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29 replies

Ladies Only, Men Only, Players Only

MN-MomMN-MomHSBaseballWeb Owner
The regulars here know that there has been some ... ahhh, discussion Eek about the rules and manners being applied in the new Men Only forum.

I have tried to keep my distance and allow the male moderators of the forum to establish the ground rules there, because after all, the sign on the door does read: Men Only. I did step in briefly to help when some of the content was clearly outside the bounds of this site's G-rating, but have tried to stay at arm's length about matters of politeness and welcoming of "guests". But several of the moderators have graciously contacted me asking for my opinion on matters, and some agreement has been reached about how order might be restored. Wink

The short version of the story is:

A new sign is posted on the door of the Men Only forum, exactly like the one that has always been on the Players Only forum:
"This forum is for Men Only. Players and Women, please stay away -- there are plenty of forums for you to post in."

For the time being, I have two requests:
1. That "non-men" try to honor that sign most of the time, and
2. That the occasional "uninvited guest" be treated with civility, or in other words be treated according to the basic Board Manners of this entire site.

The long version of the story is...an analogy:

Picture the mom and dad who sometimes invite a few other couples over to watch the Super Bowl, or invite a whole family or two over for a 4th of July picnic - those analogies are most of the general forums on this site. (And of course they all talk about baseball.)

The wife invites her friends over for a wine-tasting party and asks the husband to make himself scarce so they can talk about their interests - including their baseball-playing sons. Dad pokes his head in once to tell her he's running an errand, cracks one joke but gets away with it 'cuz he's pretty sweet - that's the Ladies Only forum.

The teenage son has a some friends over and asks mom and dad if they can "give him some space" in the family room - that's Players Only.

And here is the Men Only forum: the dad invites his friends over for a poker game one Saturday night and says "Hon, I hope you don't mind if it's just us guys". The mom pokes her head into the den once during the poker game, and peering through a little cigar smoke asks her husband if he knows where the (whatever she's looking for) is. He says he hasn't seen it, she respects his time with the guys, they go back to playing poker and telling tall tales about HS football scars, etc. Wink

So, that's my little story for the day! Anyone for a wine tasting party? Big Grin

Julie
Last edited {1}
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ClevelandDadClevelandDadHSBBWeb Administrator
Interesting Smile Julie - you are the best!

Obviously, there are some here who feel a Men Only forum is necessary and I respect that. Here is my take and it has been expressed before. The hsbbweb "may have already been" as good as it could be. My concern is that I hope we don't lose the charm of what we have here by trying to make it all things to all people. My feeling is the power of the site is that men and woman contribute equally for a balanced view on a given situation. Seems unique especially for a sports forum.

As far as having a Ladies Only forum, that makes sense to me. Some women may not feel they have a good sports background and may be intimidated to post questions otherwise in the general forum. I have seen many moms make their first post in the LL.

The Mens Only forum I don't get. It seems very joke oriented and we already have unusually unusual. I am sure there is another side to this argument but it escapes me. Just my two cents and I am the first to admit that the job of managing the site is way more than I could possibly handle Smile
K KCBaseball100+ posts
So let me see if I get this right....

Ladies Only is for ladies only, but men may enter at their own risk (and are treated quite graciously).

Mens Only is for men only, ladies are to stay out.

Seems like double standards to me. I'm not a feminist, but this just doesn't seem quite right. Shouldn't men have manners, too?

BTW...I give my teenagers space, but would never leave them home alone for the weekend. They need supervision and guidance at all times. You're not letting a teenager moderate Players Only and would step in if you need to, as it should be.

I respectfully disagree with the direction this is taking.
FungoFungoHighly Regarded and Beloved Old Timer
OK ladies, listen up! I have to go with CD on this one. We men don't need our own forum. Real men know how to hijack threads, open doors that say DO NOT ENTER, and drive down one way streets (The wrong way). Maps, directions and organization are made for those weaker individuals that cannot figuire out things in real time. As you were!
Fungo
MN-MomMN-MomHSBaseballWeb Owner
Sorry, I did leave the teenager part out of my analogy. It was unstated but I hoped implied that the parents in the analogy don't leave the teens home alone unsupervised - they poke their heads in to the family room periodically to check on things. Just as adults do moderate the Players Only forum.

I didn't expect this explanation to make everyone happy. A little disappointed at the overwhelming disapproval so far. But I do the best I can to handle contentious issues, NOT according to primarily my own preferences or wishes, but trying to be fair to the differing wishes of many different members and participants in the site. As I mentioned above, I have discussed with moderators the ground rule that the new forum, as with all forums, should be handled in compliance with the Board Manners.

Sometimes my little volunteer job is not much fun.
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
I am not the one to say what is right and what is wrong. It's not going to make a differnce to me whether I can post in their or not as to what I like to accomplish here on the HSBBW. I also hope that this will not stop some of the dads who have come to the Ladies Lounge and joined it on occassion. I would miss Fungoette's posts, FO, etc. Even when MM came asking if he could come in, we welcomed him. That's what ladies do!

I posted only to let those know that in respect to what has been asked, I will abide.
Last edited by TPM
L lafmom5,000+ posts
First of all, I can and will abide by the rules of no women in the Men's Forum if that's what is requested.

However, CD's thoughts have been privately verbalized to me by several of our male posters who feel this forum has opened up a can of needless worms.

