Pitchers Hit by batted balls

I don't think it's the time for pitchers to adopt protective gear, but it's time to put serious effort in designing protective gear for pitchers.  Eventually useful gear will come along.

I saw a prototype of a product the other day that I think will be the first step toward head protection for P's.  It is basically a skull cap with thin cylinders of padding.  Not too cumbersome and a player could wear it under a regular hat, perhaps a size or two larger.

I know they are experimenting with the hats that have built-in padding but this made more sense to me.  Still not full facial protection by any means. 

i dont know what the #'s are for pitchers being hit in the head, probably pretty low, so i think head gear is never going to happen. They always seem to get hit in the face area and you will never get a pitcher to wear a face mask. Skull caps don't protect the face, so IMO this shouldn't, wont happen at the MLB level.

Someday, someone will wear a mask (probably a person who got drillec before), and take lot of abuse. That would be the first step, if it proceeds further, we'll see.

I know this won't eliminate the inherent danger for pitchers and not saying it would have stopped what happened to Chapman yesterday, but in general: banning protective elbow padding for hitters... any padding, even the inner ankle pad that guys wear... would help protect pitchers.  Hitters are too insulated and too comfortable In the box.  It was never supposed to be this way.  Pitchers are 100% exposed. The balance that once existed between the two is gone and needs to be re established.

 

The various beanies and prototypes that they're coming up with are great and I'm all for it, but these will never eliminate the danger either... short of a full cather type head gear, which I don't see happening. Taking away all the hitter "armor" at all levels is the single quickest and most effective way to help protect pitchers that I can think of.

I know this doesn't address the face shots but it does address the concussion issues that are so high on everyone's radar now.  For that reason, I think it may happen to some extent.

Right. Would help on a shot like the one Brandon McCarthy took.  Add a modified ear flap, and you give guys a chance to turn into the comebacker, the way a hitter instinctively does, and have some protection on contact.  I agree that this will probably come to pass before too much longer. Think it's a process that MLB is wanting to get underway: get pitchers used to wearing something (anything). Then, modifying and improving that will be a lot easier.  Just look at the evolution of batting helmets, which no one wanted to wear originally either.

I'll throw this out (and the baseball purists will cringe) but why not use technology to restrict the batted ball speed much like they do in golf? 

I believe there will be a day when pitchers will start wearing a head gear/face mask of some sorts. I think it will have to start in little leagues then graduate from level to level. It will not go over well with purists. But then again, I'm sure everyone was laughing in the early 1900's when protective head gear was being worn to the plate. Batters aren't laughing now...

Agree with you except I can't see full masks being worn.  Whatever is coming won't need to filter up all the way from LL.  MLB can dictate head gear for all minor leaguers, so that's where it will start. And HS and colleges would almost certainly follow the MiLB lead... Because it would be the right thing but also because they would be a greater liability if they failed to adopt the latest professional protection. So MLB can start the process with a stroke of the pen and I think they will... maybe early in the new commissioner's tenure.

Wish I hadn't clicked on this thread.  Hits home, since I was on the field, when BFS Jr. was carted off the field a few years ago, with blood coming out of his ear.  This was before the current bat restrictions used by most Travel Ball sanctions, you had huge batted ball exit speeds from these juiced bats.  Even now with the 1.15 youth restrictions, and BBCOR bats, we just saw what a wooden bat can do.

 

I am a fan of MLB hopefully taking the lead, and I agree, the first person who wears protection will take some grief, but soon others will follow, and hopefully the amateur ranks, down to youth will follow.

 

After seeing that happen to Jr., I can never watch him pitch again without the fear in the pit of my stomach...same with mom.  I don't think he much thinks about it on the mound, but he has been buzzed a few times with hits up the middle, and you can tell it brings back memories (not good ones).  Every time he misses his spot, and catches too much plate with a good hitter up there, you think to yourself, "he dodged a bullet there".

