CatcherMom:
Im assuming your son in involved with the BaseballNorthwest State games etc. If not, he should be.
This is a very interesting thread. The reason it is interesting is that it was my tryout. There were 47 players at the tryout and each of them was invited by a group of 8 scouts including myself. The kids were from Oregon, washington and Idaho and they were what we consider to be the best 47 players from the 3 states. Being invited means that you are a fine player or believe me you would not be there as poitics does not mean s**t to me. There were no walk ons, as you had to be invited to try out.
There were an additional 5 kids that were invited that did not make the tryout. 2 of them were with their summer teams and would have faced problems with their coaches if they had left their team. One pitcher had a tender shoulder and could not make it. The 3 of them all called me ahead of time and I took this into consideration, and they have been invited to play for us as they are all prospects. 2 other guys just did not show up and won't be with the Area Code Team.
The catcher in question is the best high school catcher in the Northwest and is still not sure he can make it as his team is playing at the same time as the Area Code event.I saw him play 5 times this spring as he was a teamate of a 1st round pick that I was scouting, so my evaluation comes from watching him play in 5 games and get about 20 AB's and catch a hard throwing right hander who was drafted by the Mariners.
Your son is a very good player, and that is why he was invited in the first place. He was edged out, but as far as I can see he is one of the 4 best catchers in the Northwest and that covers a lot of high school catchers.
The Area Code games do not charge the kids one cent to participate, so whatever money Student Sports makes does not come from the players or their families. They charge the scouts and college coaches admission to the games, but we are all on expense accounts so ......who cares?
I invited another player about 6 years ago who was also invited twice and I cut him the first time and it was very hard on my love life at home, as the player I cut was my son. He got edged out that year too, and I caught he l l for it at home.
There were an additional 5 kids that were invited that did not make the tryout. 2 of them were with their summer teams and would have faced problems with their coaches if they had left their team. One pitcher had a tender shoulder and could not make it. The 3 of them all called me ahead of time and I took this into consideration, and they have been invited to play for us as they are all prospects. 2 other guys just did not show up and won't be with the Area Code Team.
The catcher in question is the best high school catcher in the Northwest and is still not sure he can make it as his team is playing at the same time as the Area Code event.I saw him play 5 times this spring as he was a teamate of a 1st round pick that I was scouting, so my evaluation comes from watching him play in 5 games and get about 20 AB's and catch a hard throwing right hander who was drafted by the Mariners.
Your son is a very good player, and that is why he was invited in the first place. He was edged out, but as far as I can see he is one of the 4 best catchers in the Northwest and that covers a lot of high school catchers.
The Area Code games do not charge the kids one cent to participate, so whatever money Student Sports makes does not come from the players or their families. They charge the scouts and college coaches admission to the games, but we are all on expense accounts so ......who cares?
I invited another player about 6 years ago who was also invited twice and I cut him the first time and it was very hard on my love life at home, as the player I cut was my son. He got edged out that year too, and I caught he l l for it at home.
bbscout:
That is a remarkable post that ought to provide much, much needed insight to a lot of people. Baseball is a tough but fair business. Ultimately it comes down to performance for all to see.
That is a remarkable post that ought to provide much, much needed insight to a lot of people. Baseball is a tough but fair business. Ultimately it comes down to performance for all to see.
quote:The catcher in question is the best high school catcher in the Northwest
quote:He was edged out, but as far as I can see he is one of the 4 best catchers in the Northwest and that covers a lot of high school catchers.
So, in other words, 3 of the 4 best catchers in the Northwest....were edged out.
And, the other 3 have many, many opportunities..........
Sobering, ain't it?
bbscout, thanks for providing your unusual perspective.
And, presuming your permission, I am posting your post in a similar debate in the Texas forum.
bbscout bring a lot to the table in these discussions! 
Fungo
Fungo
bbscout---
What an AWESOME post!!
What an AWESOME post!!
bbscout, guess you experienced that phenomenon of it being both extremely hot and extremely chilly at the same time, huh?
Thanks much for taking time to relate the info in your post.
Thanks much for taking time to relate the info in your post.
quote:Originally posted by FormerObserver:quote:The catcher in question is the best high school catcher in the Northwestquote:He was edged out, but as far as I can see he is one of the 4 best catchers in the Northwest and that covers a lot of high school catchers.
