High School=Rec ball?

This is only my observation - not intended to cause a uproar--I can only speak for our school & our travel ball. Our High School coach wants his players playing the most competitive ball possible in the summer and fall. As well as weight training and throwing. Our Travel Coaches want our boys playing High School ball. In our area the travel ball doesn't start up for HS guys until HS ball is all but over.

So that said it seems that High School baseball competition is stepping up, do to so many coaches wanting their players playing at the travel ball/prospect level. Limited spots available on a High school team makes it difficult for rec level players in our area to make the High School team.

I think it depends on the pool of players that a HS attracts. A typical HS (~2,400 kids)in our area attracts kids from 4 leagues (or more) so the starters on the Varsity team would play on any travel ball team in the country. (except maybe for a few "elite teams") Our summer HS team played in one tournament and beat all of the travel teams we played soundly. So in one sense just because you play on a travel team does not mean you are better than the next player.

If you lived in an outlying area that has a smaller pool of players to draw from then this would probably not be the case.

I don't see baseball going the way of s*o*cc*e*r where the HS team is not as important as the travel team. It is simply too popular at the HS level, whereas many don't care about the "s" sport. (at least here in the US)

That said playing for some kind of travel/scout team has become more important for kids to be seen at the next level. (as well as the whole show case phenomena)

Why is it posted here in Pre High School?

Did I miss something?

My bad Skeep. I am usually on the pre HS side and it was the youth BB thinking that got my attention. I don't think it really matters which place it is at. If it is a big deal I am sure a moderater will move it(or delete it).

Plus, I don't think this trend will have any effect on kids that are already in HS. I think it will only affect the up and comers.

quote:

Are there kids who start on varsity HS who wouldn't make your travel team?

Yes. 2B goes to a small 3A school that only gets the 3A designation because they count the middle schoolers. Not a very big talent pool. During the fall and summer seasons, when a lot of the better players are playing basketball or football or doing other things, it is very much to me like rec ball. Kind of laid back and slow. But to me summer and fall are the times to let younger guys play without the pressure of the regular season, so that's fine. It's just really hard to make the transition from a tournament like East Cobb or the USA Baseball 16U championships to an area HS summer game. Each has its purpose, but it's a different ball game.

quote:

Do any of you who have kids that play on high end travel and HS notice a difference in ability?

Yes, but the travel team that he plays on combines the best in the area - he is the only one at the 16U level from his school, and there is one at the 18U level. Players come from big schools and small. It is the talent and the speed of the game that makes the travel team so much fun.

In the spring season, though, it's totally different. Even if the HS talent level might not be the same as the travel team at all positions, the intensity and the will to win and "represent" for your school is definitely there. Wearing the jersey to school on game days, having teachers and administrators see their students perform well on the field, and competing against other area schools (some of whom have your travel teammates on them) - it's great. We were actually district runner up last year with 3 freshman starters, and the district tournament games were a blast. It's a different kind of intensity than travel ball, and in some ways more fun. I hope you enjoy it.

Thanks for your input 2BMom. Your reasoning for HS ball sounds just like the reasoning that I hear for Rec ball. It is more fun, its great to represent your school and community, and play with your freinds, but the quality of play isn't quite as high as the travel ball.

It just sounds exactly like someone describing LL to me.

And people are leaving rec ball to play higher level youth travel. I just wonder if in the near future that will also happen in HS.

It just sounds eerily similar and the people that are leaving rec to play travel are the same people that are going to be in HS some day.

Just weird I guess.

Thanks, Doughnutman. There is one difference that I didn't mention. I think high school coaches lives are much easier if they win. Most of the time, the best nine are going to be out there, so the daddyball factor, while it may be still present at times, isn't as much of a factor. At least that has been the case from our experience. There are always accusations of favoritism from parents whose players don't get much playing time, or didn't make varsity, or whatever, but in most cases, the HS coach is going to try to get the guys on the field who are going to give him the best chance of winning. Rec ball around here is mostly a celebration of mediocrity. We tried it when we first moved here, and it wasn't a good experience for us - were pretty much told not to come back and so found a travel team instead. On the other hand, HS welcomes good players.

High School aged kids do not play travel ball during the High School season. They are all playing High School baseball. When a freshman comes into High School baseball for the first time in his life he is playing against and with players that are alot older and alot more mature both physically and mentally than he is. No matter how talented he may be the fact is a 14 or 15 year old will be challenged when playing against and with 18 and 19 year olds.

