5 Iowa hs teams have a case of covid. Not sure how summer will proceed. 26th ad's are to reevaluate.
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I have a bad feeling that given the spikes in some states we may see some of youth sports start to shut back down again. A local area school district had allowed for high school athletes in small groups come back to campus for strength and conditioning plus off season work outs. I think this was 2-3 weeks ago. They just shut it back down. No more on campus activities until further notice.
The tournaments we have played in and that we have went and watched a family friend play in, no efforts to social distance or wear masks at all by the people in the stands. I think if there is an instance where several people at one event come up testing positive that it starts down that road of possibly canceling tournaments.
I went the first night to games here the first night HS baseball and softball played in Iowa (these are high school varsity sports, BTW) and was truly appalled at the lack of social distancing or other precautions being taken by fans, let alone players. Iowa has worked really hard to be "safe and responsible" and kept most of our cases isolated to meatpacking plants and nursing homes. I'm not sure the games are worth it if it results in widespread cases. Hopefully it doesn't come to that.
People will test positive right now. Many in the fall. Many in the winter. More again next spring. More will test positive next summer. We will not go a day for years without people somewhere, in every state, testing positive. When our leaders start realizing we just need to learn to live with this and do our best to support the most vulnerable, we can go on our business and have sports.
But as long as we freak out over a positive case and try to save every single life, we won't have sports anywhere. Or weddings. Or normal education. Or graduations, field trips, studying abroad, memorable travel, vacations, etc.
Feel awful for the elderly right now. Feel just as awful for our youth.
@James G posted:People will test positive right now. Many in the fall. Many in the winter. More again next spring. More will test positive next summer. We will not go a day for years without people somewhere, in every state, testing positive. When our leaders start realizing we just need to learn to live with this and do our best to support the most vulnerable, we can go on our business and have sports.
But as long as we freak out over a positive case and try to save every single life, we won't have sports anywhere. Or weddings. Or normal education. Or graduations, field trips, studying abroad, memorable travel, vacations, etc.
Feel awful for the elderly right now. Feel just as awful for our youth.
I have tremendous respect for my state, where our businesses are open, we are playing high school sports, where our little league started play on Monday and where my high school will hold an in person graduation on Sunday. "Our leaders" have thrown open the door and asked us to be safe and responsible on our own, with little guidance for what that might look like and many of us are taking up that challenge pretty well.
I am proud of those of us who are being careful while living our lives — staying home when they are sick, wearing masks when unable to socially distance, and maintaining social distance when possible.
Please note that I didn't say we should shut down due to a positive test. I said I was concerned about cases becoming widespread. Please note that I didn't say we should shut down at all, I said I am concerned about the number of people who won't do easy things like wear a mask or sit six feet away from me in order to protect both of us.
Yes, we have to learn to live with this. On the other hand, we can't ignore it.
For the next few months, for instance, study abroad won't be an issue — it's likely the EU won't let us in until we reduce the percentage of infections in the United States. Feeling bad won't fix that.
Nice post IOWAMOM.
I understand that people had to get back to work, that is a given. Bills have to be paid and food put on the table.
The most important thing is/was that everyone get back to school, regardless of it being preschool, elementary or secondary. But we just couldn't resist. Everything we did to flatten the curve is pretty much non existent.
People said that Governor DeSantis did such a good job. Today he admitted that he lied. He lied so he could open the state up when it wasn't ready. Today the employees at Disneyworld asked to wait to open. He let everyone back in without any restrictions. He refuses to wear a mask, people are not happy. More and more young adults are getting sick here. Problem is that they don't know they are sick.
And DeSantis is allowing the RNC to come to Jacksonville with no restrictions.
As of today, Palm Beach County residents have to wear masks in public or they can be fined. I don't get why it's so terrible to wear a mask. Or social distance.
Feeling bad won't fix it. Ignoring it won't fix it. Never said to ignore it. What we are seeing is that nothing is stopping it. Europe, Brazil, other places have had masks and social distancing in effect for months. Doesn't matter. You can mandate masks, you can mandate social distancing, it doesn't matter. It's too late, it's too widespread. You should be lucky you are in an area where businesses are open, kids are playing, etc. I and many others aren't in any area where that is happening yet.