I guess I'm not too overly concerned, because the wonderful guys that I know on this board will continue to do most of their posting in the other forums anyway. I think they like, respect and value having interaction with the ladies and players.
FungoFungoHighly Regarded and Beloved Old Timer
I make light of this but I think there are many female posters that need to “ease into” the HSBBW and become accustomed to the brash side of the internet and sports. I think the LL is a great idea. Personally I could care less about the Men only area.
Many men fail to realize that emotions play a big part in communications and get to the point not considering the emotions. Some even thrive on that. I know I’m guilty of that but I’m not going to change. Women are often on the other end of the spectrum. I've seen the emotional aspect of the message make more of an impact on the woman than the message itself. The difference in Mom/Dad becomes evident when my son calls the house. “Can I talk to Mom”? usually means he needs some emotional support. “Can I talk to Dad” usually means he needs a black or white answer to a specific question. Does this mean that each needs to be limited to their area of “expertiece”? Of course not. I can get emotional and my wife can often nail down an answer better than me. I don’t particularly like to consider emotions when I give an answer and she doesn’t like to be blunt for fear of offending someone. I can appreciate her feeling and don’t want to offend her ---- but I could care less if she understands mine. Is that bad? Why should she care how I feel? I can handle it. In my opinion there are just as many women here on the high school baseball web that offer just as good if not better information. To be honest I have communicated with many posters for years and didn't know if they were male or female.
Fungo
K KCBaseball100+ posts
I won't lose any sleep over whether there's a men's only forum. I was just responding to the labeling of these forums. I didn't even look at the men's forum until this problem caught ahold of my curiosity.
Look at the thread going about Bryant Gumbel. It seems like this Ladies vs. Mens problem is just another example of furthering a double standard.
It really isn't a big deal for me emotionally. Just an observation on a snowy day!

Julie...
You are very appreciated for all that you are doing. Please don't feel harrassed about this issue. Sometimes change is hard and this forum reflects that. We're all just here to chat with each other and I, for one, don't want to make your job harder. I was just responding...that's what forums are for! And this is one of the best!
collikarcollikar1,000+ posts
MN MOM ~ Thanks for all you do! I'm really enjoying all the forums.

I respect what you're doing here, and am more then happy to comply.

I enjoy all the forums, but don't feel I must post in any of them. If I see something in the men's only forum that I feel it necessary to comment on, then I'll come back and talk to the ladies about it.

Personally, I have felt the posters have all been very informative and congenial.

Thanks again for all you do.

collikar
LadyNmomLadyNmom1,000+ posts
Geez Fungo....I was prepared not to welcome male posters in this forum....and then you have to go and post.....and such a nice post.....so...I'll be welcoming to one and all...but not because that is what ladies do, as TPM said....could care less about that...no...only because I couldn't be unwelcoming to someone as nice as you....
MN-MomMN-MomHSBaseballWeb Owner
A little more food for thought:

The sign on the door to this forum says "Gentlemen, enter at your own risk". It does not read: "Men, c'mon in, don't pay any attention to that Ladies sign on the door, you are guaranteed to be welcomed here."

Although the sign on this door may say it very nicely, there's still an understanding that in the Ladies forum, the ladies have the right to welcome who they wish - generally those who seem to respect the uniqueness of the forum and tread lightly - which includes most of the guys who visit. But I did remember this recent thread as I listened to some of the public and private debate about this issue:

http://hsbaseballweb.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/8556090291/m/6821081051

rotlaugh

Julie
Last edited by MN-Mom
LadyNmomLadyNmom1,000+ posts
Julie....on this thread we did not delete Linear....and that is the treatment we received in the Men's Forum....each and every posting was wiped out....and not so much as an apology from the offending moderator.....

....and now....well we are basically being told...stay out....we won't delete what you have to say anymore, but you are not welcome anyway....

....and the good news is.....this is my last comment on this subject.....you have a tough job, I appreciate you very much....and I'm going to respect any and all requests....
Last edited by LadyNmom
FutureBack.MomFutureBack.Mom1,000+ posts
Julie ...

So as not to extend the ... err ... discussion much further, I would just like to say that I too will abide by your wishes tho I do not understand the exclusion of women in the men's forum. The ladies' lounnge says "enter at your own risk" ... why not the same for the men's room?

And I still don't understand why the posts were deleted and tho it isn't ever going to happen, I wish the guy that did it would 'fess up ... if only in a PM to those of us whose posts/threads were deleted ... and state his case.

But again, I too will abide by their requests and keep out. None of us wants you to lose any sleep or hair over this because we value you so very very much.

Love you, Kiddo good
Last edited by FutureBack.Mom
URKillingMeBlueURKillingMeBlue1,000+ posts
MN Mom -

Great decision, once again demonstrating great wisdom and calm in what could escalate into a contentious subject (hope hubby appreciates YOUR skills in that area, too Smile)

Happy to see that all sides seem to be respecting your point of you and are both tolerant and understanding of other's points of view -- whether they personally agree with them or not!

As I check site for the first time today after a long day of work, I am reminded again that you are volunteering to take the 'herding' of us folk... thanks again for your diplomacy and patience read
Last edited by URKillingMeBlue
FutureBack.MomFutureBack.Mom1,000+ posts
FO ...

quote:
aren't most male rooms equally or more intimidating from a cleanliness perspective?


Could be, especially driving down the highway and using one of those "rooms" at a gas station in Podunk Junction. But being a camper and having to answer "the call", I am even strong enough to use those "rooms", even the port-a-potties at some of the baseball fields we have visited. Some of us are just more daring, I guess ... 14

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