Has HS Baseball out lived it's usefullness?

High school coaches are not very important to the recruitment of high school age players.
You can think that if you want to eliminate a potential connection to a school.

Most high school coaches just receive their paychecks and most of them are football coaches anyway.
For what they get paid I doubt many are going to retire early, and a majority are usually in conflict with the football coach to begin with.

We get most of what we need from our kids playing select ball and going to showcases.
Yes, but see #1

Our kids are thinking about not playing high school ball and concentrating on their select team.
What a waste of potential reps, and I don't know if many overlaps with select teams really occur.

HS baseball is not select baseball but it is an important time in the overall HS experience and in many cases is the last time you play with the kids you grew up playing with. This site in many cases is directed toward, and posted by the player/parent who is moving on to play after HS. It is not a true representation of opinions concerning HS baseball as a whole.

myself being a high school coach that dedicates alot of time and effort to the game of high school (not claiming to be a good one), feel the exact opposite is true. i believe that high school baseball (at least in our state) is still the biggest step for a player to make. how well a player does for his high school team means more to our college coaches than select teams, etc. how do they get along with the other players, how do they practice, how do they manage their time with school AND baseball. all of these are consistant questions that i get from the college coaches. i spend many hours a week (especially during the season) talking to college coaches, and i get the impression that high school is still VERY important to the development, and continuation, of a players career. i predict that a great deal of the "select" and "travel" teams will phase out in the future and high school baseball will still be standing proud.
some wise person told me that even though they may be seen more in the summer, the high school coach is still the most reliable source for college coach.

coachb25, i feel your pain i get that impression reading this board on occaision myself. however i feel proud of what and how i do things and after reading a great deal of your post, so should you.

by the way i really enjoy this board and have picked up some great ideas. keep it rolling

NO!

High School is for the masses. Most HS kids don't have illusions of grandeur. They will play as long as they are able and be satisfied doing so.

If some people don't want to play, they are welcome not to. It opens up a spot for kids who just play for the love of the game.

I am not a high school coach, though I was in the early to mid 80s........there has been one constant in youth baseball (prior to college) and that is high school baseball. It will still be here even after 'select' teams, showcases, etc., have evolved into something else. It is the logical step before becoming a college player.

"I ask, do some of you feel that high school ball has out lived its usefulness."

Why are there high school sports to begin with? They are in place to give kids opportunity to play and enjoy a variety of sports. It also gives the student body events to enjoy and rally around in the name of their school.

An added benefit is that High School sports give athletes exposure to coaches and scouts that help determine their participation at the next level.

Almost all high school sports have off season events that are additional exposure opportunities (track, basketball, volleyball, s****r, tennis, swimming, softball, and wrestling).

I hope that nobody thinks that all of these sports have out lived their usefulness. All we will have left is Football.

HS ball vs. select is becoming analagous to youth rec ball vs. select. There remains one signficant difference. HS ball carries a significant social status aspect.

I will not be surprised to see year round HS age select ball begin within the next five years.

HS has, to some extent, brought this on itself. In many larger HS's, athletes are feeling forced to pick one sport. And once they become a one sport athlete, they typically becoming very committed. So it will be less of leap to decide to go select year round, to play at the highest level of the game year round.

I hope that HS baseball will continue, but will it go the route of LL Inc. in the bigger areas?

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Originally posted by catamount36:
i spend many hours a week (especially during the season) talking to college coaches,

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If more HS coaches did this, you'd have fewer complaints. Unfortunately my son's HS coach for 3 years didn't have communication with College coaches as a priority.

Coach

The opinions represented reflect individual impressions of individual situations. "The squeeky wheel get the greasing" the old saying goes.

It's very easy to hit a message board and reflect the negatives in a particular situation. I've done it. I know. It happens much more than reflecting the positives in other situations.

High school baseball is part of the recruiting process and in our case an important part. The first high school team's JV coach led us directly to a select team, which led us to Perfect Game, TeamOne, another select team and ultimately to college baseball.

High School ball is playing with your friends, the ones you started with way back, representing your school, your town.