There is no High School team as talented as the top tier showcase teams. My sons Showcase team had every player on it go on to play at the D1 level with most going to ACC schools the rest to SEC and two to Conf USA. So yes his showcase team was better than the High School team. But the High School team plays in the spring and the showcase teams play in the summer and fall.

The High School experience is one of changes as you get older as far as the baseball goes. If you are a talented player you will be above the grade as a JV player in most cases but very challenged by the Varsity level of play. Even if you are very talented because 18 and 19 year kids are just stronger and baseball smarter. As a soph you will continue to be challenged the gap begins to shorten. As a Jr and Sr if you are a top tier player you start to dominate the game. But you learn how to step up into a leadership role for your team and learn how to handle the pressure of being relied on to help carry your team in certain situations.

Are showcase teams more talented? Of course only the top players are invited to play on these teams. But there are things learned as a baseball player playing High School baseball that can not be learned by playing showcase baseball solely. Its a baseball experience that is critical in the development of a baseball player imo.

High School baseball is not going anywhere. Some people think that playing in High School is a step down for them and they need to play showcase baseball all the time. Again no showcase teams are playing at the High School age during the High School season. High School baseball is a great time of a young mans life. Its a lot more competitive for younger guys playing against older players. Its part of the process that can not be ignore or just blown off.

I hear what you are saying Coach May. But it wasn't too long ago that youth travel teams never played during the LL season and that has certainly changed. They were only used to improve and get better for the LL season. Not to skip it.

Part of my job is looking for trends and trying to prepare my company for the changes that are coming. I see everything in patterns and trends so when I saw this pattern of reasoning I wondered if this is coming in the near future. Thanks for the info.

College coaches are coaching during the spring. Top tier High School players are not going to skip High School baseball for many reasons. #1 They enjoy the experience of playing for the team and not playing to be seen. They get a little tired of this in the summer and fall to be quite honest with you. #2 They know its an important aspect of their baseball development. #3 They want to play for their school , home town and with life long friends. #4 They want to be scouted by the pro scouts their sr year leading up to the pro draft in June. And there are many more reasons.

The Showcase team Coaches are not going to step on the toes of the High School coaches by putting anything out there that directly conflicts with the high school season. Plus college coaches are not going to be scouting any showcase teams during this time of the year because they are playing themselves.

The bottom line is when you reach the high school age , its about playing high school baseball during this time of the year. The summer and fall will belong to Showcase , Legion etc.

I'll try to keep this to a travel v. rec standpoint rather than the rah, rah aspects of playing school ball.

The term "rec ball" tends to be used on boards as a negative term. It tends to mean players who aren't talented. High school players are talented. Obviously, like rec ball, the high school is confined in it's talent search by boundaries (in most areas) and therefore isn't the level of travel ball.

From a recruiting standpoint showcases are becoming more important than high school teams. It's easier to see more talent at showcases in a shorter period of time. Except football, this is the direction recruiting has moved.

But travel teams do not play in the spring. It's summer ball. Playing on the high school team demonstrates a player can balance academics and athletics. I'll bet any college coach would want to know why a prospect passed on high school ball. Dissing the talent level would not be a good answer to demonstrate proper attitude.

My daughter played high school and travel softball. I believe she was very emotionally committed to both. The five seniors played school ball together for six years (ms & hs) and with and against each other going back to 7/8 rec ball. You don't get that sense of attachment to travel teammates.

First off Coach May, I greatly appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions and I respect your opinion on things HS. Greatly. I have read everything you have ever posted on this site.

My emphasis is on possibilities. All of your reasons make a lot of sense right now but things change. Showcases haven't been around that long. There are already HS aged leagues and tournaments for kids who didn't make their HS team due to ability, training, or grades. You see it in s****r and somewhat in basketball now where the HS season is skipped or it doesn't mean much. Kids are focusing on one sport at age 10. Things have really changed in the last 15 years or so.

