Leading contributors to faster game situation POP times?

It depends on the catcher. Some have great exchanges and some drop the ball into their hands. Some have great footwork and some have cement shoes on. Then, there are combos of the above 4.

One thing that has helped many catchers I see is a better exchange. I work with our EvoShield Canes catchers to exchange at the middle of the body (chest area).

Since my son is a catcher I tend to watch catchers I agree that many catchers lose time on the exchange. This was an issue with my son.

He has very fast feet, and in fact had an instructor tell him to slow his feet down a bit so that they weren't ahead of the rest of him. He was throwing with too much arm and not enough legs. As his lowers his transfer it all meshes better.

I recently had this conversation with one of my pro clients.

He's very athletic, has a very good arm (consistently 1.96-2.0 in a game), but knew something was off towards the end of the season.

He thought that he needed to be quicker with his exchange. I agreed, but not for the same reason.

Proper throwing mechanics is a system. A number of moving parts working together to achieve one result. Each action, good or bad, leads to another until the point of release.

His issue, and that of most of the catchers I see, was that his hips were kicking out to his left and his body was turning prematurely.

The exchange took longer to happen because he had turned his upper body to the side, so in order to make the exchange, the hands had to travel further.

The footwork now took longer to complete because in order for his right foot to make its way back to his center of gravity it too had to travel further to catch up to the rest of his body which had kicked out to the left.

This lengthened the path the ball had to take to get into an efficient throwing pattern and caused a delay in shifting his momentum towards his target because his body was already going in the wrong direction.


If I had to pick one thing that can speed up a throw, it would be cleaner/shorter footwork, as our lower body controls the direction of momentum in a throw. However, the sooner the exchange takes place, the sooner I can start my footwork, the sooner I can get rid of the ball.

Jay, this is an interesting observation. Thanks.

This is what I teach my catchers:

EXCHANGE- Ball Transfer (from mitt to throwing hand).
This starts with catching the ball and the positioning of the catcher's feet, shoulders, glove hand, and throwing hand. This method is designed to handle both the good pitch (strike) and the wild pitch. As with pitching and hitting, there are several different techniques that work better in certain situations. For catchers, some work best when the pitch is a strike thus easily handled. But since many pitches are not strikes (including pitch-outs), a more flexible method is necessary so that the runners are thrown out. Catch the ball one-handed with the arm stretched forward, directly in the glove's pocket (for better control). Bring the glove to the throwing hand, waiting at a center point about waist high, arm extended. Since the hands are apart, only the glove hand reacts to the high/ low/ in /out pitch. So, no matter where the pitch is caught, return it to the center point for transfer. The transfer from glove to hand can be accelerated by “flipping” it to the bare hand, held palm up. The further the flip, the quicker the release (and the more room for error). This takes a large amount of practice- start by playing catch using this technique; and be prepared to get yelled at by your coach!

Coach Rick Straub

Also we work on:

RELEASE.
The RELEASE is from the moment the ball hits the mitt to the release of the throw; or just under half of what is termed pop time. POP-TIME is the time from the pitch hitting the catcher's mitt to the throw hitting the infielder's glove at second base; usually about two seconds.

Reducing the release time of the catcher's throw is a matter of good mechanics/ techniques and timing. The only deterrent to catchers moving into throwing is the batter's swing. This is the theory behind the pitch-out; it removes the fear of interfering with the batter, and of course, being struck by the bat.

If you knew the batter was swinging (or not), you could have a quicker release.

This can be accomplished by “reading the pitch” and the movement of the batter. The ideal pitch to throw would be a near-strike that is too high, yet catch-able. There is no challenge to the catcher (no jumping, reaching, moving), with no attempt by the batter to swing. This allows the catcher to rapidly move into action, no waiting, catch the ball while setting his feet to throw, rapid transition of ball to hand.