 

That is the one part of the game that scares the hell out of me.  I don't look forward to, and hope I never live to see a pitcher get drilled, and not wake up.  Yes, I hope protection is not too far off.

Add to first post:

 

I agree VERY much with Soylent Green:  the batted balls that are coming back at the pitcher, are not the middle, or inside pitches, they are the middle away, and outside pitch hit up the middle.  Two reasons for this: 

 

First you just about can't throw inside anymore, the rules are such that you get a warning if you knock somebody down.

 

Second, the bullet proof armor that batters wear, gives them no fear of taking the outside corner away from the pitcher. 

 

Bob Gibson used to say in interviews, that anytime he saw a batter inching closer to the plate, he'd knock them down, "that part of the plate is mine, you cannot have it".  Now that you can't throw inside, and they have no fear of getting hit with the armor they wear, those pitches "middle out, and outside" are becoming "center cut" pitches for batters. 

Exactly!!

 

The gear has to look cool and thats the biggest problem. The second problem is the designers of the protective gear think the gear has to provide excellent protection. I would be happy if the gear provide just "some" protection, but looks good.

 

How about the black Lebron James mask. Who thought that looked good? Or how about the old Kareem Goggles? Hocky face gear?

 

The problem is it happens rarely and eveybody forgets. But I get HS and college pitcher parents always pay attention.

Only real way to make this happen is to start in 2015 with all little league youth levels making it mandatory.  Then as that group moves up it stays mandatory with them.  Just get them started used to it and it will filter all the way up at some point.

 

Not the best solution but a realistic one.

I don't have an answer to the protective equipment question. All I can say is that I truly believe there are people working hard to find some sort of solution. Is it going to be popular? No, I don't think so. Not at first. So knowing there probably is not much of a solution to solve the problem from happening, instead it is important to me to consider the aftermath. That means having a solid Emergency Action Plan for when it does happen. As soon as Chapman got hit last night, the Athletic Trainers from both teams were on the field. Just that quickly. The EMTs and I'm sure team doctors were on the field shortly. He was immobilized and quickly taken off the field on a cart to be taken to the hospital.

 

I'm sure there are many parents on here with high school pitchers. Ask yourself this question... if your son got hit in the face with a line drive, how soon does he receive appropriate medical care?

 

This scenario is one that goes through my head every single time I step into the dugout for a baseball game or for a softball game. Yesterday while our softball team was warming up on the field, I was looking at gates and seeing what was around the main gate onto the field. I needed to see how the ambulance would get onto the field if we needed to. 

I was blessed with a daughter and so, when she was a freshman pitching varsity, she was hit in the face twice.  I've never been so scared.  Yet, she would not wear a facemask and went on to pitch many more games.  As stated here pitches middle out and where hitter could just unload.  Both times she said to me that she had to be better.  Scary stuff knowing it could happen in any game. 

 

I know that baseball coaches, fans, etc. frown on mask.  I am in favor.  It is great to be all macho until it is your son, or in my case daughter, laying on the ground. 

 

I am thankful that Chapman has a chance at a recovery.  The news said that he is having a steel plate put in his face today.  Prayers for a speedy recovery. 

According to Sports Science...

Normal humans:
- stride 87% of their height
- "stride" lasts .92 secs (unclear if they mean through foot plant, or release)
- release the ball over their front foot

Aroldis Chapman (6'4")
- strides 120% of his height (or 7 and 1/2 feet)
- "stride" takes .8 secs (15% faster)
- releases the ball up to 12 inches past his front foot.

So, not only does he throw it 5 mph faster out of his hand than most, but the ball has slowed 3 mph less before it reaches the plate because of the increased stride and release point. So 5 mph radar reading is really 8 mph more to the hitter.

 

This topic reminded me of an earlier topic. I can't say I haved watched him pitch before. But, how is his defense? I know I'm a regular human being but, sorry if your stride length is at 120% of your height you make yourself a sitting duck.

it will be similar to when hockey goalies adopted the mask, and hockey players adopted helmets - a bit of hemin' and hawin' but eventually folks will come around

Softball pitchers have already solved this problem... 

