Lowering 60 time

Lowering that to a 6.4-6.6 is quite a steep task. Almost impossible. 6.4-6.6 is fast for MLB standards, and the type of players that run that are blazingly fast all their lives. You can still lower your time, but I don't think to that level. I would recommend learning the correct way to run (track coach or someone that knows what they are doing) and stretching. Stretch, stretch, stretch.

G


did you get our last email?

Yes and thank you for inviting me to your schowcase.
Me and my family are currently considering attending the showcase I will have an answer for you in aporximatly a week. Thanks!

My son ran a 7.4 as a sophomore and got it down to 6.9 by his senior year. It took a lot of work and focus on mechanics and strengthening his glutes and legs.

He was probably more like a 7.2 and had an offday that will remain published forever.

The first and most important hurdle will be a sub 7 time and as a sophomore with a 7.1 that should be attainable with some focused effort.

Good luck!

It would be difficult to lower your speed to the 6.4 range but 6.6 might be possible. One son has run documented 6.4's and the sophomore is in high 6.8's. You definitely need to have a track coach look at your stride, arm action, lean, and start. Both my guys run multiple track events. So many players I see at baseball showcases do not have good running form. Constantly run 65's so that you will learn to run all the way through on your 60's. I agree with the statements above that 6.4 on down is electrifying speed and is probably not achievable for someone who wasn't born with a natural gift. The turf you run can definitely have an affect on your times so try to get a time on turf. My son has not yet been timed on turf and I hope this would lower his time into 6.3 range. If you go to a Perfect Game event you can get timed by laser timer and I am sure these are more accurate than hand held. We went to a tryout with multiple scouts sometime back and son's time ranged from 6.45 to 6.69 on multiple hand held timers so keep running and get multiple samples as some guys are really slow with their timer reactions. In that event, the scouts that posted the times had only 8 guys out of 251 running below 7.0 and had son at 6.69 when everybody else had him at 6.5 or less so it depends on who's holding the timer. Your 7.1 is not a bad starting point as a soph but yes you need to getr that down to 6.75 and this is very possible.

You can't change your fast twitch muscles but you may get down to 6.9 with proper technique. You can help your arm strength which will get your defense on line. You can hide less defensive speed with a stronger arm. An example is a SS that can play deep, he gets to balls others can't and can throw people out because of his arm. If you don't have the arm you can't afford to play deep.

We can't tell you how much you can improve, but in general a 16 year old 5'11" 150 lb player (your description in another thread) who runs a 7.1 is actually reasonably fast. Depending on the level of hormonal maturity, many 16 year olds pick up 5-10% in speed in the following 2 years, just as many 16 YO kids pick up 10-15% in pitching velocity or the distance that they hit a baseball.

Now if you are already full-grown, and a week without shaving leaves you with an obvious beard, then probably technique improvement is the only avenue to gain speed.

Actually, your low to mid-70s throwing velocity is the area that needs the most improvement. Your 60 yard time, even if it stays about the same, won't by itself stop you from playing some level of college baseball, but your present throwing velocity might be a show stopper. I'm sure you can improve it, even if you are already at full hormonal maturity, through a combination of technique improvement and a throwing program.

Yes I agree with those above. 7.1 is not the area to concentrate on. Get your arm strength up. That is an area where you should concentrate your efforts.

You should calculate your SPARQ rating. This is starting to gain traction as a standard measuring for baseball players as it incorporates speed tools as well as strength tools. And there is a national database that can give you an idea of where you rank. Check this out...
http://www.eastcoastproshowcas...mance_Guide_2008.pdf

quote:

Originally posted by schwammi:
You should calculate your SPARQ rating. This is starting to gain traction as a standard measuring for baseball players as it incorporates speed tools as well as strength tools. And there is a national database that can give you an idea of where you rank. Check this out...
http://www.eastcoastproshowcas...mance_Guide_2008.pdf

Are you sure about this? I never hear anyone talk about sparq ratings as any kind of standard for baseball players....in fact I rarely hear anyone talk about sparq ratings....

I've been coaching and scouting for the past 30 years and that's the first I heard of SPARQ. Is there a website to go with this and explain.

SPARQ as far as I am concerned has no true relationship to baseball skills

Sparq testing has been done for several years at the Stanford Camp. Those who don't test well don't like it, those that do test well think it is very important. It is a test of athleticism, (speed, power, agility) and it is used more for football. They have tried to come up with a few tests that check for the type of athleticism needed for baseball, but they don't claim that it tests baseball skills. Jacob Ellsbury has the highest recorded baseball score as of last year.