For most kids high school baseball is the pinnacle of their careers and hopefully a positive experience led by capable, intuitive teacher/coaches, mostly underpaid in my view who help all players prepare for life after high school AND baseball.

Sometimes I complain about it. If I didn't care about high school baseball or didn't think is was very important, well, I just wouldn't bother.

EDIT: grammer

I would add that generally, in my opinion, high school coaches do a better job of teaching the game and teaching baseball skills than do other coaches.

grateful

I'll agree with you. In retrospect, it was the certainly "more conventional" than rec ball.

What is the purpose of high school ball? For my son, it was a way to build self-esteem, have some fun playing with friends and hopefully to achieve a goal(Hoping to make varsity.) As it turned out,high school ball provided some of the best and without a doubt some of the worst experiences my son has had. (The game itself was the easy part.)That's why I think it is an important part of a player's development and maturation.
There is no question that there is a huge difference between select ball and high school ball because their purposes are different. For this reason,I don't think it's fair to compare them to each other. Each program has its place and each is important.

Coach, regarding ***the comments you’ve read***
The responses are just my own thoughts, for what it’s worth. I am a pansy and have no interest in arguing.

***High school coaches are not very important to the recruitment of high school age players***

Some High School coaches are extremely important in the recruiting process. Some can be the very most important. After all, a good high school coach should know more about his players than most anyone.

***Most high school coaches just receive their paychecks and most of them are football coaches anyway***

1. There are a lot of High School baseball coaches who are “only” there for the extra money.
2. There are others who would do it for nothing.
3. And there are a few who would actually pay to do it.
I would always choose coach #2

***We get most of what we need from our kids playing select ball and going to showcases***

Depends on what one "needs". I would like to think that every good player has a large "need" or desire to play High School Baseball.

***Our kids are thinking about not playing high school ball and concentrating on their select team***

I don't get it, Why wouldn't they do both if they’re really baseball players? Each year we see most of the very best players in the country. They all play High School baseball, if they live in this country and they're eligible.

When ever you have 20,000 to 60,000 or more (counting assistants) High School Baseball Coaches, you automatically get a large number of bad ones. There are also a large number of very good ones and even a number of great ones.

Some are well respected others are not. We know a few “select” type coaches who have no credibility and they deserve none. There are also a lot of bad college coaches and even some bad professional coaches. Because of the numbers involved it just stands to reason there would be many bad high school coaches out there.

When I order pizza at my favorite place, there's this one lady I always hope is working, she makes them much better than the others.

All High School baseball coaches and HS programs are not the same. They do not all provide the same things to their players.

I feel there are some outstanding HS Coaches who contribute to this site, including “CoachB25”. I enjoy reading what all these High School coaches have to say. I believe these guys are among the good coaches who truly have a passion for the game and the players. People who truly love what they do, usually get real good at it.

What I don’t understand is why the very good coaches seem to take it so personal when people bring up bad coaches or other problems associated with HS baseball. As in everything there is the good, the bad and the ugly.

High School Baseball is GREAT, it’s a very important part of most every players life. It sometimes does have its limitations, but it will never “out live its usefulness”.

Great High School Coaches like the legendary Marc Johnson (Cherry Creek HS) understand that there are a lot of opportunities available that are much better than playing only High School baseball.

Just because there might be something better, doesn’t take anything away from the importance of High school Baseball. Nothing is trying to replace it. After all, where are the “select” level players during the High School season? I know that we stay very busy, following players during the High School baseball season. It should never bother any HS coach that there are some great opportunities available for top level players outside of their High School team.

High school sports are a VITAL part of a high school students life, be it playing or watching.It is also a key social element

They have not and will not outlive their usefulness as they have a niche in high school life.

Are all ther coaches good ? NO --but on the other hand there are selct programs and events that are not good either-- it all depends on who is running them and who the copaches are on the staff

Do all HS coaches get deeply involved with the recruiting process? NO But there are select/travel team coaches who do not get deeply involved in the process as well

Here in the Northeast HS baseball is key in terms of HS life and preparation for Legion ball etc in the summer and comes the select team aspect and showwcases

Keep in mind that in most NE states the play cannot participate in sports outside of school during his season---thus he cannot play HS ball and "select" ball at the same time. Personally I like the rule--it keeps kids from being "torn" and being burned out

HS baseball has a purpose at least in my mind.