That would not stop getting hit in face though right, just head/side of head.

In addition to the physical injuries pitchers incur, the hitter who lines one at the pitcher's head is very often messed up, too.

 

Bring on the solution.

 

Agree w how quick can they get medical help. We have athletic trainer at school but they don't attend every game. We don't have ambulance parked near field like football team does. In past we were on teams w parents who were dr. but they were not always there due to work schedule. 

Well yeah easy for them they pitch standing up, baseball pitchers pitch differently and balls coming off bat faster. How heavy is that thing?

Maybe instead of making protective gear we look at changing the construction of the baseball to reduce the COR in the ML ball down to that of the college ball....

 

When I played competitive slow pitch I would wear a lacrosse helmet when I pitched with a modified cage.

Softball pitchers stand 43' away as opposed to 60'6". I would like for someone to argue that a monster shot back to a pitcher in softball is much, if any bit, slower than in baseball at those two respective distances. Mound/flat ground, standing straight up, hunched over after pitches may be completely irrelevant when one's face is in danger.

The only "good" thing about what happened to Chapman is that when a superstar player is involved, the wheels start turning a little faster.

 

Having a good EMT plan and trying to come up with a workable pitcher's cap or mask are great.  But Coach3 is right on, the needed protection is quite obvious and readily available.  Personally, I wish a name pitcher would go to it because that might remove the stigma... but I just don't see it happening anytime soon. Still, just takes one guy doing it to get the ball rolling... maybe Chapman will be that guy?  Can call it "doctor's orders".

 

But worth repeating the point that enabling guys to pitch inside, move a hitter's feet when necessary, etc via removing batter's "armor" would provide as much or more meaningful protection to all pitchers as almost anything else... and could be instituted immediately.  Part of that is umps letting guys establish inside too.  It's not about throwing at guys, it's about the natural balance between pitcher and hitter... that's the essence of the game anyway IMO.  To pull another quote from the great Bob Gibson: "I'm pitching inside. If it hits the man... tough."  Problem today is that the hitter doesn't have to worry about it much.

I do agree we need to take away batters armor. That probably needs to happen immediately. That will go a long ways to helping a pitchers mental side of game. Who decided that batters wearing armor was okay anyway.

I don't want to do a reply and have more pictures of the softball player in the thread. I don't know what the velocity, reaction time or impact differences are between baseball and softball. But the core of the softball is less dense than a baseball to decrease those factors from what they used to be.

http://m.espn.go.com/wireless/...amp;i=FB&w=1dugr

Our son has been on both sides of this scenario, he's a Pitcher, taken a couple hits, but never to his head. But, as a batter, he hit a hard line drive to the opposing Pitcher's head in a game. Scariest thing we've ever experienced. The ballpark went silent, the pitcher lay completely silent and motionless.  We all feared the worst. The Pitcher was Life Flighted to a large hospital. The young man was hospitalized a couple of weeks, then Home-Schooled for weeks. The young man overcame his injuries, and eventually resumed Pitching. The 2 boys kept in touch for awhile. Fate brought them back together a few times afterwards. But, neither gave up on their love of playing the game of Baseball. And ironically or maybe intentionally, his Coach put him in as the starting Pitcher, the next game.

Son isn't sure of the potential headgear for Pitcher's in the future. He's had concussions (Football & Passenger in car wreck), he's aware of risks that Pitcher's have of head injuries. While he understands the headgear's potential to possibly protect a Pitcher, he is not convinced that it won't impair or have a negative effect on a Pitcher's ability in pitching.

       
       

I think we need to clarify what we are talking about when it comes to ball stats... There are two factors to account for when analyzing ball performance in a lab setting,  Coefficient of Restitution (COR) and compression, which is the weight needed to compress the ball a quarter of an inch. The COR of ASA fastpitch softballs are a .47 max with a compression rating of 375lbs. I believe a MLB, which is more lively that NFHS and NCAA balls, ball has approximately the same COR but a compression rating of closer to 600lbs. A high COR high compression ball is extremely lively,  i.e. a golf ball. A low COR low compression ball is dead,  i.e. a balled up sock. High COR low compression is like a super ball and Low COR high compression is like a rock.

