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Just For The Record

P PGStaff10,000+ posts
Seems like this is a good time to post this.

Every once in awhile there are posts written that are not exactly favorable to Perfect Game. It doesn’t happen often, but it happens.

I don’t like it when that happens, but I do understand it. While it might bother me, I can live with it so long as what is being said is the truth. When it is untrue, I get defensive. When it involves someone with an agenda it makes me mad. Usually we find out there is an agenda involved, so sometimes the truth comes out in the end.

Sometimes people are just being honest and explaining that PG didn’t really help them that much. I understand that PG has not been the world’s greatest experience for every single person. Wish it was, but that is impossible. I understand that what we do can be expensive, but we do try to keep the cost down as much as possible. I understand that some can’t afford what we do, that is originally why we got started holding tournaments for top level travel teams. It allows us to help find a place for “talented” players who can’t afford to get those opportunities without help and it can be done following the NCAA rules.

While I’m at it, another pet peeve is reading people talk about going to play at East Cobb or Jupiter. There are all kinds of events at East Cobb and Jupiter during the year that are no where near as big as the WWBA events at those places. It’s also obvious that many people don’t know that the WWBA (and the BCS) are in fact Perfect Game. For those that don’t know… The WWBA and the BCS… That is us!

Truth is… Perfect Game is NOT for everyone. There are no guarantees that if you show up at a PG event that something good is going to happen to you. It is also very possible that something good will happen to some of those who never attend a PG event. PG is not something mandatory in order to be successful in baseball. In fact, there is NOTHING that is mandatory other than the player doing what he can to keep getting better. I really don’t see us as being some kind of an investment in someone’s future. Players need to invest long before we ever see them and keep investing after we see them. That investment doesn’t have to involve a lot of money. All we are is an opportunity, nothing more nothing less. For some it turns out to be a great opportunity, for others it could turn out to be a waste of time and money.

Another thing… It is embarrassing when it is brought up that we donate to the site. I never wanted people to know that. I never even wanted the advertising that is on here. I know that Julie and CD bring it up occasionally because they care. That is greatly appreciated, but the truth is I think it can cause people to fear saying what’s on their mind. We have nothing to do with running this site. I’m sure some think there are all kinds of PG employees and friends posting here saying good things about PG or posting on our behalf. Truth is that most people in our organization don’t even know about the HSBBW. I don’t think any of them ever post here or even follow it.

Most important to me and I would like everyone to know this because it is the main reason for this post. I have never, not once, asked for any post to be deleted or a topic to be closed or a poster to be kicked off the site for any reason. It is very important to understand that I just want to be a participant rather than anything else. If something is posted that is not true, in my opinion, I will speak up. When it comes to baseball I NEVER lie! Don’t take that to mean always being right, because being wrong has become somewhat of a habit.

This is Julie’s site. It’s monitored by the moderators. I like it here because of the many good people who participate here. I very seldom look at other message boards other than our own.

All that said, thanks to all you people who have said nice things about PG over the years. Because of usernames I don’t know who a lot of you are, but it sure feels good when people go out of their way to say something nice.

Bottom line.... We are not special and don't want to be treated specially.
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MN-MomMN-MomHSBaseballWeb Owner
I just wanted to let you all know how very true this is:

PGStaff said:

"I have never, not once, asked for any post to be deleted or a topic to be closed or a poster to be kicked off the site for any reason."

I have great respect for PGStaff / Jerry, having met him several times at events. Because of my respect for him and for Perfect Game, I sometimes send him an email or Private Message, if I am concerned about a poster here apparently "bashing" PG.

Every single time, Jerry's response has been:

"Don't worry about it, and please do not do anything special on our behalf."

Every single time.

I have also said this publicly before but I will say it again:

Although Perfect Game has been the most helpful and generous financial supporter of the cost of running this website, Jerry was never in favor of having PG advertising banners placed on the site, and reluctantly allowed me to place the banners at my request, because I wanted to acknowledge Perfect Game's support of our community.

Most of you know this already:

Perfect Game is a totally classy organization, run by a totally classy, honest, and caring family.

Julie
Last edited by MN-Mom
ClevelandDadClevelandDadHSBBWeb Administrator
Look, this thread is an example why I have so much respect for PG.

