

When my kids was very young, he attended holiday clinics run by local college players thru the local academy.  For $50 they babysat for a few hours and taught them some basics. 

My HS son works at a local hitting facility. Mostly he sets up nets, batting machines and so forth, and makes sure kids don't break anything while they're there, but many coaches of the little guys have started asking to have him there when they use the cages because he does a nice job of working with their kids on very basic hitting and throwing, and the kids are thrilled to learn from a high school player they'll see on the field later this year. And when compared to the dads coaching lower level Little League, my son knows a lot.

My son and a friend (both D1 guys) helped staff a local baseball clinic put together for the local youth league.  His friends dad (former D1 pitcher) spent quite a bit of time making sure it was legal for him to pay the guys for helping and was told by multiple sources that it was fine as long as he didn't pay them more than what the job they were doing was worth.  They got $15/hour if I remember right.

My son started giving lessons in High School - worked mainly with 6 - 9year olds.  Charged $25/hour.  Usually went to the kids house. Had a nice lesson plan he found on the internet.  Hitting (tee work into a net, soft toss, occasionally BP at a park), fielding, throwing, etc.  Did 8 or so lessons a week in the summer.  Kids loved him.   He tailored the lessons to each kid.  Now he works at an indoor baseball facility year round and plays for his HS's football and baseball teams.