Im a 14, almost 15 year old sophmore LHP and i throw 70-75 with control. what are any other kids same grade/throwing hand throwing? im 6-0 135.
Original Post
Replies sorted oldest to newest
My LHP-son logged 72 MPH (Jugs) at age 14. At 17, he is committed to pitch D1 and clocked at 89 (Jugs) in a game just a week ago. Most certainly it can happen! Just work on your mechanics, long-toss, workout regularly and believe.
just wondering, how big is your son, in terms of soze and weight? i need to set a bench mark for myself to try to aim to
LHPStow, you should focus on being the best pitcher you can be and doing all it takes to get there. The training, workouts and learning will pay off when you can command the strike zone and keep hitters off balance. There are lefties that throw 85 who can get'em out and some who throw 90 that are all over the place. Since we can only work on what has been given to us and enhance it to its personal max, being a complete pitcher will benefit you more than trying to learn to throw as hard as possible. Good luck and never quit.
Throwing speed is not a mathematical progression. My son was throwing 78-80 as a HS freshman and is starting his JR year in college and has maxed at 84-85. He pitches at 82-84 and he is 6'3 and 189lbs. He has long skinny arms and fingers and his doc told him to be patient . The velo will come if he keeps working hard.
This year his coach is not concerned with velo but minimal pitches. A triple A pitcher who works out with his team said his P coach has also stressed location and minimal pitches over velo.
This year his coach is not concerned with velo but minimal pitches. A triple A pitcher who works out with his team said his P coach has also stressed location and minimal pitches over velo.
i undersatnd that control of the pitches and the ablity to keep hitters off balance is more important, but wiil colleges still notice me if im just average in throwing speed, but have the other aspcets needed?
so am i at about the right speed for what age/grade im at now, or should the speed be higher than what is currently is?
That is a hard question to answer. Lots throw harder but the real qustion is are you successful? Also are you long tossing and all the other arm strengthening things you need to do.
i am pretty successful, and i do longtoss, but other than long toss, im not really sure what else i need to do to throw harder
I would get a program of light weights, band work and Plyometrics. You should get good instruction to make sure you are getting the right workout.
ok, what areas do i need to strenghten? Arms? Legs? upper body?
quote:Originally posted by LHPStow:
ok, what areas do i need to strenghten? Arms? Legs? upper body?
D. All of the above
LHPStow,
Not knowing you personally of course, I'll take a wild shot and guess that you should probably work on strengthening the musculature of your shoulder capsules and triceps. Daily prone holds, for a minute or longer, and daily 'triceps push-ups', are great conditioning for pitchers.
Almost all pitchers are of course deeply interested in strengthening the musculature that helps them accelerate the ball. However, few realize that you cannot really accelerate the ball any faster than your body's capacity to decelerate. If you suddenly threw a ball at 90 mph, but your decelerator muscles were only strong enough to stop your arm from going 70 mph, what do you think might happen to you? (Hint: It wouldn't be pretty.)
If you really want to condition yourself to ramp up to higher velocities than your current level, it would be smart to pay attention to the muscle groups that have to slow you down after every delivery.
Not knowing you personally of course, I'll take a wild shot and guess that you should probably work on strengthening the musculature of your shoulder capsules and triceps. Daily prone holds, for a minute or longer, and daily 'triceps push-ups', are great conditioning for pitchers.
Almost all pitchers are of course deeply interested in strengthening the musculature that helps them accelerate the ball. However, few realize that you cannot really accelerate the ball any faster than your body's capacity to decelerate. If you suddenly threw a ball at 90 mph, but your decelerator muscles were only strong enough to stop your arm from going 70 mph, what do you think might happen to you? (Hint: It wouldn't be pretty.)
If you really want to condition yourself to ramp up to higher velocities than your current level, it would be smart to pay attention to the muscle groups that have to slow you down after every delivery.
I would also say you should pay attention to the areas that protect your arm from injury.
Get agood book on pitching that has a proven workout program. They can be fond in libraries or Chapters.
Get agood book on pitching that has a proven workout program. They can be fond in libraries or Chapters.
ok thanks for all the help
quote:i am pretty successful, and i do longtoss, but other than long toss, im not really sure what else i need to do to throw harder
I heard that when Roger Clemens was a kid he would go to a work site and stack a bunch of sheet rock against a wall and would throw the ball as hard as he could into them and could see his progression by how many he actually broke through. I thought it was pretty interesting.
ya that is pretty interesting, id never heard that before. thnks
I suggest you avoid throwing at Gyprock. Not only is it dumb but you migh wind up in jail.
lol, ya i wouldnt ever do that, i just thought it was interesting what clemens did to improve his arm strength
What improves arm strength is throwing not what you throw at.
i know i need to do both, but which would benifit me more, lifting weights to get physically bigger, or longtoss?