We never heard of PG when my son was being recruited. There is no quid pro quo for me to be on the protective side. For me it is very simple.

bbscout was a hero on this site. He didn't post all that much but his words carried tremendous weight. Unfortunately, he has passed away and it is a loss we have not yet recovered. IMHO, PG is one of the few others here that are in the same class as bbscout for the knowledge and experience he has gained. The cool part is that PG freely shares his knowledge both publicly and privately.

My issue has nothing to do with protecting PG's business which he is more than capable of doing. My sole interest is that he sticks around as one of "us" and for that I will not apologize for being overly protective
Rob KremerRob Kremer1,000+ posts
I'm with CD.

You simply cannot spend much time around here and fail to develop an immense amount of respect for Jerry. This site would be devastatingly diminished without his presence, without his ready help and insight.

PG bashers may come and go as they will. I doubt they will ever get much of a foothold here. We all know an agenda when we see one, and I can say this for sure, after five years or so here:

PGStaff has no agenda other than helping anyone who needs it.
Baseballdad1228Baseballdad1228500+ posts
Jerry could never log on to HSBBW again and it would not impact Perfect Game in the slightest. My guess is that the advertising on here isn't driving tons of kids to showcases or events either.

Thankfully Jerry chooses to participate and share decades of incredible baseball knowledge and love for the game with people who benefit from his experiences and insight.

I wonder how many PMs Jerry answers in a single day from people - like me - who seek guidance in a baseball world that can be overwhelming at times. I bet the number would stun us all.

He's helped me and my children through the years in many ways and all we can give him in return is our respect and our gratitude.
igballigball500+ posts
I agree with the above positive statements about PG and Jerry. My son never attended a PG showcase but our baseball life was greatly enriched by attending Jupiter for a couple of years. It's a must baseball experience imo.

Jerry has said loud and clear that his showcases are not for everyone. Family budgets are what they are and frankly I don't even understand how anyone even ask such a question. It almost seems a set up. Ask all the questions you want about the event but only a family can make that decision.
06catcherdad06catcherdad1,000+ posts
Jerry, no need to apologize or defend yourself. Most people on here know exactly where you are coming from, and appreciate the contributions you make to HSBBW in terms of your posts.

For the rest of you, I'm sure that Jerry has little if any idea who I am, even though my teams have played in a number of their WWBA tournaments, and many of my players have gone to their showcases, my own son included back when he played. I've never met Jerry, would like to since he seems like such a decent man, but it'll probably never happen. That's OK too. I know that associating my baseball teams with PG and what they do has enabled a lot of our players to gain opportunities they would not have otherwise received, and in the end that is what matters. It IS about the players, after all is said and done.

The entire Ford family, in my limited experiences dealing with them, are decent, honest and downright fine people and I'm glad they've provided opportunities for so many aspiring student athletes to demonstrate their talent over the years.


I recommend them for one reason -- they are the best.
Coach_MayCoach_May10,000+ posts
Can you imagine how much time would be waisted weighing and measuring kids at one of these events? Would you rather spend that time actually evaluating them play or work out?

When you do this stuff for a living like PG does you dont need to rely on what someone else says in regards to ht and wt. You can see it for yourself. If someone wants to fudge on it so be it. Its just not going to matter in the scheme of things.
CADadCADad5,000+ posts
AntzDad,
It takes a lot of time and it isn't all that easy to measure everyone accurately. That would probably mean extra staff. That would probably mean the showcase would cost a couple bucks more. Anyways, you'll see different heights listed for the same kid at every level and there's no way to know which one is right. The only place I know of that measures height and weight (before reading plash's post) is the Stanford Camp. I'm sure they find the differences between what the players list and what they measure quite amusing at times.
Last edited by CADad
Q Quincy1,000+ posts
PG was started, as I recall, because there was apparently no one else filling the need. For this, I and all of baseball appreciate the existence and great work of PG.

PG has become a trusted resource for scouts and college coaches. Their showcase evaluations and tournaments give exposure to young student athletes that was lacking in the nation.