For me it is fairly simple.......during the summer, I see select teams and one showcase. In the spring leading up to the draft, I see the players that I liked the previous summer play HIGH SCHOOL BASEBALL, and if I am lucky, I get to draft a couple of them after watching them play on their HIGH SCHOOL BASEBALL TEAM.

High School baseball is the backbone of amateur baseball at the teenage level.

In my area, there are about 3-4 select summer teams that have fine players on them. The rest of the "select teams" are filled up with kids who should have just played on the local summer team.

If you play HS baseball JUST for the opportunity to showcase to a college coach...
If you play HS baseball JUST because it might aid you in getting a scholarship to college...
If you play HS baseball JUST because what's in it for you as an individual...

Then, I would say it has outlived its usefulness to you as an individual and it's best that you move on.

If you play HS baseball to represent your school and community ...
If you play HS baseball to improve your abilities ....
If you play HS baseball to be a part of a team and to achieve team goals ....

.... then I have a HS where you would be welcome ... of course, there are a lot of other HS's out there who would welcome you too.

Quote from above:
***We get most of what we need from our kids playing select ball and going to showcases***

Last year, at our first HS varsity pre-season scrimmage, there were 20-30 pro scouts stacked behind the backstop, watching a senior named Phil Hughes. There were several scouts at every pre-season and season HS game Phil Hughes pitched. He got drafted 1st round by the Yankees. Seemed like those scouts thought HS baseball was a good enough venue to come out and watch ...

I also agree with the folks here that's HS baseball is about a Whole Lot More than just exposure. You don't do ONLY HS baseball if you wanted to get more exposure and you don't do HS baseball ONLY for the exposure.

Coach B25 -
One of the things I really like about this site is that good coaches create posts like this to help us all understand each other a little better. The last time, I offended a few folks, so I will try ot choose my words a little better.

We can only speak of our own experiences. As a coach or scout, you deal with lots of players and situations. On the other hand, we parents usually only go through this with our limited number of kids. What one person would see as someone "slipping through the cracks" another sees as an injustice done. Same situation, different perspectives.

So, from this parent's perspective:
1. High school coaches should be very useful in the recruiting process. You have more contacts and experience. I don't need you to do it all, but I am a complete novice and need guidance.
2. The majority of the HS coaches we are familiar with are FB guys that took baseball to get an additional stipend and head coaching experience. They are not baseball guys. The few that want to be good coaches will work at it and generally get better. Our team has progressed in the playoffs under them - until we met up with a team with essentially equal talent and a "real" baseball coach. What makes parents and players bitter is when the converted FB coach favors his FB players over the baseball guys. It happens. Afterall, an FB coach is more familiar with his FB players athletic abilities. When I read on this website how many of you real baseball coaches are coaching baseball, I envy your players. My son saw the other side of the coin.
3. There were no select teams in our immediate area, we didn't really know why they existed and we did not know anything about showcases. I do know that we were asked about them at college tryouts, so they must carry some importance. Other than that, no experience with them.
4. My son knew that the coach was a FB coach and he knew how his HS career would go. Rather than quit, he continued to work as if he had a real baseball coach. The boy loves the game. He eventually played (in a limited role) for his school and he had some personal success - enough to get him in a JUCO. My son would tell you that for all of the negatives he endured, he would not have skipped HS ball. He has friends in the same situation that would say the same.

Finally, out of curiosity I went to a select tournament last year. I did not see the "rah-rah" I have always enjoyed at LL or HS games. I saw talent and mechanics without spirited teamwork. Once again, remember that this is one parent's perspective from a limited viewing of a select tournament. I am not saying they are all like that. I concluded I liked HS better because of the "rah-rah," I knew the players (on the field and on the bench) and I enjoyed the team spirit I saw as well as the competitive drive to "prove my school is better than yours."