You are 14 almost 15. It is important to get proper instruction on weight training. It can be very detrimental to you if you don't do it properly. I would start withe light weights and work on strengthening your shoulder. You are at the age where your have to be careful. There is a right way and a wrong way.
LHPStow,
I would emphasize long-tossing. It has definitely been the path to success for my own LHP-son. He throws year-round, even in winter (only instructional not full-speed bullpens between late Oct.-early Jan.) Throw 5-6x week, get mechanical instruction, and work on your athleticism. I would focus on cardio, core, ploymetrics and LIGHT weights. And as Bobblehead says, do it right. Avoid lat pulldowns, bench pressing and such. Focus on the legs, the core, and THROW THROW THROW. Also add in a good band-work program (also need to know how to do this properly).
Do an internet search of the Jaeger long-toss program. It works!
I would emphasize long-tossing. It has definitely been the path to success for my own LHP-son. He throws year-round, even in winter (only instructional not full-speed bullpens between late Oct.-early Jan.) Throw 5-6x week, get mechanical instruction, and work on your athleticism. I would focus on cardio, core, ploymetrics and LIGHT weights. And as Bobblehead says, do it right. Avoid lat pulldowns, bench pressing and such. Focus on the legs, the core, and THROW THROW THROW. Also add in a good band-work program (also need to know how to do this properly).
Do an internet search of the Jaeger long-toss program. It works!
Hey dude, im also a LHP. I went to camp this summer and hit 83 on the gun as a freshman. Im now in my sophmore year... hoping to add some MPH on the fastball and have some success at the varsity level. Like the other guys said, just keep up the long toss and get in the weight room. I would also suggest some plyometric work, and some weighted ball work.
Good luck, pm me if u want
Good luck, pm me if u want
Kevin, I'd be really careful about weighted balls. I don't think they're necessary and I'm not a fan of anything that could potentially alter the arm slot or throwing motion. Just throw good 'ol fashioned baseballs.
Ok, thanks bum. I haven't ever thrown with them, but i heard theyre good if u do them properly. If anyone has any ideas about training i'd appreciate suggestions in my thread called "offseason training"
Kevin, Bum Jr. has NEVER used weighted balls and he's now 17. He long tosses 5-6x week.. does plyometrics, band work, core work, weights, cardio.
Here's his velocity numbers on the Stalker:
Age 15, Jan06: 77 Stalker College Camp
Age 15, Aug06: 79 Stalker PG Jr. National
Age 15, Nov06: 81 Stalker College Camp
Age 16, Jan07: 82 Stalker College Camp
Age 17, May07: 85 Stalker High School Game
Age 17, Jun07: 86 Stalker Stanford All-Star Camp
Age 17, Nov07: 87 Stalker Sr. Fall Classic AZ
Age 17, Jan08: 88 Stalker PG World Showcase
He will pitch in the Pac-10. Work on your mechanics and long-toss. Forget weighted balls.
Here's his velocity numbers on the Stalker:
Age 15, Jan06: 77 Stalker College Camp
Age 15, Aug06: 79 Stalker PG Jr. National
Age 15, Nov06: 81 Stalker College Camp
Age 16, Jan07: 82 Stalker College Camp
Age 17, May07: 85 Stalker High School Game
Age 17, Jun07: 86 Stalker Stanford All-Star Camp
Age 17, Nov07: 87 Stalker Sr. Fall Classic AZ
Age 17, Jan08: 88 Stalker PG World Showcase
He will pitch in the Pac-10. Work on your mechanics and long-toss. Forget weighted balls.
Bum,
Impressive numbers. It appears that he plays baseball year-round. Does he play other sports?
I do have one sort of unrelated question about those statistics. If you son was 15 years old in november 06, how was he 17 years old 6 months later?
Impressive numbers. It appears that he plays baseball year-round. Does he play other sports?
I do have one sort of unrelated question about those statistics. If you son was 15 years old in november 06, how was he 17 years old 6 months later?
Bum...couple questions.
Where does your son do his long toss in the winter time?
What do you consider long toss or how do you guys go about it? (seems like a strange question but I've seen a lot of differences in the way people long toss or what they consider long toss)
Where does your son do his long toss in the winter time?
What do you consider long toss or how do you guys go about it? (seems like a strange question but I've seen a lot of differences in the way people long toss or what they consider long toss)
LHPStow, the above is all good info, but one thing not yet mentioned is, you're a year young for your grade. You will graduate HS at age 17, not 18, if I read you correctly.