Update on Chapman...

http://m.espn.go.com/mlb/story...8900&src=desktop

Very lucky!

I haven't seen the replays of either McCarthy or Chapman's injuries [my son is a pitcher, so don't won't to think about it all day].  I have given this issue some thought and came up with one idea that would offer some minor protection for a pitcher while they work out a more permanent solution,  I'll explain:

 

I've noticed over the years that when pitchers have been hit by a line drive, they do manage to get their glove up near the oncoming  hit, but not enough to either deflect it or catch it.  Now, I know baseball players are creatures of habits, more so than other professional athletes IMO, but if we could develop a larger mitt, similar in size to a 1st baseman's glove but designed to be a traditional style glove, that extra 2+ inches of leather could deflect more balls, thus giving a pitcher a better chance of avoiding the direct hit from a line drive.  I've seen my son hit by 6 line drives in the last 6 years, but fortunately, all have been below the neck and leave large bruises and create funny tales of bravado.  As I mention, this thought of mine is a band aid, not a solution to the issue of protecting pitchers.

 

Which leads me into a second question:  do most pitchers wear a cup when pitching? My son says he and many others do not, and I find that hard to believe.  To restrictive and chafes the area bad he says.  Any thoughts.

Wednesday my son was nearly hit by a line drive combacker.  It missed him by about the width of the ball.  Everyone on both sides gasp when it happened.  if he was a right hander he would have been hit.  I have never been afraid of that happening but the college hitters are all pretty good and he does not dominate like high school.  He did not seem to be phased by it but his Dad and Mom were.  He does not wear a cup.

My son is a catcher so he always wears a cup. But then again, he said it would not feel like baseball without a cup.

I am not sure about the larger glove, most pitchers use their glove side during their stride, into foot plant, and a larger glove in my opinion would add a lot of weight, and I don't think would be all that practical, again this is just my opinion.

 

My son does not wear a cup.

 

If you read my post to this thread earlier, you will know my son was carted off the field a few years ago.  After that happened, anytime an MLB pitcher was hit, I (my wife as well) did everything we could to not have any sports channels on, especially MLB network in fear of son seeing that.  It had the reverse effect, in that he eventually heard about it in talking with friends, and I think he could feel how afraid we were, and likely wondered how nervous he should be going forward.

 

MLB network is always on after I get home from work in the main living room.  As soon as I got home from work yesterday, BFS Jr. asked, "did you see what happened to Chapman?"....I told him I did, and although I didn't downplay it, I also made sure he did not outwardly see what I felt deep down.  We talked about it, and we went over how a pitcher needs to establish inside, in order to be able to safely pitch outside.  It's not full-proof, but it at least provides some comfort in him, that there is strategy involved in increasing the odds of avoiding it.  He also said, "those are once in a lifetime flukes"....in his mind, he already had his, so he has at least tried to convince himself the odds are in his favor that it won't happen again.

 

Edit to add:  I know it is newsworthy, however I wish (especially MLB network) did not run, nonstop the video of pitchers when they get seriously injured.  A few times is ok, however I am not sure if they realize how this affects parents, and pitchers...I just think it is a little much after the 50th segment about it.

Soylet, you may have a point about the elbow armor but the ankle pad is not for a pitched ball. It is for a ball that is fouled off. Ever foul a 90+ fastball off your shin or ankle? Hurts like hell is an understatement . I wouldn't put that in the solution but your point on pitching inside is valid. That's an umpire decision to make and a philosophical one for pitching staffs. Right on the money about the type of pitches being hit up the middle. My son is an oppo hitter at heart and he is pulling and going middle much more this year. He says its because pitchers refuse to come inside so he has to get on top of the plate and those outside pitches are now not outside anymore.