So, in other words, 3 of the 4 best catchers in the Northwest....were edged out.
And, the other 3 have many, many opportunities..........
Sobering, ain't it?
bbscout, thanks for providing your unusual perspective.
And, presuming your permission, I am posting your post in a similar debate in the Texas forum.
FO, We are taking 3 catchers to the games, so I guess there are 3 catchers who are pleased, and probably 3 States worth of catchers who are not pleased.
bbscout
you select players
we select players
there are only so many spots on a
roster
not getting selected does not mean the player is not good
some will be pleased others will not because they all want to be there---it just cannot be--it is a way of life--same happens after job interviews--"I should have gotten the job"
it is the way it is
do you not agree? you pick up and go on the next event/game whatever
you select players
we select players
there are only so many spots on a
roster
not getting selected does not mean the player is not good
some will be pleased others will not because they all want to be there---it just cannot be--it is a way of life--same happens after job interviews--"I should have gotten the job"
it is the way it is
do you not agree? you pick up and go on the next event/game whatever
jemaz, I agree the post by bbscout was very good. As far as performance always being the deciding factor though I have to disagree as I have seen other issues show up plenty of times in the game of baseball and other sports. I am not saying it happened in this case but there are plenty of times that it does.
Lineshot
I cannot say you are wrong, but if a selected player is not good enough to have been selected on his merits, it will soon enough be clear to all. Baseball does not extend favors to anyone in the end.
I cannot say you are wrong, but if a selected player is not good enough to have been selected on his merits, it will soon enough be clear to all. Baseball does not extend favors to anyone in the end.
The thing I was wondering was...were they the best three catchers...or were they prospects?
With all due respect to BBScout and others...bias (political or not) shows up at almost every showcase. Perhaps height, or maybe even the kid runs on the field at "mach 1", or could be he's been raised in the south...brought up to say "yes, sir" to the coach. Or, tools are so great ya gotta find a way to "overlook" those "make-up" deficiencies.
These are the exceptions...but bias exists ON the playing field...and in coaches,scouts, recruiters everywhere.
(No "axe to grind" here, son is 6'1", only says "yes, sir" to the preacher and hustles but no "mach 1") I just beg to differ on the statement "baseball does not extend favors to anyone". Draft percentages disprove that...and many "selected players" are selected on potential merits. It is clear to all, they just cannot or will not re-vamp system.
I do feel that showcases or camps like TR's do a great service to the players, for reasons that should be clear to all that read TR's posts. That is just my humble opinion, based on his (and others) track record on getting players to the next level. Another disclaimer; I am in favor of these showcases, because it does offer "exposure", it is just the fact the some are overexposed, while legitimate players are cut for the "overexposed" players that have been seen, seen and seen again. "Tools" are not that hard to identify.
With all due respect to BBScout and others...bias (political or not) shows up at almost every showcase. Perhaps height, or maybe even the kid runs on the field at "mach 1", or could be he's been raised in the south...brought up to say "yes, sir" to the coach. Or, tools are so great ya gotta find a way to "overlook" those "make-up" deficiencies.
These are the exceptions...but bias exists ON the playing field...and in coaches,scouts, recruiters everywhere.
(No "axe to grind" here, son is 6'1", only says "yes, sir" to the preacher and hustles but no "mach 1") I just beg to differ on the statement "baseball does not extend favors to anyone". Draft percentages disprove that...and many "selected players" are selected on potential merits. It is clear to all, they just cannot or will not re-vamp system.
I do feel that showcases or camps like TR's do a great service to the players, for reasons that should be clear to all that read TR's posts. That is just my humble opinion, based on his (and others) track record on getting players to the next level. Another disclaimer; I am in favor of these showcases, because it does offer "exposure", it is just the fact the some are overexposed, while legitimate players are cut for the "overexposed" players that have been seen, seen and seen again. "Tools" are not that hard to identify.
Catsuremom,
They are all prospects. Some of the prospects get invited to the Area Code games. MOST don't.
Players reach the next level from LL, high school, college, and the minor leagues based on potential.
It is a natural selection process just like life itself.
Bias is in the selection process. Scouts are biased towards 6'4" 210 pound kids that hit the baseball out, throw it more than 90 mph, or run the sixty under 7 seconds. Their prior experience provides some of the basis for that bias.
Hustle and respect for the game, coaches, other players, and for the player himself are important traits of sucessful baseball players that impact the bias of scouts. "The intangibles."