What matters is whether college coaches use this testing. It seems that some rely heavily on it, while most do not.

Google it if you want to know more.

My son has never been asked for a Sparq score from a college coach or pro scout.

Since he asked how to lower his 60 time, can you answer the question. I know he has given his other credentials but he wanted to know what he could do. If you could not get a personal trainer or anybody what could you do on your own to lower your time? Is it just running sprints and correcting your mechanics? Is there anything else you can do?

Work out with his buddies on the track team

well they don't really know that much about running, they just do it. It will be really helpful when I am getting blown out when they are running 4.4 and I am running a 4.9

Find a gym with a glute ham raise. Squats and box jumps. Find some slight hills and run DOWNHILL. This is overspeed training and will make you faster if you committ to make it part of your program.

Also your first 10 yards will be very important. Work on your start.

johnny

I respect your apparent lack of knowledge regarding track people---the sprinters can teach him how to get a better start--one quick step can help immensely

Incidently my son was a 6.6 guy in HS and got down to 6.4 in collegeand he worked out with the HS track team---the big key though is instincts and that you cannot teach

Is the glute ham raise the machine where you lay on your stomach and do "curls" with your legs?

Also, how many days per week would you advise for the downhill run and how long/reps etc?

Play socker for a year or two. It will greatly improve your quickness and your open field speed.

Sorry, just had to do it.

The heck with that!

frnks


what you say is so true

quote:

Originally posted by floridafan:
Is the glute ham raise the machine where you lay on your stomach and do "curls" with your legs?

Also, how many days per week would you advise for the downhill run and how long/reps etc?

No-a pic of a glute ham raise is below.

http://www.flexcart.com/member...m=PD&cid=167&pid=679

You hook your feet in on the pads and "pull" yourself up with your glutes and hamstrings.

Maybe twice a week running downhill. How far-if you are trying to improve your 60yrd time I would run 70yrd sprints. As far as how many it would depend on what kind of shape you are in.

I haven’t got time to explain it all, but there is a definite difference in the baseball 60 yard sprint and all other type sprints.

We have found that all runners can drop .2 simply by using better start technique. Running form is very important and should be worked on, but the truth is that most players will improve their 10 yard time by .2 and possibly improve another .1 over the last 50 yards.

We have film of thousands running the 60. It amazes me how many don’t know what they are doing. The best start is the one that is most efficient. There are many drills that can help a player gain speed, but you can’t reach your potential without proper technique.

For some reason we see lots of players start with their right foot forward of their left foot (closed stance) this automatically costs most runners a lot of time (remember lots of time in this cases is measured in tenths of a second). This causes the crossover step to be off line and it requires adjustments to get perfect balance and perfect line to the target. Any and all adjustments cost a runner some time.

Others open up too far thinking they can cheat that way. Opening too far is nearly as bad as being too closed. It makes it very difficult to get an immediate accurate line to the target. Most start in the same exact position they would use in stealing a base. But it should be remembered that when running the 60 you don’t have to worry about any pick off attempts. You only concentrate on going one way. So being slightly open (right toe open slightly towards the target) If you were to draw a straight line from your left heel to the target (finish line) your right toe tip should be touching that line. This puts you in a position that when you cross over you will not have your right leg in the way and you should be able to square perfectly to the target with out any side ways action.

There’s much more to perfecting your 60 start, but this will help almost anyone. I do think when it comes to running form and training players should find a sprint coach. But, once again, some sprint coaches are not baseball people and developing the most efficient start is the biggest difference maker in the baseball 60.

I do think it is a good idea to run 65-70 yard sprints, especially when it comes to running form and maintaining speed, but much easier and most effective is to practice lots of 10 yard sprints and master the start. It’s actually hard to practice lots of 60-70 yard sprints. It’s not as hard practicing lots of 10 yard sprints and much more productive. In the end they are both important. I’m a believer that every player other than those with world class speed can cut at least .2 out of their 60 time.

Note: It is very helpful to be timed constantly in those ten yard sprints. You will find out very quickly just how much time can be cut in those first 10 yards. This will allow your mind to work correctly.

Best of luck

Great post PG! Thanks!

Yes thank you! I copied your post and e-mailed it to my son.

Thanks to pg for elaborating what I was too lazy to type LOL.

