zomby,
Once again, what's the drawback? Why does anyone have to justify it? It is not illegal to hold a kid back. There are rules in place to keep parents from going to an extreme wrt to holding a kid back for sports and as long as one stays within those rules it is "just".
Why is it any more "just" for a kid with an October birthday to be in the youngest 20% agewise for his grade than to be in the oldest 20% gradewise? In Florida an October birthday makes a kid older than most of his class. In CA an October birthday makes a kid younger than most of his class. Which one of those is "just"?
Generally speaking a large majority of the arguments against holding players/students back is along the lines of "because that's the way we've always done it." "That's the way we've always done it" has lost wars and ruined companies and nations.
One of our webster's sons with an August birthday "stayed back" at some point. The player is now at a top academic university, i.e. had very good grades, doing very well in D1 baseball. What was the drawback?
quote:Originally posted by kjktj:
Off the field ...he was thrown in with a group of young men that he would have been better off not socializing with. That was where the age difference really was noticed.
Not sure how it works at your school, but here, aside from a few standard 9th grade classes, you're free to pick whatever you want. Any freshman is likely to find himself mixed in with upperclassmen in any class- gym, math, science, English... Some of my funniest memories from ninth grade are of the seniors' mailing it in. It was great for getting in parties, too. "Hey, dude, I know you from Mr. Smith's class. Come on in."
quote:Originally posted by CADad:
Wklink,
I consider the June birthdays as being just fine age wise unless there's something else going on. June is pretty much right in the middle of the age group in most states and close enough in others.
It is when you get into the August, September, October, November, December ranges that it becomes an issue. By the way, in many states those ages do stay back a year relative to other states.
I hear the "they won't be challenged" stuff but my experience is that underachieving isn't a matter of not being challenged as much as it is a lack of maturity in which case staying back helps.
Once again, what is the academic drawback of holding a kid back a year? I'd much rather have a kid more mature and prepared for college than starting college a year earlier. The benefits can be significant while the downside of starting college a year later are nonexistent.
I have no problem holding a kid back that will be 13 when the school season starts. If I had a son that was in the same situation I probably would do the same.
What I would have done is made that decision prior to junior high school.
Disadvantage?
Academic drawaback? There may be none except for the fact that school counselors may be leery of giving the child anything more than rudamentary classes since the perception of a 'held back' child is that he or she may not be intelligent enough to take advanced level courses. To be honest, tell me what the advantage is of a talented student being forced to retake the same classes he or she already succeeded in?
Well, first off is having a 7th or 8th grader enter high school a year behind his peers. If a kid is held back at say, 3rd grade it will not be remembered but if you decide to hold an 8th grader back trust me it will be remembered, both by his former 8th grade peers that will look at him as too dumb to get into high school or by his now 7th grade peers that will not really know what to do with him. We talk about the socialization of high school but we haven't once mentioned the social stigma of being held back.
My youngest is entering high school next year so I am intimately aware of the pain that the kid is starting to go through. He has made friends from his time in junior high and it would be distressing to him to realize that he is now a year behind them.
The other big negative, which I have already stated several times, is that by holding a kid back to play sports, and having that be the ONLY reason parents are giving a child the belief that athletics are more important than education and that your educational needs will be suborned if there is a chance that your boy is athletically gifted. We rail against some of the NCAA violations that we see on a regular basis and lament the 'college graduates' that can't read beyond a 3rd grade level but they are the product of a system that puts athletics over academics.
As I have said before and I will repeat again, I don't have a problem with holding a kid back for the right reasons. If the kid is struggling in school or is too immature to handle high school then he should be held back. That goes for kids ages 13-15. Some kids may not be ready to enter high school until they are 15 (some never from what I have seen). Some can handle it at 13. Others fall in the middle. But intentionally holding a child's education up to play athletics is simply unacceptable to me. Even if it is 'legal' it doesn't make it right. I also suspect that many of these parents that decide to do these things aren't telling the school district why they are doing it either. If you can't stand up in public and state to the people that are teaching you kids why you want to hold your kid back then maybe you should reconsider.
But as I said, if my son was 13 and entering high school I would consider it too. But I would have considered it about six years earlier.
All the people I know of who ended up holding their kids back as of the 8th grade were pleased with the results including the kids themselves. There was no stigma attached as far as I know. They did it for sports, IMO, even though there were other explanations given. In our area the private schools kids would go to in order to repeat a grade tended to offer a better product than the public schools.
Why is it not right? If we had held him in 8th grade so that he started HS at 14 my guess is that my son would have had a much better baseball experience in HS and despite having good grades would be in the same year academically in college at a better school academically right now. In the long run it probably won't make a bit of difference one way or the other.
Why is "holding up" a child's education wrong? It is simply a decision to be made by parents when to best start and complete a child's education through HS. Parents have a responsibility to do what is best for their children. If that means getting them through school early then fine. If that means getting them through school on schedule then fine. If that means getting them through school a bit later then fine. The key is doing what is right for your children. What anyone else does is their choice.
Why is it not right? If we had held him in 8th grade so that he started HS at 14 my guess is that my son would have had a much better baseball experience in HS and despite having good grades would be in the same year academically in college at a better school academically right now. In the long run it probably won't make a bit of difference one way or the other.
Why is "holding up" a child's education wrong? It is simply a decision to be made by parents when to best start and complete a child's education through HS. Parents have a responsibility to do what is best for their children. If that means getting them through school early then fine. If that means getting them through school on schedule then fine. If that means getting them through school a bit later then fine. The key is doing what is right for your children. What anyone else does is their choice.
Wow! When I started this thread I had no idea I'd receive so many responses. Again, thank you for sharing your opinions. Our decision has been made with the support of our son. He will begin HS at 14 and take this year to develop his academic foundation and baseball skills.