My only problem is that if PG did not choose to fill this need, it may have never been filled. I would have thought that USA Baseball would have been running talent searches of some sort as in depth as PG, but I had never heard of USA Baseball until after I became familiar with PG.

Attending PG tournaments allows players to make people say "Wow" that aren't just local family and friends. MLB and colleges get to be dazzled by the collection of talent that a PG event draws.

Further, the PG ratings and lists keep exceptional players in the spotlight all year long along with the other PG sites.

Thank you , Jerry for making PG a reality.
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
My son's second experience with PG was at the WWBA in Jupiter, in 2002 (his first was late summer in Ft Myers for the qualifier).
It was fall of his junior year, he hit 90, and that is where Kevin O'Sullivan first saw son pitch, and that is where he announced to those in the front row, "that kid is going to be a Tiger". For that experience and exposure, for that alone, I personally am grateful that Perfect Game existed.

At that tournament, there were less than 60 teams, and FWIW, PG was not the only showcase/tournament people around, but for those of us there that weekend it was evident that these people knew what they were doing and that they weren't going to fade away as so many others did. I am probably one of the few people who have seen the PG then compared with the PG now up close and personal. I thought in 2002 there were a lot of coaches and scouts, NOTHING compare to the last WWBA tourney I attended in Jupiter in 2008.

With the success of those early years, there was a steady stream of people trying to duplicate their business model and concept and no one has been able to do it since, the way PG does it.

When I needed advice from someone not close to the situation for son's decision to sign, Jerry was most helpful in advice. When we needed advice regarding advisors, Jerry was more than happy to answer my questions. I asked him if son could possibly work in Jupiter in 2008, he had someone get in touch with him asap. I asked him to speak to someone I know who needed a job and lives in Cedar Rapids, he said he would, though that person never called him. Shame, because I am sure that Jerry would have done all he could to help this young family man running out of unemployment.

That's just the way he is. he likes to help people, if he beleives in you, and he helps here because he believes that this is a worthwhile site for those who need good advice from people who have gone done the road, but always remember, he has gone that that road way before most of us have. That type of person, whether you agree with how he runs his business, whether he helps support the HSBBW or not, deserves respect, that's why I am sure CD closed the topic.

There's a lot of stuff about Jerry many people don't know, I personally think he really has a dislike for the business of baseball, and if he could do it all for free he would. I know he enjoys coming here and participating just like we all do adn I know he doesn't expect us to protect Perfect Game, he's a big boy and can take care of himself. Wink

The fact of the matter is that he has given advice that far surpasses anyone else here in specific discussions, I have learned a lot from him, and for that alone, the HSBBW wouldn't be the same without his PG advice.

To answer a question asked in a closed topic, is the showcase price worth attending, IMO yes it may be for some and no, it may not be for others, but remember what the purpose is and how it will help your son. In our case, it was most important that son got a chance to see how he stacked up against those in his grad class of those from the geographical area he would be competing against for scholarships. I didn't care about the rating, the ranking, but what son came away with as his own perception of himself and his skill set, and for that you cannot put a price tag on.

JMO.
Last edited by TPM
C CaBB1,000+ posts
Ditto all the good things said about PG and PG Jerry. My son played in the WWBA when he was 15 and then the next summer @ 16. What a class act the tourney was. Got to meet Jerry's wife because she was taking tickets @ the gate!!!!


Jerry should not have to keep defending himself and his organization from disgruntled posters. If they don't want to go to a tourney or showcase then don't go! Very simple and don't come on here and complain.
playfairplayfair500+ posts
Sounds like someone did not get the "10" they were expecting.

Perfect Game is an honest organization. There is not lying, cheating, or helping of results.

Some of the evaluation is subjective and not objective and that is where disagreements arise.

Anytime subjectivity plays a part of rating there will always be disagreements.

Boohoo.

If someone did not like you the way you like you then move on until someone likes you the way you like you.

I dont see everything the same way PG does but its not my reputation on the line with their ratings. Its their's!

When your reputation is on the line then you get a say.....And, if you consistently are wrong then your reputation is shot in the industry. (And, I dont think PG has anything close to a bad reputation...In fact I believe their reputation in the industry is excellent.)