Work on your start which will shave a considerable amount of time. Strengthen the glutes and hams to be able to move your feet faster and have more power. And run downhill to "teach" your feet how to move faster.

And while I totally agree with running some 10 yard sprints if your sole focus is running a faster 60 yard time you should run 70 yard sprints. Kind of like the old saying you play how you practice, if you drop running the longer sprints and focus only on short sprints, when it comes time to do the longer sprint you will not run as fast as you could have.

Best thing to do would be to map out a detailed running plan and change your running workouts every day. Also change the days you do the workouts and change the times so your body doesn't get use to what you are doing.

So it could look something like:

After school

Mon and Thurs 70 yard sprints
Tues and Friday 10 yard sprints
Wed and Sat downhill sprints
Sunday distance

Do this for 3 weeks then change to something like:

Morning before school

Saturday distance
Sunday and Wed 70 yard sprints
Mon and Thurs 10 yard sprints
Tues and Fri downhill sprints

Thanks Zacksdad, this is going to him too.

Would this be a work out regime primarily for offseason?

quote:

Originally posted by floridafan:
Thanks Zacksdad, this is going to him too.

Would this be a work out regime primarily for offseason?

I never knew there was one LOL...

Depends on how well conditioned the athlete is and what else is incorporated in the athletes workout throughout the day. If it is just weight training and baseball skill drills there is no reason not to have a running program in your daily routine. The highest conditioned athletes workout multiply times a day with rest and food intake in between.

A few more points about the start. In the world of drag racing if you knock .2 off your 60 ft time it is good for .4 at the end of the quarter mile. Same thing here. If you get a better start it will allow you to get to your "top speed" quicker thus translating into a quicker time.

The guy plays 5 games a week and has practice each day other than sunday. He may have to relegate it to the fall season along with the weight training.

so does anyone know what a good 10 yard dash time is? Let's say that I want to run a 60 in 6.7-6.8 what would my 10 yard have to be around?

forget the 10 yd times and 60 yd times and 70 yd times---how well do you run the bases? how well do you react in the field? how quickly do you get out of the batters box?---answer these questions and then you will see what baseball is all about

There was another thread that dealt with this as well:

http://hsbaseballweb.com/eve/f...6083255/m/2681073613

If I could offer any one thing, it is to go talk to an expert at running faster (ie a track coach). Obviously, you want to run faster because it will help you in baseball, but if people are MEASURING the 60, you need to get good at that. There is a skill and a technique to running faster and a highly motivated (and informed) athlete will do the things necessary to excel; map it out with help and build a program that is informed and pragmatic.

As to the skill of running the bases, I am reminded of the comments of Rickie Henderson, oh about 25 years ago. I am paraphrasing of course, but he said that he had mapped out the number of steps, right and left, that he would take when stealing second. He practiced them over and over. Quick and efficient, by any measure he was one of the top three basestealers of all time. As to YOUR baserunning, be pragmatic and smart; work on the things that will let you stretch a single into a double and to go from first to third on a single. Please keep us posted on your progress...

quote:

Originally posted by johnny appleseed:
so does anyone know what a good 10 yard dash time is? Let's say that I want to run a 60 in 6.7-6.8 what would my 10 yard have to be around?

Dunno the answer to this one, but I would guess that your reaction to the starting prompt is extremely important; don't forget to train that too. There is a discussion on a website (http://www.stack.com), interviewing a trainer named Mike Boyle. Mike is considered one of the elite trainers in the country and focuses on the functional aspects of speed creation. One of the starting drills he promotes is effectively teaching his athletes to "jump" out of their stances at the start. I think I am relaying it right, but they effectively explode and dive from their stances onto a high jump pad.

quote:

forget the 10 yd times and 60 yd times and 70 yd times---how well do you run the bases? how well do you react in the field? how quickly do you get out of the batters box?---answer these questions and then you will see what baseball is all about

TR,

That is very confusing to me. I'm afraid I have to disagree with you on this one. At least, the part about forgetting the running times.

Do you have players run the 60? If someone runs a great 60 time is it ignored? This is a very important running time for decision makers. It has a bearing on what happens in the future to a baseball player. It's kind of hard to forget about it!

All the things you mentioned are vitally important. But telling someone to forget about trying to improve their running speed doesn't make any sense. Also telling them what they need to do without telling them how to do it, isn't going to help anyone.