The premise behind this is similar to the outfielder that is moving into the fly ball (not flat footed) to also make this throw to the base; catching and stepping forward simultaneously in one motion. Infielders likewise will charge a ground ball, catching and setting their feet simultaneously as they transfer the ball to the throwing hand.

The catcher's feet start in the ready position. Next, the right foot takes a half step towards the middle and slightly forward (the jab step). Then, the left foot takes a full step directly towards the base. At the same time, the catcher's left hand is catching the ball, then transfers it to the right hand, the right arm is cocked, then the ball is thrown. The challenge is to “overlap” the two feet activities with the four hand/arm activities to condense the RELEASE.

This leaves the final phase of POP-TIME; the actual THROW; its velocity and accuracy. This accounts for a little more than half of all overall pop-time.

So, to reduce your pop-time, WORK ON YOUR RELEASE.

Coach Rick Straub

What's the consensus on catching the ball close to the body versus with the mitt arm extended?

I prefer catching the ball one-handed with the arm extended, bringing glove to the throwing hand, waiting at a center point about waist high, arm extended. The glove hand stays away from body, allowing the body to move forward gaining momentum as the ball is transferred to the throwing hand.

I'm no catching expert, though with a son as a catcher I have a keen interest in this.

I've been under the impression that a ball flies faster than a moving arm. How can reaching out to catch a ball and carrying it back to the exchange point result in a faster POP time than catching the ball 'deep' for a shorter exchange?

RedSoxFan,

It certainly seems to make sense that a ball flying "pitch speed" would get into the hand quicker if making a deep exchange. This however, would only be true if we as catchers received the ball by our ear. There isn't a catcher on the planet who would, or does, do that and expects to continue catching for very long. The better phrase to think of is this: "The ball never travels any faster to 2B than when it is out of the hand and in the air. The faster you get it into the throwing hand, the sooner you can get it into the air."

An early exchange out front allows the catcher to get the ball into his hand earlier. Which allows them to start the sequence of the throwing load and motion earlier. When a catcher lets the ball travel, very often it causes the premature hip turn that I mentioned in my previous post. This affects every single aspect of the throw. Especially since our throw is not happening from a position (or shouldn't). It's system of constantly moving parts.

Also, I would never teach a catcher to sweep an extended arm to my throwing hand while I was going through the exchange of a throw as Coach Rick talked about in his last post. This guarantees that the exchange will be made far enough from the body to effect the efficient movement pattern of the arm and most likely cause an all-arm throw.

http://i1129.photobucket.com/a...camp/Ruiz-Throw2.gif

The moment the throwing hand reaches the ball and begins taking it out of the glove out in front of the body, the arms should start working on top of the ball and backwards.

Also, this not correct (except for the more room for error part) ---

quote:

Originally posted by Coach Rick:
The transfer from glove to hand can be accelerated by “flipping” it to the bare hand, held palm up. The further the flip, the quicker the release (and the more room for error).
Coach Rick Straub

.

I would never advocate "flipping" the ball into the throwing hand, as it guarantees that the symmetry in the upper body's load will be unbalanced. The glove arm will start it's load sooner, but further from the body's midline than the throwing arm. This unbalance will cause the glove arm to reach it's loading point much sooner than the throwing arm and almost always cause the body to over-rotate. Once this over-rotation has occurred the body will fight to get back to a balanced position. This forces the upper-body to spin to release, taking out the entire lower-half of your body. And because of that, there is absolutely no reason to risk "flipping" the ball out of your hand and behind you with a runner on base.

Our "middle" follows our hands when they are together in front of us. Attempting to make the exchange without bringing one to the other (whatever you believe is correct) would create an incredibly inefficient throwing motion.

I've been under the impression that a ball flies faster than a moving arm. How can reaching out to catch a ball and carrying it back to the exchange point result in a faster POP time than catching the ball 'deep' for a shorter exchange?[/QUOTE]

Catching the ball in front provides two advantages;
it allows the bad pitch to be handled as effectively as the strike; and it allows the transfer from glove to hand to occur earlier.
And, it is unbalanced because the catcher is moving forward into the throw, advancing the release.