Long live HS ball with real coaches teaching the game to players that want to play!

You are a wise "Old Cat"

There's some great points made in the posts above that tell you HS Baseball certainly has it's place and purpose.

Perhaps another thing to think about and the bottom line "test" would be to ask anyone who has played HS ball, represented their school and community and developed great freindships in the process, whether they'd trade having had that experience. I don't think many would.

As a former High School coach I sometimes get the feeling that the impression of "some"is that high school coaches just put in time until cetain players get the opportunity to be "selected" or "showcased".

as someone who has signed with Alabama, and has gone through the recruiting process,i feel high school ball was a very important part of my career.In showcases, you play for yourself, its cutthroat and everyone is out for themselves. In high school ball, you learn to play for the name on the front of the jersey, not the one on the back, and you actually learn to play for something besides yourself. also its fun to play in front of your friends and family, who at showcases normally dont get to see you. High school ball also gives you the chance to interact with some of your best friends who may not be "prospects" in the sense of the word, but they LOVE baseball, and you learn how to play hard, and want to win when your around those guys because there some of your closest friends. Trust me, if you think high school ball is no longer needed, then you must not know what your talkin about. I can assure you that high school ball is very useful, as i am a high school baseball player for the next 5 months of my life.

AHSpitcher17......that was a fabulous post!!

AHSpitcher17 - I think you may have taught a few "adults" a thing or two. You hit the nail on the head. HS baseball will NEVER die because it is more than about the individual player - it is about the team, the school, and the community as a whole. Select ball, while it has its place, can never compete with that.

Let's face it - as a parent of a high school AND a select player, I definitely notice the difference between the two types of teams. The select team is all about trying to position YOURSELF to be put in a position to be recruited or even drafted. No one comes to the games except close family members and they are most interested NOT in how well the team does but mainly if their son gets enough playing time and performs well.

I enjoy watching my son play select ball. But I REALLY enjoy the groups of friends and neighbors that gather at the high school ballpark to watch the home team. I enjoy caravaning with the same group to out of town games. That feeling ONLY comes with HS baseball - not select. That is a feeling that is NEVER going to go out of style.

It takes all kinds to make a world.

Kids like AHSpitcher17 understand that HS baseball is all about the love of the game, friendship, school spirit and winning something as a team.

It's about average kids who love the game every bit as much as it is about talented young players who will certainly move up to the next level.

If your only goal is to be "seen" then you have missed the whole point of HS baseball.

No is the answer for all the reasons poster earlier. Let me just say this though. I am a High School coach and I ask alot of my players. I ask them to dedicate themselves to the sport. I ask them to work year round to be the best that they can possibly be. I tell them that what they do in the 8 months out of the high school season will dictate what they can do during that four months. Now in order to ask them to do that I must do that. I can not be a four month coach and then turn around and ask them to be a 12 month player. I have to be the first one there and the last one to leave. I start my year in Feb and coach High School for four months. Then I coach Legion for two months. Then I start our summer and Fall conditioning program as well as help with the Summer and Fall select teams in the area which some of our guys may or may not be talented enough to play on. Then we have winter conditioning that lasts up to the start of the High School season. In other words 12 months a year. If your a coach you can not ask your players to do something that you are unable or unwilling to do. The coach sets the tone for the players. And sometimes the players set the tone for the coach. Now if a player is not willing to take part in off season workouts thats ok. It can not be mandantory. But as long as I have one kid that wants to work I will be there. There are unfortunate situations where the coach is a four month coach. Players can not use this as an excuse. They and their parents must go out and find opportunities. Also they can always lift and run with friends. I can honestly say that every kid that has ever played for us that wanted to play in college that worked hard and had some ability has played in college. And there have been some that had the ability but not the desire and they did not play in college. A coaches job is to inspire and to lead. A coaches job is to push and teach each young man he coaches regardless of his ability. A coaches job is to provide an environment that is challenging and rewarding. A coaches job is to help each young man that is willing to work and aspires to play at the next level the best opportunity to do so. I have always said there is some place for every kid that is willing to work and has some ability at the next level. Be it D-1 2 3 JC Comm College I dont care. High School baseball is about pride in ones community and playing ball with the kids he has grown up with. Going to school all day and getting on that bus and going into battle together. Its about team, period. Its the time that kids learn that (I)doesnt matter the only thing that matters is that we compete at our highest level. That we win or loose leave everything on the field and do everthing possible to win the game. And if we do loose we can look one another in the eye and know that we did not let each other down. Learning to be a team player and learning to work on OUR field and having pride in our program. Everyone needs a place to call home. Your High School program, field and school is where your baseball home is. After all the baseball is over no matter how far it leads you away. You need to know that you have a baseball home that you can come back to. Former teamates that share that bond with you. Twenty years after you graduate no one will remember who led the team in wins or batting average or who started the most games. You will be teamates for life though. High School baseball, its the roots of our baseball tree.