In the end, what happens on the field is what's most important, that's what it's all about. But those things can happen based on hard work off the field. If you improve your running ability, you become better than you were at running home to first. You will not be any worse at reacting to the ball in the field, but you will cover more ground after reacting. You will be the same base runner except you will cover more distance in less time.

johnny appleseed,

10 Yard times are used by the runner to see improvement in this critical area. Players are like dogs and horses... some are early speed types some are later speed types or more accurately better at maintaining speed for a longer distance.

The goal is to cut .2 (or more) out of the 10 yard time. Whatever that 10 yard time is to begin with doesn't matter. This means you should cut "at least" .2 out of the 60 time as well. Even more if you also work on sprinting technique.

Reaction is important, but first a runner needs to have the proper technique. No matter what anyone thinks, the guy who can improve .2 in 10 yards is a more valuable baseball player in every way. In fact, the first 10 yards is much more important in baseball than 60 yards.

PG

I am not really a stat guy when it comes to 60 yd dashes and radar readings on arms in the field or pop times---I am more result oriented

A couple of examples:

01--we had a young man a few years back you ran a 7.6 60--it was true reading as he did back to back on the same turf---get him on base in a game and his instincts took over---he ran the bases like a mad dog---today he is playing Division II baseball and leads his team in stolen bases

02-- Arm strength--- last year we had a young man throwing 89 from the outfield---put him on the mound and his best velocity was 79

Bernie Williams is a great example of a player with excellent foot speed that could not run the bases properly if he tried.

Yes we do the speed arm strength stuff at our events but they are really for player comparisons and parents

I trust you see where I am coming from

TR,

I think I know where you're coming from, but it doesn't have much to do with scouting. If the kid who ran the 7.6 ran a 6.8 he would be much better yet, wouldn't he? He wouldn't lose his instincts because he improved his running speed. Someone throwing 89 from the outfield doesn't mean he can pitch, it just means he might have a good arm from the outfield. I've seen 89's that were real good and 89's that weren't so good.

If Bernie Williams didn't have running ability we might not even know who he is. He is a good example of just how important certain things (like running speed) are. He won four gold gloves as a centerfielder and stole 147 bases while scoring 1366 runs. He also had 55 triples. None of that would have happened if he couldn't run fast. Yes, there were many others who were smarter runners, but most of them didn't play centerfield in the Big Leagues. Besides his biggest problem was dealing with the signs for some reason.

I think people need to know how these things work. Great instincts and being a smart baserunner are great, but if you are trying to go first to third, every .2 of a second equals approximately one full stride. The guy with the great instincts gets a much better jump. If he runs a 7.5 60 and a 6.5 runner get the same jump the 6.5 runner will reach 3B approximately 5 full strides before the 7.5 runner.

I understand instincts, but the best instincts in history can't make up for 5 full strides. That would mean the 7.5 runner would have to have a full 5 stride jump over the 6.5 runner. And then they would both arrive at 3B at about the same time provided they both ran the same route. And the easiest thing in the world to teach is how to round the bags. And there is a lot of important things defensively and offensively besides how many bases are stolen and that pertains to running speed or lack of it.

BTW, scouting is all about player comparisons. I hate to think we would be running the 60 for the parents of all people. That thought has never even crossed my mind.

Here are the people at an event we did this winter who are interested in getting those running times. As can be seen, scouts want to get that information.

It's the scouts and college recruiters who care the most about running times. If they didn't care they wouldn't time them or call and ask about them. Same for the radar gun readings. Sure they might like the slower guy better at times, but that is because of the rest of the package. Being a smart base runner with good instincts IS extremely important. After that, the difference becomes which player can actually run the fastest. Truth is, if you can't run, you had better be able to hit and play a position that doesn't require running speed.

When it comes to running ability... It seems pretty simple to me. There is always a target or finish line. Where ever that target is 1B, 2B, 3B, HP, or to the ball... the guy who gets there quickest is the one scouts are looking for. At least when it comes to running ability.

All that said, it is possible to be quick without having exceptional speed. Quickness is very important in baseball. Maybe that's what you mean. It's just that sometimes distance has to be covered and that is when lack of speed sticks out like sore thumb.

"Results oriented" would be more closely associated with "stats". Velocity, and running times are more about tools not stats. Scouts don't care much about stats, but they care a lot about tools. The present day results in a young player mean very little to a scout. Fast enough at one level doesn't make a player fast enough at a higher level. The game changes speeds with each level.

A pitcher should run back to the dugout ...slowly, work on getting that FB to 87 and his off speed to 72.