Some people think it's terrible to wear a mask and social distance because it goes against constitutional rights. And there is some merit to it. There is no federal or state law that says people have to wear a mask or social distance. Or even require healthy people to cover their mouths and noses to protect others. Very slippery slope with that, and that is why we are seeing many lawyers take it up. Some think it's terrible because there still to this day isn't any refutable evidence that it works. Lots of little tidbits and speculation, but no definitive science to back it up. Some think it's terrible because you watch the massive protests and so far there haven't been outbreaks in those areas from a few weeks ago. All valid opinions on these reasons.
We are in an area where you really can't enter any place without a mask. Businesses are following CDC guidelines. And people adhere and respect each other. Even with that, COVID is hitting way into the thousands every day in Florida.
Being outdoors really is not the same as jamming thousands of people indoors.
I have a huge problem with people thinking that they don't have to wear a mask because of their constitutional rights. We are in a crises, the world is in crises. Use your head, think about the next person if not yourself.
Yep, you can follow constitutional laws or ethical/moral ones. Neither is incorrect. Which is why it should all be individual choices on whether one wants to wear a mask or social distance.
Just came back from a tournament in Iowa. The workers in restaurants, food stores, and in the facility all wore masks. For some reason our hotel, a Marriott, did not. Fewer than 1 in 100 fans wore masks at the baseball facility, which is all well and good if you can distance yourself, which I could...except when it rained and we all had to crowd under one central structure. It rained hard on parts of Fri, Sat and Sunday, with heavy winds that rendered all but the most heavy duty umbrellas useless.
If you are wondering why we could still play, it was because the fields were incredibly well drained, and it was a turf infield. They played throughout the weekend, and only suspended play temporarily if there was obvious lightning or a very heavy downpour. My 16yo played his first game in rain the entire game. The 1st pitcher tried to throw a curve once, then it was all fastballs and changeups afterwards.
@James G posted:Yep, you can follow constitutional laws or ethical/moral ones. Neither is incorrect. Which is why it should all be individual choices on whether one wants to wear a mask or social distance.
One major issue with these continued and misguided posts seems obvious: this is a medical and public health issue at its core. The medical guidance is clear: wear a mask and socially distance. In work places, restaurants and other public areas, additional protections need to be in place. Individual choices are, clearly, a complete and utter failure.
This is a HEALTH issue. Follow sound medical guidance. It is not a constitutional issue.
It's actually is a constitutional and law issue. Businesses can of course opt to require it for patrons (no shirt no shoes, etc) but you cannot force people to do it by law. Anybody that does is in line for a nice lawsuit, until there is a law passed.
And there isn't any medical studies that absolutely show masks and social distancing works with coronavirus. Mask studies for other things to protect? Tons of them. Stopping coronavirus within past 4 months? Nothing conclusive. Like I said there are other countries and states that have mask mandates and social distance stuff in place. Still didn't stop the spread.
I'm all for saying you can wear masks if you want. I'm all for saying a business can implement capacity measures if they want. The key phrase is if they want.
But to say that everybody must do this because science says so is misleading. There is too much of it and real life situations in other countries and states that show it has little effect.
Individual choices aren't a failure either because it doesn't matter at all. This will continue to run its course no matter what. So the question still begs, how long do you want to cripple our youth and way of life (long as cases are reported and some people die? 1 year? 5 years? 10 years? Either pray for herd immunity or it to miraculously die out, because a vaccine isn't going to eradicate it.
If the point was to not overwhelm our healthcare system (remember that?) then we did the job asked. Time to move on and open everything back up with personal choices.
What provision of the constitution is so absolute that wearing masks and social distancing cannot be imposed in a pandemic and through emergency declarations. Governors in TX and FLA are now back tracking. This is not an issue or "more testing." This is an issue or a greater percentage of those tested being infected with increasing hospitalization rates, with no end in site. What provision of the constitution? Are you referring to the US Constitution or provisions of 50 State Constitutions. The Federal Government has, in effect, said this is a State issue.
@James G posted:Yep, you can follow constitutional laws or ethical/moral ones. Neither is incorrect. Which is why it should all be individual choices on whether one wants to wear a mask or social distance.
If it is a constitutional issue, that is for the courts to decide. Not any individual. If we could all decide individually whether laws were or weren't constitutional, there would be no law.
Best thing I read on here, months ago: some people think it's fun to drive drunk. However, you do not have a constitutional choice about whether or not to drive drunk. It's not just about what you think you want to do, it's about the impact on other people. Exact same thing for masks. The mask doesn't protect you, it protects me from you.