High school coaches are not very important to the recruitment of high school age players.

HS coaches are not needed in order to get a college scholarship. That does not mean that the help of your hs coach is not wanted or appreciated. It has always been my position that putting all of your eggs into the coaches basket hoping to get a scholarship is a bad idea. You should proceed as if you will receive no help and be grateful if you get it.

Regardless of how the coaching contingent on this website feel, most hs coaches are not equipped to help very much. That being said, I have observed that the coaches on this site are not the mainstream. The fact that they come here and care put them above the crowd.

The reason the HSBBW was started was because of the total lack of information out there to help the parent through the recruiting process. Please don't tell me that now that a few of the educated coaches post here that suddenly we don't need anybody to help other than the hs coach. I ain't buying it.

Most high school coaches just receive their paychecks and most of them are football coaches anyway.

Who cares? Some of us feel that coaches like the ones posting to this site are the minority. To insinuate that coaches just want a check is ludacris and cynical. Most of these guys care and try. Does it mean that they are competent, good, or educated in the recruiting process? No it doesn't.

We get most of what we need from our kids playing select ball and going to showcases.

One of the reasons that my son loved the hs season was to play for his school, with his friends, for his coaches, in front of his family, and get lots of practice and repitition that is not received in select ball. HS ball was the thrill of his baseball year. PERIOD.

Our kids are thinking about not playing high school ball and concentrating on their select team.

That is stupid. No team woth it salt plays during the hs season. So why would one skip hs to practice for select ball? That is dumb.

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The select team is all about trying to position YOURSELF to be put in a position to be recruited or even drafted. No one comes to the games except close family members and they are most interested NOT in how well the team does but mainly if their son gets enough playing time and performs well.

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Select ball for us was to play the best competition possible. That was the only reason. Others do it for other reasons.

Every fall we read about all the coaches that care. The school year starts and a lot of coaches do not have the time to post. Then we hear all the stories about parents getting no help. Take your head out of the sand guys. You are not the mainstream. You are the cream. Post here during the season and give your wisdom to the parents who are lost. jmo

Depends on the perspective from whence you come.

In example if your son has been playing on highly competitive select teams since the age of 8 years old as mind has then high school baseball was a come-down in challenge and a totally boring experience for him, competitively. But it was very important to him socially since it helped to establish many of the friendships he has to this date.

Similarly my daughter attends a Summer music camp which would be tantamount to doing select baseball in comparison. As a result the high school music experience for her is rather boring since the music is not very challenging.

It is the same perspective if you take students who are Advanced Placement(AP) and making them attend College Prep(CP) level classes and now you get the picture that high school baseball can be a real come-down for the serious BB player.

The problem is, though the AP level player wants to compete at the AP level he can't with a basic or CP level type team just as the AP level student can't get the maximum out of a basic or CP level class because of the elementary nature of the material. The competition is just not there...so to fit in, the AP type player will play down or play up to the level of competition they are with...as the case may be.

The answer to the problem for high school coaches is to the same as their counterparts in other subjects...know if you're an AP level program or a CP or Basic level program. But don't retard the development of your good players, just to accomodate the players or their parents of the poorly skilled ones.