You are quite slender right now and are likely to lag others in your grad year in filling out, simply because you are younger.
Make sure when you talk to college scouts that they know this about you. Folks need to know that you still have "room to grow", both in strength and in MPH.
If you show MPH gains every year and are only 17 as a senior, a college might view you as a great catch if you're at 86 +/- then, since you might still be a kid who could scrape 90 by your freshman or sophomore years of college. Being a lefty, that's plenty of MPH for you to get your fondest wishes.
You are quite slender right now and are likely to lag others in your grad year in filling out, simply because you are younger.
Make sure when you talk to college scouts that they know this about you. Folks need to know that you still have "room to grow", both in strength and in MPH.
If you show MPH gains every year and are only 17 as a senior, a college might view you as a great catch if you're at 86 +/- then, since you might still be a kid who could scrape 90 by your freshman or sophomore years of college. Being a lefty, that's plenty of MPH for you to get your fondest wishes.
Andrew.. yes I'm off with my ages. I'm reposting.
Age 15, Jan06: 77 Stalker College Camp
Age 16, Aug06: 79 Stalker PG Jr. National
Age 16, Nov06: 81 Stalker College Camp
Age 16, Jan07: 82 Stalker College Camp
Age 17, May07: 85 Stalker High School Game
Age 17, Jun07: 86 Stalker Stanford All-Star Camp
Age 17, Nov07: 87 Stalker Sr. Fall Classic AZ
Age 17, Jan08: 88 Stalker PG World Showcase
*****
Bum, Jr. is only 5'10". Baseball is his only sport but he also is a varsity debater. He throws year-round and this means in Winter he throws with his Summer team in their indoor training area twice weekly and 3x weekly at my health club, against the racquetball court wall. If you can't do this, set up an indoor net to simulate long toss.
He essentially uses the Jaeger method. Do a google search. He will do a flat-footed toss 20-25 feet to a partner, about 15-20 throws. Then slowly work to greater distances. He'll use crossover step emphasizing solid mechanics to about 60 feet. Then crow hop if necessary. Each 5-10 throws go back 15-20 feet in distance. Work to max distance, then reverse the process working in. When you come back in, you'll notice the ball will tend to sail high. This is the pull down phase, where you regain your release point. What Jaeger and others say is that it is the pulldown phase where you get the benefit. When Bum Jr and his throwing partner are at 60 feet, this is where he is throwing his hardest. Even closer and he slows it down til finally he's back to where they started.
Hope this helps. But remember, it is all for naught if you don't have good mechanics.. find a good instructor. And go slowly until you build up the arm strength.
Finally, IMHO this DOES NOT mean throw bullpens year round. And please-- don't forget regular band work to stabilize the shoulder.
Age 15, Jan06: 77 Stalker College Camp
Age 16, Aug06: 79 Stalker PG Jr. National
Age 16, Nov06: 81 Stalker College Camp
Age 16, Jan07: 82 Stalker College Camp
Age 17, May07: 85 Stalker High School Game
Age 17, Jun07: 86 Stalker Stanford All-Star Camp
Age 17, Nov07: 87 Stalker Sr. Fall Classic AZ
Age 17, Jan08: 88 Stalker PG World Showcase
*****
Bum, Jr. is only 5'10". Baseball is his only sport but he also is a varsity debater. He throws year-round and this means in Winter he throws with his Summer team in their indoor training area twice weekly and 3x weekly at my health club, against the racquetball court wall. If you can't do this, set up an indoor net to simulate long toss.
He essentially uses the Jaeger method. Do a google search. He will do a flat-footed toss 20-25 feet to a partner, about 15-20 throws. Then slowly work to greater distances. He'll use crossover step emphasizing solid mechanics to about 60 feet. Then crow hop if necessary. Each 5-10 throws go back 15-20 feet in distance. Work to max distance, then reverse the process working in. When you come back in, you'll notice the ball will tend to sail high. This is the pull down phase, where you regain your release point. What Jaeger and others say is that it is the pulldown phase where you get the benefit. When Bum Jr and his throwing partner are at 60 feet, this is where he is throwing his hardest. Even closer and he slows it down til finally he's back to where they started.
Hope this helps. But remember, it is all for naught if you don't have good mechanics.. find a good instructor. And go slowly until you build up the arm strength.
Finally, IMHO this DOES NOT mean throw bullpens year round. And please-- don't forget regular band work to stabilize the shoulder.
Sounds good Bum.
I really like the Jeager program. We do a variation of it when the weather warms up.
My son also uses weighted balls and has seen good results with them. In the winter he throws into a net in our basement.