Right now there are coaches who have problems with kids playing fall or summer ball anywhere but in their programs.
There is a generation of kids and parents who skip LL to play travel now when that was unheard of not too long ago. I guess I will just have to wait to see the changes in the future along with everyone else.
It's just that most of the reasons to stay in HS ball are very similar to the reasons people use to stay in rec ball at the young ages. And people are leaving rec ball by the team.
I hope it doesn't change. But the one constant in life is change.

quote:

Originally posted by 2Bmom:… In the spring season, though, it's totally different. Even if the HS talent level might not be the same as the travel team at all positions, the intensity and the will to win and "represent" for your school is definitely there. Wearing the jersey to school on game days, having teachers and administrators see their students perform well on the field, and competing against other area schools (some of whom have your travel teammates on them) - it's great. We were actually district runner up last year with 3 freshman starters, and the district tournament games were a blast. It's a different kind of intensity than travel ball, and in some ways more fun. I hope you enjoy it.

What you’re describing is COMPETITIVENESS! People can call TB competitive, but all that means is general skill level of the teams is higher than the general skill level of HS teams. But, its very seldom that you’ll see a TB team get all excited over playing another team they’ve never seen before, because there’s no “connection”.

I forgot to mention on the showcase front. Whats to stop a showcase from throwing a Pro only showcase during the season for kids that don't have the grades to play in HS and can't go to college or maybe left college but want to play pro ball. Scouts only. I would think that most showcase coaches would consider that a favor for the kids. It would start off slow but then you never know.

Just a scenario to see how it could start off.

RJM,
I don't consider rec to be bad baseball. It is just that when I hear someone describing HS baseball it sounds just like someone describing rec ball. All of the same reasons are used. The similar descriptions just made me think of the possibilities and if we are going to see the same changes in HS as we are seeing in youth baseball today. I certainly don't want to start an argument with anyone. Just throwing out possibilities and seeing if anybody else has any ideas on the subject.

I definitely don't feel strongly on the matter either way.

So far with the kids I know or know of, I've only heard of s****r, tennis and swimming being sports where some kids have been told to only compete for their club team.

I know a 14yo who wonders why kids play high school baseball, hopefully he'll get his answer next spring...

In this area there is a disturbing trend. Due to the budget crunch, many high school teams are having to resort to function like a travel team. In Volusia County, the high school baseball teams have to pay a facility use fee to the school board to play on their own field at their own school. Some h.s. sports are not being funded at all!

quote:

Originally posted by BOF:
I think it depends on the pool of players that a HS attracts. A typical HS (~2,400 kids)in our area attracts kids from 4 leagues (or more) so the starters on the Varsity team would play on any travel ball team in the country. (except maybe for a few "elite teams") Our summer HS team played in one tournament and beat all of the travel teams we played soundly. So in one sense just because you play on a travel team does not mean you are better than the next player.

If you lived in an outlying area that has a smaller pool of players to draw from then this would probably not be the case.

I don't see baseball going the way of s*o*cc*e*r where the HS team is not as important as the travel team. It is simply too popular at the HS level, whereas many don't care about the "s" sport. (at least here in the US)

That said playing for some kind of travel/scout team has become more important for kids to be seen at the next level. (as well as the whole show case phenomena)

BOF - great points. Just by reading the responses in this thread you can tell that not all high school situations are the same and thus one cannot generalize for all situations.

IMHO, there is much more to the high school situation than the hometown rah-rah stuff. I believe that high school baseball is often crucial or vital to the proper development of a ballplayer. With select or high end travel ball, there is a certain amount of choice or selection (by team and/or player) that goes into whether or not a player is on the team. A high end travel team will often court players they want on the team or players will seek them out and feel them out for their respective chances. Sometimes the competitive pressures are removed or mitigated by this process imho. In other words, a player can jockey around until they find a team they can play on. In some cases, all the players are high end college players, in other cases, players are the best a particular team can find. In some cases, a player is on the team because someone he knows started the team.

In many high school situations, this is the first time a player is forced to learn how to compete and deal with the circumstances as they are. The coach may not like your particular style. There may be other kids who are older and stronger. There may be a dozen different hurdles to overcome that are all out of the player's control. This is where they find out if they have the metal, the will, and the wherewithall to beat someone out. Learn how to perform under pressure. IMHO, pressure is having to perform or sit. If you are on a travel team and the coach already believes in your talent, I question whether a player feels the same type of pressure as in the competitive high school situation.