What usually happens is the AP level "team" players find it difficult to maintain a high level of motivation and interest playing in a program that is not very competitive, so they try to fit in with the tempo of the "team" to the detriment of their own development.

HS baseball with a Basic level or CP program, for an AP level player, becomes their "practice" time, in that the time can be used to "work" on getting "reps".

My son loves HS ball. High School is a big part of his life, he’s a 10th grader, and this is a natural part of the high school experience and growing into an adult. I don’t believe he could imagine being without it. Not only is it a sport to him but it (HS baseball and baseball in general) are a part of his social life. He hangs out with the boys from his HS team.

In addition, I personally feel that a well run program provides opportunities for development that many select teams do not. This fall his HS team had open workouts two days a week at the field. This not only allowed the players to gain reps to improve their skills but allowed them to socialize and have fun without being on “display”. I think this is important and the boys need some down time just to enjoy themselves. If it also gives them a chance to improve, so much the better. In addition the HS team is having open conditioning workouts throughout the winter 3 days a week. This again will provide opportunity for improvements in their game but without the weight of competition. It also gives them another opportunity to socialize and to learn to work together during the drills plus they get to play pickup basketball after the drills are done. Fun to them and improves stamina.

And what can be more fun than playing a home and home against your cross town rival that many of the boys from both teams grew up playing with and/or against? Our immediate area has two High Schools, one with 2700 students and the other with 2200. Their districts are divided by an Interstate. The rec. leagues and AAU teams they played on were not. Many, including my son, play on the same select teams. Therefore they have played on the same teams and against one another for their entire baseball lives. So far this fall, from these two HS teams, 6 pitchers and 2 position players have committed to college teams (5 of those being Div. 1 schools). Several other seniors, 2-4, position players are close to committing. The boys look forward to the two matchups all school year long. It’s just not the same when you travel and play a team of faceless players in another state. High quality ball but just not the same.

I believe there will always be a place for HS ball. Select ball and what ever it evolves into will have its place also.

PIC

I might be way off but I don't agree with your analogy of AP classes, , boredom due to competitive level etc. The challenge is in the player, not the game.

Playing on a team with kids who can't catch, throw or adjust to the bounce is frustrating for sure. But there are two sides to every story.

How about the infielder who knows that EVERY throw to 1st base must be PERFECT or it won't be caught. Or a pitcher that knows a wild pitch is an automatic scores. Or a catcher that knows that a throw to second might end up in the outfield.

A talented player learns how to compensate. He learns not to throw a little high, or a little left, or to hold the ball when every instinct tells him to throw it because can see that the 3rd baseman isn't even looking.

Then one day he gets on a team where all the players are GOOD and he finds out just what it is like to let loose and play. And it is a true joy. In the same way a sunny day is so much more instense and bright after a week of dismal weather overcast

We can learn from most experiences if we look for the challenges.

Both of my sons play(ed) HS and high level Select.

They loved playing on their select teams, playing with and against outstanding players. They loved getting the chance to travel. They loved being seen by hundreds of college coaches and pro scouts (which they didn't happen on their HS team). Most of all they love playing with kids who love the game as much as they do.

On the other hand, they loved playing with their friends and classmates. They loved representing their school. They loved knocking off the crosstown rivals (who might be their teammates on the select team ). They loved playing in front of their school peers. They loved the attention they got at the school when they won the first conference title in the schools 39 year history. They loved the feeling making it to the state sectionals. Of course we were lucky, their HS coach is now a life time friend to my wife and I and our sons.

They wouldn't give up either experience, each has its pluses and minuses but I am glad they had the opportunity to experience both.

Has HS baseball outlived ts usefullness.........as a parent and an umpire...the answer is a resounding "NO".

I think on this site we sometimes lose track of the vast expanse that is HS baseball. For those of us who have children playing at higher levels we know the roads to that goal are different than before. Select teams and showcases are the norm for the upper level player.

But based on the numbers of players that participate in HS baseball, HS baseball is overwhemingly useful. Maybe its not the front runner for high level recruiting, but for school pride, athletic participation and community involvement, it is important.