The intangibles of a 5'9" player can offset the physical power of the 6'4" 210 pounder.
The draft is a selection process. Baseball players are selected that major league baseball teams believe (with their biases) have the potential to compete in the minor leagues and reach the major leagues.
Althought there has to be some exposure, the amount of exposure or under exposure is not likely to impact the selection process significanly.
The baseball draft is not the end of the process but actually the beginning.
It is their system, with their learned biases.
Even the scouts.
Of the 1500 players that are recommended to be drafted by scouts only a fraction will ever play major league baseball.
In the natural selection process, the survivors learn to adapt.
Those that try to change the process don't survive.
They are all prospects. Some of the prospects get invited to the Area Code games. MOST don't.
Players reach the next level from LL, high school, college, and the minor leagues based on potential.
It is a natural selection process just like life itself.
Bias is in the selection process. Scouts are biased towards 6'4" 210 pound kids that hit the baseball out, throw it more than 90 mph, or run the sixty under 7 seconds. Their prior experience provides some of the basis for that bias.
Hustle and respect for the game, coaches, other players, and for the player himself are important traits of sucessful baseball players that impact the bias of scouts. "The intangibles."
The intangibles of a 5'9" player can offset the physical power of the 6'4" 210 pounder.
The draft is a selection process. Baseball players are selected that major league baseball teams believe (with their biases) have the potential to compete in the minor leagues and reach the major leagues.
Althought there has to be some exposure, the amount of exposure or under exposure is not likely to impact the selection process significanly.
The baseball draft is not the end of the process but actually the beginning.
quote:It is clear to all, they just cannot or will not re-vamp system.
It is their system, with their learned biases.
quote:but if a selected player is not good enough to have been selected on his merits, it will soon enough be clear to all.
quote:Baseball does not extend favors to anyone in the end.
Even the scouts.
Of the 1500 players that are recommended to be drafted by scouts only a fraction will ever play major league baseball.
In the natural selection process, the survivors learn to adapt.
Those that try to change the process don't survive.
.
Fascinating thread...
This could only happen on the HSBBW...unhappy parent meets coach/scout who they hold responsible for their beef...
Highlights the difference in viewpoint..what a parent sees as a a political injustice...
...is simply good research/selection to a scout.
In this case both viewpoints would seem to have validity. For the parent, this is a tryout. Why have a tryout if your not going to use the results or the players who showed? For the scout, why ignore the best information and players that you can get(including those with prior comittments )to provide the best team/players?
In the end such selections and selection processes in baseball and in many sports are are subjective, not objective. "Fair" is in the viewpoint. As a result frustration is likely to follow.
Finally, with all due respects to all of you/us....and while the player in question may have indeed deserved selection...when it comes to sports...A parent (myself included) is the LEAST likley to be able to judge their child's talent level objectively. And this may apply to a slection process as well.
I for one have been in the same position and felt EXACTLY the same way. For me, the scouts explaination was a wonderful opportunity to see the selection world from the other, non-parental side.
44
.
Fascinating thread...
This could only happen on the HSBBW...unhappy parent meets coach/scout who they hold responsible for their beef...
Highlights the difference in viewpoint..what a parent sees as a a political injustice...
...is simply good research/selection to a scout.
In this case both viewpoints would seem to have validity. For the parent, this is a tryout. Why have a tryout if your not going to use the results or the players who showed? For the scout, why ignore the best information and players that you can get(including those with prior comittments )to provide the best team/players?
In the end such selections and selection processes in baseball and in many sports are are subjective, not objective. "Fair" is in the viewpoint. As a result frustration is likely to follow.
Finally, with all due respects to all of you/us....and while the player in question may have indeed deserved selection...when it comes to sports...A parent (myself included) is the LEAST likley to be able to judge their child's talent level objectively. And this may apply to a slection process as well.
I for one have been in the same position and felt EXACTLY the same way. For me, the scouts explaination was a wonderful opportunity to see the selection world from the other, non-parental side.
44.
quote:I for one have been in the same position and felt EXACTLY the same way.
just being invited would be a thrill.but if my son was considered one of the 4 best at anything in new england i'd be doing cartwheels.
when life gives you lemons, make lemonaid
when life gives you lemons, make lemonaid
[QUOTE]Originally posted by FormerObserver:
The baseball draft is not the end of the process but actually the beginning.