Now here is a PG quality check.... Of the 220 (or so) kids who went to the 2009 PG Nationals at the Metrodome how many committed to playing in college? (Maybe PG can answer) I can tell you from my quick check it is about 100%.

How is that for a success rate of identifying kids who could play at the next level?

Mr. Ford, It is my opinion that your organization is the leader in your industry... You put kids in college by giving them a forum to show skill to people in a position to let them show skill in a high position than they currently are.

Dont let some whiner who can find more reasons to say " I cant" than can find way to say " I can" ruin even so much as your dinner.

(Ps, my kid is a PG college freshman!)
fanofgamefanofgame5,000+ posts
quote:
To answer a question asked in a closed topic, is the showcase price worth attending, IMO yes it may be for some and no, it may not be for others, but remember what the purpose is and how it will help your son. In our case, it was most important that son got a chance to see how he stacked up against those in his grad class of those from the geographical area he would be competing against for scholarships. I didn't care about the rating, the ranking, but what son came away with as his own perception of himself and his skill set, and for that you cannot put a price tag on.

JMO.


BumBum1,000+ posts
Perfect Game is a great venue for kids to get exposure. Some parents of kids who get low scores should look at what they can improve and next time score higher! I just saw Bryce Harper play tonight and believe me, he's got a lot to improve, too. I hope the kid is not an urban myth.. this game is hard, and truth is, nobody's a 10.

BTW I met Jerry a few years ago in Florida and my impression of the man is he is not about the money. He really is in it to help the players. I know he encouraged mine.
Last edited by Bum
fillsfanfillsfan1,000+ posts
Perfect Game, the company, gives thousands of kids the opportunity to display their talents in front of hundreds of scouts at multiple events. How can that be a bad thing.

PGStaff, the man, seems to be an honest and very intelligent ambassador for baseball. I believe his intentions are pure and he is doing the right things for these kids, for the right reasons. That is, helping them advance their baseball careers without an agenda.

PGStaff, the HSBBW poster, is an encyclopedia of knowledge, along with a few others, that we should all use to help us navigate the baseball journey.

How can any of those things be considered negative?
S sandlotmom100+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by 20dad:
i know these so called negative post's get old, and pg must get tired of them. but i think it looks worse to lock up a thread because of them.

the testimonials about pg speak for themselves,you you can't buy word of mouth.

Winkbut what do i know.


Closing threads that say anything negative about the PG organization gives an impression that I don't believe HSBBW wants.

Agendas are not always bad. PGStaff had an agenda with this thread. He wants everyone to know that all he wants to be is a contributor to the site. Those with negative comments about PG also have agendas. They want those that come to this site to understand that it's not always a good experience. That's not a bad agenda either. This site is supposed to be informative. It will crash quickly if we aren't able to express our opinions without fear of being shut down.

Give us the benefit of the doubt. We know a sour grapes situation when we read one. And we will call that person out on it. If this is the way HSBBW is headed, it won't be long before it's obvious that it's just a PG website. And that is a shame because PGStaff himself doesn't want that. If you doubt that will happen, look what this thread has become...a grouping of accolades for the PG organization and don't anyone dare post a negative experience or it too will get shut down.
Last edited by sandlotmom
ClevelandDadClevelandDadHSBBWeb Administrator
sandlotmom - I respectfully disagree with your take on this one. The issue was not about whether someone said something negative as nothing negative was in fact said. The issue was not about PG's business which he is more than capable of managing on his own.

The issue was about PG the "member" imho and I have taken the same position with other members here. The post in question was very subjective "Was it worth it?" That type of question invites unfair/cheap-shot responses imho (based on years of experience here) and I made an executive decision to close it. The decision could have been wrong but it was not an attempt to quell opinions on PG the business. If someone starts a thread "Is sandlotmom's opinion worthwhile?" That thread is not going to last very long. One thing we have no tolerance for is negative commentary on amateur ballplayers. Those threads have a very short shelf-life here on the hsbbweb.