As stated before, My son would not trade his experiences at Perfect Game showcases for any thing, they were first rate and great exposure.......but my college freshman came home last night to attend his sisters swim meet....as we went by the gym, he wanted to see the section champs banner that hangs in the gym.... no matter how far he goes in baseball, he will always be proud of the championship he helped bring to his alma mater. A life long pride in achievement of team goals is useful in this dad's eyes.

My son has just finished his HS experience early in order to play at a major D1 this spring. Without the wonderful leadership,mentoring and guidance he recieved from our HS coach and staff he would not have had this opportunity. The friends he has made on the HS team will always be cherished. On the other hand I have witnessed and heard from way too many parents/players of HS coaches that don't really care about anything beyond the paycheck. For all players/parents the select teams and showcases are very important, for the unlucky ones they are extremely important if the goal is college baseball. In every case the "Select College Camp" may be the single most important event in a HS players life. It is there that you can find out about the schools need and the players fit. At the end of the day for the highly rated player, far too many do not get the advantage of a big time HS program or a caring coach and staff. These are the fellows that get bored, don't have fun and can't wait for the select/travel/showcase season to begin. So, sad but true for some top notch players, HS baseball only shines because of the friendships that can last forever. My take is that about 1 in 5 HS coaches can afford to do the job the way it should be done and about 1 in 15 even come close to my son's very fortunate experience.

Be thankful you have the opportunity to play select ball in the summer. If your sons went to school in Iowa, they’d be playing high school ball in the summer and have the worst of both worlds.

A lot of Iowans would love to have a spring high school season like most of you and then allow players to play on select teams against select competition in the summer.

As far as eliminating high school baseball, I believe if everyone thought this through and thought about what is good for the game, they would not even consider this.

By eliminating high school baseball, you would be eliminating an opportunity for millions of kids from participating and for many of the students, to just watch a baseball game. That argument by itself should be enough to not even think about it.

Another thing that puzzles me is how many parents could afford another couple of months or so of expensive travel and other expenses. One thing high school baseball does provide is low cost play. Another thing is that in many communities, the high school field is one of the few decent full size baseball fields. Without a high school team, there is no need for a high school field. Do you really want to take a chance they turn the baseball field into a s o c c e r field? Didn’t think so!

I’m sure that if I put a little more time into this subject, I could come up with many other good reasons, however I believe the few I’ve given should make any more, just overkill.

AP,

I really enjoyed observing your post.

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How about the infielder who knows that EVERY throw to 1st base must be PERFECT or it won't be caught. Or a pitcher that knows a wild pitch is an automatic scores. Or a catcher that knows that a throw to second might end up in the outfield.

A talented player learns how to compensate. He learns not to throw a little high, or a little left, or to hold the ball when every instinct tells him to throw it because can see that the 3rd baseman isn't even looking.

Then one day he gets on a team where all the players are GOOD and he finds out just what it is like to let loose and play. And it is a true joy. In the same way a sunny day is so much more instense and bright after a week of dismal weather overcast

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I wish I could have written that post because I would have loved to have said that.

I hope you won't mind the emphasis added.

And for those of you that don't like or can't handle the high school coach, you won't like the college coach either.......................if you get the chance.

If you look on college rosters you will usually find a column that lists the high schools of all of the players rather than the 'club' teams.

Former Oberserver is accurate about the idea that if you don't like your hs coach, the college coach just might be the next one you don't like.

High School baseball models college baseball more than any other pre-college experience. In high school, as previous posters have mentioned, the team is the important thing. In 'select' baseball, as previous posters have mentioned, the attitude is more a "What's in it for me?" attitude. Once you have the good fortune of being part of a college team, the team again comes first.

Baseball is the ultimate team game, and high school baseball exemplifies that as well as anything else.

Huh? Are you saying that anyone who has a problem with a HS coach is simply a malcontent or crybaby? If this applied to history and all walks of life we'd be British now. Many HS coaches should be ashamed at thier own lack of effort, just as the majority should be proud of thier accomplishment.