[QUOTE]
Actually, for most baseball players, the draft is the end of the process.
As far as the Area Code tryouts are concerned, when my son was invited a few years ago I considered it to be a win-win situation. If he made the team, great!! If not, he was being seen by about 90 DI coaches and ML scouts.
The day after his Area Code tryout he received phone calls from dozens of DI coaches. One of the reps for the Area Code team also called to ask about his availability, but that there were a couple pitchers not in attendance at the tryout who they still wanted on the team and they still had to verify everyone's availability. My son was not selected, but that one Area Code tryout was the only exposure he needed to ultimately have many options for college.
And it was free!!
The baseball draft is not the end of the process but actually the beginning.
[QUOTE]
Actually, for most baseball players, the draft is the end of the process.
As far as the Area Code tryouts are concerned, when my son was invited a few years ago I considered it to be a win-win situation. If he made the team, great!! If not, he was being seen by about 90 DI coaches and ML scouts.
The day after his Area Code tryout he received phone calls from dozens of DI coaches. One of the reps for the Area Code team also called to ask about his availability, but that there were a couple pitchers not in attendance at the tryout who they still wanted on the team and they still had to verify everyone's availability. My son was not selected, but that one Area Code tryout was the only exposure he needed to ultimately have many options for college.
And it was free!!
I look at the draft process as another fork in the road. The end of the process is when the player no longer plays. JMO.
This is a great thread and great posts by BBscout, FO and OB44. I enjoy both perspectives, from parents and from scout (who also is a parent).
Another story to share, we were told that son was in consideration for Aflac inaugural a few years ago. It never happened, in fact not really sure how much anyone was interested in him. Do I think the pitchers chosen were better than son, no, from my perspective. In fact, I really didn't understand why some where chosen over others. End of story. In the end, it certainly didn't make much of a difference.
It's very very difficult as a parent going through the process to understand lots of things. When it's all said and done, NLI signed or not signed, draft or no draft, things become a bit more clearer as to what you would or would not change, and what you really had control over, and most likely in the end, I think it's because many parents just sit back, and let their son's talent speak for themselves, without worrying which event he got into and which event he didn't. I know plenty of kids who stayed close to home, parents spent little and got great opportunities. I know others who spent fortunes sending sons off to every camp, every event, every showcase and results were not to their liking. Lots of things fall into place in the end, lots of it based on a teams needs for that particular year, which is something you or anyone else has little control over.
Was my son best pitcher coming out of his class of 2004 in our area, no, but he had talent and a great GPA. The GPA was something we had control over and early on we insisted that he work harder in school than on the field, as we knew from our homework that might make the difference in the end, which it did, fro college, for him. In fact though it was helpful in recruiting, it wasn't as far as the draft, one on one I am sure a team preferred someone of equal talent with less signability issues. And I didn't realize it until later on, his scholarship amount was more hurtful than helpful.
JMO.
This is a great thread and great posts by BBscout, FO and OB44. I enjoy both perspectives, from parents and from scout (who also is a parent).
Another story to share, we were told that son was in consideration for Aflac inaugural a few years ago. It never happened, in fact not really sure how much anyone was interested in him. Do I think the pitchers chosen were better than son, no, from my perspective. In fact, I really didn't understand why some where chosen over others. End of story. In the end, it certainly didn't make much of a difference.
It's very very difficult as a parent going through the process to understand lots of things. When it's all said and done, NLI signed or not signed, draft or no draft, things become a bit more clearer as to what you would or would not change, and what you really had control over, and most likely in the end, I think it's because many parents just sit back, and let their son's talent speak for themselves, without worrying which event he got into and which event he didn't. I know plenty of kids who stayed close to home, parents spent little and got great opportunities. I know others who spent fortunes sending sons off to every camp, every event, every showcase and results were not to their liking. Lots of things fall into place in the end, lots of it based on a teams needs for that particular year, which is something you or anyone else has little control over.
Was my son best pitcher coming out of his class of 2004 in our area, no, but he had talent and a great GPA. The GPA was something we had control over and early on we insisted that he work harder in school than on the field, as we knew from our homework that might make the difference in the end, which it did, fro college, for him. In fact though it was helpful in recruiting, it wasn't as far as the draft, one on one I am sure a team preferred someone of equal talent with less signability issues. And I didn't realize it until later on, his scholarship amount was more hurtful than helpful.