Our high school was kind of like the one BOF describes. Here it was a big deal to make the freshman team. A bigger deal to make JV the following year and a huge deal to start on varsity by the time you were a junior. We had multiple travel teams attending the same high school that was the largest one in a pretty big state. We had almost 4,000 kids in grades 10-12, where well over 100 kids tried out as freshman and most of them were travel ball players. I was frightened to death about what would happen for my son but thankful as he-ll looking back he was forced to go through that process. Obviously, some travel teams require a player to be more competitive than the respective high school teams but there are still unpredictable forces in the high school situation that players need to learn how to deal with and in many cases overcome.

Very good post CD.

I think that CD's post points out the NECESSITY for kids to play HS baseball. They must adapt to a new situation if they want to play. In travel ball if you don't like the coach, the position, your playing time, etc, you have a choice to leave and find another team. In HS this really is not an option. (You can transfer but it is a big deal and there are limitations) You must learn to work within the needs of the program/team and not the needs of the player.

A kid may have played his whole career at SS and when he gets to HS and he finds that there is a Stud ahead of him at SS - he must find another position to compete for if he wants to play. A slot may open up on the Varsity team in the OF and if he wants to play Varsity - guess what he is now an outfielder. The list of variables is endless and it goes on year in and year out at the HS level.

This is such a maturing process that a player would be at a huge disadvantage if he was not forced to go through the whole team building/competitive dynamics that only HS can give. At younger ages there is always another team/league/season. In HS all of these options dwindle and you have no choice – adapt or don’t play.

If I was a college coach looking at potential players I would be very suspect if a player was not playing on his HS team. There are certainly reasons where a school may not have a team or some other unusual circumstance, but these are the odd cases.

BOF,
Do you think this applies to pitchers as well? I can't see a college coach or pro scout passing on a kid who throws 95 just because he didn't play on his HS team and only did tournaments and showcases?

quote:

Originally posted by Doughnutman:
Do you think this applies to pitchers as well? I can't see a college coach or pro scout passing on a kid who throws 95 just because he didn't play on his HS team and only did tournaments and showcases?

Who said anything about a college coach passing on a player because he didn’t play HS ball. BOF said: If I was a college coach looking at potential players I would be very suspect if a player was not playing on his HS team. There are certainly reasons where a school may not have a team or some other unusual circumstance, but these are the odd cases.

I think those are completely fair and valid statements and don’t even imply passing on a player.

I agree with Skeep. Travis Haffner of the Indians did not play high school ball because they did not have it in his area of South Dakota. It is not a deal killer but it raises some issues.

1) If a coach recruits from a certain high school and he finds out you did not play there he is going to want some reasonable answers for why that was the case.

2) If a player chooses to opt out of high school ball that is available to him, he might be cheating himself out of the competitive learning experiences that are important for success at the college and pro levels.

Not playing high school ball would not preclude someone from having success at the higher levels but it could make the learning curve that much steeper.

Trying to start a fight SKeep? I would think that if a college coach was suspect about a player he would go on to his next choice.

I assume being suspect is a bad thing correct? If two players are almost equal the suspect one doesn't get an offer. Or do college coaches take kids that are suspect on a routine basis as long as they have talent? I certainly don't know? That is why I ask the questions.

quote:

Originally posted by Doughnutman:
Trying to start a fight SKeep? I would think that if a college coach was suspect about a player he would go on to his next choice.

I assume being suspect is a bad thing correct? If two players are almost equal the suspect one doesn't get an offer. Or do college coaches take kids that are suspect on a routine basis as long as they have talent? I certainly don't know? That is why I ask the questions.

Doughnutman - all you have to do to answer your questions is put yourself in the shoes of the coach. Would you automatically cross a talented kid off your list simply because there was more risk associated with him than some kid who was less talented? I doubt it. The answer is it probably depends on your evaluation of it but I am assuming it would factor into your decision. Similarly, if two players were "theoretically" judged to be equal, I can see where something like this would cause one kid to get an offer and another kid to be passed on. What do you think? IMHO, college coaches and scouts are just like you. They have different experiences but their ability to reason things out is the same. I said in my initial post that there are no universal rules that apply to all situations.

What about from a pro perspective? They seem to draft as much from potential ability as they do from actual ability? Would they care if a kid played HS if they see a kid with a lot of talent?

Once again, not trying to start a fight. Just curious about some things that have popped up in my little brain.