Anytime the hands are brought together in front as the throw is underway, a slight flip can safely occur. The better the pitch, the better the exchange. A bad pitch must be caught and brought to the throwing hand to maintain balance and deliver a good throw. The longer the ball is in the glove, the slower the release. Maybe this helps...
Watch Pudge; in particular at the 3:05 point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...Y9HGY&feature=relmfu

I'll agree that the longer the ball is in the glove the longer the release, but I would argue that a bad pitch needs to be brought to the same exact spot as on a good pitch. Not to the throwing hand, but to a consistent spot right in front of the throwing shoulder, where the throwing hand can go retrieve the ball.

I know you're trying to provide some insight, but the video of Pudge doesn't exemplify what you say should happen. In fact an argument could be made that his release could have been quicker had he stayed out front a bit more to allow his lower half to create resistance and become engaged as he loaded his arms.

And flipping the ball implies that establishing the pitch as a strike to the umpire is being ignored. The simple fact is that while the exchange needs to take place first, it nee to take place as we are coming up out of our crouch. I can't start my approach in the direction of my target until my right foot is planted and I can't start my right foot across until I am up high enough to get it underneath my body without forcing my hips and momentum to my left. The time you believe you are saving by flipping the ball into your hand is moot, as we still have to come up out of my crouch before I can efficiently begin my stride and upper body load. I'd rather make sure I got the ball in my hand than trying to take a short cut that doesn't gain any advantage whatsoever, but instead risks mishandling the ball.

Very well put!
We agree with the handling of the bad pitch.. disagree on where that place should be. I want it in front at the same spot I would have caught the strike.

And, yes I do believe his release could have been slightly quicker by a more in front transfer.

And, yes I am ignoring the hesitation for the umpire best view of the pitch... in favor, of the out and prevention of a runner in scoring position. This is no difference than the use of a pitch-out which promotes the out and ignores the strike.

I am advocating the near-simultaneous catching of the ball with the planting of the the right foot (right foot slightly first).

The flip is risky.. not for everyone; BUT it has its rewards even if small (moot?).

These are finite points, not necessary nor achievable to some catchers BUT I believe they will make you better and throw out more runners.

quote:

Originally posted by twotex:
Since my son is a catcher I tend to watch catchers I agree that many catchers lose time on the exchange. This was an issue with my son.

He has very fast feet, and in fact had an instructor tell him to slow his feet down a bit so that they weren't ahead of the rest of him. He was throwing with too much arm and not enough legs. As his lowers his transfer it all meshes better.

That's about the same issue I see with my own son.Of course, I'm not much of a catching scrutinizer so don't always know exactly if I'm basing that upon my own limited knowledge on it but a kid with a short throw does tend to lunge. Min e does, or did, he's working on it but the lunge comes from trasfering to a short throw. Or adapting your feet and legs to a short throw style. I guess...still learning myself what to look at.

Here's what I mean though. A bit of a lunge but a fast tranfer.

http://new.berecruited.com/ath...lm?film_id=100072656

I would be happy to give you some feedback on your son.
Contact me at rickstraub2@gmail.com thanks

quote:

Originally posted by I'm Junior's Dad: Here's what I mean though. A bit of a lunge but a fast transfer.

Junior's Dad,

The lunge you see in your son's throw comes from the fact that his body is trying to create enough time for the arms to load without any right-foot (or lower-body) movement whatsoever. What you are also seeing is a product of his weight being completely on the back side and fighting to go forward. Again, this is because there is no right foot movement to create a balance point before the forward movement of the throw.

He has a pretty quick release at around .76 seconds. However, the velocity lost from not using his lower body in the throw offsets those time gains, as his throw is a good but not great HS throw at around 2.23 (video quality makes it a little tough to see actual glove impact at 2B).

