Hindsight: Recruiting mistakes

Do not be kicking yourself---the boat you are in is filled with a lot of people

Well TR, it all worked out in the end-but we wish we had known then what we know now! Hope to see you in Norwich with my 2010...

Here is ours......taking the best financial offer over the best "fit" of school....

quote:

Originally posted by rocketmom:
I thought it might be useful if those of us who have done this before would impart the wisdom (however small) gained in the process by sharing mistakes made. Here are ours: 1) putting "all our eggs in one basket" 2) being uneducated as to the significance of which division a school was in; i.e. not realizing that the level of play is not necessarily lower just because the division number is 3) assuming that a team showing alot of interest in the fall was a "done deal" 4) dismissing opportunities without having fully checked out the situation

Good Luck to all the 2010s!

Those are excellent points rocketmom!

We really do not have any regrets. That said, we had some blind-squirrel luck go our way. If I had to do things over again, I would not leave things up to chance like we did. Thus, I would have gotten my son more exposure via high-level showcases like PG. Even if we would have done that however, we could not have come up with a better opportunity for him.

Good point, CD; unless the player is of the highest level DI caliber, there does seem to be alot of luck involved. Getting more exposure and "widening the net" you cast can help your luck, it seems.

rocketmom good points and a good topic. You say:

quote:

unless the player is of the highest level DI caliber, there does seem to be alot of luck involved

I think there is a lot of luck involved for all players no matter what the level. There are a lot of unknowns whenever ANY player makes a commitment to a college. One could say the D-1 player faces greater athletic obstacles than the majority of the D-3 players thus failure could be more common at the D-1 level. I think it has to do with "fit" and we don't know how it fits until we wear it for a while.
A myriad of unknowns exist no matter how thorough we are in our preliminaries estimations ----- academics, athletic, social adjustments and just being away from home can create unconquerable challenges for the players. I like the "blind squirrel" analogy used by CD because I think all players are blind squirrels looking for that acorn. As far as baseball goes I asked knowledge baseball people about my son and allowed their opinions to form my own. No matter how objective we consider ourselves the rose colored glasses do alter the parent's perspective.
Fungo

1. Stuck with a HS program that makes no effort to help most players get into college instead of transferring.
2. Didn't make enough effort to play in WWBA tournaments. The showcases get you on the radar, more signings result from performing well in the WWBA tournaments.

Tough sledding in these economic times though.... Have a 2010 who is in the recruiting boat. Working on doing the best we can to showcase but, as most of our world, finance's preclude going to everything. That being said, 2010 is going to the Stanford Prospect Camp in June, wondering what other showcases/camps you all reccommend. Summer team not much help as we live in an area that's not conducive to travel ball exposure, at least on a national scale. So please fire some of that HSBBW wisdom towards Colorado....we need it (obviously the Rockies are clueless).

J23

quote:

Originally posted by CADad:
The showcases get you on the radar, more signings result from performing well in the WWBA tournaments.

I suspect that is more true for pitchers than for position players. In a tournament game a pitcher may throw perhaps 100 pitches, and that is quite a bit of evidence. The position player may get in total 10-20 plate appearence. An outfielder may have only a handful of plays, with quite possible no opportunity to display his arm.

Just speculation on my part; I don't really know.

The point(s) that CADad makes about exposure is true but it sparks more discussions ---- just because a player attends numerous showcases and creates MORE options does nothing to improve success. The key point he makes is hidden in the next sentence

more signings result from performing well in the WWBA tournaments.

But even this can be confusing ---- just because a player signs doesn't mean he has succeeded (in my opinion). I think success is based on a player's ability to "fit" or "belong" at the college he signs and that only happens AFTER he settles in --- this may take a year before he knows. My son was in a unique position as he was a two way player (C/P). He received offers from all different divisions. Some offers came in for him to be a pitcher, to be a catcher, or to play both positions. While he had many offers only a very few (maybe just one) provided what he thought was a good fit. Finding a fit can be very difficult and again may be controlled by luck more than not.

Again I suggest you ask others. My son played summer ball for a coach that had played pro ball for many years (7 at the MLB level). This coach also had a son on the team that had some college potential. This coach (father) pulled me aside one day and asked me --- "At what college level do you think my son can play?" I was shocked that a MLB pitcher would ask me, someone that never got past HS baseball about where his son could play. I suggested he knew much more about baseball than I would ever know. He explained why he was asking --- "How would I know anything about where he can play, he's my son"!

1. Ignoring "best fit" for "best chance to make the College World Series" in choosing a school

2. Going to a school where the coaching staff changed

3. Not clearly understanding that freshmen have to start at the bottom

Here's 3 more tips - Always make it a point to talk to parents who have "been there and done that."

Don't expect the HS coach to get you to the next level or help you in the recruiting process. Some will, but ultimately, it's up to the parent and the player

The key to recruiting is a PG showcase and/or Area Codes

rocketmom

Look forward to seeing him in Norwich---we have a great lineup of speakers for our seminar there

Good subject Rocketmom. Many of the other mistakes posted have been repeated by many. I tell all my baseball friends who have younger players to get on this website so they can benefit from our experiences. Here is Pop up son's list in order of magnitude.

