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From Joe Torre's book (a very good read, I reccomend it!), p. 185 based on research by Dr. James Andrews and Dr. Glenn Fleisig throught the American Sports Medicine Institute, Birmingham, AL. The discussion is about a possible next step by teams to minimize risk in building their franchise to compete with the big money markets.

quote:
Pitching is an act of violence. Once the pitcher loads the baseball in the cocked position, the arm rotates forward at 7,000 degrees per second. "That is the fastest measured human motion of any activity," Fleisig said.

While in that loaded position, the shoulder and arm bear the equivalent of about 40 pounds of force pushing down. The biomechanical experts at ASMI were curious about how much more force an arm could take, so they brought cadavers into the lab and pulled and pushed upon the shoulder joint to find its breaking point. The cadavers' ligaments blew apart just after 40 pounds of force. "So a pitcher is just about at maximum," Flesig said.

No wonder pitchers breakdown: they have pushed their shoulders and arms to the edge of the breaking point. Pitching, unlike most sports activities, has reached the limit of what is humanly possible. So while sprinters continue to run faster, swimmers swim faster, golfers drive the ball farther and football players get bigger and faster, the pitcher has reached his peak. You will not see a pitcher throwing a baseball 110 miles per hour. The arm and shoulder are maxed out. Pushed any further, the shoulder would blow up, like a blown engine.


Like the song goes, "Papas don't let your babies grow up to be pitchers..." Eek
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Like the song goes, "Papas don't let your babies grow up to be pitchers..."

I believe that was Mamas Big Grin

Good topic. That is what makes the Strasberg kid amazing imho. I believe every once in a while, a guy like Bob Feller or Nolan Ryan comes along who can just throw hard all the time. For everyone else, it is obviously a risky thing to do. Sandy Koufax always comes to mind when this topic comes up. Remember Frank Tananna? He was Strasberg before there was a Strasberg.
quote:
While in that loaded position, the shoulder and arm bear the equivalent of about 40 pounds of force pushing down. The biomechanical experts at ASMI were curious about how much more force an arm could take, so they brought cadavers into the lab and pulled and pushed upon the soulder joint to find its breaking point. The cadavers' ligaments blew apart just after 40 pounds of force. "So a pitcher is just about at maximum," Flesig said.

I have heard this before... That there is a limit. Obviously I don't know for sure about the physics or medical aspects, but I do have a lot of respect for common sense.

Did this happen to every cadaver? Are the ligaments the same size and strength in all human beings? Wouldn't some elbows and shoulders blow out before others? Just because a cadaver blew apart at 40 lbs of force, then can we assume that all shoulders would blow out at 40 lbs of torque?

Also the secret to pitching at a high velocity is being able to use the body rather than just the arm. There are things the body can do that help speed up the arm. What I wonder is, were those cadavers using good mechanics? Big Grin
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Did this happen to every cadaver? Are the ligaments the same size and strength in all human beings? Wouldn't some elbows and shoulders blow out before others? Just because a cadaver blew apart at 40 lbs of force, then can we assume that all shoulders would blow out at 40 lbs of torque?


I've wondered the same things (before the cadaver comment! Eek).

But its an interesting piece of research and I've read elsewhere that the human body is at its limit in pitching.

I see more kids using Lincecum-type mechanics and wonder what impact this will have?

Its interesting to ponder - huh?
Maybe that wouldn't have happened if the cadaver had a good pitching coach!

Maybe the cadaver wasn't in good condition!

Maybe the cadaver damaged his arm long before this!

Maybe the cadaver didn't get enough recovery time since his last start!

Someone should have warned the cadaver about throwing all those curveballs!

Maybe the cadaver will come back throwing harder than ever!

justbaseball, this really is an interesting topic. Big Grin
I know this started out being a serious subject. I apologize for joking about things. It's just that sometimes things are just perfect for joking around. Thanks for all the laughs and thanks to those who ignored rather than trying to straighten out the sick thinking by some of us.

I actually plan on being one of them there cadavers at some point. Now, just thinking about it makes my arm hurt! Big Grin

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