This travel ball versus rec ball thing gets a little tired to me. Every year I see a new crop of travel ball parents (I was one myself)who come along thinking Johnny is the next Clemente at the age of 14. Personally, I'd prefer to see the player playing multiple sports year round to develop his athleticism rather than playing the 150 baseball games a year our 9U-14U "Select" travel teams play out here in the desert. Don't get me wrong...I have nothing against youth travel teams, but to think they could supplant high school baseball is pretty far fetched to me.
I'd have a hard time putting my stamp on a kid who didn't play HS baseball becuase he felt it was beneath him. Keep in mind that the HS baseball dynamic is unique. Its really the only environment where a player practices daily with a team, interacts with teammates and coaches on a regular basis. The HS coach has a unique perspective in the evaluation process, as he is normally the best source for info on about a players coachability, leadership skills etc.

Trust me, I love HS ball. I go to games when my kids aren't even in HS yet and it will be a proud moment when/if my son makes the HS team.

This all started with my seeing of how the youth ball is playing out. Many kids and parents are skipping rec ball and playing travel instead. This is a generation of kids and parents coming up who only know travel. I don't think it is too much of a jump in logic to think that it could happen at an older age with access to state/nation wide tournaments and showcases. The tournament directors are usually out to make a buck and if they can get in a few more in the spring, I bet they would do it. Especially with all of the good that showcases do for players who want to go to the next level and to them, HS isn't that big of a deal when their expectations are to play pro/college ball.

This isn't what we will do nor do I expect many kids/parents to take the no HS route. But with all of the changes in youth sports over the last decade, I think it IS possible that we see more of this kind of thing and it will get to be normal. I think it brought up some interesting questions that are baseball related and I look forward to seeing all of the changes that will happen by the time my kids have kids in HS.

Of course if the economy keeps getting worse, I don't think we will see as much travel and showcases will get smaller and more local. But that is another discusion entirely.

quote:

Originally posted by Doughnutman:
Trying to start a fight SKeep? I would think that if a college coach was suspect about a player he would go on to his next choice.

I assume being suspect is a bad thing correct? If two players are almost equal the suspect one doesn't get an offer. Or do college coaches take kids that are suspect on a routine basis as long as they have talent? I certainly don't know? That is why I ask the questions.

Of course I’m not trying to start a fight, but I certainly am trying to do what ClevelandDad said. Put yourself in the other guy’s shoes. If we go back to your example of a kid that throws 95, there’s absolutely no doubt in my mind that the kid is going to play somewhere at the next level, and if it’s a real 95, it’ll likely be under contract rather than school. Why? Because there just ain’t a lot of players who throw the ball that hard! But let’s assume two players could do that and were exactly equal in every way other than one played on his HS team and the other didn’t.

Players like that don’t live in vacuums because the baseball community is very small, so there wouldn’t be any doubt because the skill set would be well known. But let’s change things a bit and say they are both equal and throw 83 but one didn’t play HS ball. What I’m trying to say is, things change when you’re not talking about a kid with “freaky” skills. In that case it wouldn’t surprise me to see a college coach pass on the non-HS player.

All that being said, I sure can’t speak for college coaches in general, or even for specific ones I know a great deal about because college coaches come in all shapes, sizes, abilities and philosophies.

quote:

Originally posted by Doughnutman:…Of course if the economy keeps getting worse, I don't think we will see as much travel and showcases will get smaller and more local. But that is another discusion entirely.

Don’t drop it! I think it’d be a great thread.

One thing not mentioned about getting exposure playing high school ball is press coverage. Players are in the newspapers during the season. A dominant high school player gets lots press. Especially when they make all-area and all-state and even more if their teams win. With the internet and on-line newspapers, the exposure's that much more. Then summer legion and showcase teams boost the exposure for players.

During the spring season, where's all this exposure coming from when just about every top baseball player from their towns and cities are playing for their high school varsity teams.