His throw could be a lot faster in both velocity and time if he stays out front with the exchange, makes the exchange while he is coming up out of his crouch, gets his right foot underneath his center of gravity and loads his arms as he strides forward to allow the back hip to drive the throw rather than his upper-body.

Right now, he uses a classic, "rock-and-fire" method. There are a few reasons why this is something he will want to change as soon as possible. For one, he is putting all of the energy in the throw on his arm (I would be willing to guess that your son had some arm, inside elbow, front shoulder pain last season---and if he didn't, he will eventually as his body gets stronger and generates even more force on the arm).

Secondly, there is a good chance that on pitches to his right, he will start to see balls tail high and to the right because his body won't be able to regain proper direction in the throw. He'll always be fighting to get his momentum working in the same direction of his throw. This will cause the elbow of his throwing arm to drop below the shoulder as the forearm lays back. Since there is no hip drive in the throw, the upper-body rotation will be all that initiates the movement toward the target until the point where his arm is forced to push the ball to second base. This can cause the arm slot to drop and create tailing actions on the ball, and also forces over throws.

Very often people believe that less is more when it comes to mechanics. That simpler is always better. The simple fact is that a high-level throw is not simple. There are a lot of moving parts and simply eliminating one of those parts (footwork) doesn't shorten the throw, it weakens the efficiency of it.

Hope this helps and please feel free to PM me if you have any questions about this post.

quote:

Originally posted by CCJR:

quote:

Originally posted by I'm Junior's Dad: Here's what I mean though. A bit of a lunge but a fast transfer.

Junior's Dad,

The lunge you see in your son's throw comes from the fact that his body is trying to create enough time for the arms to load without any right-foot (or lower-body) movement whatsoever. What you are also seeing is a product of his weight being completely on the back side and fighting to go forward. Again, this is because there is no right foot movement to create a balance point before the forward movement of the throw.

He has a pretty quick release at around .76 seconds. However, the velocity lost from not using his lower body in the throw offsets those time gains, as his throw is a good but not great HS throw at around 2.23 (video quality makes it a little tough to see actual glove impact at 2B).

His throw could be a lot faster in both velocity and time if he stays out front with the exchange, makes the exchange while he is coming up out of his crouch, gets his right foot underneath his center of gravity and loads his arms as he strides forward to allow the back hip to drive the throw rather than his upper-body.

Right now, he uses a classic, "rock-and-fire" method. There are a few reasons why this is something he will want to change as soon as possible. For one, he is putting all of the energy in the throw on his arm (I would be willing to guess that your son had some arm, inside elbow, front shoulder pain last season---and if he didn't, he will eventually as his body gets stronger and generates even more force on the arm).

Secondly, there is a good chance that on pitches to his right, he will start to see balls tail high and to the right because his body won't be able to regain proper direction in the throw. He'll always be fighting to get his momentum working in the same direction of his throw. This will cause the elbow of his throwing arm to drop below the shoulder as the forearm lays back. Since there is no hip drive in the throw, the upper-body rotation will be all that initiates the movement toward the target until the point where his arm is forced to push the ball to second base. This can cause the arm slot to drop and create tailing actions on the ball, and also forces over throws.

Very often people believe that less is more when it comes to mechanics. That simpler is always better. The simple fact is that a high-level throw is not simple. There are a lot of moving parts and simply eliminating one of those parts (footwork) doesn't shorten the throw, it weakens the efficiency of it.

Hope this helps and please feel free to PM me if you have any questions about this post.

He did actually complain of some pain right after the USBC down in Richmond this summer. I didn't know what to think of it. He was moved from 2nd base to catcher the week prior at the Temple Mid-Atlantic freedom Classic because the regular catcher didn't play that tournament and ended up catching some in Richmond thereafter.

I kind of got to wondering if it was because he's been moved around so much depending upon what team he's playing for whether it was screwing up his motion or not. 3rd base in HS and 2nd on his showcase team and then behind the plate kind of took a toll on him over the last couple of years.