Yes the mask is supposed to protect the other person, not the wearer. But there has never been, and still no state law that forces people to wear something that protects someone else. Again, all for choices. You feel you should wear a mask? Cool no prob. Your business feels it needs to require one upon entry? Fine. A governor saying everyone must wear one if you can't stay more than 6 ft from someone (but not 5 feet, only 6) or you'll be fined, or all kids must wear one in school? That's technically not legal yet and a lawyers dream.
In fact, it has already been legislated, in 1905:
It is Fed OSHA which is placing requirements on employers and businesses reopening.
They get inspected and fined for non- compliance. It’s not their choice and “okay, fine.”
@James G posted:Yes the mask is supposed to protect the other person, not the wearer. But there has never been, and still no state law that forces people to wear something that protects someone else. Again, all for choices. You feel you should wear a mask? Cool no prob. Your business feels it needs to require one upon entry? Fine. A governor saying everyone must wear one if you can't stay more than 6 ft from someone (but not 5 feet, only 6) or you'll be fined, or all kids must wear one in school? That's technically not legal yet and a lawyers dream.
The WH made a statement if more people wore masks, 33k lives would be saved. Sounds like they got that info from someone. They dont usually come up with that stuff on their own.
What happened to contact tracing?
As of today, more states will be starting to enforce wearing a mask. Too many getting sick.
Here is my issue, there is no law to make one wear a mask, but we have laws where people can legally carry a gun in the open. Which scenario will kill more people? Ridiculous isn't it?
I am not sure why this became a political issue, as noted its a health issue.
A friend of mine heard a radio ad. Seeing friends or family this weekend? Wear a mask. It’s the polite thing to do.
From that heritage article:
"The act can be read to allow for the general quarantine of all people from a particular state or states, including those who are asymptomatic or even have tested negative. But an attempt to do so would certainly result in litigation. Congress should promptly enact a statute that would affirm federal authority to impose a general quarantine if necessary."
That part is the key. It can be "read" to allow that but a statute hasn't been enacted yet for quarantine (or mandating masks, which isn't mentioned anywhere in that article). Specifically I like how it stated the asymptomatic part. There are no statutes that allow any healthy person to be forced to quarantine or wear a mask. Sounds like there are though for the sick. I do appreciate that link.
And that's another big issue going on right now. Tons of cases, but overall deaths and hospitalizations/ICU beds aren't increasing rapidly. Which means tons of people aren't necessarily getting sick. Median age of those testing positive is dropping below 40. Which means a vast majority of these case numbers you see all over the place are people that are not sick enough to be in the hospital. And will recover fast. I think it is AZ (maybe TX?) that stated all patients who are given Redesivmir drug have to be hospitalized for 5 days. Even if they are good to go home. So those count had hospitalized and beds. Always dig deeper than the headline cases. Case numbers don't matter much anymore.
Your input is so wrong and so bad.
All I know is that in 4 months, approx 125,000 people have died. No spin can justify that.
And also last year 90k died from the flu. Was there spin for that? Nobody batted an eye. For something that was viral and has a vaccine. I have no issue if you don't agree with my opinion. But I haven't "spun" anything.
As many others have stated- it's incredible that before March 2020 people were OK with the fact that people die. But since March 2020, not one person can die from this one thing. It's truly heartbreaking and frustrating on so many levels.
Not 90k
wrong information again and again and again!!!!
From the CDC site for the entire flu season:
”Conclusion
CDC estimates that influenza was associated with more than 35.5 million illnesses, more than 16.5 million medical visits, 490,600 hospitalizations, and 34,200 deaths during the 2018–2019 influenza season. This burden was similar to the estimated burden during the 2012–2013 influenza season1.“
COVID is NOT the flu!
Sorry I meant 2018 not 2019. Believe it was in range of 80-90k.
Did I say it was the same as the flu? I posted it because people reference the Covid deaths like they are completely unavoidable. Well, we also have something called the flu, which also acts like a virus that transmits from person to person and kills thousands and thousands every year. That part you can compare and the response we have been ordered to give to it.