Yes, High School Baseball is GREAT. In some cases it can be the most important step in a player’s career. Every single person on here understands High School Baseball. Yes, the colleges list the High School their players attended. Yes, High School Stats are used a lot. Yes, to the social aspect, Yes, to the GOOD High School Coaches, Yes, to representing the school, Yes, to everything, everyone is saying.

However, it bothers me when we start comparing Select type baseball in a negative way to High School baseball.

Many of those College players who have their High School listed on the roster, were actually found and recruited out of non High School events. A high level Summer or Fall team will have a complete roster of players being recruited by many colleges. The high level events are swamped with College Coaches and Pro Scouts. Many of these players are then followed closely their next High School season. The recruiters remember very well where they “found” a player, no matter what is listed on their roster.

Also, you only need to attend events like the WWBA Tournaments, Connie Mack World Series, and other National Events for “Select” players, to realize that there is much more involved than individual success. These kids are competitors and want to win badly. Often on the very best teams, if a player is only interested in “What’s in it for me” rather than being part of a “team”… He will be sent packing! This is High Level Baseball, that everyone should see first hand before judging it or comparing it to HS baseball. The skill level, competition, responsibilities, travel, pressure, etc., etc., associated with this high level of baseball “models” College and Pro baseball very well.

Once again, High School Baseball is GREAT! We don’t have to go any farther than that.

It can all be GOOD!

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Many of those College players who have their High School listed on the roster, were actually found and recruited out of non High School events.

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Amen to that! Trust me when I say my son was not scouted at his HS games . Except for maybe the Univ. of Northern Colo. or Air Force (DI's), no other DI's scout HS ball in Pueblo. A few DII's and area JUCO's, but that's about it. I also believe that the "if you are good, they will find you" statement is highly overblown. Yes, if you are a top prospect, but even if you are in the top tier of players, IMO you still need to be pro-active and make sure they know about you.

That said, I agree that HS baseball is great for all the previous posters reasons. Playing with his buddies he grew up with meant a lot to him. He turned down a chance to play select ball after his senior year to have the "one last chance" to play with his buddies (he was already committed for college). He had a ball and wouldn't change a thing (except maybe winning his last HS game in the state semi's ).

PG, Soxnole, et al......

I understand y'all defending 'select' baseball, as it does have it's place. My son played in the 2003 Connie Mack World Series and the entire team went there to win together, so I understand that. He has also played in the USSSA World Series and the East Coast World Series, and another way back when he was 14. I understand the value in that and the concept of TEAM that was important for each of those teams.

It would be nice, and again I am not a high school coach and haven't been since 1987, if important people like you and several others on this site would speak more positively about high school baseball......this thread in particular should show people the importance of HS baseball to the young baseball players in our country.

In all my years as a college coach, I have observed that most of the teaching of baseball skills goes on during high school practices....I have had so many summer coaches, including those who coach 'select' teams, who said they don't have as much time to teach and practice as high school coaches do.....yet we still get baseball people on this board who put high school coaches in the 'bad' category because of their own experience.....all HS coaches are not like the ones you have had......and in my experience I would say that high school coaches are inaccurately portrayed by most people who write in these forums. It is too bad.

I am not being critical of club programs......but I will admit that the negative attitude toward HS baseball, its importance, and the coaches is disappointing and in my opinion can appear to be somewhat self-serving (for those who are promoting 'select' baseball and showcasing).

My son's high school baseball team was not necessarily considered one of the elite programs in our state, but including him, there are 12 members of his high school team playing college baseball right now (6-DI, 2-DII, 2-DIII, 2 JC).....the vast majority of them were first noticed and seen during their high school seasons.

There is not one thing in particular (other than ability and skill) that is vital in helping kids get 'noticed', earn scholarships, etc.....not showcases, not select teams, not camps, not private instruction......but one thing that is common among players who continue on to become college players is that they all attended high school and virtually all of them played high school baseball.

Baseball is a game that everybody on here loves, and instead of bashing the sport that has been so fabulous for us and our kids perhaps we should think of ways to promote ALL types of amateur baseball so that it will continue to be America's Sport, Our National Pasttime.