JMO.
FO, I believe what I stated did not, for the most part, disagree with your counterpoints. They are ALL prospects. In this case, prospect and potential equal the same.
The natural selection process is not a great comparson, though...natual selection provides that the strongest survive. In MLB, of those 1500 30-100 of those players are given greater opportunity to proceed. We should be familiar with those greater opportunities...money, chances, extra time and effort to develop. Yes, bias is a part of life, but the statement was made..."politics don't mean #### to me"...it is there whether he intends it or not. No slight to him, he appears to me to be a very fine person. The hustle and respect you reference as being important traits for the game, I wholeheartedly agree, in fact, I see the current trend in MLB (to overlook character and integrity in a "toolsy" players as very detrimental to the essence of the game). It was a reference to what BBscout posted some time ago...he expressed a disdain for those particular traits...a bais.
I also differ with you about "exposure", but it is an opinion, and those always differ!
It is their system, however imperfect it is, I happen to love the game and I do think over time, a correction will be made and less foolishness will be tolerated.
FO, the BEST team is not made up of POTENTIAL, it is present ability. (As far as your comment about the make-up of the scouts team. The parent was not "judging talent level" here, she was simply expressing frustration over the apparent bias. BBScout adequately answered that question and she understood.
It is all too common on this site for posters to jump to that tired old statement..."parents are not capable of judging talent level of their own kids". I give them more credit than that. Yes, there are some that cannot, mostly they get left behind in little league, I have found most parents are perhaps more critical of their own, but are seeking a fairness on the playing field that in some cases is not there.
A open mind towards all should be given freely.
As stated, MLB, the draft...is not the end...for some it is the beginning...of baseball at the next level, for some, it is the beginning of a wonderful life in some other field.
The natural selection process is not a great comparson, though...natual selection provides that the strongest survive. In MLB, of those 1500 30-100 of those players are given greater opportunity to proceed. We should be familiar with those greater opportunities...money, chances, extra time and effort to develop. Yes, bias is a part of life, but the statement was made..."politics don't mean #### to me"...it is there whether he intends it or not. No slight to him, he appears to me to be a very fine person. The hustle and respect you reference as being important traits for the game, I wholeheartedly agree, in fact, I see the current trend in MLB (to overlook character and integrity in a "toolsy" players as very detrimental to the essence of the game). It was a reference to what BBscout posted some time ago...he expressed a disdain for those particular traits...a bais.
I also differ with you about "exposure", but it is an opinion, and those always differ!
It is their system, however imperfect it is, I happen to love the game and I do think over time, a correction will be made and less foolishness will be tolerated.
FO, the BEST team is not made up of POTENTIAL, it is present ability. (As far as your comment about the make-up of the scouts team. The parent was not "judging talent level" here, she was simply expressing frustration over the apparent bias. BBScout adequately answered that question and she understood.
It is all too common on this site for posters to jump to that tired old statement..."parents are not capable of judging talent level of their own kids". I give them more credit than that. Yes, there are some that cannot, mostly they get left behind in little league, I have found most parents are perhaps more critical of their own, but are seeking a fairness on the playing field that in some cases is not there.
A open mind towards all should be given freely.
As stated, MLB, the draft...is not the end...for some it is the beginning...of baseball at the next level, for some, it is the beginning of a wonderful life in some other field.
quote:As stated, MLB, the draft...is not the end...for some it is the beginning...of baseball at the next level, for some, it is the beginning of a wonderful life in some other field.
Catsuremom...THAT is a wonderful perspective on the draft!
The reality is that by the time baseball players are 16-18 years old "reputation" becomes extremely important to scouts. That can be either a "good" or a "bad" reputation.
That reputation thing is a hard thing to overcome but it CAN BE DONE.
In reality when it comes to selection to things like Area Code, Aflac, etc. reputation plays a big role in the selection process along with "tryouts".
In regard to the draft, scouts are in a tough sitation - take a chance with a kid who might not have the reputation of other highly regarded HS players and the scout looks like an idiot if the player does not work out. However if he recommends a player that everyone perceives as a top player and that player ends up not working out then it is not the scouts fault - EVERYONE thought the kid was a lock.
With the above being said, a player with talent will get a chance to prove himself. It may just take a little longer and take a little more work on his part but it can - and is - done all the time. In the end talent will win out. Potential at some point has to be cashed in with results on the field.