It seems to be the thinking that the future, college or MLB, is determined by what happens in showcases and tournament ball, not high school. I believe that is mainly the case with the scouts attending more showcases and pg and other events.
There are the flukes. The kid drafted #15 this year by the Dodgers shot up in the draft because of a high school outing as a pitcher and he very rarely pitched for his East Cobb travel team.
I don't see a change any time soon for players dropping high school and going full-time travel ball. There is still the appeal of playing for your high school team and the experience of competing for it.
I have seen a change in the better coaches telling their players to play travel ball rather than school ball in summer.

quote:

Originally posted by rbinaz:
This travel ball versus rec ball thing gets a little tired to me. Every year I see a new crop of travel ball parents (I was one myself)who come along thinking Johnny is the next Clemente at the age of 14. Personally, I'd prefer to see the player playing multiple sports year round to develop his athleticism rather than playing the 150 baseball games a year our 9U-14U "Select" travel teams play out here in the desert. Don't get me wrong...I have nothing against youth travel teams, but to think they could supplant high school baseball is pretty far fetched to me.
I'd have a hard time putting my stamp on a kid who didn't play HS baseball becuase he felt it was beneath him. Keep in mind that the HS baseball dynamic is unique. Its really the only environment where a player practices daily with a team, interacts with teammates and coaches on a regular basis. The HS coach has a unique perspective in the evaluation process, as he is normally the best source for info on about a players coachability, leadership skills etc.

Then you have not been to a large showcase or the WWBA for 18U or seen teams like East Cobb practice. With 200 scouts at one game, they don't care where he played high school. From a scouts point of view, high school in many places is not relevant because the level of play is not equal. Most coaches do not scout players at high school any more, they do it at showcases and large exclusive tournaments like WWBA. They can see the kid play a lot of games against good competition. They can see the kid throwing 95 against a batter who hits .500 and vice-versa.
I also like the kid who plays many sports.
I can see where it will swing that way in the near future. The better players will grasp, especially in their senior years, that they can get more exposure by doing showcases, whether individual or team, their senior years in front of pro and some college scouts, if timed right. I believe it will start with the upper eschelon players and then trickle down as travel ball has done. Parents and players will see it work for the best and more will join. Just my opinion. As in travel vs. rec, there will be those who say they are only young once, play with your friends and grow up after high school. There will be those who say you should be loyal to your high school and community. (Doughnutman, I agree just like rec ball advocates) And then there will be some who will say I must do what's best for me and mine and do the showcase thing as many of us have done with travel ball.

I've said this many times in the past and I'll say it again. At the high school level in the areas of the country where I coached, the players begin practicing 6 days a week until games start. Then its generally 2 games and 4 days of practice a week. If they are being taught the game, this is a very important time for kids to learn the game and hone their skills. Most travel teams are not well practiced, they are gatherers of talent. They expect their players to know the game already. I have been to at least 12 tournaments a year for the past 15 years. The coaching at the travel level has not always been the best. Any good high school coach can watch and see many areas of the game that are being ignored due to the talent level. I am sure thats not in all cases and there are many great coaches at both levels. High school ball also allows a kid to represent his school, where he spends most of his young adult life for 4 years.
Travel ball is not favored by scouts, they could care less where they see the talent, they just want to see it. It just so happens that during the summer, when most scouts and college coaches are free, we have created a travel ball society.
When more and more travel ball teams come along, the talent will also then be diluted. I am already seeing that. Any kid who may be a decent player, doesn't want to play rec ball anymore, so the local parents start another travel team. There will always be the elite organizations, but those will continue to be available to the real elite players, and not any kid who wants travel over rec. Just MHO.

quote:

Originally posted by zombywoof:
One thing not mentioned about getting exposure playing high school ball is press coverage. Players are in the newspapers during the season. A dominant high school player gets lots press. Especially when they make all-area and all-state and even more if their teams win. With the internet and on-line newspapers, the exposure's that much more. Then summer legion and showcase teams boost the exposure for players.

During the spring season, where's all this exposure coming from when just about every top baseball player from their towns and cities are playing for their high school varsity teams.

Most big-time college coaches don't read these papers and the pro scouts sure don't. It may help the mediocre player but not the upper eschelon players. They are given scholarships and contracts mostly from showcases and large WWBA tournaments and pg events where they can be seen against equal level players.
Coaches and scouts could care less about the player who throws a perfect game in hs. Most of them realize that he was probably playing guys that are below them. We, as parents and fans, are the only ones who read those articles.
When I see little Johnny beat so and so on here whether 12U or hs, I give kudos to the parents and player but don't put much worth in it unless it was at one of the top travel tournaments.
Watching the LL world series, I am reminded that your ability is only relative to your competition. All except a very few of those kids that are playing at that world series could compete against the players at elite 24. It is the same for college and pro scoults with HS.