I am starting to see a bit of a tail on his throws but only when he's throwing from 3rd base and it's only once in a while. I think his last radar time was 76-80mph from 3rd in a series of 5 or six throws and they were straight lines but yes, he has started to tail off with a little pain.

I'm fairly certain that any position he'd probably play at the college level would be in the middle infield some place but just seems like he's on a cantchers binge right now and may feel like it's just something he wants prospective coaches to know that he can do.

Thanks. Sure is a lot to absorb and things I've certainly not thought of.

quote:

Originally posted by I'm Junior's Dad:

quote:

Originally posted by CCJR:

quote:

Originally posted by I'm Junior's Dad: Here's what I mean though. A bit of a lunge but a fast transfer.

Junior's Dad,

The lunge you see in your son's throw comes from the fact that his body is trying to create enough time for the arms to load without any right-foot (or lower-body) movement whatsoever. What you are also seeing is a product of his weight being completely on the back side and fighting to go forward. Again, this is because there is no right foot movement to create a balance point before the forward movement of the throw.

He has a pretty quick release at around .76 seconds. However, the velocity lost from not using his lower body in the throw offsets those time gains, as his throw is a good but not great HS throw at around 2.23 (video quality makes it a little tough to see actual glove impact at 2B).

His throw could be a lot faster in both velocity and time if he stays out front with the exchange, makes the exchange while he is coming up out of his crouch, gets his right foot underneath his center of gravity and loads his arms as he strides forward to allow the back hip to drive the throw rather than his upper-body.

Right now, he uses a classic, "rock-and-fire" method. There are a few reasons why this is something he will want to change as soon as possible. For one, he is putting all of the energy in the throw on his arm (I would be willing to guess that your son had some arm, inside elbow, front shoulder pain last season---and if he didn't, he will eventually as his body gets stronger and generates even more force on the arm).

Secondly, there is a good chance that on pitches to his right, he will start to see balls tail high and to the right because his body won't be able to regain proper direction in the throw. He'll always be fighting to get his momentum working in the same direction of his throw. This will cause the elbow of his throwing arm to drop below the shoulder as the forearm lays back. Since there is no hip drive in the throw, the upper-body rotation will be all that initiates the movement toward the target until the point where his arm is forced to push the ball to second base. This can cause the arm slot to drop and create tailing actions on the ball, and also forces over throws.

Very often people believe that less is more when it comes to mechanics. That simpler is always better. The simple fact is that a high-level throw is not simple. There are a lot of moving parts and simply eliminating one of those parts (footwork) doesn't shorten the throw, it weakens the efficiency of it.

Hope this helps and please feel free to PM me if you have any questions about this post.

He did actually complain of some pain right after the USBC down in Richmond this summer. I didn't know what to think of it. He was moved from 2nd base to catcher the week prior at the Temple Mid-Atlantic freedom Classic because the regular catcher didn't play that tournament and ended up catching some in Richmond thereafter when he wasn't playing second base.

I kind of got to wondering if it was because he's been moved around so much depending upon what team he's playing for whether it was screwing up his motion or not. 3rd base in HS and 2nd on his showcase team and then behind the plate kind of took a toll on him over the last couple of years.

I am starting to see a bit of a tail on his throws but only when he's throwing from 3rd base and it's only once in a while. I think his last radar time was 76-80mph from 3rd in a series of 5 or six throws and they were straight lines but yes, he has started to tail off with a little pain.

I'm fairly certain that any position he'd probably play at the college level would be in the middle infield some place but just seems like he's on a cantchers binge right now and may feel like it's just something he wants prospective coaches to know that he can do.

Thanks. Sure is a lot to absorb and things I've certainly not thought of.

quote:

Originally posted by I'm Junior's Dad: Here's what I mean though. A bit of a lunge but a fast transfer.