I think that no-one knows what the shape of this will be. Yes, younger people are being diagnosed right now, and therefore cases may go up but not deaths. Or, there may simply be a delay of a couple of weeks; young people this week, their vulnerable acquaintances in hospitals two weeks after that, deaths 2 weeks after that. Right now we just don't know. Where do we want to be in a month? You say it might not be so bad; true, but it could also be disastrous, we don't know. More cases mean more spread, that is a fact. Requiring masks to curb it, which is not particularly difficult to implement, is a good idea, given that it could be disastrous. The 24-hour news cycle means that every day, we learn something new. Time sure seems to be moving slowly.
I disagree with the comparison with the flu. Flu shots are available, there also are theraputics, and, not everyone is vulnerable to the flu, whereas everyone on the planet is vulnerable to COVID-19. If the entire workforce gets sick, don't you think that would be a problem? Keeping the curve flattened is just as valid now as it was a few months ago.
I get a flu shot every year, I had one shot which protects me from pnuemonia. It basically gives me protection from getting seriously ill.
The only thing that protects me from COVID is a mask and social distancing. I am limited as to where I can go.
Don't use that argument.
I read the other day, that while many younger people are getting ill and recovering, doctors predict that this disease will leave it's mark on many. Mostly in raising the chances of lung and heart disease. No one really has a clue to the consequences of getting COVID.
Compare it to what happens to a heavy smoker after 30-40 years. There is that unknown factor.
I saw a women from Colorado (pretty sure that was where she lived) who is on her second round of COVID. She was in pretty bad shape. I would say she was early 40s.
So now they are discovering that you can possibly get it twice and you probably won't have lifelong antibodies, as we do with other diseases. Another unknown factor.
Things will get worse. Wait until the weather gets cooler.
@James G posted:Sorry I meant 2018 not 2019. Believe it was in range of 80-90k.
Did I say it was the same as the flu? I posted it because people reference the Covid deaths like they are completely unavoidable. Well, we also have something called the flu, which also acts like a virus that transmits from person to person and kills thousands and thousands every year. That part you can compare and the response we have been ordered to give to it.
You are posting misinformation. According to the CDC, the highest amount of deaths per flu season(they go that way rather than by year) was in 2017-18, and was about 61,000. The average over the past 9 seasons(all the years that the CDC has posted) was approx. 37,000. C-19 has killed 125,000 in 4 months, and reliable estimates have it going over 180,000 by Oct.1.
Minimizing and denying the amount of death this disease causes will not make it go away. Smart health practices, and perhaps luck, will. Some of our idiot politicians were holding up Sweden as a model to follow, when their death rate is 40% higher than ours. It would be far smarter to follow the example of their neighbors, the Danes and the Norwegians, who took stringent, preemptive measures back in the beginning to halt the spread of C-19, and as a result have death rates per capita that are far less than ours. They are also now back in business, due to them not acting liked spoiled little children, and actually taking their medicine before they got really sick.
Who would've thought it? Being guided by health professionals about an epidemic is more effective than being led by self interested politicians and wannabe constitutional lawyers.
There is a difference between dying WITH Covid and dying FROM Covid, which the numbers do not reflect. If someone dies WITH Covid, it has been counted as a Covid death. In fact, many reporting districts are now counting cases that were "suspected" as Covid-related to be Covid deaths. I'm not at all trying to say that there is no risk--Covid is very real and very dangerous; however, the data being used is suspect because of the political and economic ramifications of it. When money and medicine mix, be very suspicious of the messaging. Add politics into that mix and it doesn't get better.
All that said, the OP is about baseball in Iowa. I'm glad it's happening--my son will be there this weekend, and we are looking forward to it. We will choose to remain socially distant and will choose to take measures to protect our family, as is our responsibility...but we're there for baseball, not a PPE convention.
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I was one of the biggest to argue about not going overboard about shutting things down. However having masks when social distancing is not allowed is a different issue, and I don't see how it hurts anybody except in very specific situations and people. Courts have upheld many instances of states mandating temporary measures to battle pandemics under the 10th amendment.
In our community during baseball games, masks are rare except for the umpires, who have to wear them. We also social distance, and when a rain comes, they kick everybody out of the park, requiring us to go to our cars.
@Viking0 posted:In our community during baseball games, masks are rare except for the umpires, who have to wear them. We also social distance, and when a rain comes, they kick everybody out of the park, requiring us to go to our cars.
The key words in your post that jumped out at me is " in our community".