So to all the parents who are convinced their sons should have been chosen for Area Code, Aflac, city league all-stars, etc. relax and chill - at some point if your son really does have the talent he will get his opportunity.
It is unfair but it is becoming more and more common for baseball players to be labeled at an increasingly young age. Just the way it is.
That reputation thing is a hard thing to overcome but it CAN BE DONE.
In reality when it comes to selection to things like Area Code, Aflac, etc. reputation plays a big role in the selection process along with "tryouts".
In regard to the draft, scouts are in a tough sitation - take a chance with a kid who might not have the reputation of other highly regarded HS players and the scout looks like an idiot if the player does not work out. However if he recommends a player that everyone perceives as a top player and that player ends up not working out then it is not the scouts fault - EVERYONE thought the kid was a lock.
With the above being said, a player with talent will get a chance to prove himself. It may just take a little longer and take a little more work on his part but it can - and is - done all the time. In the end talent will win out. Potential at some point has to be cashed in with results on the field.
So to all the parents who are convinced their sons should have been chosen for Area Code, Aflac, city league all-stars, etc. relax and chill - at some point if your son really does have the talent he will get his opportunity.
It is unfair but it is becoming more and more common for baseball players to be labeled at an increasingly young age. Just the way it is.
There is a logistic problem in baseball. As many have mentioned there are only so many spots on a team. It is not uncommon for great abll players to not make a team. You often are only as good as your last outting.
BBscout and all coaches try to be fair and yes they do have favorites who they have followed who may get picked on their reputation.
In due respect to all scouts and coaches, saying that certain players are the best in a region is fact I find hard to grasp. Ball players are on going works in progress even in their 20s and 30s.
BBscout gave me some advice in athread that got pretty heated after viewing my son's video. I would like to say he heeded that advice and is now throwing harder than he did before. His last outing he faced 5 batters in a relief effort 1 2/3 innings behind a drafted pitcher who also played in the Independant League. We were down 5-3 and he struck out 5 straight with 2 balls called. Only one bat touched the ball and fouled it off. Everyone was commenting on his FB for a change. The point is to all those who believe in themselves and weren't picked for teams move past it and keep working at you game. This is an on going developement and every scout / coach has an opinion that may or may not be valid.
BBscout and all coaches try to be fair and yes they do have favorites who they have followed who may get picked on their reputation.
In due respect to all scouts and coaches, saying that certain players are the best in a region is fact I find hard to grasp. Ball players are on going works in progress even in their 20s and 30s.
BBscout gave me some advice in athread that got pretty heated after viewing my son's video. I would like to say he heeded that advice and is now throwing harder than he did before. His last outing he faced 5 batters in a relief effort 1 2/3 innings behind a drafted pitcher who also played in the Independant League. We were down 5-3 and he struck out 5 straight with 2 balls called. Only one bat touched the ball and fouled it off. Everyone was commenting on his FB for a change. The point is to all those who believe in themselves and weren't picked for teams move past it and keep working at you game. This is an on going developement and every scout / coach has an opinion that may or may not be valid.
Former observer,
I must disagree on one of your statements. Players do not get promoted on potential alone.
Eventually they must demonstrate the ability to translate potential into performance. Yes, some get promoted for a time on potential alone but the number of positions available are constantly diminishing. Players are cut or released who don't produce. The minors and the majors are about doing well not having just tools. Organizations who don't live by this usually fail to produce winning players and teams.
The toolsy guy with lots of potential will get many chances to develope and show what he can do, but he must in the end deliver.
I must disagree on one of your statements. Players do not get promoted on potential alone.
Eventually they must demonstrate the ability to translate potential into performance. Yes, some get promoted for a time on potential alone but the number of positions available are constantly diminishing. Players are cut or released who don't produce. The minors and the majors are about doing well not having just tools. Organizations who don't live by this usually fail to produce winning players and teams.
The toolsy guy with lots of potential will get many chances to develope and show what he can do, but he must in the end deliver.
quote:The point is to all those who believe in themselves and weren't picked for teams move past it and keep working at you game.
Good post Bobblehead. I almost mentioned the logistical problem you stated, because it does factor in and muddy up the water.
I really do not think scouts are the problem, they are stuck in the middle of the muddy water, trying to make a living,and help out as many talented players as possible. As with anything, there are many good ones and a few not.