There are hundreds and hundreds of PG threads here that no one has a problem with. Some of the threads are in fact negative (e.g., people complaining about a low rating). We are a community here of like-minded baseball lovers. We are all free to disagree as well.
2Bmom2Bmom1,000+ posts
Just for the record, I had a personal experience with PG earlier this week. Not as 2Bmom, but as myself. I felt comfortable asking the question because PGStaff has been nothing but truthful, forthcoming, and helpful to me on this site. In this case, my question was answered and the issue resolved in less than 5 minutes. I know one thing for sure. They do care about players, and not just the blue chippers, either.
ClevelandDadClevelandDadHSBBWeb Administrator
quote:
Originally posted by Eric G:
Did not mean to cause a ruckus guys. I have no problem with the thread being removed.

The thread was not removed and you did not cause a ruckus. You said you were looking for yes or no answers. 90% answered it was and 10% answered no. The thread is still open for people to vote yes or no if they so choose.

Again, I encourage people to read our attached links/articles and to peruse past threads for answers to questions before posting. Every baseball thought that pops into one's mind does not have to be debated imho. Most baseball decisions are personal and thus the board is cannot answer those questions.

In the instant case Eric, I know you have posted that your son attended two recent college camps because you posted as such. Were those worth it? To point out subjectivity here, if you attend one college camp for 200.00 and are evaluated by the coaches at that camp only, you basically paid 200.00 per scout to evaluate your son. If you went to a PG event say for $500, and there were 100 scouts in attendance, you paid $5/scout. Perhaps you feel the college was more worth it to "you" because you felt the instruction was more personal or some other personal factor. Others may feel differently. Still yet others may take it as an opportunity to let the haymakers fly. Again, my decision to close your thread may have been wrong.
igballigball500+ posts
The larger point about any evaluations is that they are at best a snap shot in time. If I'm not mistaken Dustin Ackley, who was just named Baseball America player of the decade, was not drafted out of high school and therefore not a very highly "ranked" player at that time. I think how a player (and his parents) interpret the information they get and what they do with it is more important than the data itself.

Ackley seems to have done all right for himself after all.
TRhitTRhit10,000+ posts
I am with sandlotmom here---closing threads such as is happening too often now,whether CD sees it this way or not, is doing nothing but alienating posters---what is the sense making a statement or expressing an opinion that is baseball oriented if it will be deleted and not even discussed---I found it curious that when Coach Milburn came after me with his insinuations regarding what I do nobody shut him down--matters not to me in the least because I am a big boy and take care of myself as will people who know me and how I operate.I always consider the source and had the full background on this source.

I have known the PG people as long if not longer than most on this site and I can tell they need no protection--they are A-1 in my book and disgruntled people come with the territory--it is part of the deal when you are in the public eye.

Also to make the statement, and I am talking pure business here, that was made about "look at the top of this page",to me,cast a bad light on PG. It infers that PG is the "big" supporter and thus is not to be criticized. Knowing the PG people as I do I can tell you that they probably argued long and hard not to have the ad published on the site..
ClevelandDadClevelandDadHSBBWeb Administrator
quote:
Originally posted by TRhit:
I am with sandlotmom here---closing threads such as is happening too often now,whether CD sees it this way or not, is doing nothing but alienating posters---what is the sense making a statement or expressing an opinion that is baseball oriented if it will be deleted and not even discussed---I found it curious that when Coach Milburn came after me with his insinuations regarding what I do nobody shut him down--matters not to me in the least because I am a big boy and take care of myself as will people who know me and how I operate.I always consider the source and had the full background on this source.

I have known the PG people as long if not longer than most on this site and I can tell they need no protection--they are A-1 in my book and disgruntled people come with the territory--it is part of the deal when you are in the public eye.

Also to make the statement, and I am talking pure business here, that was made about "look at the top of this page",to me,cast a bad light on PG. It infers that PG is the "big" supporter and thus is not to be criticized. Knowing the PG people as I do I can tell you that they probably argued long and hard not to have the ad published on the site..

You win the debate TR. The thread has been re-opened.
ClevelandDadClevelandDadHSBBWeb Administrator
quote:
Originally posted by sandlotmom:
CD: OK, I get now what you were trying to do. Unfortunately, it fell out differently. It was difficult to follow whether or not negative things were actually said.

In the end I do believe that we will band together to ensure that the true mission of HSBBW remains.

The thread has been re-opened.
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