Here in Florida, there are lots of people not from our community. I don't find it a coincidence that the states with most cases have opened up so that people can come from other states to enjoy the ammenties, vacation or play sports. How many have traveled here from other states for that reason? Were you and your family tested before you came, after you came home?
I am pretty sure that is why coaches from all D1sports are home watching 3, 4 games at a time on computers, tablets, etc. Seems to me that more than likely they were concerned about their families and that their bosses were concerned for them as well.
As far as those defending the not wearing of masks because you aren't sick, the only way you know that you aren't sick is if you get tested regularly.
@4T2 posted:There is a difference between dying WITH Covid and dying FROM Covid, which the numbers do not reflect. If someone dies WITH Covid, it has been counted as a Covid death. In fact, many reporting districts are now counting cases that were "suspected" as Covid-related to be Covid deaths. I'm not at all trying to say that there is no risk--Covid is very real and very dangerous; however, the data being used is suspect because of the political and economic ramifications of it. When money and medicine mix, be very suspicious of the messaging. Add politics into that mix and it doesn't get better.
...
We've all seen the many theories and rationale points behind death numbers being understated and being overstated. The majority of top health experts, doctors, medical examiners and hospital officials (including those who have nothing to gain financially and/or stand to lose more than they gain with their position on this) believe the number is understated.
@cabbagedad posted:We've all seen the many theories and rationale points behind death numbers being understated and being overstated. The majority of top health experts, doctors, medical examiners and hospital officials (including those who have nothing to gain financially and/or stand to lose more than they gain with their position on this) believe the number is understated.
I am on the fence with over/under. According to an ER doctor hospital admins want all deaths labeled C19. Brings them and insurance companies more money from the government.
@cabbagedad posted:We've all seen the many theories and rationale points behind death numbers being understated and being overstated. The majority of top health experts, doctors, medical examiners and hospital officials (including those who have nothing to gain financially and/or stand to lose more than they gain with their position on this) believe the number is understated.
Man, I tried so hard not to jump in..... the same stuff over and over again. In my opinion, Deaths are understated if you accept the actual public death count (which I don't) and postulate that there were deaths from Covid that weren't identified and counted. Do I think some people died of Covid that weren't counted - sure how could there not be.
BUT logic should tell you that current publically reported COVID death counts are overstated because so many deaths were "assumed" COVID due to the financial incentives. There are anecdotes all over the place about this. My friends aunt died before Covid hit her nursing home, she was added as a COVID death 6 weeks after her death as assumed Covid. She's in the official number. The financial incentives are real as TPM just pointed out. This argument will just go in circles because one group is accepting the baseline number as a fact and one group is correctly not in my opinion.
@cabbagedad posted:We've all seen the many theories and rationale points behind death numbers being understated and being overstated. The majority of top health experts, doctors, medical examiners and hospital officials (including those who have nothing to gain financially and/or stand to lose more than they gain with their position on this) believe the number is understated.
Not arguing the overstate/understated thing. However, I do know that treatments for COVID have improved greatly. The death rate should go down due to that, but they are hard to pin down. Early on, it was a crapshoot (part of the reason that such drastic action was taken early on), and now there are sound evidence based policies hospitals are following.
James G, "And that's another big issue going on right now. Tons of cases, but overall deaths and hospitalizations/ICU beds aren't increasing rapidly.
https://www.khou.com/article/n...ea61?ref=exit-recirc
Correction!: Houston hospital system ICU is at 97%, with 1 in 4 being COVID. Gov Abbot just issued order to suspend elective surgeries. Death rates are a "lagging" statistic....just like happened in New York, NE US...
No cure for stupid!
The disease is easier to treat because it is different. Before it was labeled a lung disease, now vascular as well. Steroids and breathing treatments have replaced ventilators. You don't necessarily have to have a temperature to have COVID. You wont necessarily die from COVID. However, if you have an underlying condition that you are unaware of, it could be deadly.
The cure is prevention, each has to decide whats best for them and family.
"It is completely normal for us to have ICU capacities that run in the 80s and 90s," Houston Methodist CEO Dr. Marc Boom said. "That's how all hospitals operate.
Different story, same guy:
Boom said the state can avoid a lockdown if more people adhered to social distancing and wore face coverings. "Many are doing it, but clearly not enough and I think we can stop this," he said. "I'm hopeful we can do that if everybody rallies around together and focuses on how to do those things together."