1. Not taking academics seriously.

2. Assuming letters from big schools meant he did not have to respond or look for a place to go after HS.

Son did Jupiter, East Cobb, Arizona Junior Showcase and Area Code. Going to these events can help, especially if you get a hit or two or pitch lights out. Don't expect the phones to start ringing, or letters to flood in. Nope, none of that occurred. Son was seen at the Area Code tryout, a coach saw him, and that school was the only one to make an offer. We took it after speaking to ex-teammate's parents who went on to that program. I also visited that school recently and now my big concern is coach is doing so well, he may get recruited by big program. One last thing about Area Code, most of the players chosen for this have already committed to the large D1 programs, if your son hasn't been recruited by then, they are just a good ballplayer needed to fill out the roster.

quote:

Originally posted by Fungo:
The point(s) that CADad makes about exposure is true but it sparks more discussions ---- just because a player attends numerous showcases and creates MORE options does nothing to improve success. The key point he makes is hidden in the next sentence

more signings result from performing well in the WWBA tournaments.

But even this can be confusing ---- just because a player signs doesn't mean he has succeeded (in my opinion). I think success is based on a player's ability to "fit" or "belong" at the college he signs and that only happens AFTER he settles in --- this may take a year before he knows. My son was in a unique position as he was a two way player (C/P). He received offers from all different divisions. Some offers came in for him to be a pitcher, to be a catcher, or to play both positions. While he had many offers only a very few (maybe just one) provided what he thought was a good fit. Finding a fit can be very difficult and again may be controlled by luck more than not....

Great points Fungo. Much of my recruiting "expertise" comes from what I have read here on the hsbbweb and all that was learned after my son had signed. One thing I am adamant about though is I always trust my own judgment first. I would not allow a message board to make my decisions for me nor determine my strategies for that matter.

Recruiting is very simple when you think about it. It is talent plus exposure. If a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it, I can assure people that it does not make a sound. On the other hand, I have read hundreds if not thousands of stories here on the hsbbweb of kids who had ten times the amount of exposure mine had and ended up with lessor opportunities.

The thing to keep in mind with Fungo's comments is that signing-on with a college is the easy part. Actually finding your way on to the field is the toughest challenge most will ever face in their lives. Fit is crucial to ensure success. Here are some more of my thoughts that I formed before ever hearing of the hsbbweb:

1) Look for programs that win - regardless of level.

2) Find a program you are sure that wants you and build up from there. Some say they want to play at an ACC or SEC school and they start there. Nothing wrong with those aspirations but find a sure thing first and then work your way up from there.

CD

I respectfully disagree with regard to winning programs---why not go to a program in a strong conference and has a strong schedule but they are not a winning program--if they ain't winning it ups the odds for freshman player to get playing time quickly

As for "big" programs how about this

I am listening to the Division III regionals right now and there are kids in the event who have played on our travel team---they are all starters on teams with a shot to go to the Division III World Series--may not be equal to Division I in some peoples eyes but these kids are playing on winning teams and could be huge winners--one of the players who is a junior at Trinity was with them last year as National Champs---it all depends on what you want as an individual

quote:

As for "big" programs how about this

77-6 over the last two years and in the undefeated bracket of the regional championship. I remember one of the kids saying last year, "UConn may be a lot better than us. But we practice and play just as hard." Some of these kids have put up such huge numbers over the past couple of years I'll guess they could play at higher levels. Last year's stud pitcher is. He's in the minors.

Fungo;

When I started the Area Code games in 1987, the pro scouts selected the players and the college coaches enjoyed the benefits. For this reason over 400 players who played in the tryouts and AC games have now played ML Baseball. Over 4,000 have played college baseball.

The association between the pro scouts and college coaches is very interesting and has continued for 26 years of our Goodwill Series.

The pro scout for both personal and human objectives
desires to "help" the player, who has "reasonable" talent. This "help" may be a "quiet" recommendation for the coach to see the player or to send information.

To summarize: play every inning, every practice with
100% energy and run to your position between innings. Do not sit in the dugout waiting for the coach to appear with the equipment. "I guarantee you, someone is watching"

Today, I watched a youth 13 year old game and in the final inning a runner crossed the plate and the next batter did not signal slide or "hold up" nor did he remove the bat from the baseline.

Fortunately the coach was one our former Legion players and I requested a 60 second meeting after the game, made my statement and departed.

The player will not forget next time. At 13 years of age he has a "second" chance. At 16-17 he does not!!!!

Please excuse the "long message".

Bob

Fungo,
I liked that story about the coach, one of the most important things in this process is to be objective.

Things worked well for our son, not sure of any mistakes, but I am sure we made a few along the way as well.

As far as chosing a winning program, that's not always possible for everyone. While there is no way I would want my player to attend a losing program, finding a place that he felt comfortable at (fit) with a good solid baseball program that is competitive year after year in it's conference should be the goal at any level. If your only goal is to play on a team that heads to Omaha each year, one has to understand that this may not be the best "fit" for everyone. More often than not players leave those type of programs searching for more playing time, which is now harder to do (transfer rules). A great situation is where a young staff is needed, that gives you more opportunity.

Each and every player has different goals, and that should be the basis for any decision.

And don't forget about the educational part of the whole process.

I'm extremely happy with the choice my son has made and so is he. However, three things stand out in my mind as to how we will do things differently with my other two boys.

1. Attend the Stanford Camp if invited. My son was invited but we didn't realize what a big deal it was.

2. Convince my son to sit when injured. My son played hurt almost his entire summer before his senior year, being hurt in the second scrimmage game for his travel team after high school. He wanted to play so bad that he played with the injury and minimized it to us, his parents. I think it hurt some of his opportunities since coaches who saw him assumed they were seeing him at 90-100%

3. Read even more HSBBW and ask more questions!!! I started reading HSBBW in 2005 and joined in 2006, so I had the benefit of three years to absorb the great knowledge offered on this website before the recruitment process started in earnest. I also read two books that were recommended. I still could have been better prepared for the process.