Junior's Dad,

The lunge you see in your son's throw comes from the fact that his body is trying to create enough time for the arms to load without any right-foot (or lower-body) movement whatsoever. What you are also seeing is a product of his weight being completely on the back side and fighting to go forward. Again, this is because there is no right foot movement to create a balance point before the forward movement of the throw.

He has a pretty quick release at around .76 seconds. However, the velocity lost from not using his lower body in the throw offsets those time gains, as his throw is a good but not great HS throw at around 2.23 (video quality makes it a little tough to see actual glove impact at 2B).

His throw could be a lot faster in both velocity and time if he stays out front with the exchange, makes the exchange while he is coming up out of his crouch, gets his right foot underneath his center of gravity and loads his arms as he strides forward to allow the back hip to drive the throw rather than his upper-body.

Right now, he uses a classic, "rock-and-fire" method. There are a few reasons why this is something he will want to change as soon as possible. For one, he is putting all of the energy in the throw on his arm (I would be willing to guess that your son had some arm, inside elbow, front shoulder pain last season---and if he didn't, he will eventually as his body gets stronger and generates even more force on the arm).

Secondly, there is a good chance that on pitches to his right, he will start to see balls tail high and to the right because his body won't be able to regain proper direction in the throw. He'll always be fighting to get his momentum working in the same direction of his throw. This will cause the elbow of his throwing arm to drop below the shoulder as the forearm lays back. Since there is no hip drive in the throw, the upper-body rotation will be all that initiates the movement toward the target until the point where his arm is forced to push the ball to second base. This can cause the arm slot to drop and create tailing actions on the ball, and also forces over throws.

Very often people believe that less is more when it comes to mechanics. That simpler is always better. The simple fact is that a high-level throw is not simple. There are a lot of moving parts and simply eliminating one of those parts (footwork) doesn't shorten the throw, it weakens the efficiency of it.

Hope this helps and please feel free to PM me if you have any questions about this post.[/QUOTE]

He did actually complain of some pain right after the USBC down in Richmond this summer heading into the instructional camps that followed a few days later. I didn't know what to think of it. He was moved from 2nd base to catcher the week prior at the Temple Mid-Atlantic freedom Classic because the regular catcher didn't play that tournament and ended up catching some in Richmond thereafter when he wasn't playing second base.

I kind of got to wondering if it was because he's been moved around so much depending upon what team he's playing for whether it was screwing up his motion or not. 3rd base in HS and 2nd on his showcase team and then behind the plate kind of took a toll on him over the last couple of years.

I am starting to see a bit of a tail on his throws but only when he's throwing from 3rd base and it's only once in a while. I think his last radar time was 76-80mph from 3rd in a series of 5 or six throws and they were straight lines but yes, he has started to tail off with a little pain.

I'm fairly certain that any position he'd probably play at the college level would be in the middle infield some place but just seems like he's on a cantchers binge right now and may feel like it's just something he wants prospective coaches to know that he can do.

Thanks. Sure is a lot to absorb and things I've certainly not thought of.[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

The best catch and throw guys focus on their transfer.. transfer at their right shoulder as their body closes and legs load.. feet happen on their own and are only as quick as the transfer.. if feet are too quick then the catcher gets out on his front foot and is fumbling for a grip while trying to throw.. period

YES, I would agree this is your classic method...taught to young catchers to get them "up and running", and getting average results.

But, if you can get your feet (right foot) to drive the throw and transfer in front, you will achieve above average results. Of course, its not easy!!
Watch Weiters...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yb9Ykr5y4rg

quote:

Originally posted by CCJR:
......An early exchange out front allows the catcher to get the ball into his hand earlier. Which allows them to start the sequence of the throwing load and motion earlier......

Spot on.....my son's catching coach focuses on this. Go get the ball out of the glove as soon as you can out in front. It really keeps him compact and quick. Also ensures consistent exchange versus any type of later transfer or flipping.

I agree.. get the ball out of the glove as soon as you can out in front.. flipping becomes an extension/ improvement to this...with some risk