He likes to do both long toss and weighted balls.
I really like the Jeager program. We do a variation of it when the weather warms up.
My son also uses weighted balls and has seen good results with them. In the winter he throws into a net in our basement.
He likes to do both long toss and weighted balls.
OK, Bum here's a bit smaller list for CASon, a poor disadvantaged , 6'2" RHP:
Age 16, Dec07: 81 Stalker College Camp
Age 16, Jan08: 83 Stalker PG CA Underclass (hope they noticed that one.)
Age 16, Jun08: xx Stalker Stanford All-Star Camp??
Age 17, Nov08: xx Stalker Sr. Fall Classic AZ
Age 17, Jan09: xx Stalker PG ??
Got a feeling I'll have forgotten about this post by the next one. Looks like Rusty is 5 or 6 mo. older for his grade, another grave disadvantage for CASon. Young and right handed, I wonder if he can get disability?
, 6'2" RHP:Age 16, Dec07: 81 Stalker College Camp
Age 16, Jan08: 83 Stalker PG CA Underclass (hope they noticed that one.)
Age 16, Jun08: xx Stalker Stanford All-Star Camp??
Age 17, Nov08: xx Stalker Sr. Fall Classic AZ
Age 17, Jan09: xx Stalker PG ??
Got a feeling I'll have forgotten about this post by the next one. Looks like Rusty is 5 or 6 mo. older for his grade, another grave disadvantage for CASon. Young and right handed, I wonder if he can get disability?
CA Dad, sounds like he right on target. My only worry for CADad, Jr. is that you have him pitching year-round.. is that right? I have Bum, Jr. shut down bullpens between October and January.
Bum,
Nope. Sent you a long winded PM explaining what he's been doing.
Nope. Sent you a long winded PM explaining what he's been doing.
WARNING - Don't let yourself become overly concerned with your own or anybody else's MPH. It is just not good for your mind. The main thing to do is to concentrate on becoming a better Pitcher and things will take care of themselves.
quote:Originally posted by CADad:
OK, Bum here's a bit smaller list for CASon, a poor disadvantaged
....
If my son is 6' in bare feet, do I list him as a 6'2"
Corky,
I agree some people let MPH become their obsession. But I would not discourage the boy from wanting to improve and achieve. There are things he can do to get all he can get out of whatever God gave him, and I think we should encourage someone with the drive to see how good he can become.
The reality is, the higher your MPH, the more opportunities you'll get. You ultimately still have to get batters out, no question. But it's not like the two aren't related to some extent. He shouldn't ignore the other aspects of pitching, but be careful not to sound like he shouldn't really care what his MPH is, que sera sera.
Whether we like it or not, it matters a lot.
I agree some people let MPH become their obsession. But I would not discourage the boy from wanting to improve and achieve. There are things he can do to get all he can get out of whatever God gave him, and I think we should encourage someone with the drive to see how good he can become.
The reality is, the higher your MPH, the more opportunities you'll get. You ultimately still have to get batters out, no question. But it's not like the two aren't related to some extent. He shouldn't ignore the other aspects of pitching, but be careful not to sound like he shouldn't really care what his MPH is, que sera sera.
Whether we like it or not, it matters a lot.
Midlo, great post! I agree 110%. Don't kid yourself, without velocity it will not matter one iota how brilliant of a pitcher you are.
To gain great velocity you need to maximize your fluidity, your mechanics, and your arm speed. All the things that allow you a repeatable delivery (ability to throw strikes) AND maximize velocity. So it's all related.
Fluidity and mechanics can be worked with by getting good pitching instruction. I believe arm speed is maximized by long-toss.
I have said this before but I will say it again. Velocity is not the show. It is the ticket to the show, and without it you do not get in.
To gain great velocity you need to maximize your fluidity, your mechanics, and your arm speed. All the things that allow you a repeatable delivery (ability to throw strikes) AND maximize velocity. So it's all related.
Fluidity and mechanics can be worked with by getting good pitching instruction. I believe arm speed is maximized by long-toss.
I have said this before but I will say it again. Velocity is not the show. It is the ticket to the show, and without it you do not get in.
i don't have any scientific data to back this up, but. in the winter between fr/soph yr at a jc,my son joined a gym with a pool. he started swimming that winter. he put enough mph on to interest scouts. 5-9 190,lhp, looked more like a football player.he threw long toss and all the rest of the pitching workouts. swimming was the only difference. coincidence? it may be but it stands to reason same motion,with a little resistence?
lhpstow
velocity will come ,more important is the real estate theme........location location location.
lhpstow
velocity will come ,more important is the real estate theme........location location location.