I know in our area a serious ball player even at an early age would not play rec ball. Most play travel ball which si not too expensive and usually plays within a 100 mile radius.
For the last 15 years or so the Elite ball came into beinjg. It delivered better coaching,training and travel to the US to play top teams. There is no comparison to HS and even the local travel team. It is very expensive depending on the team you play for and generally costs between $4000 to $10,000. Some of the teams have affilliations with top college programs,with Ontario
/Canadian Youth teams and pro scouts. HS is competetive but it usually lacks depth. I am sure that as here in parts of the US there are very strong HS teams depending on the area they are from. HS is probably more important in these areas than others.
With the advent of showcases the colleges and pros have a one stop shopping centre compared to running all over the country to attend tournaments and games. I have seen the decline in scouts attendind what were once large local events with 20-100 scouts. The only time I see them is when they are lokking at an individual like Nick Weglarz or some other high profile player. We used to hold the NABF world series and teams like East Cobb and all the top teams would come. Scouts were every where but the general tournaments don't draw many if any at all'
Going to large showcases can be good and bad for different players. If you attend a showcase where there are guys throwing 90+ which is most of them and you throw 84 it can actually be a bad thing for you even if you perform extremely well. I am a strong believer in playing HS and top elite ball. HS more for fun as compared to intense elite ball. I also believe in self promotion using the elite ball video to create interest. Too many people blow there brains out going to showcases in my opinion. Since I can compare what results my son had and others who went to the big showcases I would have to say we did better than most at very little cost. We created oportunities at some big name schools but that was never our agenda.

Doughnutman:

Anyone throwing 95 is going to get a look regardless. However most 95ers had to learn to pitch somewhere. We are talking about the average player here, not even those getting a pro look. The number of kids getting looked at in HS by the pros is statistically insignificant. It won’t be your son, my son or 99% of the people on this board.

Rbinaz:

I agree 100% that too many young kids and parents get trapped into thinking that little Johnny has to play travel ball. Young kids need exposure to multiple sports, period. When you get to HS the athletes become obvious, the HS coaches see this and that player will get coached and put into the position. Little Johnny travel ball may or may not be this kid. A perfect example of this is our starting SS on Varsity this year will be a Soph “athlete” who the coach saw immediately at the first try out, picked him, worked with him last year and groomed him for the slot that will open with a departing Sr. He never played one game of travel ball and played three sports as a youth. Little Johnny travel ball SS was stuck on the freshmen squad and will never see an inning on the Varsity team. (at least at SS, my guess is that he may make the team in his Sr year but will not start) His parents spent tens of thousands of dollars and trucked him all over the country for nothing.

Jeff Conell:

You are dead wrong about coaches not scouting at the HS level. The college coaches know the HS coaches, they talk to them and do go to games. Our HS legion team had a college scout following one Sr. kid on my sons team this summer. He has been offered a spot on a top 40 D1 program without seeing him play against top talent… not even against our league rivals.. just one or two mediocre legion teams. (BTW he was a multi-sport athlete, and never played travel ball)

As far as getting known, I am sure all of the scout teams, showcases, camps help, but if you want to play for a certain school you are better off contacting them directly and going to the source of the decision. It’s called target marketing.

BHD:

I am sure Canada has different dynamics as far as developing baseball skills. Florida and California develop so many players since they have the weather and competition that travel ball is a nicety but not a requirement. I agree with you on the whole showcase phenomena, many go and waist their time and money. I have a target velocity for my son and when he gets close or over this then I will take him to one to get an independent ranking. If he has not hit where I think he needs to be at then we will just wait it out until he does.

This thread has drifted around but is what I consider the best part of HSBBW. Since this is in the pre-HS thread and in the FWIW department:

1. I think that HS baseball is a MUST for any serious player. Baseball will not go the s******r route where HS does not really matter. All of the reasons are in this thread.
2. Travel ball is good once you get over 13. Before this, don’t waist your time and money.
3. Make sure you kids play a variety of sports and have wide interest. It WILL make them more competitive in HS.
4. The athletes will rise to the top in HS regardless how many travel ball games you son has played.
5. When he gets there, sit down, shut up and enjoy the experience with your son and let him find his way.