You cannot view the process through rose colored glasses, In the last 10 years I have observed appalling behavior from coaches, scouts and parents. A player MIGHT have a chance to go further if he is able to put it all into perspective and rise above it. Even then... talent, tools, heart and love of the game might not get you there...but if you got a big bonus you sure are going to get a heap of help and time enough for almost any of those (talented ones) who did not get picked to have a fair shot at making it. Just ask any minor leaguer who has been released to make room for the potential player coming in! I can hear your reposes to that, but I say, just carefully study the stats. Whether you stay and move up, or get released and go home is both subjective and objective, depending upon what some guy somewhere (usually with money) thinks MIGHT work.
I really do not think scouts are the problem, they are stuck in the middle of the muddy water, trying to make a living,and help out as many talented players as possible. As with anything, there are many good ones and a few not.
You cannot view the process through rose colored glasses, In the last 10 years I have observed appalling behavior from coaches, scouts and parents. A player MIGHT have a chance to go further if he is able to put it all into perspective and rise above it. Even then... talent, tools, heart and love of the game might not get you there...but if you got a big bonus you sure are going to get a heap of help and time enough for almost any of those (talented ones) who did not get picked to have a fair shot at making it. Just ask any minor leaguer who has been released to make room for the potential player coming in! I can hear your reposes to that, but I say, just carefully study the stats. Whether you stay and move up, or get released and go home is both subjective and objective, depending upon what some guy somewhere (usually with money) thinks MIGHT work.
CatSureMom:
If you are good enough, you will get your chances. If not, it will come to an early (relatively) end. Coaches and organizations want to win. Money might get you more time, but that does not last forever. And if you did not begin with money, you still have a chance -- but not an endless one -- if you are good enough. Most, in the end, are not.
Those that see politics almost always have a connection to someone who was good, perhaps very good, but not quite good enough to achieve that to which they aspired. It's the inherent fairness of the game. The rest of it matters hardly at all.
If you are good enough, you will get your chances. If not, it will come to an early (relatively) end. Coaches and organizations want to win. Money might get you more time, but that does not last forever. And if you did not begin with money, you still have a chance -- but not an endless one -- if you are good enough. Most, in the end, are not.
Those that see politics almost always have a connection to someone who was good, perhaps very good, but not quite good enough to achieve that to which they aspired. It's the inherent fairness of the game. The rest of it matters hardly at all.
An incorrect assumption. I do not see politics, I see truth. I have no connection to someone not good enough to acheive that to which they aspire. You merely prove my point by assuming anything about anybody to which you know nothing. I never said money lasts forever, I said, in baseball, it will get you greater opportunities to prove what someone of equal talent did not get. There is fairness in the GAME.None of it matters hardly at all.
Here is where we have our fundamental disagreement, CatSureMom. You believe guys who get less money have equal ability. Sometimes that is true -- and when it is, those guys succeed. But mostly, it is not true and that is why the guys without the money don't succeed. It is not because they did not get enough of a chance. It is because ultimately, they were not good enough. And that is essentially true at every level of the game, but more true the higher you go. No one gets anything out of favoring the players who are not as good as other players (other than a parent).
quote:In MLB, of those 1500 30-100 of those players are given greater opportunity to proceed.
And, a large percentage of them don't make it to the major league.
No, I do not believe guys who get less money have equal talent as a blanket statement. They might.
"And a large percentage of them do not make it to the major league"
Indeed! We do not disagree there!
You appear to assume that I think the ones that were drafted are not talented or that is some "parental" issue...it is neither.
"And a large percentage of them do not make it to the major league"
Indeed! We do not disagree there!
You appear to assume that I think the ones that were drafted are not talented or that is some "parental" issue...it is neither.
This is a quote from Fungo a few month's Back.
The High draft pick's, have to prove they Don't Belong.
The low draft pick's, have to prove they Do Belong.
Are something to that affect. It does ring true. EH
The High draft pick's, have to prove they Don't Belong.
The low draft pick's, have to prove they Do Belong.
Are something to that affect. It does ring true. EH
quote:Please take this from a parent who has felt a lot of baseball pain these last two years:
Keep telling yourself it's not the journey, but the destination. Keep telling yourself that when things are good and when things are bad. It does help you keep focus.
OLDVAMAN,
You are my hero sir
peace